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Thu Aug 24, 2017, 02:56 PM

 

Public school systems of Latin America

ARGENTINA







BRAZIL







CHILE





COLOMBIA





MEXICO





CUBA














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Arrow 21 replies Author Time Post
Reply Public school systems of Latin America (Original post)
OBenario4 Aug 2017 OP
GatoGordo Aug 2017 #1
OBenario4 Aug 2017 #2
GatoGordo Aug 2017 #3
Judi Lynn Aug 2017 #12
Bacchus4.0 Aug 2017 #16
GatoGordo Aug 2017 #17
OBenario4 Sep 2017 #18
Judi Lynn Sep 2017 #19
GatoGordo Aug 2017 #4
Judi Lynn Aug 2017 #5
GatoGordo Aug 2017 #6
Marksman_91 Aug 2017 #7
Judi Lynn Aug 2017 #8
GatoGordo Aug 2017 #11
Judi Lynn Aug 2017 #9
Marksman_91 Aug 2017 #10
Zorro Aug 2017 #14
Marksman_91 Aug 2017 #15
GatoGordo Aug 2017 #13
Judi Lynn Sep 2017 #20
GatoGordo Sep 2017 #21

Response to OBenario4 (Original post)

Thu Aug 24, 2017, 03:39 PM

1. Amazing!

 

Cuba must be a paradise of free everything.
Free education? the State provides!
Free healthcare? the State provides!

You should move there, open up your laptop from the (free?) internet patio of your (free?) house and tell us all about the liberties you enjoy in a free Cuba. The minimum wage is equivalent to $0.12-0.15 per hour.

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Response to GatoGordo (Reply #1)

Thu Aug 24, 2017, 04:00 PM

2. Yep, minimum wage is quite low.

 

On the other hand, they don't have 300 people sleeping on each street like in São Paulo or New York.

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Response to OBenario4 (Reply #2)

Thu Aug 24, 2017, 07:24 PM

3. Maybe we should ask those people if they would rather live in Cuba?

 

I haven't read about the mass influx of people pouring into Cuba. As a matter of fact, I don't see a whole lot of anonymous, armchair Marxists pounding on embassy gates seeking to emigrate. After all, who wouldn't want to give up every personal liberty in order to be coddled by a dictator?

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Response to GatoGordo (Reply #3)

Fri Aug 25, 2017, 11:41 PM

12. As so many people know, some Miami "exiles" go back to Cuba.

That became known by anyone sober who watched tv news when Elian Gonzalez was held prisoner by the gusano community in Miami, and it was reported by national media that his great uncle Lazaro had met Elian twice before, when he was even younger, during two trips he made to Cuba on vacation. He was reported as having spent his days fishing, and his evenings in the hotel bars, and slept in Juan Miguel's own bedroom, while Juan Miguel slept outside in his car, to accommodate his father's brother. Very nice gesture, and Lazaro felt obligated to repay his generosity once, by buying him a goat. That's right, a goat.

So if "exiles" are so terrified of "commie" Cuba, why do they go back there? Aren't they afraid of being flung into prison and beaten until they squeak? A lot of US Americans have wondered about that once they heard about it.

Other Cubans do it, including the couple which survived the ordeal with Elian, which took the lives of the others on board, one of whom was Elian's mother Elisabet's boyfriend, an ex-con from Cuba who had killed a man in a fight, also named "Lazaro." He was unable to get a visa from the US Interests Section in Havana due to his violent record, but had made the crossing multiple times, staying with relatives in Miami, before deciding to go back, get Elisabet, her kid, and some paying customers and heading back to Miami.

From a book written by Anne Louise Bardach, a former journalist with the New York Times, who did a major series of articles on an interview with Luis Posada Carriles, one of the two masterminds of the Cubana airliner mid-air bombing which murdered well over 70 people, including children in a Cuban fencing team;

In Cuba, one used to be either a revolucionario or a contrarevolucionario, while those who decided to leave were gusanos (worms) or escoria (scum). In Miami, the rhetoric has also been harsh. Exiles who do not endorse a confrontational policy with Cuba, seeking instead a negotiated settlement, have often been excoriated as traidores (traitors) and sometimes espías (spies). Cubans, notably cultural stars, who visit Miami but choose to return to their homeland have been routinely denounced. One either defects or is repudiated.

But there has been a slow but steady shift in the last decade-a nod to the clear majority of Cubans en exilio and on the island who crave family reunification. Since 1978, more than one million airline tickets have been sold for flights from Miami to Havana. Faced with the brisk and continuous traffic between Miami and Havana, hard-liners on both sides have opted to deny the new reality. Anomalies such as the phenomenon of reverse balseros, Cubans who, unable to adapt to the pressures and bustle of entrepreneurial Miami, return to the island, or gusañeros, expatriots who send a portion of their earnings home in exchange for unfettered travel back and forth to Cuba (the term is a curious Cuban hybrid of gusano and compañero, or comrade), are unacknowledged by both sides, as are those who live in semi-exilio, returning home to Cuba for long holidays.


