Hillary Clinton
Related: About this forumWatching Maddow and Sanders interview.
He seems ticked off tonight in most of his answer
He is bound to go to he Convention and try to convince superdels to support him.
Bleacher Creature
(11,235 posts)The same superdelegates he was railing against last month?
This would be hilarious if there weren't any actual consequences.
SunSeeker
(51,369 posts)He basically said the nominee should be picked based on who is more likely to defeat Trump. And, of course, he thinks he does better than Hillary against Trump--citing hypothetical polls. He ignores that Hillary also crushes Trump in those polls.
riversedge
(69,722 posts)spreads--NH--. He thinks those supers should go for him--he will argue that it is the will of people in these cases.
BlueCaliDem
(15,438 posts)Philadelphia, to the Democratic Convention, to contest super delegates even IF he's behind. He doesn't appear to want to concede no matter not. He wants to get the super-dels of the States he's won (even the ones where they had caucuses, rather than actual primaries). He believes he's owed them.
Either he's just saying it to keep the fund-raising gravy train going, or he's angry and means it.
riversedge
(69,722 posts)said in another post--he seems extra irritated tonight. IMHO Thanks for filling in important information.
BlueCaliDem
(15,438 posts)And yes, I agree, he appeared extra agitate tonight. I guess he didn't like the news that people have said that Obama told donors behind closed doors that it's time to unite behind Hillary Clinton. That seemed to really piss him off.
Rose Siding
(32,623 posts)Now he was that despised establishment to belong to him. It is the way of most revolutions. Revolting in all meanings of the word.
charlyvi
(6,537 posts)And let's give Hillary ALL the delegates in the states she has won. How does he think this helps him?
jmowreader
(50,451 posts)Under the current rules, including superdelegates Hillary has 1606 and Sanders 851.
If it was winner-take-all across the board, Hillary would have 1792 and Sanders 517.
shadowandblossom
(718 posts)charlyvi
(6,537 posts)stopbush
(24,378 posts)He would end up with more supers based on the states he's won than he has now. Hillary would lose supers that she already has. That's why he's framing his argument the way he is.
charlyvi
(6,537 posts)Last edited Fri Mar 18, 2016, 01:07 PM - Edit history (1)
But he won't get enough SDs to flip over to him if he's behind in pledged delegates. Not within the Dem apparatus when he's only been one for 10 months against a woman who has worked within the party for 40 years. If he manages to tie or exceed the number of PDs Clinton has that's a different ballgame, but the odds of that happening are slim to none.
msrizzo
(796 posts)If he makes a big stink about it I would prefer eliminating the superdelegates all together (they are supposed to be untethered to the state vote, after all) instead of just duplicating what already happened in the primary and forcing party leaders to vote against their will. If they eliminate them and make the number needed for nomination the same percentage as it was with superdelegates, Hillary would still win. I don't know why he wants to make this so personal to elected party officials. It's like he is declaring war on them and then wanting to be their leader. That's called conquest not consensus.
charlyvi
(6,537 posts)But I'm not absolving Bernie at all. If Bernie's campaign does it, then Bernie does it.
obamanut2012
(25,911 posts)She gets all the delegates of all the states and caucuses she's won, right?
Seriously, wtf. this is actually enraging me.
synergie
(1,901 posts)superdelegates but PLEDGED ones as well. Basically saying screw you to all who voted and all that Clinton has won. They were planning on the MILLIONS from the revolution to get that popular vote, but failed to achieve those turnouts he still keeps talking about.
http://crooksandliars.com/2016/03/sanders-camp-lays-out-strategy-remaining
Or he could just be being fleeced by Tad Devine. He FAR outspent Clinton in every state he lost on Tuesday.
BlueCaliDem
(15,438 posts)It feels as if the Sanders campaign is coming apart at the seams.
