American Jews are angry with Netanyahu

[Jefferson23]

The community fears the worst of the backlash over Netanyahu's speech to Congress has yet to be seen.

3/9/2015

Rabbi Eric H. Yoffie served as president of the Union for Reform Judaism from 1996 to 2012. He is now a writer, lecturer and teacher in Westfield, New Jersey.

I talked over the weekend with a longtime friend – a committed Jew, active in Jewish communal life, and a strong supporter of Israel. He calls himself an independent but votes mostly Republican. On U.S. President Barack Obama, he is wary and reserved; he voted for him once but for his opponent the other time. And my friend is very, very worried about the threat that Iran poses to Israel’s security.

When I asked for his thoughts on Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s speech, I was taken aback by his reaction. He was angry; furious, in fact. He saw the speech as a wildly inappropriate orgy of Obama-bashing. As an American, he was offended – and worried. Had it ever happened before, he asked, that a foreign leader spoke to our Congress and launched a direct attack on the American administration? I told him that, to the best of my knowledge, it had not.

A couple I know with more or less the same Jewish commitments and political views responded similarly. They had watched the speech and felt that members of Congress were being bullied by a foreign leader. True, the leader in this instance was from a place they love dearly, have visited often, and advocate for vigorously. And yes, they are concerned about the dangers posed by an Iranian bomb. But Netanyahu’s high-handed reprimand seemed out-of-place to them and the adoring responses more political than sincere. They saw the whole spectacle as an affront to American dignity. An American Congress with any self-respect, they said, should not tolerate being lectured in this manner.

snip* Yoffie says that American Jews worry about “severe” repercussions. -

But, from all that I have seen and heard, American Jews are not yet ready to move on. They are unsettled, uneasy and personally distressed. They are worried that the speech will generate repercussions that have yet to be felt and that could be severe. They are especially concerned that the partisan atmosphere that the speech has sparked and legitimized will drive away Democrats and progressives who have always been a mainstay of the pro-Israel coalition. -

http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.645963

[Jefferson23]

1. further

And these were the Republicans. The Jewish activists who are Democrats that I spoke to – and most Jews are Democrats – were much tougher. While all are Israel supporters, they had a range of views about Iran. Some shared the fears of Netanyahu, some backed the position of the Obama administration, and some were simply unsure or undecided. But no one was happy with Netanyahu's speech. “Look at what Nancy Pelosi said,” one friend told me. “That’s what Democrats really think.” Pelosi, who possesses an impeccable pro-Israel record, had referred to the speech as “an insult to the intelligence of the United States.”

Several people worried about the impact the speech would have on African-American support for Israel. Jews on the left side of the political spectrum have worked with African-Americans on Israel issues for decades, with significant success. But the decision of Civil Rights hero John Lewis and other members of the Congressional Black Caucus to skip the speech was widely noted, and some Jewish activists are wondering if the task of drawing minorities to the pro-Israel flag has now become a good deal more difficult.

The organized Jewish community is desperate to move beyond the speech and the divisions it generated. As noted by the Forward, Jewish organizations now want to unite the community by focusing on the substance of the Iran deal, rather than the breach of protocol that marred Netanyahu's visit.

But, from all that I have seen and heard, American Jews are not yet ready to move on. They are unsettled, uneasy and personally distressed. They are worried that the speech will generate repercussions that have yet to be felt and that could be severe. They are especially concerned that the partisan atmosphere that the speech has sparked and legitimized will drive away Democrats and progressives who have always been a mainstay of the pro-Israel coalition.

None of this means that the prime minister should not have dealt with the terrible, existential threat posed by Iran. But it does mean that he should not have given that speech. Instead, he should have declared a three-day election moratorium and arrived in Washington together with Isaac Herzog, his main election rival. They could have jointly addressed AIPAC, conferred with senior members of Congress and the State Department, and forcefully delivered the message that preventing an Iranian nuclear weapon is not a partisan issue for anyone but a concern for all Israelis, whatever the outcome of Israel’s election. And had they done so, they would have made their points without turning into enemies those very people whose support they require if Iran’s march to the bomb is to be thwarted.

But Mr. Netanyahu chose another course, one that may have advanced his personal political interests but did not advance the security interests of Israel. And in doing he so made American Jews' efforts to support Israel in taking on Iran much harder than it was before.

http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.645963

[C_U_L8R]

2. They are trying to divide us.

Oh hell no they won't !

