HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Topics » Politics & Government » Hillary Clinton (Group) » New York Magazine: The C...

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 03:50 AM

New York Magazine: The Case Against Bernie Sanders

...
Sanders has promised to replace Obamacare with a single-payer plan, without having any remotely plausible prospects for doing so. Many advocates of single-payer imagine that only the power of insurance companies stands in their way, but the more imposing obstacles would be reassuring suspicious voters that the change in their insurance (from private to public) would not harm them and — more difficult still — raising the taxes to pay for it. As Sarah Kliff details, Vermont had to abandon hopes of creating its own single-payer plan. If Vermont, one of the most liberal states in America, can’t summon the political willpower for single-payer, it is impossible to imagine the country as a whole doing it. Not surprisingly, Sanders's health-care plan uses the kind of magical-realism approach to fiscal policy usually found in Republican budgets, conjuring trillions of dollars in savings without definingtheir source.
...
The Sanders campaign represents a revolution of rising expectations. In 2008, the last time Democrats held a contested primary, the prospect of simply taking back the presidency from Republican control was nearly enough to motivate the party’s vote. The potential to enact dramatic change was merely a bonus. After nearly two terms of power, with the prospect of Republican rule now merely hypothetical, Democrats want more.

The paradox is that the president’s ability to deliver more change is far more limited. The current occupant of the Oval Office and his successor will have a House of Representatives firmly under right-wing rule, making the prospects of important progressive legislation impossible. This hardly renders the presidency impotent, obviously. The end of Obama’s term has shown that a creative president can still drive some change.

But here is a second irony: Those areas in which a Democratic Executive branch has no power are those in which Sanders demands aggressive action, and the areas in which the Executive branch still has power now are precisely those in which Sanders has the least to say. The president retains full command of foreign affairs; can use executive authority to drive social policy change in areas like criminal justice and gender; and can, at least in theory, staff the judiciary. What the next president won’t accomplish is to increase taxes, expand social programs, or do anything to reduce inequality, given the House Republicans’ fanatically pro-inequality positions across the board. The next Democratic presidential term will be mostly defensive, a bulwark against the enactment of the radical Ryan plan. What little progress liberals can expect will be concentrated in the non-Sanders realm.


http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/01/case-against-bernie-sanders.html#

Great read. The article demonstrates why Hillary is far and away the best candidate when it comes to being able to do what actually can get done.

28 replies, 2491 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 28 replies Author Time Post
Reply New York Magazine: The Case Against Bernie Sanders (Original post)
SunSeeker Jan 2016 OP
underthematrix Jan 2016 #1
BlueMTexpat Jan 2016 #12
Tommy2Tone Jan 2016 #2
Treant Jan 2016 #20
Cha Jan 2016 #3
billy_j2 Jan 2016 #4
MADem Jan 2016 #6
Cha Jan 2016 #7
BlueMTexpat Jan 2016 #13
stonecutter357 Jan 2016 #15
pandr32 Jan 2016 #5
SunSeeker Jan 2016 #22
pandr32 Jan 2016 #28
leftofcool Jan 2016 #8
Nyan Jan 2016 #9
Ellen Forradalom Jan 2016 #10
Nyan Jan 2016 #11
BlueMTexpat Jan 2016 #14
stonecutter357 Jan 2016 #16
Ellen Forradalom Jan 2016 #17
Nyan Jan 2016 #18
1StrongBlackMan Jan 2016 #27
kjones Jan 2016 #24
SunSeeker Jan 2016 #23
1StrongBlackMan Jan 2016 #26
Treant Jan 2016 #21
Thinkingabout Jan 2016 #19
William769 Jan 2016 #25

Response to SunSeeker (Original post)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 04:16 AM

1. This really is a great read.

And this is one of the reasons I think HRC is the best choice too:


But here is a second irony: Those areas in which a Democratic Executive branch has no power are those in which Sanders demands aggressive action, and the areas in which the Executive branch still has power now are precisely those in which Sanders has the least to say. The president retains full command of foreign affairs; can use executive authority to drive social policy change in areas like criminal justice and gender; and can, at least in theory, staff the judiciary.


Bernie avoids foreign policy always pivoting back to economic policies where he can engage in a delusional diatribe against the rich without offering realistic do able solutions.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to underthematrix (Reply #1)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 07:20 AM

12. This is one of the many reasons that I too

prefer Hillary.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SunSeeker (Original post)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 04:27 AM

2. I just finished reading this

Everything Bernie is proposing, on every plan requires congress to go along with him. The ACA passed with not one single Republican voting for it. How is he going to compliment his grand plan? The correct answer is he isn't. He is just feeding his base who believe the man is a messiah.

This post destroys all Bernie's arguments and does it well. Thanks for posting it.

K&R

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Tommy2Tone (Reply #2)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 12:37 PM

20. Most of his plans

require a Democratic supermajority in the Senate--and one that's actually Democratic, not the Dem/Ind short-term dominance we had to push the ACA through.

That seems rather unlikely...and it also seems rather unlikely that the Senate will go for a health care plan that even Vermont as a state couldn't pass.

It's a bit sad, but it looks like we'll have to work incrementally through the ACA. I'd suggest a public option first to reign in the insurance companies a bit, and then expand that over time...but I'm not a politician and not a health care expert.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SunSeeker (Original post)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 04:31 AM

3. Thank you, SunSeeker.. I am against Bernie Sanders for President even if there weren't a risk with

him as the nominee. I don't think he's what our Country needs.

