What is the best ccw self defense gun in your opinion?

[darkangel218]

I just bought a Taurus PT111 gen 2, I like it so far. I haven't had the chance to take it to the range yet though.

Any thoughts about ccw self defense guns in general?

PS: I already asked Krispos (the host of this forum) if I can inquire about it, and he said it was OK.

[villager]

1. Whichever one the NRA allows you to take into their headquarters

n/t

[villager]

5. I am sorry, truly, for what happened to you.

My ex-wife was also a survivor. Well, kind of a survivor. She took some particular demons into our marriage which, sadly, never left.

My point was, the NRA doesn't allow guns in their headquarters. Did you know that? They promulgate them, want everyone to carry them, but don't allow them in their own workplace. Why would that be?

And --without knowing your background -- I suppose I didn't think this was the most sensitive time for that kind if an OP on the DU page. Other gungeoneers have deliberately made such posts in the wake of various massacres, kind of to rub peoples noses in their weapons fetish. Perhaps you didn't know that bit of DU history, either.

In any case, I wish you safety and healing. Whether there's ever an appropriate time for us to discuss whether that can really come via a gun, I don't know.

But be well.

[Duckhunter935]

7. Ate some crow on that insult

Just so sad.

[villager]

16. God, what a shitty thing to say about that exchange. But then, par for your course.

Typifying all that is wrong both deep in your soul, and in this forum.

Buh bye!

[Duckhunter935]

20. Yes, nice way to talk to a rape survivor

[darkangel218]

25. I blocked them.

I went over their posts and I could not, for the life of me, ever have a conversation to someone who is so nasty right off the bat.

Thank you.

[Duckhunter935]

34. Yes I have had to deal with them before

I feel so sorry for you and wish you the best.

[GGJohn]

67. I am so sorry for what happened to you darkangel218.

May your demons be put to rest and may you have a peace filled rest of your life.

[darkangel218]

75. Thank you for your kind words.

X

[darkangel218]

8. Is there ever a sensitive time to talk about self defense??

Shootings happen all the time. I actually bought my Taurus and asked the host of this forum if I can post about it Before the school shootings.
It is important to me to talk about self defense, and it might be important for others who ccw, especially females.

Thank you for the well wishes though.

[villager]

19. "Shootings happen all the time."

Well then, I guess I have no further comments here.

[darkangel218]

21. Perhaps not.

And you should apologize for trying to tie me up to the NRA.

[villager]

22. I thought I did?

I am glad to see you appalled by the idea of being tied to them, though.

Sorry for doing it.

Quite glad you have nothing to do with them.

[darkangel218]

24. Then you should self delete.

Thank you in advance.

[villager]

26. No -- because the point about the NRA *not* allowing concealed carry is still valid

You would not be allowed to take your gun into NRA headquarters.

It's worth asking why that is so.

[Marengo]

72. There appears to be a dispute about this issue...

I've read the NRA does allow CCW in it's HQ.

[DonP]

77. They do have a shooting range in their HQ building

They promote it in gun magazines and online; "Visit the Museum, spend some time on our range, have lunch in our cafeteria and visit our store".

Kind of hard to use a range with no guns allowed?

But it's easy to say anything about the NRA without actually checking and assume no one will question your claims.

Good example are the NRA Talking Points constantly claimed. When asked where they are, no one ever seems able to point to them. Maybe it's just a metaphor?

[oneshooter]

11. Youdon't really care.

The first words off of your keyboard were ugly snark. You let your true self show.

[villager]

17. First words were truth about the NRA.

Buh bye!

[oneshooter]

33. So the rest of it was all YOU. n/t

[gejohnston]

45. actually, they do

they even have their own gun range.

[villager]

46. Actually, according to this: "the NRA staff is armed, while visitors are disarmed"

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/12/21/1172739/-I-Called-the-NRA-Today-Oh-Boy

[darkangel218]

48. You need to stop posting on this thread. ( took you off ignore only to point this out)

I am a rape survivor. You need to back out with your drivel , it is disgusting to try and tie people up to certain organizations only to make your point. I asked you to delete, you refused. Please don't post lies ( like the NRA one) in my thread again. Go start your own. Have a great day.

