Environment & Energy
Related: About this forum“The Fuse is Blown”. Glaciologist’s Jaw Dropping Account of a Shattering Moment
Antarctic glacier dynamics, as they are happening right now:
The Fuse is Blown. Glaciologists Jaw Dropping Account of a Shattering Moment
We are so far beyond screwed we can't even see it any more from here.
Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)Scientists were too cowed by politicians such that they always toned down their findings rather than be deemed "cranks" or "hysterical alarmists".
It is now WAY too late.
2naSalit
(86,509 posts)of silencing the scientists to begin with. This became general practice as soon as the "deriders" were selected by the SCOTUS fifteen years ago.
What amazes me is that browsing the job announcements at USAJobs - the official federal jobs site - I see the requirements for these positions set a pretty bar... perhaps it's to gain info on and to further silence those who would be able to dispute the deniers in office. I know a few who have been looking over their shoulders this past decade and a half.
azmom
(5,208 posts)So we can screw that one up too.
that is the historic MO for our society... Europeans came over here and did that and it didn't, on a grand scale, take very long to accomplish the task.
azmom
(5,208 posts)It's but a blink of an eye.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)progressoid
(49,964 posts)GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)He makes a very good point about how hard it is for scientists to communicate any sense of urgency. Even here, on an activist board that should be as up-to-the-minute as it's possible to be, we have people (granted, very few any more) who resolutely refuse to countenance any sense of urgency. How do we get through to them?
On edit: It's a very hard realization to get one's mind around - sort of like hearing what can only be a sea of rats chittering in your basement...
Another edit: Is there even any point in trying to get through to people? "Wake up and kiss your children goodbye!" doesn't seem like a very useful message...
pscot
(21,024 posts)Last edited Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:34 PM - Edit history (1)
There's is a grim sort of satisfaction in pounding deniers over the head with this stuff. They're so transparently wrong on the facts and so defective in their "reasoning".
n/t
phantom power
(25,966 posts)GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)That thought prompted my second edit.
I'm still a Junior Taoist Ranger...
Gregorian
(23,867 posts)And second, there are no perceptible symptoms by which ordinary people can see in order to judge for themselves.
Some of us have been aware of this for over forty years. But we're oddballs. I knew there was a problem, but science hadn't even caught up with the problem enough to detail what and where that problem existed.
What really irks me is that anyone with eyes that actually connect to a brain can see that this all stems from overpopulation. No one needs a news anchor to tell them that we have a problem there. And yet this situation is completely unbridled. This is the problem.
Once we realize there's a serious emergency, with respect to global warming, then we will slowly begin backtracking in order to find the cause. And then we may start doing something about population growth. But I doubt it, and I believe it wil be far too late to do a thing about it.
You can't unfry an egg. So it behooves us to stop being such assholes, and start talking about what people do in bed. Yes, that's where this is all coming from. That isn't to say that in an emergency, population is not where we begin. It isn't. We begin by putting money into ways to stop burning fires with petroleum. But the problem still exists even if we solve that part of it.
And pardon me for a not well thought out post. I just can't bother thinkiing anymore, as it seems futile with so much ignorance.
The2ndWheel
(7,947 posts)It's not from what people do in bed. It's that we started saving everyone from death. Each time it was done, it was that much more difficult to stop the next time. Not just morally, but increasingly physically more difficult.
Now it doesn't even stop with our own species. Now we have to go out and save all the other ones too, which only adds more complexity, which requires more energy to do.
No form of life wants to die, but they have to. To me, the desire to actively, directly, and consciously stop death, anywhere, all the time, and all that we do in the attempt to do so, is where it stems from. Overpopulation is just a byproduct of that. As is the need to start talking about what people do in bed.
defacto7
(13,485 posts)that has taken all reasoning from the natural progression of life and death and human perspective of it.... Abrahamic religion.
If overpopulation is the problem, religion of Abrahamic philosophical origin was/is the enabler and enforcer.
GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)They accept it and even celebrate it. The doctrine of post-death judgment and eternal damnation is a deeply evil teaching. Give me Bardo or reincarnation any day...
The2ndWheel
(7,947 posts)I think we get to this point anyway though, Abrahamic philosophy or not. That philosophy can be a justification, or a rationalization, for what was being done. The idea of God is the ultimate objective observer, because there's very little real objectivity in real life. Without that, who died and made the guy hogging all the stuff right?
Organized religion is, well, just another form of organization. As is civilization, which is, like any organized effort, a resource concentration mechanism. Once humanity started down the road of establishing a center, funneling those resources toward the center, and expanding outwardly, it was just a race to see who won.
We're not where we're at for any one reason. It's taken both violence and compassion, fact and faith, dumbass luck and earned skill, etc, etc. It takes both something like the concept of heaven to keep people getting out of bed every morning to deal with the bullshit because what's the point to existence if not for some purpose, any purpose, and the ability to actually physically save people's lives, even though each life that has ever been saved has contributed to the overpopulation issue.
Gregorian
(23,867 posts)there's nothing we can do about people who are already here. That leaves only those who haven't been born, to deal with.
Yes, increased lifespan put more living people on planet earth, but not in an exponential way that birthing does.
OKIsItJustMe
(19,937 posts)It's the same science, but nicely presented with CGI, explaining why the process is unstoppable.
defacto7
(13,485 posts)No more words to be said.