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Little Tich

(6,171 posts)
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 02:45 AM Oct 2015

No, Palestinian Violence Is Not an Inevitable Response to the Occupation

Source: Haaretz

Yes, the occupation is the central cause of terrorism. But the terrorist who picks up a screwdriver and stabs five Israelis in Tel Aviv has made an explicit moral choice to do so.

Where there is an action, there is an equal and opposite reaction.

This has been the line taken in a series of op-eds on the recent wave of violence in Israel and Palestine. Many of them say the same thing over and over again: Palestinian violence is the inevitable response to the occupation.

In Haaretz, Gideon Levy wrote "Even Gandhi Would Understand the Palestinians’ Violence." In the Guardian, Marwan Barghouti argued "There will be no peace until Israel’s occupation of Palestine ends," whilst Mairav Zonszein opined that "Israel’s domination of Palestinians makes violence inevitable." In September, Samah Salaime asked "Why do they throw stones?" The answer, of course, is the occupation.

It seems like an obvious point. The Palestinians live under a violent occupation. Many live in refugee camps, with little or no basic rights. Jewish settlements in the West Bank proliferate. Settlers and Palestinians are treated under two different legal systems. Settler violence is often ignored, whilst snipers are used against stone-throwing Palestinian children, who are then tried in military courts. The settlers have vastly more rights and resources than the Palestinians. Is violent resistance any surprise as the occupation nears its 50 year anniversary?

Read more: http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.680636

Note: Premium article. If you don't want to use Google to access the whole article, the article is accessible at its original location: http://zionish.com/newtons-third-law-of-palestinian-stabbings/

14 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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shira

(30,109 posts)
1. Pretty good article - here's more of it it...
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 06:15 AM
Oct 2015

But pieces such as Barghouti’s and Levy’s do more than just explain Palestinian violence in the context of the occupation. Explanation moves quickly into justification. In many of these op-eds, it follows that if one recognises that the occupation is the core motive behind the stabbings, then terrorism is merely a functional response. Terrorism is not condemned, but rather seen as the inevitable output of the structural logic of the occupation.

It’s Newton’s third law of Palestinian stabbings. The occupation is the action, terrorism is the reaction. Nothing else occurs within this logic, and no other causes of violence are deemed important. This neutral functionalism, where the terrorist is solely and exclusively the product of occupation, absolves the terrorist from any moral judgement. Occupation and terrorism is understood exclusively as action and reaction and nothing more. Under this argument, it doesn’t make sense to condemn a causal inevitability. The terrorist is not condemned for murder in the same way that a balloon isn’t condemned for popping under pressure. Both are the inevitable reaction to the initial action.

DetlefK

(16,423 posts)
5. Why would a Palestinian run amok, when he knows that israeli police will kill him?
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 07:18 AM
Oct 2015

What could possibly cause a Palestinian to disconnect from his everyday-life, from his plans, from his future, and just throw it away?

That must be one hell of a sermon, one hell of a rumor, one hell of a propaganda-piece that would cause a Palestinian to do a 180°-turn: One day he's a peaceful citizen who has something to live for, then he reads something outrageous and the next day he goes on a killing-rampage that he knows will end with his death.

All in an hour's work.

Unbelievable, right?

 

shira

(30,109 posts)
2. Thanks Tich - it's this "justification" for terror against Jews that stinks to high heaven
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 06:17 AM
Oct 2015

It's why the most hostile, ugly critics of Israel are seen for exactly who they are by genuine anti-racists who care about and fight against modern day anti-semitism.

Little Tich

(6,171 posts)
3. I'm glad you liked it - it's very close to how I see things myself.
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 06:45 AM
Oct 2015

People always have a choice - "the occupation made me do it" is a lousy excuse. We're fully responsible for our actions, and we can't just blame extraordinary circumstances when we do bad things.

However, I also believe that there can be mitigating circumstances, but it could never be an excuse.

DetlefK

(16,423 posts)
4. Please answer two questions:
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 07:09 AM
Oct 2015

1. What other forms of resistance are there to the occupation, apart from violence? And, excluding those forms that have been tried and failed, which of these forms should the Palestinians exercise?

2. If current political trends in Israel continue (barring extraordinairy, unforeseeable, disruptive events), what will the situation in Israel be in another 40 years in terms of the Israeli-Palestinian-conflict? In which ways will the situation be the same and in which ways will it be different?

Little Tich

(6,171 posts)
6. My Answers:
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 07:20 AM
Oct 2015

1. Non-violent protests

2. One state for Jews and Palestinians

Perhaps they're not the answers you expected, but I do think they're the true answers.

DetlefK

(16,423 posts)
7. I have doubts.
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 07:28 AM
Oct 2015

1. Why would the state Israel care about non-violent protests? Why would the israeli media even report about non-violent protests when they refuse to report Israel-on-Palestinian violence to israeli citizens? Will non-violent protests convince the settlers that their extremistic doctrine is wrong?

2. As I said, the prediction should be a continue from current political trends. What could the pathway from Netanyahu to a One-State-Solution look like?

 

shira

(30,109 posts)
8. Non-violence has never been tried minus the most atrocious incitement & violence....
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 08:15 AM
Oct 2015

Once the Palestinians cut out the mega- incitement and violence against Jews - for real - this conflict is over.

DetlefK

(16,423 posts)
10. And the settlers will accept the Palestinians' right to live in the Westbank?
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 08:29 AM
Oct 2015

Do you really believe that?

Little Tich

(6,171 posts)
9. I'm a great believer in non-violent protest.
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 08:29 AM
Oct 2015

It's difficult for the oppressor to deal effectively with non-violent protests. It's also much easier to give in to non-violent protests than violent ones. I also think that the use of violence is profoundly corruptive, and that it gives power to those who are ready to use it, rather than those who don't want to.

I know that the situation is frustrating, but violence isn't the right way.

I don't know exactly how things will play out, because Netanyahu has a tendency to surprise, and when you think it can't get any worse, he's sure to find a way to make it worse. But if the two-state solution is dead, he can only create more apartheid. The actual issue will still be about civil rights and giving Israeli citizenship to everyone in Gaza and the West Bank.

I'm not a promoter of the one-state solution, I just think it's the only possible outcome.

Response to DetlefK (Reply #7)

 

bumprstickr

(74 posts)
13. one parallel might be Northern Ireland.
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 08:43 PM
Oct 2015

The violence that arose in response to British oppression has been replaced by cooperation. Ian Paisley is no longer a powerbroker and Protestant and Catholic are living together. It can be done, but it takes a real commitment from both sides.

Maybe if both sides commit to nonviolence? But can they?

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
11. Perversely, the Israelis have almost trained the Palestinians to engage in such attacks.
Fri Oct 16, 2015, 09:45 AM
Oct 2015

When there is no violence, the Israelis feel like they have it made and don't need to make any concessions, if it ain't broke don't fix it.

On the other hand, intifadas have brought the Israelis to the negotiating table and to recognize (in words) the need for a Palestinian state.



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