[Jefferson23]

3. The gamble that Bibi and AIPAC took on with future voters is yet to be seen. The Iran deal

will likely go forward, yet the residue of Netanyahu's interference may give voters,
especially young voters, more than a second thought on support for Israeli policy.

[The Blue Flower]

4. It wasn't good for American Jewry

Watching it, I could only imagine how the anti-semites who believe Jews control the media, government, and finances will be framing it.

[hedda_foil]

5. I've had similar worries about antisemitism raising its ugly snout.

I worry for my family members in Israel and for the Jewish people here and abroad. The chutzpah is staggering.

[azurnoir]

6. That could happen however I would think that there was in a way more danger from

the Goldman-Sachs financial revelations (that's polite) and nothing much happened, that said what the real political price may be is that the US's UNSC veto is no longer insured

[hedda_foil]

7. I completely agree. What I meant was the cumulative effect of these things.

[guillaumeb]

8. The various ethnic haters will continue to hate.

Whether they are anti-Semites, KKK members, or whoever, they will continue to hate because hatred is an emotional response. The "Jewish control" myth has no basis in history but people repeat it anyway.

What I do not like is being labeled as anti-Semitic when I criticize some actions of the Israeli government. I feel that tendency is the reverse side of anti-Semitism.

[Scootaloo]

16. It's not a "reverse," it's just another expression of antisemitism

The assumption that "Israel equals Jews equals Israel" is antisemitic. period. it doesn't matter if someone is using that logic to attack Jews or to attack critics of Israel.

[King_David]

9. With a bit of luck Netanyahu will be gone soon but with ISIS now Israel/ Palestine is not exactly

Going to be the most important thing on the agenda and with what's going on with ISIS nor is Israel likely to lose any support- at all . If anything support for Israel is bound to grow.

This has already been seen in the Gay community where support for Israel has grown to the extent that QuAIA has been disbanded in Canada and the Gay reps on NYC city council are uber big supporters of Gay friendly Israel.

[Scootaloo]

10. QuAIA's retirement has nothing to do with that, however

Rather it's due to a small group that got stretched thin by multiple areas of activism.

And I dunno if taking a free ride to Israel counts as "uber big support," but Ritchie Torres did use gay rights to justify ignoring and violating human rights.

[azurnoir]

11. apparently

Torres is gay, but the words weren’t his: they were practically verbatim from an Israel lobby group. In fact, it’s mostly right-wing (not LGBT) organizations writing the “gay rights” lines in support of Israel. By contrast, Palestinian LGBT groups say that Israel’s daily violence makes all Palestinians so unsafe that LGBT rights are not a matter for separate discussion. Arab LGBT voices assert that Israel preys on them even as it claims to support them. New York LGBT organizations have made clear that queer justice and racial justice are inseparable, from Israel/Palestine to our own streets.

Torres’ insistence on separating them is telling. At home, he stands with #BlackLivesMatter and he’s a champion of racial justice challenging the NYPD. In Israel, he’s American and gay. There, he stands with the Jewish Community Relations Council (staunch defenders of Muslim surveillance and “brothers and sisters in blue”) – and a State of Israel where rights are allocated, and lives valued, according to race. The JCRC are defenders of a state that segregates housing, buses, citizenship, and indeed gay rights. Still more perverse: Israel’s iron-fisted policing, field-tested on Palestinians and Israeli dissenters, have shaped the NYPD’s approach to New Yorkers as a “human terrain” of threat levels.
- See more at: http://mondoweiss.net/2015/02/trample-justice-council#sthash.CGsYertv.dpuf

[King_David]

12. QuAIA disbanded because of lack of support

Stop parroting the dudes official safe facing line .LOL

With ISIS throwing gays off buildings Iran does the same and Hamas and Hezbollah are proxies and Palestinian PA and Hamas treatment of Gays it's no wonder support is waning.

[Scootaloo]

13. I will take the organization's statement over yours, Dave

[King_David]

14. Sure

It fits the narrative .




cheers

[Scootaloo]

15. I figure they know their reasons better than you do

Were you a member?

[King_David]

17. I do not live in Canada

But would of been a member of a non Racist , non Hate LGBT group called Kulanu , that were responsible for driving QuAIA to disband, if I was living there.


KULANU great job.....yeah .....

[Scootaloo]

18. Interesting. Have a source?

All i'm finding on "Kulanu" is an Israeli political party and a New York-based 501(c)3 that seems about forging connections between assorted and disparate people practicing the Jewish faith.

