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Thu Jun 27, 2013, 09:59 AM

Choose your chief reason for advocating against firearm carry

Last edited Thu Jun 27, 2013, 01:01 PM - Edit history (2)

Firearm carry in this instance refers to open or concealed carry of a gun in places outside the gun owner's home, property or business respecting any prohibitions to areas off limits by law.

(Anyone that has a reason other than those listed, please choose the "pass" option. Also feel free to share that reason either privately or publicly and whether you'd like your reason added to the list in the poll.)

Thanks
13 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited
1. private citizens lack the skill to target and shoot ONLY an aggressor
0 (0%)
2. chance of injuries due to accidents and negligence
2 (15%)
3. chance of a carrier becoming emotionally or mentally unstable
0 (0%)
4. chance of a carrier deciding to commit a criminal act
0 (0%)
5. there is never a case not better handled by law enforcement
0 (0%)
6. people have no business ever owning a gun and I prefer fewer police carry guns
0 (0%)
7. I have no issue with concealed carry
0 (0%)
8. I have no issue with open carry
0 (0%)
9. I have no issue with either form of carry
11 (85%)
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Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll

43 replies, 3968 views

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Arrow 43 replies Author Time Post
Reply Choose your chief reason for advocating against firearm carry (Original post)
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 OP
peace13 Jun 2013 #1
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #4
LonePirate Jun 2013 #2
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #5
Jenoch Jun 2013 #3
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #6
NYC_SKP Jun 2013 #7
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #9
Buzz Clik Jun 2013 #8
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #15
premium Jun 2013 #10
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #25
tridim Jun 2013 #11
premium Jun 2013 #12
tridim Jun 2013 #14
premium Jun 2013 #16
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #19
tridim Jun 2013 #20
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #21
GreenStormCloud Jun 2013 #31
jehop61 Jun 2013 #13
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #17
rrneck Jun 2013 #18
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #23
Eleanors38 Jun 2013 #28
rdharma Jun 2013 #22
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #24
rdharma Jun 2013 #26
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #27
rdharma Jun 2013 #29
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #30
oneshooter Jun 2013 #32
oneshooter Jun 2013 #33
DonP Jun 2013 #34
oneshooter Jun 2013 #35
premium Jun 2013 #36
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #37
premium Jun 2013 #38
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #39
premium Jun 2013 #40
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #41
premium Jun 2013 #42
discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2013 #43

Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Original post)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:09 AM

1. 1. Anger

 

2. Mental illness

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Response to peace13 (Reply #1)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:20 AM

4. option 3 has been updated per your suggestion

thanks

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Original post)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:16 AM

2. Options 1-6 are all equally valid

The cowboy hero derangement syndrome has to stop.

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Response to LonePirate (Reply #2)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:21 AM

5. IMHO...

"cowboy hero derangement syndrome" = choice #3

thanks

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Original post)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:17 AM

3. Your OP is a little

 

confusing. Are you asking why an individual does or does not carry, or are you asking why an individual is for or against ANYONE having the ability to legally carry or not?

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #3)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:24 AM

6. I'm asking politically...

..."why an individual is for or against ANYONE having the ability to legally carry or not" as you say.

Please feel free to suggest an alternate phrasing.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #3)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:26 AM

7. "I have no issue" suggests that it's about one's position on other's rights to carry.

 

Also indicated by the construction of Q#6:
"people have no business ever owning a gun and I prefer fewer police carry guns"

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #7)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:34 AM

9. This is precisely the point

The poll asks your opinion on the public's right to carry and laws that uphold or restrict such actions.

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Original post)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:30 AM

8. Other: 2, 3, and 4.

 

4 would include a rash decision based on alcohol, rage, jealousy, etc.

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Response to Buzz Clik (Reply #8)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:50 AM

15. Just to clarify

#2 refers to non-criminal negligence and accidents.
#3 would cover emotional outbursts like rage, anger, jealousy...
#4 would cover intoxication while carrying. (While there may be a few, I'm not aware of any states that don't view carrying drunk, high or somehow impaired as a crime, not that I've made an extended study.)

Is there any way you could choose the option you feel presents the most general danger?

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Original post)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:36 AM

10. We have both in Nevada,

 

open carry without a permit and CC with a permit, though, that may change in the future. Some lawmakers are floating the idea of constitutional carry.

Hasn't been a problem as far as I can determine.