Bernie himself appeared really agitated this evening on Rachel's show.
synergie
(1,901 posts)Has anyone bothered to ask what happened with the FEC filings? I saw sonething about "real people" of something? What is that supposed to mean?
BlueCaliDem
(15,438 posts)About the FEC: they demanded a response last night (March 17, 2016) and the letter stated, in bold, that they will not get another extension.
You can read about those troubling donations and even more troubling book keeping of the Sanders campaign at The People's View. That piece also contains links to the two letters notifying Bernie2016 of their shoddy book keeping. I mean, donors are exceeding the FEC limits by thousands of dollars and there are 665 donations coming from international addresses that haven't proven to be U.S. citizens!
LannyDeVaney
(1,033 posts)interesting. Talk about a flip-flop!
SunSeeker
(51,369 posts)rock
(13,218 posts)"We can't beat Hillary, but we can beat Trump!"
charlyvi
(6,537 posts)I'd like to see his poll numbers after going through what Hillary has gone through with them! They would rather run against him, though, so they they've barely touched him.
Basic LA
(1,710 posts)...to direct "Bernie's Soviet Honeymoon."
charlyvi
(6,537 posts)Chevy
(1,063 posts)he has never run a national campaign till now lets see how his 20 point lead drops when the Republican slime machine fires up and unloads everything including the kitchen sink at him(Or has the Clinton's call that any given Monday) More curious how his supporters would handle such a onslaught on their candidate considering what we have seen so far from them.
SunSeeker
(51,369 posts)Not only have they not touched him, they've been helping him! They desperately want to run against him, not Hillary.
obamanut2012
(25,911 posts)Hillary has more votes and more PDs and more SDs. he has Vermont and the GOP shivering in joy over attack ads.
SunSeeker
(51,369 posts)synergie
(1,901 posts)were planning on harassing the pledged delegates. He's lying his butt off about it today, but the video and a transcript prove it, as does that nastiness in Iowa. They had apparently pre-programmed some paranoia into the ones they actually won, and were doing their best to steal more.
livetohike
(22,084 posts)the many reasons I can't envision him as a President. He doesn't like to be challenged. I guess Rachel is getting to him.
still_one
(91,962 posts)livetohike
(22,084 posts)Presidential material. 😊
still_one
(91,962 posts)synergie
(1,901 posts)an old man with constipation who would get all crotchety waiting for an enema in the ER she had to deal with a few times. And she keeps asking if his wife is involved in farming or with horses or something. Apparently they remind her of poor white people in rural areas who came in to the ER that she covered on the weekends when I was growing up.
She thinks there is something very shifty about both of them, but she also loves Hillary, so she might be a bit biased.
DURHAM D
(32,595 posts)OwlinAZ
(410 posts)She will lose.
sufrommich
(22,871 posts)riversedge
(69,722 posts)in the sanders Group crying. Thank you.
George II
(67,782 posts)Bleacher Creature
(11,235 posts)riversedge
(69,722 posts)wysi
(1,512 posts)She's beating your guy, and she will wipe the floor with Trump in November.
riversedge
(69,722 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)where he can be singularly focused.
riversedge
(69,722 posts)sheshe2
(83,341 posts)Not.
fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)Response to OwlinAZ (Reply #5)
Post removed
still_one
(91,962 posts)Cha
(295,912 posts)you haven't noticed.
R B Garr
(16,920 posts)under the bus, so it's no wonder where his supporters get their discriminatory attitudes.
riversedge
(69,722 posts)a bit scary ===for lack of other words at the moment.
R B Garr
(16,920 posts)proving to be quite self-centered and divisive. Now the super delegates are okay if they go his way, but for Hillary, it's attack, attack, attack. He acts like people can't see and understand his duplicity.
Cha
(295,912 posts)doesn't do online politics.
I told her she was dead on in my opinion.
How the hell are the super dels going to want someone who's losing and acts like that. They're smart.. they know they want anyone like that for POTUS.
still_one
(91,962 posts)cannot win the general election.