[King_David]

19. Heres an article by an LGBT reporter, I think what a friend tells me she is a member too...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1134&pid=96930

The executive director of Jewish LGBT group, Justine Apple, who diligently endeavoured to counteract QuAIA’s existence year after year by organizing a pro-Israel float and contingent to march in the parade, said she’s not surprised they decided to disband.

“The Pride parade is about openness and inclusivity, not about divisive, inflammatory messaging that only serves to create a hostile and toxic environment,” Apple said Friday.

Nevertheless, like me, she is under no illusion they’ve gone away never to be heard of again in another form.

“Sadly people so obsessed with hating Israel never really go away,” Apple says. “However it would be nice if they would focus their energies on speaking out against actual abuses against our community, such as in Iran where people are being executed because they are gay.”

Kulanu Toronto ("All of us" in Hebrew) is the city's only Jewish LGBTQ social, educational and cultural group.

Our programming is geared towards LGBT people of all ages. Most of our members are in their 30's, 40's and 50s.Our community includes people of various Jewish affiliations (from secular to religious). All of our catered events are kosher and have a Jewish flavour to them. Our events include Shabbat dinners, Chanukah parties, Pesach seders, pub nights, film and speaker nights, karaoke, plays, brunches, potlucks, and marching in Toronto's annual Gay Pride Parade.

Friends and allies are welcome at our events.

Contact: Justine Apple (Executive Director)

https://jewishtoronto.com/directory/kulanu-toronto

[Scootaloo]

20. Still not sure where kulanu comes in?

Interestingly, in my looking arounf the intrnet, all I've found of the supposed "hatred" QuAIA expressed... is simply opposition to Israeli policy against Palestine.

it looks to me like the hatred is coming the other way - a pack of Zionist assholes finding an excuse to unleash all their pent-up bile against gay people. Celebrations of denying them forums to speak, support for barring them from the public eye. Same old familiar gay-bashing stuff, simply justified by the claim of being "pro-Israel."

Which is why Pam Gellar is joining your celebration (you can look her up yourself, i won't link to Atlas Shrugs.)

[King_David]

21. A really great group, I think they have chapters in the USA too

QuAIA (Queers
Against Israeli Apartheid) has applied to march again in this year’s parade on
Sunday, July 1. They will be marching among 160 other groups. We will need as
many of you as possible to come out and support Kulanu Toronto to counter their
inflammatory, hateful messaging. As many of you know, QuAIA creates a toxic
environment that alienates the people of Toronto and in particular, our Jewish
LGBT community. Their hostile signs and messages should not be given license to
hijack the parade as they did in 2010 and turn it into a political propaganda
tool. If you support Israel, the only democracy in the Middle East, the only
state in the region to embrace and celebrate its LGBT population, come join us
as we march on Sunday, July 1. And bring your friends and family members, gay
and straight.

http://kulanutoronto.org/quaia-and-pride-updates-june-2012/

[Scootaloo]

22. "Hostile signs and hateful messages"?

?itok=dMo7PK0M




?w=620


Absolutely monstrous

[King_David]

23. Disbanded.....yea !!!

Not very tastefully dressed, fashion police definitely needed , after all it is Gay Pride, there are standards.

[Scootaloo]

24. But hateful? Hostile?

Looks to me like all the hostility was coming at them, not from them. Especially that part about the Toronto councilman threatening to bar everyone from participating in a pride event, unless they forced QuAIA out? Wow. That's what you support?

And wow, look at the roiling stench of homophobia wafting off of you after your edit.

[King_David]

25. Homophobia ?

Seems like you know what that is the same as what you know what antisemitism is.


As a member of LGBT , I support the LGBT community and especially the LGBT group in Toronto called Kulanu that fought against the hateful group called QuAIA and were a major cause of their eventual demise/Disband .

[Scootaloo]

26. How else to read your "fashion police" bullshit?

And again, no hatred has been shown coming from QuAIA, but plenty is directed towards them - including your own, which is evidently wholly due to their orientation.

[King_David]

27. No it's wholly due to their hate

Scootaloo has strange fallbacks when totally losing an argument 100% Scootaloo accuses the Jewish guy of antisemitism and now the Gay dude of homophobia.

Bizarrely thinking that Scootaloo knows is bizarre in of its own.

That's really a bizarre ridiculous tiresome habit.

Are you not tired of the many many DU timeouts ?