So even if you fervently endorse Sanders's policy vision (which, again for the sake of full candor, I do not), he has chosen an unusually poor time to make it the centerpiece of a presidential campaign. It can be rational for a party to move away from the center in order to set itself up for dramatic new policy changes; the risk the Republican Party accepted in 1980 when Ronald Reagan endorsed the radical new doctrine of supply-side economics allowed it to reshape the face of government. But it seems bizarre for Democrats to risk losing the presidency by embracing a politically radical doctrine that stands zero chance of enactment even if they win.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SunSeeker (Original post)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 05:53 AM

4. Hillary's and her Neo Liberal Centrist's new slogan "No We Can't"

Sanders position is not about him, but about what he represents in the Democratic party. He is a return to the core values of what Democratic party people used to fight for, before they went "Centrist". He is about organization and hopefully he is not like Obama who upon ascending to the presidency, where he turned his back on his organization, Sanders is all in with organization. Democratic party voters and members are looking for long coat tails. The movement is about taking back the house and the Senate. It is all about encouraging new voters and keeping them voting. It is all about a "Democratic " movement not a Rebublic ideal where we elect and then hope they do what we want.

Organization begins at the local levels and state by state. He has that same momentum that would have allowed Obama in his first two years to have placed and enacted a progressive agenda, if he wanted to . He didn't and without a doubt, judging by her war hawkish, corporatist and Wall street activities of the past, she is the most perfect Republican to run for the Democratic nomination.

It is a simple choice, either we can or we can't! Sanders or Hillary. Hope, change or capitulation.

Look at their records , not their political words. Words are cheap. Sanders is inspiring the Democratic party because his actions are authentic, not triangulated.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to billy_j2 (Reply #4)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 06:14 AM

6. You are in a protected group--LEAVE, please. nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to billy_j2 (Reply #4)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 06:22 AM

7. All bernie does is talk .. Hillary actually gets the job done.. I don't care what kind of

propaganda is being pushed around against her. It's just that.. and you're not going to be able to spread misinformation in here anymore.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to billy_j2 (Reply #4)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 07:23 AM

13. The latest Hillary-trashing meme

is plastered everywhere else on DU.

But here, you may NOT do it.



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to billy_j2 (Reply #4)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 07:28 AM

15. Are you a true Bernie supporter ?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SunSeeker (Original post)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 06:03 AM

5. Well put

...and why I worry that if Sanders were to win his rhetorical bluster would quickly begin to make him seem impotent rather than a leader of a political revolution--losing its fantastical effect on his followers, and they would become jaded and turn on democrats...blaming them all for the lack of pie-in-the-sky progress and their own delusions of being revolutionaries.
The mid-term election could be a Republican feast.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to pandr32 (Reply #5)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 01:15 PM

22. He has already turned on Democrats, has been bashing us for years. nt



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SunSeeker (Reply #22)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 09:42 PM

28. Yep

You've got that right, and at every opportunity is lambasting the DNC during the campaign.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SunSeeker (Original post)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 06:47 AM

8. One of the best posts outlining the reasons to NOT vote for Sanders!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SunSeeker (Original post)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 06:49 AM

9. The fact that the "president retains full command of foreign policy"

is the reason I prefer Bernie over Hillary.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Nyan (Reply #9)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 07:00 AM

10. I can't even imagine

Bernie vs. Putin.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Ellen Forradalom (Reply #10)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 07:09 AM

11. Right. And Hillary's gonna be tough on him?

And Putin's gonna cower because Hillary so tough?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Nyan (Reply #11)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 07:24 AM

14. Why are you here?

This is the Hillary Clinton Group.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Nyan (Reply #11)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 07:29 AM

16. do NOT vote for Sanders!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Nyan (Reply #11)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 08:59 AM

17. Yeah, why would we expect a girl to be tough with him?

That's just crazy talk isn't it? Makes no sense in your world, I see.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Ellen Forradalom (Reply #17)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 09:18 AM

18. Yeah I'm a sexist asshole that's why I support Bernie.

Are you serious with this shit?
He's much more of a dove than her. That's why I prefer his foreign policy stance than hers.
Is that so hard to understand?
By the way, I'm a girl and I've dealt with a fair share of sexism in my life. So don't fucking throw that shit at me.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Nyan (Reply #18)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 07:44 PM

27. Bernie may be much more of a Dove than HRC ...

 

but Putin is no dove.

While Putin knows and respects HRC; he will have to establish a relationship with Bernie, from scratch. And, he will do so by testing Bernie in ways he never would test HRC.

And, I can't say how Bernie will respond to the tests. That concerns me.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Ellen Forradalom (Reply #17)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 02:21 PM

24. Maybe Bernie and his trolls will try to out-troll Putin.

Or just assault him with passive aggressive snark and hope he rolls over.

The idea that Bernie can handle foreign policy better than Clinton...is
perhaps the most ridiculous thing I've heard all season.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Nyan (Reply #11)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 01:18 PM

23. Putin sure as hell isn't going to cower to a guy who honeymooned in Russia. nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Nyan (Reply #11)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 07:39 PM

26. You clearly haven't been paying attention ...

 

Putin respects HRC and has a relationship with her; whereas, Putin will test a President Bernie in ways he never would HRC ... just to see how far he can go. And I can't say, I know how Bernie will respond to that test.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Ellen Forradalom (Reply #10)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 12:39 PM

21. "Your economy is the problem Mr. Putin..."

Well, duh, obviously it doesn't help. The fact that Putin's a bit nutty seems to be a bigger barrier.

I'm firmly convinced that Mrs. Clinton has his number...since she's shown she had his number in the past.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SunSeeker (Original post)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 09:48 AM

19. Hillary is not promising changing ACA to a single payer because she

Knows it is not going to happen, she knows it will not get through Congress. This is where her experience is important in her campaigning. You can't promise the sky when you know it is not possible. She does not want to be a failure.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SunSeeker (Original post)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 06:17 PM

25. Listening to him speak & to see what type of people support him is why I won't support him

in the Primary.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread