We have a hatred problem on this site.

[Loki]

I've seen some of the most disgusting verbal abuse thrown at a woman who has done nothing more than run as a Democratic Presidential nominee. Verbal vomit, pathological liar, fascist are just to name a few. I just had a post hidden when I replied to this, I know I probably went too far, but I'm not sorry. We have people that have become worse than Trump supporters in their venom and no one will stop them. They personally attack her and this site continues to allow this hypocrisy to stand but never allow us to call them out when it has passed the level of decent disagreement. I've trashed the Sanders group, now I'm going to trash General Discussion Primaries. They can continue the hate, it will come back to haunt them.

[Ellen Forradalom]

1. It's the same hate thrown at women anywhere on the Internet.

Running for president, commenting on video games, blogging about user interfaces, being publicly feminist--no matter, you are a target of abuse. NO GRLZ ALLOWD ON THE INTERWEBS.

[Staph]

13. +1,000,000,000,000,000

I'm sixty-two years old, and I'm tired. Tired of being assumed to be unintelligent, uninteresting, un-everything. I thought when we were breaking barriers when I was in college (I was in the first class of women allowed to march in my university marching band in 1972!), that the future would be brighter and freer.

When I worked in the corporate world, we had annual presentations and lectures and full-blown seminars on diversity in the workplace. My company took the subject extremely seriously. When the speaker discussed discrimination on account of race, skin color, national origin, religion, sexual preference -- it was treated quite respectfully by all present. When the subject of discrimination against women was brought up, the jokes came out. The speaker (a man, by the way) could not stop the juvenile humor. Boys will be boys!

I remember saying to a friend in 2007 that a black man would be president before a woman, just as black men were given the vote before women. I'm now wondering if I will see a woman president in my lifetime. It doesn't have to be Hillary. But surely there is some woman that can be considered capable of running this country without damaging the sensibilities of the fragile-egos of poor, widdle boys.

[WHEN CRABS ROAR]

31. When I became enlightened some time in the sixties

and realized that women and men where equal and later when I was lucky enough to work at the University of California at San Diego with women and men in the same setting it was a blessing.
I could care less if the next president is a woman or a man.
I am a Sanders supporter, but I don't see any need whatsoever to insult or call Hillary names.
But I am not a "poor widdle boy"
That's being sexist.

[yallerdawg]

79. You don't think this is a problem?

Outcomes don't matter?

We're all "equal" on the front end, so no need to check what comes out the back end. It'll happen one day, sure, because gender does not matter - is not an issue.

Just not this time. Just not this woman.

[yardwork]

85. You're in the Hillary Clinton group.

[yallerdawg]

106. I'm in the Hillary Clinton group?

It's the only group I'm ever in!

What I am saying, we have to understand if we don't actively, affirmatively, seek a qualified, experienced, electable woman candidate - we might never have one!

We have institutionalized gender bias at every level, and we can't let it be something that will just happen.

The attacks on Hillary and supporters are just another manifestation of the entrenched resistance against the change and 'quiet revolution' we are in the process of enacting now!

Not with 'someone else.' Not next time. NOW.

Ready for Hillary!

[WHEN CRABS ROAR]

97. I think you misunderstood my point.

I was responding to the posts subject matter and that was, personal attacks on Hillary.
I made it quite clear that I don't condone, support, or engage in them.
Your opinion of Hillary and mine of Bernie are simply that, opinions.
If you are saying that gender doesn't matter I totally agree with you, I would never vote for someone based on their gender.
I believe that international corporations have a strangle hold over ours and most other countries in the world and need to be held in check for the future, mutual benefit of all of us.
Otherwise an extinction event is a very real possibility.

[Staph]

90. I'm not in the Hillary Clinton group.

I'm not in the Bernie Sanders group. We West Virginians don't get to vote until May, and I have not yet made up my mind.

What I was imperfectly trying to express was my disappointment with politics in general and the women's place in the world specifically.

When black men in 2008 expressed joy in finally seeing a black face among the 44 white faces of American presidents, we cheered with them, and shed a tear or two. But, when I state that I would like to see a woman among those 45 men, I'm told that I am sexist. As I said in my first post above, I don't care if it's Hillary or some other woman. I want to see someone who looks like me in the Oval Office.

If you don't understand that . . . .

[Zing Zing Zingbah]

120. I think it will be very meaningful to have our first woman president.

It actually makes me a little sad that it seems to be downplayed so much.....
like having a woman president isn't all that. It's not that big of a deal. It doesn't really matter. It's the kind of thing we can just wait on forever because it doesn't matter so much. Because women and their "issues" don't really matter all that much... even though woman are 50.8% of the population. You know how women are. Always bitching like they have some problems.. making a mountain out of a mole hill. They're the ones making problems for themselves. They had it good staying home with the kids and all that and they went and messed that all up with that frivolous women's rights movement. Now they want to be president, WTF?

[question everything]

108. Just to inform you: if you've post a similar post on Sanders group

saying you are a Hillary supporter, you will immediately get an email telling you that you are blocked from posting there.

Here, unless someone is really offensive, we politely disagree.

(At least, I don't know how many were blocked by the hosts).

[WHEN CRABS ROAR]

114. I prefer to bring more civility to DU

after all we have Trump to defeat, now that's a real enemy.
Have a good night.

[shenmue]

14. Yep

[yardwork]

20. Reddit nation.

[wryter2000]

52. I can't agree with you enough

I never thought I'd see DU sink to this low.

[Zing Zing Zingbah]

119. Right, my first thought was that it is not just this site.

It is a general problem across the internet.

[SunSeeker]

2. K & R

[Iliyah]

3. K & R

and it won't stop . . . all the way to the WH and thereafter. SAD.

[Stuckinthebush]

4. It's nasty

True colors coming through.

I suspect the majority of them to be gone in a few months. Most are low post members anyway. It is sad that many long time DUers are caught up in the sickness.

[Agnosticsherbet]

5. At some level, there is a tacit agreement to let people say whatever the hell hey want.

The effort is to destroy an opponent rather than change their minds.
Some of it appears to happen to push people to get angry so that they react and can be silenced.

[yardwork]

19. It's very hypocritical.

Newspaper articles with mild criticism of Bernie's policies are routinely hidden here, but the vilest posts against Hillary are a-ok.

[Agnosticsherbet]

36. The jury system suffers from the tyranny of the majority.

[quickesst]

11. What is truly disheartening

... is the number of Bernie supporters who claim to be Democrats and say they will vote for the Democratic nominee whoever it is that allow the hatred to go unchecked and in many cases get caught up in the fervor and join in. Kudos to those who do speak up, but unfortunately, they are few and far between.

[yardwork]

18. I'm sorry that post was hidden. I could have written it myself.

[quickesst]

25. As could I my friend...

.... as could I.

[Rose Siding]

83. Yes, it was a petty hide. No absolutes were used, the statement was qualified

"Some" Sanders supporters is what was said.

[Loki]

22. FlaDem

They will not silence us!

[quickesst]

24. Absolutely...

...NOT!!! 100% agree with your hidden post. It was a petty, crap hide.

[DesertRat]

30. There have been several of them over the past few days.

[quickesst]

37. They are exposing themselves....

...for what they are, and it ain't pretty.
https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=%253Fwidth%253D196&imgrefurl=http://onlineinstruction.ning.com/working-with-students/responding-to-angry-student-e-mails&h=2000&w=2000&tbnid=FqRopGCMYNx_UM:&docid=hCmOWBl2dtZk0M&ei=kxHiVtfLKsH0jwOt853IBA&tbm=isch&client=ms-android-verizon&ved=0ahUKEwiX4c_FsLfLAhVB-mMKHa15B0kQMwiJASgiMCI

[shadowandblossom]

76. Can't see anything

It doesn't link to anything

[quickesst]

107. Yeah...

Since google changed things I can't link to a pic directly. Shows up fine on my phone and pad. It was just a rather amusing angry smiley face.

[DesertRat]

29. Why do they keep coming to this group and hide our posts?

In their forum the post whatever they want about Hillary, including links and cartoons from right wing sites.

[yardwork]

48. Those posts always survive alerts, if they are alerted on at all.

Often the jury results come back and half the people voting to Leave say that they think that the post really is rude, etc., but they've seen worse, so they're leaving it.

This would be like being on a jury and saying, "Yeah, I'm convinced that this man did murder 10 people, but I've heard of somebody who murdered 15 people, so I can't vote to convict."

