This Is Where Likely 2016 Voters Draw The Line On Gun Rights - HuffPo

[GGJohn]

X-posted from the other group.

WASHINGTON -- A vast majority of likely 2016 voters oppose legislation that would allow gun owners to carry their concealed weapons without a permit, according to a new national poll released Wednesday.

The poll, shared first with The Huffington Post and conducted on behalf of Everytown for Gun Safety, a coalition of gun control groups, was done to assess public attitudes toward carrying concealed weapons. The issue is a timely one, as three state legislatures -- in West Virginia, Kansas and Montana -- are considering rolling back some of their permit requirements.

Everytown found that 88 percent of likely 2016 voters oppose concealed carry without a permit, and 57 percent of voters said they would be less likely to support a candidate who voted to allow concealed carry without a permit.

The poll did find that a majority of voters support allowing concealed carry in public, with the strongest support among Republicans, conservatives and rural voters. While the issue of concealed carry did produce some cleavages -- 62 percent of white voters support it, while majorities of African-American and Latino voters do not -- what wasn't controversial was the concept that one must obtain a permit to carry. Even 80 percent of Republicans and 80 percent of gun owners opposed concealed carry without a permit.

Everytown Chief Strategy Officer Brina Milikowsky told HuffPost that the group's polling results made it "overwhelmingly clear" that Americans "strongly oppose" concealed carry without any training, which often is a part of the permit process.

much more
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/18/gun-laws-public-opinion-_n_6889262.html

Yeah, like I'm going to believe ANY poll commissioned by Everytown, which is financed by Bloomberg.

Here in AZ, permitless concealed carry isn't controversial at all, it's accepted as a fact of every day life.

[Duckhunter935]

1. How much did Bloomberg

fork out for this one? They will not advertise this I am sure .....

The poll did find that a majority of voters support allowing concealed carry in public

Key findings
A majority (57%) of voters support allowing citizens to carry concealed handguns in public, including 40%
who strongly feel this way. However, there are some divisions on this issue, with 40% saying concealed carry ought to be illegal (including 32% who feel strongly).
ii

The strongest backers of concealed carry include gun owners (81% believe carrying a concealed
handgun ought to be legal), Republicans (76%), conservatives (71%), and voters in rural areas (70%).

Most areas of the country support concealed carry, with the strongest support in the South (63%). The Northeast is the only
region in which more voters oppose (49%) than support (46%).

This issue breaks down along partisan lines. More than three quarters (76%) of Republicans believe
concealed weapons ought to be legal, compared to just 39% of Democrats. Meanwhile, a majority
(58%) of independents believe concealed weapons should be legal.

White voters show strong support (62%). In contrast, a majority of African Americans and Latinos
oppose (54% and 53%, respectively).

http://everytown.org/documents/2015/03/ccw-release-memo.pdf

[Electric Monk]

2. 88 percent of likely 2016 voters oppose concealed carry without a permit

88%

and 57 percent of voters said they would be less likely to support a candidate who voted to allow concealed carry without a permit.

[Duckhunter935]

3. And I agree

A permit should be a requirement to carry in my opinion. Always good to have training and reasonable checks. So do you think since most agree that concealed carry with a permit, that should be allowed nationwide. You know since the majority is in favor of it?

Another simple question that I doubt you will bother to answer though.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

4. I think we all know that when it comes to important issues what really matters is --

who has the best cartoons.

[Eleanors38]

8. HA!

[Electric Monk]

10. Taunting, bullying, and useless empty posts. This thread is a great example of gunners "debating".nt

[Eleanors38]

11. In a sea of mud & name-calling, you have issues with "HA?"

[DonP]

12. But here you are again ... and again.

[sarisataka]

14. Much like the absent poster

You had a word with before he picked up his marbles and went home?
However you since decided the assholes, no strike that, fetishists, no strike that too before it gets alerted- edit is such a wonderful feature- deserve every word they get.

[NYC_SKP]

26. Ohhhhhh! Is that what happened with all the self-deletes?

Schooled in public by the new sheriff? Shot down, as it were?

Oh dear me.

I feel badly whenever I see discord, even among those with whom I disagree.

[sarisataka]

41. The newest host

suggested that said poster perhaps be a little less confrontational to another poster who was actually promoting banning AR pistols.
Apparently since it wasn't my way, he chose the hi-way- deleting many posts on the way to exile. I can only assume dedication to reducing gun violence and commemorating victims did not trump ego.

Interestingly he could have appealed to to another host who has returned lately, though not posting in the group he hosts nor his former favorite group.