That is why President Obama won, and the same reason that Hillary will win.
In regard to your second statement you are absolutely right about discriminatory attitudes.
Setsuna1972
(332 posts)Right out of Bernie's mouth to the Berniebots to repeat and insult people in the south. Actually had one tell me that Hillary only won the Confederacy on Twitter !
DesertFlower
(11,649 posts)watching the debates about a month ago i changed to hillary. i realized if he was elected there's no way congress would work with him. they wouldn't work with obama who has a much nicer personality. he couldn't get an infrastructure bill passed. he barely got ACA passed. why would they work with bernie whose constantly saying they're bought?
livetohike
(22,084 posts)colleagues. They don't think he's the best candidate. He's so self righteous, they probably don't like to work with him.
SunSeeker
(51,369 posts)If he can't even get Congressional Dems to rally around him, how's he going to get Republicans?
griffi94
(3,731 posts)He's from a very small, very white, very liberal state. He's never had to
work with anybody.
Bernie is more of a social critic than anything else. It's easy to agree with
his issues but he'll never get any of them passed.
He's been in the senate for years and never worked on the coalitions and relationships
needed to run for POTUS.
It's the same reason he bombs with minorities. I know he marched with Dr. King but what's he done in the last
40+ years besides sit in Vermont and point out how both parties suck.
He was in a position to lead his revolution at any time. Why doesn't he start in the senate.
At this point he's not much more than a commentator who will be happy to lead but only
if he can start at the top.
Bluestar
(1,400 posts)Have not heard one concrete proposal from him yet. Just the same old stump speech over and over again. I wonder who is going to do all work and come up with the ideas? Gee, I really like this group!
I find him cranky as well.
I think what a lot of his supporters hear is free tuition
and better paying jobs and single payer healthcare for all.
I'm for all of those things as well. I just don't believe him when
he says he can deliver them.
livetohike
(22,084 posts)of the free world. Although if he lives long enough, he may primary Hillary in 2020 when he is 79 years old.
I think he is looking at this as his last gasp to get his ideology out there and is finding few takers. His big rallies aren't creating converts that vote.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Last edited Fri Mar 18, 2016, 08:17 AM - Edit history (1)
My experience indicates the best (most accurate) references come from a candidate's peers. A candidate can look great on paper, have superior supervisory reviews, be technically off the charts, and motivated/enthusiastic as all get out ... but if his/her peers report can't work with his/her, the candidate is a poor fit.
SunSeeker
(51,369 posts).
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)the most fantastic scenarios.
I can't tell if he is that disingenuous, or that delusional.
What I took away from that interview is that he wants to win the nomination no matter what it takes...even if it going against the will of the majority of the voters.
Hekate
(90,189 posts).... what's good for other people, much better than they know themselves.
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)he arrived in Congress. If his revolution is not working with other members of Congress the his revolution did not serve him very well.
Squinch
(50,773 posts)bills that said people shouldn't do things that were already illegal.
Don't know why you can't see the revolution in that. You probably just don't understand his greatness.
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)Squinch
(50,773 posts)Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)Squinch
(50,773 posts)I couldn't figure out why he's been filing his nails in Congress all these years if what he wanted was a revolution.
livetohike
(22,084 posts)Justice
(7,182 posts)Then said winning in Michigan same as winning Illinois and Ohio without mentioning they are not in the south.
He always comes across angry about issues but tonight he was just angry. Not pleasant.
He looked very good but was a little too close to the camera.
stopbush
(24,378 posts)That's a dog whistle for sure.
spooky3
(34,302 posts)It's unbelievable that he said that. Can't wait to hear how he tries to dismiss CA and NY when she wins there too.