Page XVIII
Preface
Cuba Confidential
Love and Vengeance
In Miami and Havana

Copyright© 2002 by
Ann Louise Bardach

https://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3023618#3024362

Don't forget Eloy Gutierrez Menoyo, who drove a lot of Miami gusanos wild when he decided, on a vacation with his wife and family to Cuba, to NOT return to the United States with them. He was even threatened by the U.S. Government once it was known he was staying there, which was a very conspicuous move by the George W Bush administration.

From an earlier link:

Eloy Gutierrez Menoyo threatened by US for living in Cuba
Posted February 09, 2005

Anthony Boadle | Reuters

A U.S. resident who had spent 22 years in a Cuban prison for opposing communism and returned to the island to work for democracy now faces a U.S. jail threat for violating travel restrictions.

Eloy Gutierrez Menoyo, a Cuban exile who returned in 2003, has been warned by the U.S. Treasury Department that he could be fined $250,000 or sent to prison for 10 years for staying in Cuba in violation of sanctions intended to isolate the government of Fidel Castro.

“They don’t understand: I am not a tourist in Cuba, I am an activist working to establish a legal space for an independent opposition,” Gutierrez Menoyo said on Tuesday in an interview.

“It is illogical. I’m here seeking freedom and the United States comes and tells me I face a 10-year prison sentence,” he complained.

More:
http://havanajournal.com/politics/entry/eloy_gutierrez_menoyo_threatened_by_us_for_living_in_cuba/
https://www.democraticunderground.com/110836176#post6

More on Eloy Gtierrez Menoyo, posted by tremendous, knowledgeable source DU'er, Mika, who has lived and worked in Cuba, made many trips back and forth, has family and friends there still, of course:

Mika Donating Member Sun Dec-03-06 08:14 PM
Response to Reply #49

52. Gutierrez Menoyo now lives in Cuba. After his move back to Cuba, the US won't let him visit the US.
Edited on Sun Dec-03-06 08:34 PM by Mika

According to the new BushCrimeInc dictate Mr. Gutierrez Menoyo has violated the rules regarding his length of stay in Cuba. He has reclaimed his right to live in Cuba as he is a Cuban citizen who never sought asylum in the US. In doing so he now is refused a US visa to visit his family in Miami, or do any speaking engagements in the US.

He has formed a new political party, Cambio Cubano/Cuban Change, (contrary to the ignorant belief that Cuba has only one political party) that works within the current electoral system in Cuba. He has not been persecuted in any way in Cuba. He has been soundly vilified by the hard line exiles in Miami.


and, also extremely informed source, SayWhat,whose source Wayne S. Smith served the U.S. as the Head of the U.S. Interests Section in Havana, Cuba:

54. Wayne Smith Comments on Eloy Gutierrez Menoyo

Yes, Mika. Menoyo is light years beyond the others. I admire him and what he stands for. He is a 'when they made him, they threw the mold away' kind of individual. I've watched him with much interest since Elian and Juan Miguel graced our shores.

<clips>

Just when you think U.S. policy and actions toward Cuba cannot possibly get any dumber, they do. The actions the Treasury Department is threatening to take against Eloy Gutierrez Menoyo are truly mind-boggling. Here he is, a man who fought against Castro, was captured arms in hand and spent 22 years in prison. Released in the late 1980s, he went to Miami and formed an opposition group called Cuban Change (Cambio Cubano), but said all along that he did not want to be an "exile leader;" rather, he wanted to return to Cuba and lead Cambio Cubano from within the island, but as a group that would work within the law and be recognized by the government. In effect, a loyal opposition. Feeling that time was passing him by, a year and a half ago, after a visit to Cuba with his wife and children, he announced that he was not returning to the United States; rather, he would remain in Cuba indefinitely. This was a rather dangerous thing to do, given that he did not have any authorization from the Cuban government, which made it clear that it was unhappy with his decision. But remain he did, and the Cuban government tolerated it. He has not opened a Cambio Cubano office, but, as he puts it, "there's still time."

No one would ever say that Eloy does not have guts. He has demonstrated again that he has plenty, and he has eked out a certain amount of "opposition" space for his efforts.

Now, on the one hand, the U.S.Government says it supports oppositionists in Cuba. But one the other, it is now threatening to impose a huge monetary fine against Eloy and to send him to prison for ten years BECAUSE HE OVERSTAYED AND DID NOT COME BACK IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE NEW REGULATIONS. But if anything, Eloy's case simply points up again how foolish and
counterproductive the new regulations are. "No, sorry, sir," they seem to be saying," you can't stay and try to expand the parameters for legitimate opposition. You must return by the limits set by the new regulations! That's what's really important."