[sheshe2]

95. All I can do is block them.

Your post is spot on, yardwork.

[DesertRat]

109. perfect analogy

[misterhighwasted]

41. Fla Dem

Censorship
When there's no other tool left.

[sheshe2]

44. Censorship is correct.

Thanks mister.

[shadowandblossom]

65. You took the word right out of my mouth.

They're engaging in censorship and harassment in mass on youtube as well.

[yardwork]

74. Welcome to DU!

[shadowandblossom]

92. Thank you!

for welcoming me. I'm sad to come in at such an ugly time, but thank you still.

[sheshe2]

96. Welcome.

Stay strong.

[Cha]

102. Fla Dem's hide was an example of what your OP is about, Loki

Silenced because they don't like what you say.. not because it's against any TOS.

It's not fair. And, it wouldn't be "partisan" for the Admin to step in and correct it to FAIR.

[sheshe2]

104. I just spent the last 15 minutes...

Reading up and down this post and blocking anti Hillary comments. What do they not understand about Groups? Safe havens? WTF!

[Buzz Clik]

7. Indeed.

[Lucinda]

8. Yep. It is awful.

The behavior is worst I've seen in a dozen years. Hopefully it will all be over soon, and things can try and fall back into something resembling "normal."

[yardwork]

49. It's the worst I've seen since I joined DU in 2004 or something.

Definitely the worst I've seen of any primary season, by a long way.

[sheshe2]

9. Thank you Loki.

Sad but true.

[Agschmid]

10. For the hide on this thread...

On Fri Mar 11, 2016, 07:43 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

If Bernie wasn't running many of these jerks would be Trump supporters.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1107&pid=69562

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

So now you're saying Sanders supporters = Trump supporters ?

JURY RESULTS

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Fri Mar 11, 2016, 07:47 AM, and the Jury voted 4-3 to HIDE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: And now we are saying an opinion, even if incorrect is a TOS/CS violation? Yah no, it's not. -Agschmid
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: garbage
Juror #4 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Looks like you missed the point of Loki's post.
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: This is posted in the Hillary Group. The comment did not specify who they meant, and since it is in a special group, it is for that groups consumption

[Jackie Wilson Said]

28. Not true about all Bernie supporters, but sadly is true about some.

There seems to be a disconnect somewhere between:

"gotta elect someone and If I dont get my way I am taking my ball and going home"


You see the American people ARE going to elect SOMEONE.

And while I personally would rather that be Bernie over Hillary, I am not at all confused about the first part of that connection issue.

Someone is going to move their furniture and clothes into the White House when Barack and Michelle and family leave.

Now how in the hell could anyone who would vote for Bernie be willing to allow that someone to be any of the three stooges offered from the other side?

I dont get it.

[wryter2000]

56. Thank you eom

[TonyCapo]

57. You could say the same thing about Trump supporters too. n/t

[applegrove]

12. I agree she is being dehumanized. No amount of sunlight is allowed to sit on her shoulder on this

discussion forum. Reminds me of the gungeon and the NRA.

[mcar]

15. K&R

[UtahLib]

16. It's getting worse every day.

[yardwork]

17. No shit.

[Happyhippychick]

23. It's why I stay far away. I'm neutral. I'll vote for the candidate whoever it is.

But the way Hillary is being discussed is disgusting.

[SCantiGOP]

26. Right on the mark

[Thinkingabout]

27. It breeds a false sense of entitlement, does it change my opinion of Hillary, no, in fact it tells

me I have made the correct choice of candidates.

[riversedge]

32. Not only that but Ifsomeone posts a positive thread

about Hillary in gd-p or even in LBN--it gets hit on--lots of vile comments and the majority of them do not even pertain to the OP--just comments like she is corrupt- or she is a LIAR-no evidence--just vile nasty comments over and over. It has been going on for months now and no one does anything about it.

[NBachers]

33. Sadly, 65% of this place has been taken over by hateful, gibbering blood- jackals.

It's an out-of-control riot of snide comments and smirking contempt. I sure am tired of it. I no longer feel welcome here. I think that's the objective.

They will be glad if they can push me out of here permanently.