Rose Siding
(32,623 posts)SunSeeker
(51,369 posts)But Scarborough had no qualms pontificating about how Hillary needs to smile more--even though she's not the grumpy one!!
still_one
(91,962 posts)New York and Penn
It seems that Sanders has the same temperment as John Mccain, oh my
riversedge
(69,722 posts)said that their polls show a tighter race in AZ.
still_one
(91,962 posts)was from March 3. The latest Arizona poll from March 7 has Hillary up +26, and Pennsylvania from March 2 has Hillary up +30
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/ny/new_york_democratic_presidential_primary-4221.html
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/az/arizona_democratic_presidential_primary-5466.html
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/pa/pennsylvania_democratic_presidential_primary-4249.html
While it is good to be skeptical about the polls, New York and Pennsylvania are closed primaries, so only Democrats can vote in the Democratic primary.
California is semi-closed, which means if they register as an independent, 1 month before the election they must request a Democratic or republican ballot. They cannot mix and match. There are no recent polls for California, but the odds our the nominee will have been determined by then.
Sanders also said he had a good shot in Ohio and North Carolina. We will see
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Cha
(295,912 posts)he says of value.
GusBob
(7,286 posts)He's a liar
charlyvi
(6,537 posts)Cha
(295,912 posts)by 16 points and lost Michigan by 2.
Bernie's losing.
msrizzo
(796 posts)I refuse to let them pick our nominee.
Cha
(295,912 posts)msrizzo
(796 posts)I'm around just laying low.
stopbush
(24,378 posts)He will never get Hillary's super delegates to flip. She has 464. He has, what, 24?
He obviously has NO support among the party regulars who are the supers. They're with Hillary. It's delusional to believe those hundreds of super delegates will change their allegiance to an Independent posing as a D.
Bernie's rational: "Hillary easily beats Trump in the polls, but I beat him even moreso" is not compelling.
Agnosticsherbet
(11,619 posts)He intends to try to game the system and force get the nomination without having won it.
I've seen people making those same accusations of Clinton.
The more I learn about him, the less I like him.
riversedge
(69,722 posts)make sure I was awake and hearing correctly.
stopbush
(24,378 posts)He says he's won more under-30 votes than Hill & Trump together. "That's the future of the D party" sez BS. So, we can see his narrative developing: he's getting killed in every metric that matters, so we'll redefine and narrow the focus until we find a statistic that makes BS look better than Hill.
His grand plan is to flip the super delegates because he polls better among people wearing beanies while eating couscous than does Hillary.
Childish, obvious and ridiculous.
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)apparently the thought is he has more votes than Trump so he could beat Trump. As you say Hillary has more votes, guess this must make her a winner.
pandr32
(11,447 posts)He is trying to game the system, and he will try to hype up his supporters to help him force the DNC to see things his way. Meanwhile the dollars will still flow to him instead of donors paying off their college loans with it. Jane can continue to get commissions on ad buys!
LexVegas
(6,005 posts)Treant
(1,968 posts)gwheezie
(3,580 posts)His face was all flushed.
still_one
(91,962 posts)Angry all the time
pandr32
(11,447 posts)still_one
(91,962 posts)riversedge
(69,722 posts)actually looked like a new suit-well pressed. I wonder if this is the new look???
gwheezie
(3,580 posts)Maybe his face wasn't flushed, it might be a spray tan.
jmowreader
(50,451 posts)The hardest job in this entire campaign so far must be Bernie's makeup artist. I assure you it is a living bitch to tone down Bernie-level flushing on a male, because you have to use a LOT of product and you don't want it to look like you're using any. That, and his preferred hairstyle is the very unpresidential "bed head all the time" that they're going to have to talk him out of if he manages to make it past the primaries.
pandr32
(11,447 posts)He started the campaign by trying to paint Hillary Clinton and her supporters as perceiving that she was entitled.
Hillary's hard campaign work, the endless debates and Town Halls that showcased her qualifications, the groups and people she has met with and the endorsements she has earned, the detailed plans she has worked out and put forward, the constant right-wing smears she has had to wipe off--thanks to Sanders this time, and the Congressional coalition she has put together because of all of the qualifications and experience she has from working so hard for so long, and the fact that she has been a Democrat who has worked hard to help other Democrats---all be damned!