[villager]

49. It's not a lie (about NRA policy), sorry. And I will reply to replies.

Have a good day yourself. Be well.

[friendly_iconoclast]

82. Your claim about the NRA has been shown to be incorrect at least twice

Are your other posts of similar accuracy?

[gejohnston]

51. Don't believe everything you read on Kos

http://buzzpo.com/shannon-watts-caught-red-handed-lying-nra/
http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/nraban.asp

[villager]

53. Of course there's Wonkette:

http://wonkette.com/582166/no-guns-allowed-at-nra-convention-now-everyone-will-get-mugged

[gejohnston]

55. see the snopes link I included

Here is the thing about bloggers left and right. Very few are any good or worth reading. Most of them play telephone and simply plagiarize without fact checking.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

74. wonkette: a truly trusted and professional source for news

Starting a story by saying, "UH OH, small-dicked white men..." is just the height of professionalism and enough to inspire every journalist out there.

There is little hope for your side and that is part of the problem. I'm inspired!

[Marengo]

73. Did you miss the update, at the bottom of the OP?

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/12/21/1172739/-I-Called-the-NRA-Today-Oh-Boy

"UPDATE: 5/20/2014 Markass informs me that what I discovered in the diary above is presently not true (and appears to be suggesting it never was). I assure you that at the time 18 months or so ago, I did spend the time calling whom I said I did, and reported what I was told truthfully and fully. Their policies may have changed in the meantime, or I may have been misled or their left hand doesn't know what their right hand is doing (if they even have a 'left' hand, or just two right hands). Anyway, thank you Markass for checking. My info may be out of date."

"I Called the number like you claimed to do in this story expecting to prove to someone it was true, unfortunately it very much isn't true, the NRA Does allow Visitors with CCW Permits to Carry, and you should fix your story and actually call them yourself"

[Duckhunter935]

12. I am so sorry

That person has had many hides for over the top insults. I think any firearm that you feel comfortable with and fits your hand. Mine is a Ruger SR40C. Small, concealable and can 10 or 15 rounds.

[darkangel218]

23. The one I bought is 12+1

I feel very comfortable with it, but we'll see at the range. I hope the recoil is not too bad. Any advice as to the ammo for target practice for my PT(9mm) ? I bought the gun new, it has never been shot before.

[S_B_Jackson]

64. Any of the major name brands will be good for target practice

a box of 100 rounds of Winchester White Box should only cost about $25. Before the trip the range clean and lubricate the slide.

[Warpy]

3. Good answer

but I'd have said "no gun."

I've faced down guys with guns twice and escaped with my life and property intact. Having a gun in either case would have gotten me shot and probably killed.

[gejohnston]

4. Personally, I carry a Ruger LCP

whatever works for you

[darkangel218]

6. I thought of getting a Ruger

Good reliable gun. I had a Berretta Nano ( no longer have it, because twice I had a bullet get stuck in the chamber, and my fiance thought is not safe anymore - we sold it)

This Taurus looks easy for me to handle, and actually I have a better grasp on it then on the Beretta.

(posting from my cell, sorry for the typos)

[doc03]

9. The LCP 380 is what I have myself only felt the need to carry it one time

in about 6 years. If I could do it over I would consider the Ruger LC9s, they weren't on the market at the time. I originally bought a Springfield XDM .40 cal. but found it was not practical to carry for me anyway.

[gejohnston]

89. I have the LC9s too

but I have this theory that it is easier to deescalate a situation with just having my hands in my pockets.

[Straw Man]

91. You can carry an LC9s in your pocket ...

... unless you wear very tight pants. A slim-profile Kydex holster helps.

[Logical]

87. Pocket holster? Nt

[gejohnston]

88. yes.

[S_B_Jackson]

10. Whatever pistol you find that you are most comfortable shooting and with which you have trained

sufficiently to be proficient and familiar with. Caliber is caliber is less important than proper control and shot placement.
Smaller and lighter do not equate to "easier to shoot".