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Response to premium (Reply #10)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 11:42 AM

25. Thanks for the reply

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Original post)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:37 AM

11. #3, but it's not chance. It has happened with all the gun nuts I know personally.

CCW makes them extremely paranoid about everything and everybody in the world.

It's a sickness, and IMO it needs to be treated as such.

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Response to tridim (Reply #11)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:40 AM

12. I don't know where you live,

 

but I've yet to know anyone who's as you describe and I have a lot of friends with permits.

Clarify for me, are you saying that anyone with a CC permit has a mental sickness?

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Response to premium (Reply #12)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:49 AM

14. I'm saying all the people I know with CC permits now think that the world is out to get them.

They weren't like that until they acquired their CC permits.

I worry most about my Dad.

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Response to tridim (Reply #14)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:51 AM

16. Well, all I can say is that my experience different than yours. nt.

 

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Response to tridim (Reply #11)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 11:04 AM

19. I respect your choice

The statistics I've seen show that apart from firearm assaults during the commission of other crimes, about 1/3 of shooting injuries are preceded by arguments.

Having said that, I would suggest that your assertion is reversed and that paranoia may lead some to seek a CCW.
I would expect that most people would not become paranoid due to carrying.

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Reply #19)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 11:16 AM

20. IMO irrational paranoia should be a disqualifying criteria for CC.

My dad became paranoid after he started carrying. His friends have too.

I think I know why... It's because he is now constantly thinking about the simple to use, deadly weapon on his hip and probably thinking about who in his world he might shoot and for what reasons. I really don't think he would shoot anyone, but who knows now?

That kind of stuff can totally screw up a formerly rational brain.

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Response to tridim (Reply #20)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 11:33 AM

21. People that CC...

...(at least IMO) ought to be constantly thinking, while they are carrying, about the responsibility of doing so. I don't carry. One of my flaws is that I procrastinate and I'm not convinced that procrastination wouldn't lead me to fall into bad habits like failing to adequately train often enough.

Carrying is a responsibility. If he were my dad, I'd mention to him the changes I saw in him and keep an open dialogue.

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Reply #21)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 08:03 AM

31. What he calls paranoia is probably just situational awareness.

We all know that in CCW classes we learn to be more observant of what is happening around us. Yes, we do look for possible threats. What that poster ignores is that violent crime does exist.

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Original post)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:45 AM

13. Except for nos. 7 thru 9

All of the above

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Response to jehop61 (Reply #13)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:54 AM

17. Are you unable to choose...

...which of the first six you feel presents the greatest danger?

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Original post)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:57 AM

18. While I have no issue with public carry I'm not a fan of unrestricted carry.

Laws that promote better understanding of our relationships with others, especially when that relationship surrounds technology that can seriously injure or kill them, are a good thing. While the safety record of those who carry guns in public is very good, we are missing an opportunity to teach people. Laws regarding the carriage of firearms are rules of engagement, and the public would benefit from an understanding such rules since they play an important part in our relationships with other cultures. Just as it is a good idea for people to understand the fundamentals of firearm technology because it has been with us for a long time and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future, conflicts with other countries will also be an important part of our future.

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Response to rrneck (Reply #18)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 11:38 AM

23. I'm not necessarily a fan of unrestricted carry either

I mostly agree with your thoughts.

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Response to rrneck (Reply #18)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 02:15 PM

28. I agree. Training should be geared to self-defense and avoiding conflict,

 

and not to pursuit and apprehension, properly the role if law enforcement.

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Original post)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 11:38 AM

22. Better title for thread would be: "What could possibly go wrong?"

 

And the correct answer would be: 1-4 (and several other tragic scenarios the OP hasn't considered).

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Response to rdharma (Reply #22)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 11:40 AM

24. How about sharing your thoughts? n/t

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Reply #24)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 11:57 AM

26. Have you considered unauthorized use by a second person of CCW holder's gatt?

 

Theft, child gaining access, etc.

How many times have you heard of guns being left in rest rooms, theaters, Disney Land/World etc.

Sorry. But the public's safety should take priority over some irrational and paranoid gun hugger's imagined "need" for a dangerous "security blanket".

Note: I edited my post above to delete answers #5 & #6.

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Response to rdharma (Reply #26)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 12:34 PM

27. Thanks for those thoughts

I've considered some of these. Among the negative possible consequences to carrying, I don't consider theft at all since a firearm can be stolen from anywhere at any time and having it in a holster on one's person, IMHO, would make theft less likely not more. I feel the same way about a child gaining access to a holstered gun.