[DesertFlower]

53. i agree. nt

[Paladin]

34. K&R, big-time. I'm with you, Loki. (nt)

[great white snark]

35. Yes and that's why I'm so grateful for our AA women who stay while taking the brunt of the hatred.

My only comfort is knowing that much of the discourse comes from cowardly Independents not Democrats.

[Gothmog]

38. I agree with your analysis

[ConsiderThis_2016]

39. Some folks tend to get a little touchy as they get older...

Often it's called a mid life crisis and at times age can do other things. Probably explains the generational divide we see.

[Blue Idaho]

63. the social media generation.

Those who have grown up spending countless hours on all forms of social media tend to lack empathy, respect, and boundaries. Generally speaking, those that have lived longer in the actual world tend to be more respectful, tolerant, measure their words more carefully.

[shadowandblossom]

72. or

perhaps it relates more to facing a great deal of unaknowledged harassment, double standards, and censorship among other things.

[StarzGuy]

40. I've noticed that this site appears to be all Sanders all the time. And...

...there doesn't appear to be any space for Clinton supporters. So, I agree with what you state and I can only hope that we ...all can get along...

BTW, I already voted early for Sanders. But I will vote for Clintonif she wins the nomination.

[misterhighwasted]

42. HERE, this explains GDP

Best example I could find

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027672661

[Loki]

45. Thank you,

So glad we still have them to look back on and laugh.

[onehandle]

43. They're going to lose and they know it.

It's obvious.

[kydo]

46. And of course this was alerted

Didn't leave a comment as I didn't want to get shunned from jury duty, so I was one of the "leave it" votes without comment. But finally a truth post that wasn't hidden by the berners bunch.

Thanks Loki for saying the truth and yet surviving the attacks!

On Fri Mar 11, 2016, 12:41 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

We have a hatred problem on this site.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/110769546

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Threats to trash the Sanders group and the General Discussion Primaries group is nothing more than threatening to vandalize the Democratic Underground website.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Fri Mar 11, 2016, 12:50 AM, and the Jury voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I voted to leave it as it seems the alerter is throwing around hatred too.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: What? This has to be the most ridiculous hyperbolic alert ever
Congrats on winning your award, best victimhood

Juror #5 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: over-the-top
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Ah yes, another primary season at teh DU
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given

[yardwork]

54. Read the alert message! That is hilarious!

Threats to trash the Sanders group and the General Discussion Primaries group is nothing more than threatening to vandalize the Democratic Underground website.


So now we are vandals if we trash the groups that we don't like, just as the Admins set up and urge us to do?!!!

This is hilarious!



(P.S. I am reasonably sure I know the identify of that alerter. Very distinctive writing style.)

[sheshe2]

98. ;)

[DesertRat]

111. Does the alerter know the meaning of "trashing a group"?

Did s/he think it meant to literally "trash" (vandalize) the forum?

[Loki]

89. Thanks for letting me know, I thought it would probably be and it was.

But the alerter obviously doesn't understand what "trashing" means

[johnp3907]

112. What a moron that alerter is!!!!

And now they or one of the other Berniebots will alert on me for calling a moron a moron, just like they did before. They also alerted on my calling their Stainist censorship Stalinism.

[ancianita]

47. Primary season doesn't excuse the venomous talk. Party unity isn't uniformity, but personal attacks

are tough to walk back when it comes to unifying the party for the General Election later.

Early on, Berners warned each other to speak the way Bernie would approve, but too many of them have ignored good advice from their own camp, even.

More people need to go take breaks away from here and not be forced by juries.

I take exception to your comment that anyone here is worse than Trump supporters, however. You will not see Democrats punch, mob or throw out protestors at their rallies. That hasn't happened. So just stop making an unfair characterization of the people whom you argue with.

[yardwork]

59. I took the OP to mean that the people acting that way aren't really Democrats.

I firmly believe that there are trolls on DU pretending to be Democrats whose real purpose is to discourage people from voting for either Bernie or Hillary.

If they can make Bernie supporters look bad while spreading vile lies about Hillary, that's their goal. These people are definitely not Democrats.

Most Bernie supporters don't act that way. As you say, Bernie himself doesn't act that way.

[Cha]

105. The OP said in their "venom" specifically. So she is right. this is Hillary's

Group.. for her Supporters. Just a FYI.