Myself, I carry a Sig P245, my wife carries a Sig P228 that she "borrowed" from me and after shooting it said, "this is mine now", she is kind enough to allow me to clean it for her after we've been the gun range.

[oneshooter]

13. My personal CHL piece is a SIG220

But that is just me.

[darkangel218]

27. It looks similar to my Taurus PT111

Let me see if I can post a pic.
[IMG][/IMG]

I covered the sn#. But yah, thats my Taurus PT

[oneshooter]

35. Hammer fired with a drop safety, 45acp.

[darkangel218]

37. OK, not so similar after a closer look

[darkangel218]

15. I know smaller doesn't equate easier to shoot, because of the recoil

I did the same to my fiance's Glock 26, but he didn't let me have it.
I will post after I take my PT111 to the range, let you guys know how well it works. I bought it new, with 2 mags, and 1 year warranty. If any problems like I had with the Nano I will get rid of it :/

[S_B_Jackson]

60. Yup. The smallest and lightest pistol I own

is a FEG 9mm Makarov...it is absolutely brutal to shoot and since it doesn't weigh anything, it provides little resistance to the recoil and you absorb most of the force in the web of your thumb, in your wrist, in you elbow. I never shoot more than 2 magazines (6 rounders) before I just slide into my other role of posture-coach and designated magazine re-loader for the rest of the family.

As for appropriation by an S.O., she got a CPO that was worn and I found a LNIB two-tone at a good price which she covets but I won't let her shoot. She tries to tell me "That's too pretty to be a man's gun..."
She was assaulted in her own home by a burglar several years ago, she was fortunate that her roommate and BFF had forgotten something and had to return home - heard the ruckus coming from my now-wife's bedroom, and retrieved the shotgun that had been her housewarming gift from her father. The sound of that 12-guage shotgun's having a shell racked into the chamber spooked the assailant and he jumped out of the second story window rather than find out what might happen.

Hopefully, this pistol will suit you - good luck and safe shootin'.

[darkangel218]

61. Thanks bunches!!!!

I will post after the range x

[bowens43]

14. a dog... guns are not for defense. anyone who thinks they are are not familiar with the statistics.

[darkangel218]

18. My guns are for defense.

I target shoot, but main purpose is to keep me safe. I was raped once (almost died), and I won't let that happen ever. again.

[friendly_iconoclast]

31. You are free to decide that for yourself. You are *not* free to decide that for others

[ileus]

42. I have dogs to tell me when it's time to pay attention.

Our Black German Shepard is an excellent dog, but it's a very poor replacement for a CZ, 500, or AR when it's really needed.

[darkangel218]

50. I agree with you there, Ileus.

+1

[1939]

28. Advantages of the Beretta Nano (and similar pistols)

Is that you keep your thumb where the hammer comes back while putting it in a holster or pocket so that if the trigger catches you don't mistakenly fire the pistol because you can feel the hammer coming back and stop in time. With a striker fired pistol, it is easy to shoot yourself in the foot while holstering the pistol.

[darkangel218]

30. Can you explain to me then what are the disadvantages of carrying a PT111 vs Nano?

My Nano had 2 squibs on 2 different occasions while at the range. My bf said that is unheard of, so he had me sell it. Both times I had both ear muffs and ear plugs on, but I managed to realize that something was wrong, stop, and check the chamber. Sure enough, the bullet was still there. I have other friends who own Nanos and they nevef had a problem with it. But anyway, how is my new pistol different?

[Straw Man]

68. Beretta Nano is a striker-fired pistol.

Advantages of the Beretta Nano (and similar pistols)

Is that you keep your thumb where the hammer comes back while putting it in a holster or pocket so that if the trigger catches you don't mistakenly fire the pistol because you can feel the hammer coming back and stop in time. With a striker fired pistol, it is easy to shoot yourself in the foot while holstering the pistol.

You may be thinking of one of the other "baby Berettas," like the Tomcat or Pico. The Nano is striker-fired, and reminds me very much of a Glock 26, except slimmer.