Sanders wants it!
Because the rhetoric he has spewed for decades finally sounded new to a group of predominantly young white people who don't seem to care that the actual factual details don't jive with the talking points, because he has been living in the same rut in a small state with little to challenge him, because he has been a career politician for decades with little to show for it, because he thought he could suddenly declare himself a Democrat and run against a woman who has been hammered by the GOP and grab the nomination for himself, because he finally feels like a leader of a revolution even though it is largely in his mind, and because he has let his ego get ahead of any good sense he may have had at some point--he thinks he is the one who should be given the nomination in the end...
...even if Hillary Clinton already earned it the traditional and proper way.
Wow! Just wow!
spooky3
(34,302 posts)Who feel entitled. Entitled to choose the candidate we prefer.
I get really sick of hearing about Clinton's alleged sense of entitlement, "coronation", etc. I consider it part of the sexist reaction to her given there is NO evidence that she expected to sidestep the hard slog of campaigning, fund raising, etc.
pandr32
(11,447 posts)You make a couple great points yourself!
Sanders set out to paint Hillary Clinton as corrupt and entitled from the beginning, even without any evidence--it makes me sick, too.
spooky3
(34,302 posts)So few endorsements from colleagues.
I wonder what we will hear when he picks up a few delegates in Idaho, Utah, etc.
riversedge
(69,722 posts)Hekate
(90,189 posts)pandr32
(11,447 posts)Response to riversedge (Original post)
Her Sister This message was self-deleted by its author.
still_one
(91,962 posts)Her Sister
(6,444 posts)but you are right about NY's primary.
still_one
(91,962 posts)KewlKat
(5,624 posts)He wants a brokered convention.....blah blah blah....same as drumpf....only if BS is behind, doesn't matter, he has a better chance at beating drumpf and therefore deserves and should get the nomination. I'm recording the show in a bit so I can capture some of his dilusional statements....I couldn't believe what I was hearing! We have a pair, bookends.
http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/watch/bernie-sanders-touts-strength-on-trade-647053891730
interview tonight on maddow's show.
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(107,090 posts)Remember those fabulous 60's?
Then came the 70s.
charlyvi
(6,537 posts)Probably fits him better these days.
riversedge
(69,722 posts)Peter is right. Bernie will be arguing he is better able to defeat Trump. Yes, he did emphasis that during the interview.
Peter Daou ?@peterdaou 2h2 hours ago
Does anyone else find it ironic that #Bernie's main argument now is electability and superdelegates? After #Hillary was slammed for that?
DemonGoddess
(4,640 posts)that's for sure.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I would call him a competitor, who is realizing his history bucking the Democratic Party puts him at a disadvantage and feeling no obligation to respect Democratic rules or convention.
BlueMTexpat
(15,349 posts)Great to see you back, 1SBM! I enjoyed your PMs in the interim!
Hopefully, never again will you be held hostage by those who wish to censor your speech!
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)BlueMTexpat
(15,349 posts)But yes!
DemonGoddess
(4,640 posts)who fights dirty. Look at what he did to Kunin when he ran against her for governor of Vermont. He has a HISTORY of this.
By the way, glad to see you back!
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(107,090 posts)Her Sister
(6,444 posts)Seems likes to be totally dismissive of competitor. As if he knows better
hamsterjill
(15,214 posts)Desperate measures. I think he knows the writing is on the wall.
Tarheel_Dem
(31,207 posts)obamanut2012
(25,911 posts)Wow. Talk about someone feeling anointed.
DemonGoddess
(4,640 posts)my stomach hurts. ugh. He actually said he would want PBO to recuse his nomination for SCOTUS, if he won the nomination. That's ridiculous. It is the SITTING President's job to nominate for the vacancy. It is the SENATE's job to vote on the nominee. IT DOESN'T MATTER what happens in November. This has to be addressed now. PBO is president until January 2017.