While I often enjoy seeing my enemies fight I don't view our GC proponents as enemies. Misguided, close-minded, single issue purists perhaps but not enemies. If they could listen, I believe we would find more agreement than opposition.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

15. My post about cartoons

is a jab at the fact you refuse debate in favor taunts, bullying and empty posts.

[blueridge3210]

17. But, referring to gun owners as "glib sociopaths"

is okay, because is adds so much substance to the debate. Okay, got it. Thanks.

[Electric Monk]

18. Not all gun owners. It's a subset, but highly represented online, for example, here in the gungeon.

nt

[blueridge3210]

19. Uh huh.

Keep spinning.

[Electric Monk]

20. Here's the cartoon again. Glib sociopaths refers to people like this character.

Why is everyone running away? I simply don't understand!



That guy. Does the shoe fit?

[blueridge3210]

21. And you continue to imply

that this is representative of gun owners in general.

[Electric Monk]

23. Do you know what the word "subset" means? Evidently not. Now go read a dictionary or something. nt

[blueridge3210]

25. How sad

that you're not the group host here and don't drive this train.

[Duckhunter935]

29. Yes, we know you are calling DU members here

"glib sociopaths". You have stated that yourself.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1172163353#post18

[Nuclear Unicorn]

30. Is there a subset of the whine cellar that actually cares about people rather than

just being control freaks?

Or is it too small of a sample to have a subset?

[Electric Monk]

31. Cares about people, like the children at Sandy Hook, you mean? Of course I do.

Now one of you is going to play that clip of Mrs Lovejoy from The Simpsons, mockingly. That's how this goes, right? We've danced this dance before.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

32. And what proposal has come out of the whine cellar that would have prevented Sandy hook?

[blueridge3210]

33. Nothing.

But that's not the point. The point is to vilify all gun owners; pass laws that only affect those prone to obey the law and then claim "It's for the children!". Lather, Rinse, Repeat.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

34. "It's for the children!"

Which is interesting considering how many other things not only kill children but also kill children in higher numbers. Yet, the same amount of zeal seems lacking.

[blueridge3210]

35. But, if you have the bad taste to bring that up

you are then a "glib sociopath".

[Electric Monk]

36. Why would you expect anything but a raised finger in return when you call GCRA the whine cellar?

http://www.ncsl.org/research/civil-and-criminal-justice/summary-president-obama-gun-proposals.aspx

[Nuclear Unicorn]

37. So what you're saying is you expect to get flipped off everytime you post that stupid TT cartoon.

Apparently you can dish it out but you can't take it. Like most controllers you expect to bully and vilify but when your tactics are mocked for what they are it's a pout-fest. If the term whine cellar is so upsetting not whining could prove an effective antidote.

If you want to debate I'll be happy to debate; without snark, even. But if all you want to do is pretend you care about children to infer others don't while posting insulting cartoons I'll hand it back to you in spades. I'll let you pick the topic, I'll let you set the rules for decorum; but I will have my equal say and I'll meet you measure for measure.

[Electric Monk]

38. You didn't enjoy my humorous post of Obama's list with Obama's picture flipping you the bird?

Hint: his opinion carries WAY more weight on this issue than mine does. Disagree with him. Direct your anger at him. Then enjoy the pizza.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

39. The President can conduct himself like an adult and not hide behind cartoons.

Direct your anger at him. Then enjoy the pizza.

So what you're saying is, you can't carry on a dialogue on your own terms; you're hoping I might break forum rules so you can avoid having to actually defend your proposals (assuming you have any) as well as your bullying and vilification.

How telling.

[sarisataka]

44. Oh they do care about people....

unless they have a gun when they become a victim

A Shelburne man was shot Friday in a mishap at a Charlotte gun range, the Vermont State Police say.

Joshua Scarfone, 19, was target shooting at theLaberge Gun Range off of Lime Kiln Road in Charlotte on Friday afternoon when JoshuaRamstrom, 20, of Hinesburg experienced "a negligent discharge," Trooper Angela Baker said in a statement.

Ramstrom was "converting a rifle to a pistol" when the discharge occurred, Baker said. The shot struck Scarfone in the pelvis.

(snip)

Police are continuing to investigate the incident, Baker said. The case will be forwarded to the Chittenden County State Attorney's Office for review.

http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/story/news/local/2015/03/13/man-shot-charlotte-gun-range/70290030/

I wonder if he feels safer yet?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12628490

or might be a gun owner

I'm sure they arranged to be buried with their guns, and have the profile of their favorite piece carved onto their headstones. The one who died of natural causes must have a very, very embarrassed ghost...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1262&pid=8343

Then there is much less caring. It can be had to tell since often concern for real victims is muted in the rush to be the first one to make a penis reference. It used to be fucking gun humpers but that has been copyrighted by a few posters.

