Israel/Palestine
Related: About this forumNo end in sight: Occupation marks 45th anniversary
The Palestinians are not the only people in the world who lack an independence state. Yet there is one fundamental difference between the Israeli occupation of the West Bank and Gaza and, lets say, the Chinese occupation of Tibet, not to mention the situation of the Basques in Spain or the Kurds in Turkey (both examples are often cited as comparisons by the Israeli right). In all of those cases, the occupying country annexed the territory at hand and turned the people living in it sometimes against their will into its citizens. Israel never did that. It let the army run the occupied territory. The Israeli occupation is also different from the American occupation of Iraq or Afghanistan, because Israel has a claim to the land it conquered, because it is using the natural resources of this land, and because it moves the Jewish population into the occupied territory.
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The life of every Palestinian in the West Bank is at the mercy of any soldier he or she meets. We are talking millions of people, who havent got the most basic protections that civilians everywhere enjoy. All Palestinians are tried by military tribunals, where the prosecution and the judges wear the same uniform that of the IDF. Palestinians are not allowed to travel outside the West Bank without an army permit. They are subject to long lines at checkpoints and to arbitrary searches whenever they meet a soldier. Soldiers enter Palestinian homes at any time day or night without a warrant. When a Palestinian is wronged by a soldier, there is little point in filing a complaint, as the army doesnt have the checks and balances a civilian authority has. Palestinians are not just Israelis with lesser rights; they are more like the prisoners of Israelis. I know this, because I have seen the occupation in action and I have been directly involved in it.
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The worst turn of events took place under the Oslo Accord. The agreement divided the West Bank into three areas, the largest being under full Israeli control. The idea was that a permanent agreement under which the occupation would be terminated would be signed in six years, but it never was. So instead of letting Oslo expire, Israel made another brilliant move it began acting as if Area C (the one under Israeli control) was officially handed to it. Today Israel builds roads, even new neighborhoods, commercial spaces and culture halls in the West Bank, while pushing the Palestinian population from those areas to the crowded cities and villages (a good graphic of the land allocation can be found here). Hundreds of illegal Palestinian homes are being destroyed every year, and no permits for new ones are given. This systematic displacement and confiscation has been taking place for almost half a century. The problem with the settlements is not the settlers. Its the state.
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In recent years, the occupation has reached its most sophisticated level. It is the greatest national project Israel has launched. The best and the brightest take part in it: the high-tech industry invents new means of control and supervision over the local population (the army has become so good at this job, that Israel has exported much of the knowledge it gained in the West Bank and Gaza to other occupying countries); the best legal scholars come up with loopholes to allow the ongoing confiscation of assets and deprivation of rights; and the most skilled diplomats are taking part in a propaganda war meant to convince the world that the Palestinians are to blame for the occupation. Astonishingly, the international community is buying this nonsense, treating what is basically a massive-scale human rights violation as if it was a remote border dispute between two sovereign nations.
http://972mag.com/no-end-in-sight-occupation-marks-45th-anniversary/47544/
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)2,500,000 Palestinians are crowded into the other 40%
holdencaufield
(2,927 posts)that make up 99% of the anti-Israel whinging and are allegedly the ONLY thing standing between perpetual war and utopian peace only account for 8% of the West Bank -- Settlements with actual buildings -- 1%.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)the West Bank, Israel controls the Jordan river aquifer and there for the water supply to the entire West Bank, funny how you leave that part out
Swede
(33,233 posts)So a few hundred of them get killed every year,but hey,they're citizens of the occupying country.
Fozzledick
(3,860 posts)The war can't end until the Palestinians stop attacking.
So far they've refused to even discuss it.
If they wanted peace they could have it. The problem is that's not what they want.
Why blame Israel for defending themselves?
Bradlad
(206 posts)"Why blame Israel for defending themselves?"
Because that justifies the attack on them by the side they hope to see defeat Israel.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)especially in the West Bank where Israel is financing the transfer of its civilian population to occupied territory?
kayecy
(1,417 posts)45 years of occupation in order to achieve what borders?........Jordan?...Area C?.......Green line?
Of course it is all the Palestinians fault...They should have ethnically-cleansed themselves and gone to Jordan years ago.
shira
(30,109 posts)Last edited Wed Jun 6, 2012, 06:41 PM - Edit history (1)
Ehud Barak just proposed in the past week to unilaterally disengage from the W.Bank.
The Palestinians and their supporters are against that, as they all are seemingly against ending the occupation. They simply don't want it to end. They were against the Clinton Initiatives of 2000 and Olmert's 2008 offer. Both would have ended the occupation and settlements long ago.
Ironic how those who are most vocal against the occupation/settlements are the ones most vested in their continuation. For what would they do if the occupation/settlements ended? Advocate vs. China, Cuba, Syria, or Saudi Arabia?
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)it seemed Barak was just making noise here is the thread about his announcement
http://www.democraticunderground.com/113410789
kayecy
(1,417 posts)I know you suspect everything the Haaretz prints, but was Barak speaking for the GOI?
Education Minister Gideon Sa'ar severely criticized the defense minister, saying that his "position did not represent the government's position, one that is in a clear minority both in the government and in the coalition."
http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/israeli-unilateral-withdrawal-from-west-bank-will-perpetuate-mideast-conflict-palestinian-official-says-1.433401?localLinksEnabled=false
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Was Barak proposing a unilateral withdrawal to the Green Line or merely regurgitating the old two state proposal based on "temporary borders" with Israel keeping East Jerusalem and everything else it wants?
It would help if you clarified what the GOI's position is before you make accusations about ..."those who are most vocal against the occupation/settlements are the ones most vested in their continuation."
Those who are most vocal about Palestinian missed opportunities for peace are the ones most against Palestinian refugees returning to their villages and for Israel keeping its settlements and East Jerusalem.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)The West Bank was occupied 46 years ago, 47 years ago, 48 years ago, etc.
Or does it not count as an occupation when Jordan is doing the occupying?
kayecy
(1,417 posts)Of course it counts as an occupation but the Jordanian occupation ended 45 years ago.
What is the point you are trying to make?.......That Jordan is somehow responsible for Israel's continued occupation?
oberliner
(58,724 posts)It was never not occupied.
It is only since it was occupied by Israel that there has even ever been any serious movement for it to become the foundation of an independent Palestinian state.
A movement, incidentally, that I wholeheartedly support.
I do sometimes wonder, though, why Jordan didn't establish an independent Palestinian state when it was occupying the West Bank (which included East Jerusalem).