[wryter2000]

50. I have never seen anything like it here before

People dancing with glee because they think right wing talking points will suddenly come true and she'll be indicted for doing absolutely nothing wrong. I can't believe Bernie Sanders would approve of what goes on here.

[SharonClark]

51. I agree

This is what comes from living in a bubble and having their hatred reinforced by the mob; anyone who disagrees with those in the bubble are evil and must be destroyed. It is crazy.

[DesertFlower]

55. i never thought i would see

such hatred against a democratic candidate.

hillary has enough hate directed at her by republicans and has for years. this is sickening.

[Starry Messenger]

58. There are some people on DU I will never look at the same way again.

It's unfortunate, but bullying and group-think has pushed several people into total nastiness. I don't mind honest criticism, but the vile bomb-throwing of disgusting verbiage is insane.

[Lucinda]

66. +1

[yardwork]

78. I feel the same way, Starry.

Even the people reccing hateful threads - I just have to shake my head.

[sheshe2]

100. Saddens me. eom

[Blue Idaho]

60. Total agreement!

The sexism and general level of disrespect is making this place some kind of underground but certainly not a place where any person of conscience can justify frequenting. Certainly no place a true Democrat could be proud to support.

I would not be surprised if this whole thread got locked before I finish typing this - the jury system is a joke and even the HC group moderators act like they are suffering from Stockholm syndrome. Say anything remotely negative about Sen Sanders, his supporters, or the pitiful state of DU and they will disappear your words in the blink of an eye.

It's a shame you can't delete your own account here - if people started doing that - maybe then the people that own this place would understand just how bad things have gotten.

[yardwork]

82. The HC group hosts are doing a fantastic job!

As group hosts, they have very limited powers. They can block people from posting in this group, and they can lock threads. That's it. The hosts don't have the power to delete or hide individual posts, and they certainly can't undo jury decisions.

All hosts on DU are volunteers. There are no moderators. The hosts of the Hillary Clinton group are doing a wonderful job and I thank them!

It sounds to me like you have complaints about the owners of the site.

[Blue Idaho]

115. I have complaints about both.

Last edited Fri Mar 11, 2016, 01:17 AM - Edit history (1)

The HC group hosts do have a difficult task - but they are also overly sensitive to the possible problems the Bernistas can create. They told me as much after locking one of my threads. The reason stated was it might potentially create "headaches" for the group host. Not that it violated anything - but they just didn't want the hassle.

The length of this thread and the number of recommends attests threat I am not the only one who has complaints about the owners of this site.

Be well.

[lovemydog]

61. Few will read this or care, but I'd like to add

that it's gotten much worse in the past couple of weeks. Some Sanders supporters say 'you're an idiot if you judge a candidate by the company they keep' but I do. We should for Donald Trump and Ted Cruz as well. I very much consider the company one keeps as a factor in how I cast my vote. There is no question in my mind that the Hillary supporters at this site have been drowned out in a sea of personal hostility and cliquish mob mentality that I despise. Almost anything positive said about Clinton or even her personality is attacked as being a 'meme' sent out as 'instruction in an email' or some such ludicrous hogwash. I'm not denying there are trolls and campaign operative posting here, but I don't know who they're working for, how many of them there are, or why people who post here cannot seem to understand that many here like me are actually real human beings, individuals who care about the direction in which we're headed, and who enjoy talking with other progressives, democrats and leftists and sometimes agreeing and sometimes agreeing to disagree, but treating one another as real people.

Last night I watched the debate between two good candidates. I posted a couple of things, basically saying that I can and will support both candidates in their runs in both the primaries and the general election. I was saddened to see that nearly none of my online friends in the African American group were posting. I'm very interested in hearing their thoughts about the debate and sharing our feelings about a lot of other things too. I didn't see them posting very much in the General Election: Primaries section of this site either. I saddens me when I look for my online friends and can't find them.

I think we all need to think about the mark we leave both in person and online. Considering every honest attempt among leftists and progressives and democrats that doesn't fit one's narrow view as a conspiracy of evil will merely shrink rather than grow the base of support we need to win all elections, especially at local and congressional levels where it truly matters.