[Duckhunter935]

28. So us DU members that post here are

"glib sociopaths"?

[GGJohn]

40. And your little group is a great example of a failed experiment.

You have the same 3-4 people parroting the same gun control clap trap, and one of your most vile and rudest members seems to have packed up his marbles and gone home after your mild rebuke of him.

[Electric Monk]

42. Here's a thread from not too long ago with replies from 9 different people and 25 recs.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12628334 Enjoy

[GGJohn]

43. Wowwww!!!!

I'm impressed.

Out of how many threads? Yet here, we accept all points of view without blocking those we don't agree with, we have vigorous debates here, several people from both sides of the aisle participate, you can't say that about your little group.

[Electric Monk]

45. The fact that GCRA even existing bothers you so much is a good enough reason for it to keep existing

You delicate flower, you

[GGJohn]

46. Doesn't bother me, I think it's funny that your grand experiment is such a failure.

You really think that what you controllers post on DU has ANY bearing IRL?

[Electric Monk]

47. The same question could be asked of every DU group and forum

or, for that matter, any online message board or chat room.

Do you post in GC & RKBA so Obama doesn't come take all your guns away? Do you think if you didn't, he'd have done so by now?

[GGJohn]

48. Well, apparently the pro 2A members here are far more in tune

with real life than your cohorts, gun rights are rapidly and steadily increasing, and the controllers are becoming more and more desperate to rein in this expansion of the 2A, as evidenced by the majority of members that post in your little group.

Do you post in GC & RKBA so Obama doesn't come take all your guns away? Do you think if you didn't, he'd have done so by now?

Not at all, President has been great for gun owners, I don't worry in the least about anyone coming to take my firearms away, I do, after all, live in one of the most firearms liberal states in this grand country of ours.

[Duckhunter935]

13. Are you going to answer my simple quesstion to you?

I will keep asking it. I asked you here and you seem not to have responded. Is this a habit with you sir?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1172163353#post3

Do you think since most agree that concealed carry with a permit, should be allowed nationwideYES or NO? You know since the majority is in favor of it.

[sarisataka]

16. Are you going to believe those

Bought and paid for NRA shills at Everytown that bought and paid for that poll?
I'm sure it's a talking point...

[Electric Monk]

22. Yes, with a permit, after passing an appropriate safety course, and in appropriate areas only.

So yes, with limits.

p.s. I don't owe you an answer on anything. When I do answer your taunts it's because I choose to.

[blueridge3210]

24. What is an "Appropriate safety course" and an "Appropriate area"?

You've carved out a grey area the size of the Grand Canyon.

[Duckhunter935]

27. Thanks

I do not taunt you. I just ask simple questions that you seem to not want to or are afraid to answer. I think this may be the first one you have actually answered. If you would answer them, then I would not have to ask them multiple times.

[pablo_marmol]

49. Being pressed to answer a question you keep dodging = taunting?!

[Duckhunter935]

50. yep, it is a new

definition for me. I guess you take it that way when you are afraid to answer a straight forward question.

[benEzra]

5. Since this is the gun control lobby's own poll,

do you think they'll stop attacking licensed concealed carry now?

[DonP]

6. I don't think they're smart enough

Even though the gun control people have clearly lost the concealed carry issue, with all 50 states now allowing some form and more and more shifting to shall issue or constitutional carry and not a single state proposing to repeal or restrict it's still an issue. Here on DU we still hear the same old song about "how dangerous CCW is".

Posting of generic crime stories where a gun was used is supposed to somehow reflect on law abiding permit holders, as if there's no real difference. When a news story is posted of a person with a CCW successfully defending themselves or their family, we get the "Yeah, but what if" brigade out to tell us all how horrible what "Might" have happened would be. Those weasels are my personal favorites.

They seem to have moved on to the "On Campus Carry" issue to some degree, but it's the same old failed arguments about how "Blood will run in the Quad" the second they cross the invisible line between legal carry everywhere else versus on campus.

They have one song, always in the same key, that they can't change, even with Bloomberg's millions behind them.

[ileus]

7. "I know you're against little kids getting killed, now with that in mind..."

[Eleanors38]

9. HuffPo is becoming da innertube's equivalent to WaPo.

Accumulating scientific evidence from their side, and constructing a sphere of reality based on polls.

Most here, including myself, favor training and certification to carry, but the "gun rights" movement is still at high tide, and it is looking for ANY measure to further liberalize the RKBA. If the controller/banners wanted to hold back the flood, they might consider this option: Find a more substantial issue, like guaranteed health care, housing, and food for everyone, and building a real party to carry out those policies.