I've said elsewhere that I don't carry and don't plan to. I also don't care for open carry in urban areas and places like theme parks. If you're carrying concealed, you can't really leave your gun in a theater, restaurant...

As far as leaving your gun in public restroom... I suppose there are people who could be that negligent so I suppose my #2 should be expanded to include accidents and overall negligence.

The unauthorized use of a firearm by someone not the owner sounds like theft to me. See my comments above about theft. And since we already have laws against theft, how would CC make thefts more likely?

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Reply #27)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 03:21 PM

29. You "feel" a firearm is less likely to be stolen, lost, or taken from a CCW holder?

 

Think again! I personally know of several cases where this happened.

Put an "idiot cord" on that gatt!

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Response to rdharma (Reply #29)

Thu Jun 27, 2013, 03:24 PM

30. Misquote?

You "feel" a firearm is less likely to be stolen, lost, or taken from a CCW holder?


I didn't say that.

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Response to rdharma (Reply #29)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 09:32 AM

32. I'm sure you have one on all of yours.

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Original post)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 09:34 AM

33. Strange

The first option seems to be ignored. How many time do we hear that the firearm will used to kill,injure everybody around the intended target. Yet #1 is ignored.
Strange.

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Response to oneshooter (Reply #33)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 09:45 AM

34. On a positive note ...

 

We've heard that canard for years and we all took turns asking for examples of "innocent bystanders" being shot up by CC permit holders. And we heard ... crickets.

I can't recall an example ever turning up. Lots of civilians shot by cops by mistake, but no examples of CCW people by the 12 million + CC permit holders. Based on their assumptions and the growing numbers there should be hundreds shot up every year, and yet ....?

Is it possible the control "fans" actually learned something from that?

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Response to DonP (Reply #34)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 09:52 AM

35. If they did, it would be the first time.

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Response to DonP (Reply #34)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 10:20 AM

36. Off the top of my head,

 

this is the only one I remember.


HOUSTON (FOX 26) -
Houston Police confirm it was a customer with a concealed handgun license who accidentally shot and killed a store clerk. The CHL holder was trying to protect Tyrza Smith, 26, from armed robbers, but something went terribly wrong and she was killed.

It happened on May 17 at the Family Dollar located at 6951 Bellfort in southeast Houston.

Police say Dwight Richardson, 20, and another man who hasn't been arrested are accused of bursting into the store, locking the front door and holding a gun to the clerk's head.

"They come in, they got guns out and they're threatening people in there. The CHL holder had every right to defend himself and that clerk," said Fox 26 legal analyst Chris Tritico.



Read more: http://www.myfoxhouston.com/story/18661869/chl#ixzz2XWKzpi00

Police have a much worse record of shooting innocent people or bystanders.

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Response to premium (Reply #36)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 10:23 AM

37. Well that couldn't be correct...

...it's from Fox.

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Reply #37)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 10:32 AM

38. LOL.

 

Don't be surprise if our brethren in the other group embraces this story, no matter who reported it, because it fits their talking points about how CCW holders are not trained to handle a situation and will willy nilly shoot up the place and kill innocents, despite evidence to the contrary.
After all, they have emotion instead of fact as evidence.

Hot outside, already breaking 100 degress.

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Response to premium (Reply #38)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 10:53 AM

39. As Mick said...

...they need an "Emotional Rescue".

It's 80 near Philly. Where are you?

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Reply #39)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 11:02 AM

40. Tonopah, NV.

 

Little town of about 6,000.

By Sat. it's supposed to be between 114-117.



Seriously thinking about moving back to Lake Topaz, NV, where I was born and raised.



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Response to premium (Reply #40)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 02:56 PM

41. Very pretty

What's winter like in both?


Friends from church moved to Phoenix and asked us to come for a visit. We weren't really able to travel at the time. However, I did express some reservations about the extreme heat. His contention was that dry heat is more comfortable. I countered by suggesting that the devil gets people into hell with that logic.

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Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Reply #41)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 03:01 PM

42. We'll get snow in both locations,

 

moreso in Lake Topaz, as it's in the So. Sierra Nevada mountain range.

Yeah, dry heat, all that means is that you burn up faster.

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Response to oneshooter (Reply #33)

Fri Jun 28, 2013, 04:32 PM

43. There are those...

...who gave answers like "all of 1 though 6". I suggest choice #2 is due to it just being low hanging fruit.

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