This is not meant as an attack on Bernie Sanders; it's just an expression that both Hillary and Bernie have strong points and weak points and that neither is perfect. I don't believe anyone perfect has even inhabited this earth, and I don't think either Clinton or Sanders is the kind of corporate shill murderous sellout that some on one side of this fence describe. I think Bernie's running an excellent campaign. I'm just concerned - and will will continue to express as long as I'm allowed here - that we all benefit from looking beyond the primaries toward the kind of party or parties we want to inhabit and the kind of ways in which we want to express ourselves.

[Lucinda]

69. Well if you look through GDP you will likely find plenty of

reasons that many in the AA community aren't posting there. There were absolutely vile things said about Southern Black voters in GDP as state after state went firmly for Hillary.

Most of us post there very rarely anymore. It's just too hateful.

[lovemydog]

71. Yes. That's exactly what I'm saying Lucinda.

It saddens me.

[Lucinda]

73. It's horrible. And should have been unacceptable.

Hopefully when we have our nominee the worst of those posters will be gone.

[lovemydog]

75. Agree, it's horrible.

Something weighing on my mind is that we get these promises from the ownership and / or administration after the primaries are over. The reason that upsets me is that it should be fixed immediately. Making a democratic site comfortable for all types of our black friends or all types of any of our friends should never be delayed.

[Lucinda]

110. I always wonder too about new voters, who find us off of the search engines...

DU is usually the first listing that shows up when you search for Democratic Message Boards and someone who might be a brand new voter, or like me, living in a very Republican area, just looking for information or community, walks straight into hell when they enter GDP. I can think of a dozen reasons I wouldn't tolerate what goes on during primaries... for basic decency, for the protection of the diversity we have here, and so many other reasons, but that one, for me, turning off new voters, has lasting repercussions. We are, and should always be, better than what is occurring now. And it shouldn't take Skinner or Elad or EarlG to make us be better. We should be doing it on our own.

[lovemydog]

125. +1

And I'll just my two cents. In my opinion if people on this site aren't doing that on their own (and they clearly aren't) then it should be done by the site owners quickly. Think of all the many younger people who are interested in voting for the first time who would read and join here if this were a place that is welcoming to black people. And is welcoming to people who truly encourage voting or being involved in all aspects of politics.

[GusBob]

116. I read it and I care

Eom

[Trust Buster]

62. I call these situations "auto pilot" moments.

If I cannot respectfully communicate my concerns about a Sanders nomination and get bounced as a result, then this forum is not worth my investment in time and thought. I express my Sanders concerns. I'm on auto pilot.

[MisterFred]

64. Mischaracterization

"done nothing more than run as a Democratic Presidential nominee"

She's lied. A lot. I've called her a liar. That's not hatred. That's honesty. I stand by it. She's a liar. As in the last debate when she tried to tie Sanders to vigilantes. You want to stop the spread of hatred in the primary? Start with your own campaign.

[Blue Idaho]

68. Typical response.

tone deaf and disrespectful.

[Lucinda]

70. He voted for it. There was no lie. n/t

[Loki]

77. Then why are you here?

I'm glad you've been able to keep track of all of the lies that every politician has told through all time. Most people prefer to call it a misstatement. It's rampant in the Republican Party and has been for years. If you think that Bernie is a perfect candidate, may I suggest that you go join his group. I don't know anyone, including myself, that hasn't lied, perhaps I must be talking with one now, MisterFred? I'm not looking for perfection, I'm looking for competence. Perhaps you want a purity test? If you are looking for that, that belongs to the christian wackjobs that like to pretend marry their daughter's so keep them pure for their husbands. Just what do you want in a candidate? Mr. Sander's is not perfect, he has lied, and he does whatever it takes to get elected, just like every other politician, and don't try to pretend that he hasn't. He's human. Hillary has been scrutinized her entire political life. There isn't much we don't know about her, and I personally think that being human and accepting one's faults and frailties is a very important part of becoming or being a good leader. I take offense at this comment on my thread about hatred as if we are the only ones participating in it. If you are pointing a finger, you have three pointing back at yourself. I've never posted anything about Mr. Sander's or his character that would even begin to approach the gall and outright disgusting innuendo and right wing crap I've read on this board about people who support her, people who have campaigned with her, the mother's who have lost their sons to police violence, President Obama, and other's in public office. If a change needs to begin, it needs to begin with us. Your post didn't do it.
,

[misterhighwasted]

81. Outstanding post Loki

[yardwork]

86. ....