Also, outstanding, and irreplaceable information from Peace Patriot:

All in one thread:
https://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2638333

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Response to OBenario4 (Reply #2)

Mon Aug 28, 2017, 12:05 PM

16. Which way do the rafts go?



?1420490815

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Response to Bacchus4.0 (Reply #16)

Mon Aug 28, 2017, 04:04 PM

17. More often than not, they go "down".

 

Apparently, they don't appreciate the very nice schools and sharp uniforms that only a dictatorship can provide!

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Response to Bacchus4.0 (Reply #16)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:39 AM

18. I've never seen people leaving Cuba to go the capitalist paradise of Haiti. n/t

 

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Response to OBenario4 (Reply #18)

Wed Sep 27, 2017, 06:26 PM

19. Haitian's try to make it to Cuba. They have a sizeable population there, too.

I think a lot of Haitians live along the south sides, starting on the east end of the island.

They even have Haitian Creole radio stations running for these newcomers. Haitians constitute a large, large number of Cubans now.

There are Americans who started looking into the idea of moving to Cuba for their retirement and they were informed by the US government that they would never been allowed to get their Social Security checks which would begin at 65 years of age, sent to them there. The US government already had that idea covered.

Also, when the US government learned that one of the former Cuban "exile" paramilitaries moved to Cuba to start his own political group, "El Cambio Cubana" it started threatening to retrieve him from Cuba and put him in prison.

Meanwhile, Cuban-Americans slip back and forth to Cuba daily.

Cuban American politicians hate it so much that some Cubans do that they have tried to have the US taxpayer-supported benefits to Cuban Americans suspended if they learn they have visited Cuba, trying to force them out of making those trips, and making the propagandists look bad. Senator David Rivera was one of them. Filthy people, trying to control Cubans over here just as their predecessors did in Cuba, before the Revolution.

Everywhere there are right-wingers only monsters flourish.

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Response to OBenario4 (Original post)

Thu Aug 24, 2017, 07:31 PM

4. more horrible government schools... in Detroit

 






What disgusting third world country wouldn't invest in their FREE GOVERNMENT SCHOOLS?

Golly... I wish WE were Cuba!

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Response to OBenario4 (Original post)

Thu Aug 24, 2017, 07:45 PM

5. Known world wide for their incredible success in education and health, aren't they?

Before the revolution only the very wealthy children attended, as education was privatized, just as it has been throughout the Americas.

The truly ####y photos provided of crappy US schools serve to prove that racism runs all the way to the bone here, as we ALL know, progressives, liberals, democrats. Education is NOT democratized in the US, and as you point out, nor is it in the LatAm countries which haven't had the chance to make education available to ALL children, meaning poor children of ALL groups, not just the ones whose parents can afford to have them enrolled in schools the poor people can't afford.

That system works fine for a##holes in every country, and if they could, Republicans would get it back that way here, too, as we watch them try to legislate laws that allow ALL taxpayers, poor included, support their private school childrens private, segregated schools.

Thanks for these outstanding looks, OBenario.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Reply #5)

Thu Aug 24, 2017, 08:02 PM

6. Do you actually believe the BS you spout?

 

"...nor is it in the LatAm countries which haven't had the chance to make education available to ALL children, meaning poor children of ALL groups, not just the ones whose parents can afford to have them enrolled in schools the poor people can't afford."

More outright lies. You must spend a lot of time reading Venezuela Analysis and TeleSur?



Do you read Spanish? It is courtesy of the Chavista "Planning Office for Universities". The translation is, “Did you know that in the past, only the bourgeoisie’s children could study in a university?"

This bald-face lie (what else does Chavismo have to offer?) unleashed a torrent of rebuttals on Twitter. My own wife was raised in Venezuela, to a working class family who sent their daughter/niece to college (1986), then medical school (1990). Her mother stayed at home raising 5 siblings and a grandparent, and her dad was a butcher. Hardly born with a silver spoon in her mouth.

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Response to GatoGordo (Reply #6)

Thu Aug 24, 2017, 09:44 PM

7. It's obvious the likes of Judi and Obenario will never learn

 

They're so far indoctrinated, it would shatter their reality to get a first-hand experience of what it is to live like a working-class citizen in Cuba or Venezuela compared to, say, an actual developed nation.

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Response to GatoGordo (Reply #6)

Thu Aug 24, 2017, 10:20 PM

8. I'm asking if you have a link I could see for your "Che" quote. Thanks, in advance. n/t

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Response to Judi Lynn (Reply #8)


Response to GatoGordo (Reply #6)

Thu Aug 24, 2017, 10:45 PM

9. Would you point out the lies you claim I posted above? That would be appropriate. n/t

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Response to Judi Lynn (Reply #9)

Fri Aug 25, 2017, 12:24 PM

10. Why bother?

 

Considering your history, even if the proof was presented in front of you, you would still refute it.

