Cuba digs in heels on concessions as part of better US ties

[Zorro]

The start of talks on repairing 50 years of broken relations appears to have left President Raul Castro's government focused on winning additional concessions without giving in to U.S. demands for greater freedoms, despite the seeming benefits that warmer ties could have for the country's struggling economy.

Following the highest-level open talks in three decades between the two nations, Cuban officials remained firm in rejecting significant reforms pushed by the United States as part of President Barack Obama's surprise move to re-establish ties and rebuild economic relations with the Communist-led country.

"One can't think that in order to improve and normalize relations with the U.S., Cuba has to give up the principles it believes in," Cuba's top diplomat for U.S. affairs, Josefina Vidal, told The Associated Press after the end of the talks. "Changes in Cuba aren't negotiable."

It's not clear if Cuba's tough stance is part of normal negotiation tactics or a hardened position that could prevent the talks from moving forward.

http://news.yahoo.com/cuba-digs-heels-concessions-part-better-us-ties-223741839.html

Ball's in your court, Raul. Obama already took the first step.

[delrem]

1. The USA has never given a flying fuck about freedom and democracy

in Latin America, South America, or anywhere in the world.
The USA has overthrown democracies, has trained and funded terrorist right-wing death squads and has backed the world's worst despots. And the USA has used economic coercion in attempts to enforce extremist capitalist practices.

Why should Cuba "make concessions" to the USA?

Because a bunch of right-wing troubadours, pretending that they're all about defending "democracy" and "freedom", say "balls in your court, Raul?". That's no argument when it comes, as it does, from hell.

[Zorro]

2. And for the past 50 years Cuba

has been such a paragon of freedom and democracy that there is no need to even consider any compromise with the US, despite Obama's overtures. That's apparently the attitude of the Castro brothers and their bootlicking Stalinist cheerleaders.

Seems to me they'd rather have the embargo and travel constraints continue so they can maintain their free and democratic lifestyle in that paradise that is Cuba today. Well, OK by me, then. Fuck 'em.

[lsewpershad]

4. No some want the Cubans

to be "boot licking" America.

[reorg]

7. somebody thought 'Zorro' was not a troubadour

or something. Thought I should let you know:


On Mon Jan 26, 2015, 03:17 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

The USA has never given a flying fuck about freedom and democracy
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1108&pid=36544

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Over-the-top personal insults. This poster has a habit of making them.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Mon Jan 26, 2015, 03:27 AM, and the Jury voted 0-7 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Huh?? Seems pretty spot-on to me.
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: 'Right-wing troubadour' is not an insult, it is used as a descriptive term here.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Whom is being insulted? Alerter, you need to learn the fucking game.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Sorry, but I'm not seeing the "over-the-top" personal insult, here. Beside which, some of those accusations are true! Leave it.

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

[delrem]

8. Thanks. 7/0. For once the fuckers didn't get me for speaking truth. nt

[Zorro]

13. Speaking truth?

Hardee har har!

"The USA has never given a flying fuck about freedom and democracy..." Yeah, right.

Looks to me you share the same perspective of other US-hating posters who infest Democratic web sites, trolling for like minds to reinforce the dominant Republican meme that Dems despise their own country.

Profane, loudmouthed, and obnoxious isn't a good way to go through life, son. Makes you sound like a teabagger.

[delrem]

15. Yes.

The USA has never given a flying fuck about freedom and democracy in Latin America, South America, or anywhere in the world.
The USA has overthrown democracies, has trained and funded terrorist right-wing death squads and has backed the world's worst despots. And the USA has used economic coercion in attempts to enforce extremist capitalist practices.

You can try to portray the history of US involvement in Latin America as being about promoting "democracy" and "freedom", but the cognitive dissonance of your portrayal vs the actual historical fact says all that is needed to be said about you and your goals.

[Zorro]

9. So then you agree that "The USA has never given a flying fuck about freedom and democracy"?

[flamingdem]

10. Well said delrem!!

Totally agree. The ball is in the court of the USA and world opinion.

I hope the BS is for show. If Wet foot is ending they will do it without warning.

[lsewpershad]

3. President Obama

is trying to resolve a problem created by the American Govt. I agree America wants to be in control not only in LA..... remember the Monroe doctrine.... extend that to the world.... regarding the new trade policies ...in Asia...."Why should we allow China... [fill in the blanks} When or where will it end???

[roody]

5. I did not click. Does the article

give an actual example of a greater freedom that the US wants?

[reorg]

6. I clicked

an article with a similar topic and the only "freedoms" mentioned there were freedom of movement for US diplomats and freedom to demand the extradition of political refugees:

Even a relatively simple measure such as granting U.S. diplomats freedom of movement around Cuba, she said, is tied to reduced U.S. support of dissidents, whom Cuba says are breaking the law by acting to undermine the government of behalf of U.S. interests.

"It's associated with a change in behavior in the diplomatic missions as such and of the diplomatic officials, who must conduct themselves as our officials in Washington do, with total respect for the laws of that country," Vidal said.

She also said Cuba has not softened its refusal to turn over U.S. fugitives granted asylum in Cuba. The warming of relations has spawned new demands in the U.S. for the State Department to seek the return of fugitives including Joanne Chesimard, a Black Liberation Army member now known as Assata Shakur, who fled to Cuba after she was convicted in 1977 of killing a New Jersey state trooper.

Vidal said the two nations' extradition treaty "had a very clear clause saying that the agreement didn't apply to people who could be tied to crimes of a political nature."

http://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2015/01/25/cuba-digs-in-heels-on-concessions-as-part-of-better-us-ties

[roody]

12. Thanks. Seems ironic because I can move

about Cuba as I please, but I don't go there to undermine the government.

[Mika]

11. Good thing that the Cuban gov isn't demanding more freedoms and dissident releases in the US.

What I find interesting is that whenever US politicos go to Cuba they get holy hell for not meeting with dissidents because they tell the "real story" of what Cuba is really like, but, imagine, if you will, if foreign diplomats and negotiators went to meet with Occupy, or Ferguson, or imprisoned pot smokers (all political dissidents) because they tell the "real story" of what the USA is really like.

Yeah, that would go over like a turd in a punchbowl. Just like in Cuba. But, no matter, US diplomats and US pols do it anyway, further demonstrating that they don't care about Cubans in Cuba, nor the ridiculousness of such activity.

[bemildred]

14. Good. Cuba doesn't owe us anything for deciding to talk to them. nt