Striker-fired pistols are fine as long as you are careful that nothing enters the trigger guard while you are reholstering. This means not only your finger, but your shirttails, jacket drawstrings, etc. If this is a problem for you, there are striker-fired pistols with manual safeties. The Ruger LC9S is one.

If you want a small pistol with an exposed hammer, a SIG P238 is hard to beat. It is single-action-only, with a thumb safety. It is meant to be carried cocked-and-locked, and is perfectly safe to carry that way. It has an additional safety feature in that you can rack the slide to remove the round in the chamber without taking the safety off, unlike traditional SAO pistols like the 1911. It is slightly heavier than pistols like the LCP, but this is an advantage in that additional weight means less felt recoil. Lightweight polymer handguns like the LCP (and the LC9S, for that matter) feel to me like a firecracker going off in my hand. The P238 is much milder and more pleasant to shoot, and I'm of the opinion that you should enjoy shooting the pistol that you're going to carry for defense or you won't practice with it, and if you don't practice with it, you really shouldn't be carrying it.

NB: With a single-action-only pistol, your thumb action when reholstering will be different. Instead of placing your thumb behind the hammer so that you could feel if started to come back, you would place your thumb in front of the cocked hammer to block it in case it starts to fall. And if you remembered to engage the thumb safety (which is one of the reasons you practice), it's very unlikely that you'll encounter such a problem.

EDIT TO ADD: I think the danger of "Glock leg," AKA shooting yourself in the foot while reholstering, has been oversold. There have been a few well-publicized incidents that were probably the result of poor trigger discipline on the part of police officers who were transitioning from the heavy triggers of their double-action revolvers. Since the 1980s, there have been millions of striker-fired pistols in use by citizens and cops alike, and there are very few incidents. But ultimately it's up to you; if your not comfortable with it, don't carry it.

[1939]

71. I misspoke

It is the Beretta Pico which has the hammer and is a very nice CCP.

The P238 is a nice weapon, but as you say is SAO.


I haver always been taught to reflexively put my thumb over the hammer when holding the pistol except in the firing position.

[Straw Man]

79. No problem.

It is the Beretta Pico which has the hammer and is a very nice CCP.

The P238 is a nice weapon, but as you say is SAO.


I haver always been taught to reflexively put my thumb over the hammer when holding the pistol except in the firing position.

That works with SAO pistols too -- just slightly differently. I mentioned the P238 because it's so easy to shoot for recoil-sensitive people.

I had a Pico for a while, but it was a bear to shoot: it had a very heavy trigger, and it stung my hand because of its extremely light weight. That said, it was very, very easy to carry. It slips into a pocket easily and is barely noticeable when it's there.

[1939]

80. Also

Micro-Eagle and the S&W Bodyguard have recessed hammers that give you the "thumb feel" without snagging on your pocket.

[Travis_0004]

29. There really is no best

It comes down to what you can conceal and what you can shoot.

A .380 on you is better than a 9mm at home.

I'm more used to open carrying a .357 (bears mountain lions etc).

CCW talks kind of remind me of glocks vs 1911 debates. I shoot a glock in an IDPA event, and I do quite well. I do not like the grip angle of a 1911 and can not shoot it well.

Same with CCW. I tried shooting a .38 J frame, and between the trigger pull, bad sights, and high recoil, I could not shoot it well. I would have been a liability. (perhaps with training I could overcome this, but I just didn't like the gun).

Meanwhile I shot the hell out of a glock 26, almost as well as my 17. It would make an excellent CCW for me.

[TeddyR]

32. FNS 9C

I prefer FN because they are the only firearms that are fully ambidextrous (other than a very few others, including the super expensive HKs) and I'm left handed. Also get very good reviews generally.

[darkangel218]

36. Thats pretty awesome.

I wished I knew about it before I bought my PT.
17 rounds for a ccw is great. I might look into buying one in the future.

Thanks tons!

[Logical]

86. Is it DA first shot and SA from there on? Nt

[ileus]

39. Yes the G2 is a good egg...I carry mine daily.

It's caused my Shield and LCP to be put in the safe with the 642.