[Scootaloo]

28. But there is no hate there to justify YOUR hatred

You're just not telling the truth about that. QuAIA has expressed no hate against anyone, but have instead been the victims of it - including from you. And you, as you do, framed your hatred against them in terms of their being gay.

So far as I can tell, you only support the LGBT community when they say and do what you want them to say and do. you evidently want them silenced otherwise, and will attack them on the basis of their being queer if they insist on dissent from your positions.

You kind of remind me of the Republican approach to Latino voters.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

29. It's comically sad how some become enraged over the tinniest of anti-apartheid groups.

Yes, the hate is in their being against apartheid so they are not the good guys in some dubious people's minds.

[King_David]

31. The comedy duet of you and Scootaloo continues on this thread:

https://m.

[King_David]

30. What complete and utter nonsense

Nothing else to say about that post .

And I'm far too polite to say what you "remind me of" ( your words)

[Scootaloo]

32. If you say so Dave

But you're making up claims that QuAIA being "hateful," and are turning to attacks on their fashion sense (really?) to bolster your non-argument. If you had an argument I'm certain you would present it.

But all you've got is hatred for gay people who don't spout your talking points.

[King_David]

33. I guess you missed the sarcasm thingy , go back and re read ,

I am really happy that you were unbanned from the LGBT group as I consider that a personal progress for you and that's good ,but that doesn't make you an expert on us.

[Scootaloo]

34. No, it's just irrelevant

You're accusing the group of hate, but the only hate evidenced is your own. And you can cram whatever smilies you want in there, the origin of your hate is pretty clear. You hate them, because they are gay and don't play your game. You find that fucking intolerable. Just as you find Jews who don't buy your bullshit intolerable.

by the by, I didn't nominate you to be my spokesperson, and so far as I know, no one else did either. "Us" indeed, Dave.

[King_David]

35. LOL I can't even read these absurd responses anymore,

Bye

Bizzarly you used to think your an expert on Antisemitism knowing better than Jewish experts such as the ADL what is and what is not Antisemitism , and now freshly unbanned from our LGBT group here on DU ( which I am happy about as its progress for you so there's that ) all of a sudden your an "expert" on homophobia?

You have to stop this ugly habit of yours of calling Jews you disagree with "antisemites" and Gay dudes you disagree with "homophobes".... I have seen that also on the most extreme right wing websites and it's just plain ugly.

So please just stop it.

Bye

[Scootaloo]

36. Funny, I can read your laughable scamming all day long

Last edited Wed Mar 11, 2015, 08:18 AM - Edit history (1)

I had more to say, but fuck it, I know when i'm being trolled in the wee hours of the morning.

[King_David]

39. Trolled Scootaloo says ?

That's funny considering the source.

[Scootaloo]

40. I thought you weren't reading anymore, Dave?

Man, you just can't tell the truth about anything can you?

have a good day at school, Dave.

[King_David]

41. Calling a fellow DU member first a troll and now a liar,Scootaloo?

And thinking me being in school is somehow an insult?


Classy....

[Scootaloo]

42. Well, you've been lying like a rug all through this thread

Do you feel insulted when I wish you a nice day at school? That's weird.

[King_David]

43. Jury never hid your post but I think the comments are very interesting:

Especially number 7..

Inn Wed Mar 11, 2015, 08:59 AM you sent an alert on the following post:

Well, you've been lying like a rug all through this thread
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1134&pid=97064

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

YOUR COMMENTS

Calling a fellow DUr a liar, even after given the benefit to retract the poster doubles down.
No matter how much acrimonious the discussion may be a personal attack like that is wrong.

JURY RESULTS

A randomly-selected Jury of DU members completed their review of this alert at Wed Mar 11, 2015, 09:20 AM, and voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT ALONE.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Nope.
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: These two posters are bickering back and forth. I can't see why this one post should be singled out to hide.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Attacks are going on on both sides.
Juror #4 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: don't usually hide but over the top insults, get a life idiot!!
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Before seeing the alerter's comments I already knew that it would say something about calling a fellow DUer a liar, which is not what happened. Saying "you lied", or "you are lying" is *not* the same as saying "YOU ARE A LIAR". Rather than shut the person up, why not ask for an explanation as to exactly what the "lies" are?
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Doesn't look like any hands are clean in that exchange. In those cases I hate to punish just one of the parties.
Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Scootaloo has been obnoxious throughout the thread

Thank you.