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Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
Wed Jun 13, 2012, 05:55 PM Jun 2012

Huffington Post: How Sex Magazines Made the World a Better Place

Of course, remember, "another group that has benefitted from key freedom of speech court decisions is the Ku Klux Klan" ...which is a brilliant logical torpedo, akin to "you're a bipedal carbon based life form that wears pants.. you know who was another bipedal carbon-based life form who wore pants? HITLER!"


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mike-edison/sex-magazines_b_1130693.html

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Huffington Post: How Sex Magazines Made the World a Better Place (Original Post) Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 OP
Quote: Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #1
Anyone who cares about the 1st Amendment.. Upton Jun 2012 #3
And along with the hand wringing, there is pining for "the good old days" Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #4
Hey Warren... UnrepentantLiberal Jun 2012 #8
Good for the jury.. Upton Jun 2012 #9
I was juror #3. RiffRandell Jun 2012 #11
Nice try, alerter. "That picture" was from a 2012 blog post, so it couldn't have been used in 2008 Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #16
That picture has been around since at least 2007. JTFrog Jun 2012 #21
There are probably 50,000 similar pictures on the web Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #22
"so it couldn't have been used in 2008" JTFrog Jun 2012 #24
You found a thumbnail of the same photo, that was ALLEGEDLY dated from 2007. Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #25
Nah. JTFrog Jun 2012 #26
Please remember that you are in a protected group. If the hosts feel you are violating the spirit of Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #27
I could care less Warren. JTFrog Jun 2012 #28
FYI "I couldn't care less" is what you meant. Warren Stupidity Jun 2012 #29
Personally, I could always care less Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #30
Wait! I've got a point! Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #31
"Meanwhile, society gets more progressive by every social yardstick." lumberjack_jeff Jun 2012 #14
That was precisely why I qualified it with that word. Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #15
There wasn't just a sexual revolution going on since the 50's Major Nikon Jun 2012 #34
And those things always seem to go together Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #35
What's wrong with the Obama girl? Upton Jun 2012 #2
Nothing. Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #5
Oh my... opiate69 Jun 2012 #6
I paid no attention to her at all in 2008. Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #7
Nice. UnrepentantLiberal Jun 2012 #10
Why? RC Jun 2012 #12
9 juries? Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #17
Nine? ProudToBeBlueInRhody Jun 2012 #23
More nannies than contributors Major Nikon Jun 2012 #32
Naughty Nannies Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #33
Stalin was also fond of pants and being made of carbon 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #13
plus a penis. That's three, which being a man, is as high as I can count anyway. Warren Stupidity Jun 2012 #18
I heard that the Penis is Evil. Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #19
I just want to say, I LOVE THIS THREAD! Warren DeMontague Jun 2012 #20

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
1. Quote:
Wed Jun 13, 2012, 07:00 PM
Jun 2012
"We need a free society, and freedom is not won by literary tea parties and well meaning, virtuous academies, it is won by disreputable people like Al Goldstein."


People who simply can't help themselves when they get that twitchy itch to gripe about the 1st Amendment or put whiny asterisks after words like "freedom" or "choice", would do well to remember that. I come from a Jewish family, if I can handle Nazis marching in Skokie and still support the ACLU, you would think that the fainting couch crowd would find a way to reconcile themselves to living in a world where adults they've never met occasionally get off looking at nude pictures of other adults they've never met, fucking.

Upton

(9,709 posts)
3. Anyone who cares about the 1st Amendment..
Wed Jun 13, 2012, 07:38 PM
Jun 2012

owes a debt of gratitude to people like Hefner, Goldstien and Flynt...

I like this:

As Jimmy Breslin once said, there are four people in the past 35 years who have effectively protected the First Amendment rights of reporters who bring the news to you: Al Goldstein, Ralph Ginzburg, Lenny Bruce, and Larry Flynt. "I know you don't want to meet them," Breslin said, "but you owe them."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mike-edison/sex-magazines_b_1130693.html#s521770&title=Larry_Flynt_and

I've become firmly convinced, the vast majority of those opposed to porn, either from the left or the right, have just got sexual hangups. Sure they'll deny it, hiding behind any number of rationalizations...but why else would they care what consenting adults do or view behind closed doors?



Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
4. And along with the hand wringing, there is pining for "the good old days"
Wed Jun 13, 2012, 08:53 PM
Jun 2012

Like, when porn was verboten but lynchings were wholesome entertinment.

The whole narrative is predicated upon the idea that "ooooh, things are sooo awful now, and getting WORSE!" except, theyre not.

Stupid, clearly misogynist slurs against the likes of Hillary Clinton are taken, totally without evidence, as evidence of the deleterious effects of "pornification".. Because, you know, all those many times that women were serious presidential contenders in the 1950s, (back when FILTH was CENSORED as it SHOULD BEEEEEEEE!!!!!!) or Secretary of State, you know, that never happened.

...


Meanwhile, society gets more progressive by every social yardstick. And violent crime is down. Free communication, including widespread availability of consenting adult erotica on the internet, hasn't led to the collapse of civilization or anything else- much to the chagrin of the bawling censorship babies, banging their plastic spoons on their high chairs, and shrieking into their porridge over their complete inability to tell the rest of us how to live our lives.


 

UnrepentantLiberal

(11,700 posts)
8. Hey Warren...
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 08:15 AM
Jun 2012

Guess which juror I was?

AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service

At Thu Jun 14, 2012, 07:53 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

And along with the hand wringing, there is pining for "the good old days"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1114&pid=1504

REASON FOR ALERT:

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate. (See <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/? com=aboutus#communitystandards" target="_blank">Community Standards</a>.)

ALERTER'S COMMENTS:

This pic was used by some DUers to ridicule and belittle other DUers during the primaries before the 2008 election. At that time, it was alerted on and often hidden, due to the nastiness, since some would like to keep such ugly behavior aimed at conservatives and republicans, and restrict such behavior when its intended to slam DUers. I am alerting in the hope that that spirit of reserving such levels of hostility for people who aren't fellow DUers.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Thu Jun 14, 2012, 08:05 AM, and the Jury voted 0-6 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: Yaaayyyy! I get to adjudicate a porn patrol alert. I couldn't agree more with the post and less with the alert. Guess who this is? Hint - he has you all on ignore. Bwahahahaha
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: Frivolous alert, and I believe the alert had more to do with Warren's post than the picture.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: Well written post, I like it. Use of crying baby picture is not nasty or OTT.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

Upton

(9,709 posts)
9. Good for the jury..
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 08:22 AM
Jun 2012

and I seriously doubt the pic was the real reason for the alert. I believe jurors #1 and 3 are much closer to the truth.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
16. Nice try, alerter. "That picture" was from a 2012 blog post, so it couldn't have been used in 2008
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 03:24 PM
Jun 2012

to ridicule anyone.

 

JTFrog

(14,274 posts)
21. That picture has been around since at least 2007.
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 05:30 PM
Jun 2012
http://www.rmwhome.com/Imagescurrent/

Picture titled crying.jpg 04-Oct-2007 22:05 37K



On edit - Before you ask, or just flat out falsely accuse, nope, I was NOT the alerter.




Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
22. There are probably 50,000 similar pictures on the web
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 05:32 PM
Jun 2012

but, whatever. Obviously, it wasn't the specific picture that bothered the alerter, but the content of the post. A little intellectual honesty would be nice.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
25. You found a thumbnail of the same photo, that was ALLEGEDLY dated from 2007.
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 05:39 PM
Jun 2012

Okay, well done, Kojak.

If you REALLY want to prove me wrong, get cracking on finding the posts on DU where that photo was used to ridicule people for... what, I don't remember.

But either way, the logic of the alert is like this:

Say someone used this image to make fun of someone once, here, and the post was hidden:



So therefore ANY post using that image to say anything, about anything, should ALSO be hidden.

It's faulty logic, but then, that never seems to stop some people.

And now, that post can't be hidden by a better-crafted alert. Oh, well.

 

JTFrog

(14,274 posts)
26. Nah.
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 05:43 PM
Jun 2012

I don't care if it's hidden or not.

Just pointing out how often some folks insist they are right when they don't have the first clue what they are talking about.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
27. Please remember that you are in a protected group. If the hosts feel you are violating the spirit of
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 05:45 PM
Jun 2012

the group or the spirit of the SOP, by, for instance, minimizing a group member's experiences, devaluing their contributions by implying they have a limited knowledge base pertaining to a subject, or otherwise engaging in confrontational behavior with group members, you can and will be blocked from the group.

Consider this your warning.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
30. Personally, I could always care less
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 09:08 PM
Jun 2012

I suspect that will apply until i'm dead, when I dont think I will care at all.

 

lumberjack_jeff

(33,224 posts)
14. "Meanwhile, society gets more progressive by every social yardstick."
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 12:23 PM
Jun 2012

And simultaneously less progressive by every economic yardstick.

I agree with your basic point, only controversial speech needs protection.

Although Jon Stewart can say the "F" word, he can't tell you what the private contractors operating in drone bases on US soil are doing.
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/06/64-drone-bases-on-us-soil/

I think that making everything transactional has done great harm, and I think it's easy to make the case that porn attempts to do exactly that, in a macro economic sense, to intimacy.

I guess my thing is "no logo", including on sex. Porn bugs me for this reason. Commoditization of that which shouldn't be a commodity.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
15. That was precisely why I qualified it with that word.
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 03:22 PM
Jun 2012

I think increasingly concentrated corporate ownership of certain things (like mass media outlets, for one, or banks) is unequivocally a bad thing. However, I do think ground-up communication has become, conversely, more democratized and free via things like the internet.

There are several trends playing out, many at cross purposes. Interesting times.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
34. There wasn't just a sexual revolution going on since the 50's
Sun Jun 24, 2012, 08:32 AM
Jun 2012

There was also a cultural revolution. The book burners weren't just suppressing porn. They were suppressing music, literature, art, and ideas. Porn just happened to be the book burners primary target.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
35. And those things always seem to go together
Sat Jun 30, 2012, 03:15 PM
Jun 2012

Much to the chagrin of folks who claim to believe in freedom but like to qualify it with "but but but"

Upton

(9,709 posts)
2. What's wrong with the Obama girl?
Wed Jun 13, 2012, 07:20 PM
Jun 2012

I took a look at what might have prompted you to start this thread, and I noticed her pics weren't posted and all the other ones at the OP's link were (all supposed examples of the "pornification" of politics, whatever the hell that means, sounds RW to me))..hmm..I'll rectify the situation:





 

4th law of robotics

(6,801 posts)
13. Stalin was also fond of pants and being made of carbon
Thu Jun 14, 2012, 11:27 AM
Jun 2012

that's two data points. More than enough to draw a conclusive trend line!

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