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Response to Marksman_91 (Reply #10)

Sun Aug 27, 2017, 11:18 AM

14. Kinda like Trump supporters

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Response to Zorro (Reply #14)

Sun Aug 27, 2017, 01:33 PM

15. EXACTLY like Trump supporters

 

Except instead of worshipping unregulated crony capitalism and white nationalism, they worship the equally effed up ideology of thinking everything should be in the hands of the state and that anyone who doesn't agree is a no-good capitalist pig.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Reply #9)

Sat Aug 26, 2017, 01:36 PM

13. HERE ARE YOUR LIES, JUDI

 

"...nor is it in the LatAm countries which haven't had the chance to make education available to ALL children, meaning poor children of ALL groups, not just the ones whose parents can afford to have them enrolled in schools the poor people can't afford." -- Judi Lynn, Thu Aug 24, 2017, 06:45 PM... POST #5 in the above thread.

That is an outright lie. The Prussian Model of compulsory government education (the same as the US) has been in place for over 50 years in Venezuela. This has resulted (in the past) in a thriving working and middle class. But you wouldn't know that, because you know nothing about Venezuela. You might be under the impression that Venezuelans are all peons/peasants, running around in white pajamas and living in snake infested cardboard shacks in the hills.

Every citizen of Venezuela, for the past 50+ years, has had an opportunity (no guarantees) to go to college/university... the same as the United States. As a matter of fact, they have been better at providing this sort of education than the United States, in my opinion. Poor people are not prohibited in an manner from attending... the same as the United States. But again, you wouldn't know that, because you know nothing about Venezuela. It doesn't fit your Chavista rhetoric.

You should REALLY go there to visit someday. Maybe when it is safer, after Chavismo is gone?

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Response to OBenario4 (Original post)

Wed Sep 27, 2017, 06:57 PM

20. The pictures tell the whole story, and tell it well.

A US American doesn't have to spend much time reading to realize how public or private schooling works in the Americas. Of course, you are 100% right.

Someone is trying to con people who tries to dispute this.

The Cuban systems for medical treatment of the entire Cuban nation, and universal Cuban education have been praised and respected throughout the entire world for decades.

Right-wing Batista fascists tailed young Cuban teachers who, immediately after the revolution, spread out immediately from the cities, into the fields, and mountains, etc. to start teaching those who had NEVER been to school to read. They worked with them in the fields, and at night, brought out their lanterns, and taught them by lantern light. The Batistianos attempted to assassinate them, but the program continued until the entire country was overwhelmingly able to read.





Sunday, January 8, 2012
652. Cuba: Fiftieth Anniversary of the Literacy Campaign

By Yenia Silva Correa, Granma International, January 5, 2012

As the United Nations Literacy Decade (2003 - 2012) is about to come to an end, the number of people in the world who are still illiterate is alarming: 64.7 million children have received no formal schooling and 793 million adults remain illiterate.

Cuba undertook a year-long national literacy campaign which was completed on December 22, 1961 with Cuba being proclaimed a territory free of illiteracy.
The campaign's organizational structures were put in place starting January 1961. In order to teach the country’s 1.045 million illiterates to read and write, volunteer teachers' brigades were organized: the Conrado Benítez, Frank País and Patria o Muerte Brigades, which included schoolteachers and both young and adult volunteers.

. . .

Not even the murder of young volunteer teachers working in rural areas diminished the enthusiasm of those who had assumed with determination one of the noblest efforts within the revolutionary process, and one which was crucial to social justice.
After 12 months, Fidel Castro's commitment to the UN General Assembly in September 1960, "…next year, our people are set to wage a battle against illiteracy!" was fulfilled.
The national illiteracy rate fell to 3.9% for a population of more than 6.9 million inhabitants. This heroic deed would have been impossible without the contribution of Cuban and Latin American students, workers and teachers and the political will of the Cuban leadership.

More:
http://forhumanliberation.blogspot.com/2012/01/652-cuba-fiftieth-anniversary-of.html

I think we can see the difference between people of conscience and those who attempt to ridicule them. There's not much to be said for the people whose only goals seem to try to destroy everything better, finer, more valuable than themselves.

People like those who live to bring life and desperately needed help to others are the ones we respect.

Thank you for this illuminating, and clearly accurate view worth more than thousands of words.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Reply #20)

Thu Sep 28, 2017, 10:22 AM

21. Todays look at a Venezuela university

 



Very lovely. Chavez has done well. Very neat desks and chairs. Nicely painted walls.

What is missing?

TEACHERS!?!?STUDENTS?!?!

My goodness... why are there no teachers and no students?

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