Hekate
(90,189 posts)You want unicorns farting rainbows? Any doubt I ever had about where Bernie's more woo-woo supporters get their fantasies just finished evaporating.
My gods -- he would want Obama to withdraw a perfectly good nominee just so he, BS, could enact his personal fantasy of nominating the flamingest liberal in the entire country. IF he becomes POTUS. And, true to form, he believes this is a chance worth taking because why? Because Congress will magically bow to his every whim once he becomes POTUS.
Sure. Just like they did for Barack Obama.
riversedge
(69,722 posts)Hekate
(90,189 posts)Man, he's really holding on. Which is admirable, but is going to make for a problematic Convention. All that sneering from Sanders' supporters about a Hillary "coronation" was always bullshit, but this is stretching it more than I thought.
Okay, that's two Conventions that are about to be overrun by insurgents -- the GOP and ours. I hope the heck we can line up the downballot races for Democratic candidates so at least SOME of the people's business can get done regardless of who wins.
NastyRiffraff
(12,448 posts)You watched Bernie so I don't have to! Lately I can't stand to look at him, let alone hear him.
Tarheel_Dem
(31,207 posts)livetohike
(22,084 posts)when he is on and I can't stand to look at him. His body language and angry, contorted face are disturbing.
DemonGoddess
(4,640 posts)Believe me, I didn't want to. That's why I skipped the original broadcast. He makes me ill.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)Walk away
(9,494 posts)by a huge margin! If he keeps this up he will solidify his cult like base but hemorrhage most of his support from Progressive Democrats. All that work trying to turn Democrats into Socialists will probably go down the drain. He will look more and more like a failed Donald Trump.
riversedge
(69,722 posts)-a brokered convention for the Democrats after the interview was over. She was musing on what was said. She did sound a bit surprised that Bernie is so forcefully saying this about the super delegates.
msrizzo
(796 posts)How can it be if Hillary will have the delegates to win? What is he going to do? Sue and make them cancel the convention? Is he trying to make himself the enemy of the Democratic Party? Maybe he will try to get his case heard by that whacko judge that keeps moving Larry Klayman's ridiculous Judicial Watch lawsuits forward.
NastyRiffraff
(12,448 posts)is that he doesn't care about the Democratic Party, or, for that matter, the country or his own supporters. He cares about himself. I don't think he initially expected to come this far, but now that he has he wants it ALL. Doesn't matter if it leaves a scorched earth, it's all about him.
DURHAM D
(32,595 posts)spent the past year yelling about the Teaparty instead of Hillary and the establishment?
Quayblue
(1,045 posts)and it makes me very suspicious of him.
riversedge
(69,722 posts)actual path to the nomination is the wooing over--the demand for super delegates--to vote for him -esp. in states that have--or might have a high voter count for him.
Walk away
(9,494 posts)He has already threatened Super Delegates with his Berniecult followers in their own states. He seems to be taking his cues from Trump and Fidel Castro! Why am I not surprised???
George II
(67,782 posts)....to choose the nominee?
And just who is "Camp Weathervane"?
By the way, he seems ticked off ALL the time.
Her Sister
(6,444 posts)polls polls polls (Which are total proof that he'd win against Trump!) He really loves them polls.
This is what he is going to use to try to convince delegates!! WTF
No matter that more people are voting for HRC!
We are voting. It shows who we want to represent us in the Democrat's side.
katmille
(213 posts)To parts of the Bernie interview and seeing tweets from some of his supporters, I'm no so sure I could vote for him IF he were to be the nominee. I've voted in every election since 1960, and almost all the local ones -- school boards, county commissioners, mayor and council members -- so I know in my heart that I would not sit out the 2016 election. But, damn! What a mess it would be if Bernie Sanders (I-VT) represents the Democratic Party.