The cultural component of why Putin is trying to conquer Ukraine.

[DetlefK]

Draw a line from St. Petersburg, through Novgorod, through Belarus, to Kiev. That is the geographical area where the russian civilization was born, where the russian people became a distinct ethnic group. Novgorod and Kiev are the two oldest cities of the wider russian civilization. From this area, russian civilization extended further and further to the East.

If anything, Putin is a patriot. He loves Russia. The version of Russia he grew up with. The russian empire of the Soviet Union. And he wants to restore Russia to this greatness, this pride, this imperialism, this domination.

BUT this status, of Russia (the country) being the center of russian civilization, has the problem that historically the heartland of russian culture is in Belarus and in Ukraine. Not in the contemporary country Russia.

THIS MEANS that Putin cannot restore this national pride of the wider russian civilization if Ukraine is in political opposition to Russia. How is he supposed to celebrate the wider russian culture and history, while simultaneously being on hostile terms with Ukraine where this history is located? He NEEDS a version of Ukraine he can be on friendly terms with or else his nationalistic jingoism won't work.





In order to understand, please imagine the following scenario of alternative history:

Please imagine that the New-England-States aren't part of the US. After the founding of the US, these states either declared independence from the US or were conquered by Canada or France. And now imagine the US being on unfriendly terms with whoever controls this geographical area.

What would US patriotism look like if you simultaneously had to hate on New-England for political reasons?

[Scrivener7]

1. Texas used to be part of Mexico. Should Mexico invade Texas?

[OnDoutside]

2. This is a Putin narrative only, and is horse manure. The people of

what formerly consisted of either the Russian Empire or latterly the USSR had never known a free or fair society ( that everyone is entitled to), and associating with yet another murderous thug like Putin will do nothing for these ordinary people. It would be like the Irish people being "part of" the glorious British Empire. Yeah, rightm

[The Magistrate]

3. Still Bullshit, Sir

Contains some accurate points on the history of the matter, but provides nothing resembling just cause for invasion and occupation.

As for your counter-factual, why should I care? The scenario could only come about through a defeat accomplished generations ago, and the idea there would be much recognizable as the United States today if England or France or Canada all on its own conquered 'New England' is stuff and moonshine.

[Wicked Blue]

4. Let's imagine that New England was a totally different set of nations

Each with its own culture, history and ethnic population.

Let's also suppose that the remaining U.S. states had kept the New Englanders in slavery/serfdom for hundreds of years. Let's imagine that the people in New England were not allowed to own land or tools,or even surnames. That they could be beaten at the occupiers' will, or sold or traded.

And then let's say that the people of New England fought a long and bloody war to free themselves from the occupiers, and had at long last tasted freedom and independence from their neighboring enslavers.

And then, let's say the greedy occupier neighbor country now wanted to re-conquer its former slave colonies for the sake of its "culture" and national patriotism. Don't those people in New England have the right to fight for their continuing independence, and to ask the rest of the world to help defend them?

Fuck Russia. Fuck its "national pride" and "culture".

I cannot feel the slightest empathy for Putin's viewpoint. He is a murdering dictator and war criminal.

[mitch96]

5. "He is a murdering dictator and war criminal."... Kinda sorta reminds me of Stalin

He killed millions before ww2 "for the sake of mother russia"...... oy,Oyoy
m

[Cracklin Charlie]

6. Isn't Ukraine a prized area for agriculture?

Something like the “breadbasket” of old Russia?

I think they grow a lot of food crops there. Putin probably needs them to feed his people. But, since he can’t get along with anyone, and he’s a thief, he’ll just go take what doesn’t belong to him.

I could be wrong about all of this.

[The Magistrate]

7. You Have The Right Of It, Sir