The G2 is easy to be accurate with, maybe not as easy as the Shield but the G2's 12+1 vs the Shield 8+1 cause it to win out. During the winter I switch over on date or movie night and carry the CZ75 or P220 just because it's nice carrying a heavy full sized pistol.

My only issue with the G2 is the really long trigger pull and where my finger is right before the break. But the reset is a beautiful thing to behold. I also don't care to much for the plastic sights but for a budget gun that's fine, best 229 bucks OTD I've ever spent (at least since the 80's)

[darkangel218]

41. I spent well over 229.. With taxes it neared 300 :/

Awesome review though , I hope I am just as happy at the range as I am now

What ammo did you use for range practice though? If you don't mind sharing

[ileus]

43. my first 200 rounds were just FMJ federals from walmart.

Since then I've run close to 600 of my 124g reloads.


I carry Gold Dot 124g HP non +p, and it's feeds them well.

[darkangel218]

44. Thank you for your reply.

I'm staying away from reloads, as my bullets which got stuck in the chamber were "reloads"

I can't risk damaging my gun or hurting myself with reloads :/

[Jake Stern]

47. Those times when I do carry it's a SCCY CPX-1 Gen2.

Good gun. Despite the smack talked about SCCY's, I've never had so much as a failure to feed. To be fair so far I've only put Winchester white box through it but looking to try it with Hornady critical defense

Been looking at the PT111 as a replacement. Post a follow up on how it does at the range.

[al bupp]

52. Not being armed is the best self-defense

since I'm statistically more likely to harm myself or someone in my family with it.

[darkangel218]

54. To each their own.

As a rape victim/survivor, I beg to differ though.
Being raped fuckd up many of my relationships. Brought on PTSD.
No one can actually picture how bad it is , unless they walk in our shoes. Just FYI.

[Straw Man]

70. Speak for yourself.

Not being armed is the best self-defense

since I'm statistically more likely to harm myself or someone in my family with it.

Not if you train yourself. The goal is to move yourself into a demographic that beats the statistical mean.

[Kilgore]

56. Walther PPK

[gejohnston]

58. great choice, classic one too

have you seen the Walther PPS or CCP?

[darkangel218]

59. Awesome

[IMG][/IMG

[Straw Man]

69. That's a PP.

It's a little bigger than a PPK. It's also a .32 caliber (7.65mm).

Bottom line is that it's no longer imported into the US. If you want to buy new, you'll be limited to the PPK in .380 (9x17mm).

[Half-Century Man]

57. Browning High Power

An oldy but a goody.

[darkangel218]

62. Too big for me to ccw

Maybe ok for a guy? :/

[Half-Century Man]

63. I prefer metal guns to guns using composite fibers.

Just my personal preference.
The Walther PPK is good, but underpowered in my opinion.
The lowest cal. I'll go in a self defense firearm is 9mm.

But try different guns in your hand, feel how they fit. This is about what works for you. What fits well gets test fired.

[pablo_marmol]

84. I used to own a FN Hi-Power.

You must have looked around a while to find a good concealed-carry holster for it, eh?

[Half-Century Man]

85. IDF 4 position holster.

Second hand.

[sarisataka]

65. Before choosing a gun for SD

you must self-evaluate if you are willing to use it when all else fails. To have a gun but be unable/willing to use it as your last resort is worse than not having the gun. I do not know you personally but given what you have shared I would venture the answer is 'yes'.

The short answer then is 'the gun you shoot accurately and feel comfortable with'.

Many people are down on Taurus. I do not own one personally but would be confident carrying one. Modern Taurus pistols are not the same as they had in the 80's.

My most common carry is an S&W 638. A simple, old fashioned 5 shot .38 that easily can be carried in a pocket holster. Not sexy but there is a reason they have been around for 65 years.

My 'duty' carry (as a security consultant) is a commander size 1911. As a single action it does require more skill but has been combat proven for over a century.

Rarest I will carry a full-sized Sig P226. It is a large gun and usually will only have it when I am required to violate my personal rule of avoiding high-risk crime areas. Thankfully such occasions only happen once or twice a year.