[Rose Siding]

80. He voted for in their favor on a stand alone amendment. No lies

You've got nothing. THAT'S honesty. Try it. -In an appropriate forum where they'll buy that garbage.

[yardwork]

84. This is a group for supporters of Hillary Clinton.

If you call Hillary a liar, then you're going to have to leave. You have the rest of DU in which to say that.

[shadowandblossom]

91. Hey MisterFred, no offense but he voted for it and he lied about it during the debate.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/politics/2016/03/10/hillary-clinton-was-right-about-bernie-sanders-minuteman-militia-vote-but-sanders-now-denies-intent/O69kcEQSuHpueuVCsxXO4L/story.html

He's a politician.

You can look at any comments section on youtube with footage of Clinton versus Sanders and compare the comment sections for yourself to see it who is doing the vast, overwhelming amount of harassing. I don't think you'll listen or agree, but there's simply no comparison and I wish that more of the good Sanders supporters would stand up and address it. Worse, is the engaging in censorship. Nasty stuff.

[sheshe2]

93. THIS IS THE HILLARY GROUP.

You are not welcome here.

[Cha]

103. Actually, you need to look at your own candidate before you start accusing Hillary of anything.

[tnvoter]

67. Agreed.

I'm tried of the hate spewed here on a daily basis. People with that kind of hate will fit in better at a conservative site. There is no difference between those who support hateful GOP candidates and those who post here against Hilary. Same talking points.

[yardwork]

87. Same talking points. Exactly.

[pandr32]

94. Truth doesn't matter...it is a war zone out there

Disgraceful, but at least we are relatively safe here, though there are lurkers who sometimes alert. They just can't allow us to support each other or have discussions--it threatens them.

[William769]

99. Kick and one of the best threads yet to recommend!

[sheshe2]

101. ....

[HuckleB]

117. I am leaning toward Sanders.

Yet, when I posted a piece critical of some of his stances, many Sanders supporters were extremely upset by the author's use of the term "Berniebots." It's a play on a Harry Porter reference, and I found it mild and humorous. Yet, many of these same people have no problem spewing vile things at those they think oppose them, including myself. The managed to get that mild post hidden, even. It's really sad.

[johnp3907]

118. If Bernie wasn't running many of these jerks would be Trump supporters.

In fact I wouldn't be at all surprised if they are.

[Blue Idaho]

121. Careful - comments like these

Will get you disappeared around here. The New and Improved Democratic Underground will not tolerate any questioning of the all-mighty and God like presence that is Lord Bernie.

[applegrove]

122. Dehumanizing our candidate is actually an early

'step' in how genocide happens. I hope they are aware of that.

[betsuni]

123. K&R

[anotherproletariat]

124. Yes we do! The bottom line is that the people who understand nuance and complexity support Hillary,

and those who like easy one line campaign slogans: "Build a Wall" "Free College" "No Muslims" "Get the Big Banks" do not take the time to understand the multi-faceted issues facing our country and tend to support other candidates. Those are the same type of people who want easy hate slogans and black and white reasons to dislike someone.

These people need to grow up and realize that the real world is a place where there are not often 'yes' or 'no' answers. It is possible for two good people to both want to be president, and both run for president, pointing out the differences between them. This does not make one or the other a villain. It makes them opponents. The vitriol on this site is very disturbing, and makes me afraid for the future of our country.

Some good news, I was talking with many of my friends at Columbia and Barnard this morning, and realized that almost all of them are Hillary supporters. It's nice to know that so many young people can see the forest through the trees.

[Basic LA]

126. She's treated not as a rival...

But as an enemy, more so than any Republican. It's like she's worse than Nixon! I'm waiting to hear that she caused the Sitka virus!

[harun]

127. One person's problem is anothers feature

Speaking of haunting...

Rally behind the establishment candidate at your own peril.

[Loki]

128. Really, another denier comes to call.

You ban us when we comment in the BS group but you come spreading your delirium like it is truth serum. You speak of peril, you don't know what true peril is. Go back to your little bubble and stay out of our group, unless you can talk like an adult. Establishment candidate my ass, your boy is just as guilty of hypocrisy as the next one.