Equally important is how do you carry the gun. I recommend a level 2 holster if possible. The female shape often has comfort issues carrying in the traditional hip position. A shoulder holster often will overcome this or cross draw can be effective. Last choice is off body in a purse or pack design for firearm carry.

Ammo is another consideration. Do not carry FMJ. Over-penetration and poor stopping power are major downfalls. As you noted, don't trust your life to reloads. Major brand JHP will give you the best, most reliable results. I am partial to Federal and Hornady. Try different brands to see what gives the best accuracy. I like 124 grain for 9mm. It is the best combination of bullet weight and speed IMO.

Carry safely and may you never have to use your weapon.

[darkangel218]

76. Thank you for the reply, Sarisataka

Great post, much appreciated. A lot of good info, thank you tons!

[Lurks Often]

78. There is no "best" single gun for CCW

There are far too many variables. For example what works in rural Alaska isn't going to work during a Florida summer.

A person needs to pick a gun that is reliable, accurate, fits their hand and that they shoot well.
Are they in a job that involves higher then normal risk (cab driver, pizza delivery, handling bank deposits, etc)?
Environment is also an issue, it is a lot harder to hide a larger gun in hot, humid weather.

Revolver vs semi-auto:
Revolver: Based on 20+ years of competitive shooting, a revolver is more reliable then a semi-auto. HOWEVER when a revolver jams, it will almost always require tools and several minutes, at a MINIMUM, to clear the jam. I also find that most people find a revolver harder to shoot well. To shoot a revolver well require more time and training then a semi auto to reach an equivalent level of skill.

Semi-auto: Slightly more prone to jams, but most semi-auto jams can be resolved in seconds and without tools. Most people will shoot a semi-auto better then a revolver given an equivalent level of training and practice.

My personal preference for a small 9mm is the Kahr PM9. It is light, very accurate, the trigger is very good and with factory ammo it has been 100% reliable.

For a full sized gun, take along look at the Steyr M9 & M40, it's kind of an improved Glock: a better trigger, fits even small hands very well, accurate, reliable and has the lightest recoil of any 9mm I have ever fired.

[Kang Colby]

81. The best CCW gun is the one you are most comfortable shooting...

the one you are the most accurate with, and the one you are willing to carry. Before purchasing a gun, I would recommend going to a range that has rentals and trying 4 or 5 different guns. I tend to believe that 9mm is the optimal caliber for CCW pistols. I would also spend time training, find someone or a training course that teaches skills beyond basic pistol. Then make sure to train regularly.

Hopefully you like your PT111.

For "range ammo" Wal Mart sells Perfecta 9mm for 10.00 per 50 rounds. It's good stuff, never had an issue with it. They also have Federal aluminum case for >$10 that our Glock eats up with no issues at all...its good range ammo.

[pablo_marmol]

83. I really love my Kahr P9, though pricy

I've heard that the .40 cals are rather snappy, but I've fired +P ammo with my 9 and it didn't feel too bad.

Love the feel, it's accurate, light and slim. Even though I had dry-fired on before purchase, I originally had pretty serious buyer's remorse at first because of the long trigger pull. But the pull is so light and silky you get used to it - and I think that shooting the Kahr has improved my trigger pull with my go-to semi-auto.

http://www.kahr.com/Pistols/Kahr-P9-w-Night-Sights.asp

I also don't have any trouble carrying my Springfield XD service model......but I have the right body type to carry larger pistols.

Edited to add: I totally agree with the two members who posted above me.

[DirtDart1319]

90. The G2 is my daily carry also

I've been carrying my G2 almost daily now for about a year. Hands down my favorite carry gun. I think the only drawback that I have noticed it the texturing on the grip causing some irritation on my side with IWB holsters. My was very accurate right out of the box. As far as ammo is concerned, I shot the first 500 rounds of what ever 115 gr. FMJ Walmart had. I like to put 500 rounds through a gun before I trust it for carry. For SD carry ammo, I use Hornady critical duty. Any major name brand JHP designed for self defense of "duty" would be good for carry. I would definitely shy away from reloads for carry though.