People with concealed carry permits have committed at least 29 mass shootings since 2007

[SecularMotion]

Every time somebody goes and shoots up a college or a school or a theater or a church, gun rights proponents take to the airwaves to argue that if only more people had guns and brought them into more places, some of these tragedies could be prevented. Polling shows that these arguments may be working, despite plenty of evidence that "more guns, less crime" does not hold up to close analysis.

As Eugene Volokh discussed earlier this month, there are indeed documented instances of "good guys with guns" stopping mass shootings. He counted at least eight cases where armed civilians (not off-duty police) appear to have prevented mass shootings since 2007. As he notes, this is probably an under-count: some would-be active shooters may have been stopped in their tracks by a brandished weapon before the body count got too high.

John Lott's Crime Prevention Research Center notes a number of other instances of armed citizens stopping would-be criminals. But some of these instances involve off-duty law enforcement officers, who are specially trained for them. Others involve armed citizens stopping knife attacks, and other altercations including armed robberies that you wouldn't normally consider a mass shooting.

On the other hand, the Violence Policy Center has documented 29 mass shootings of three or more people since 2007 where the perpetrator was himself a concealed carry permit holder. Remember Craig Hicks, the man who allegedly killed three of his neighbors earlier this year in a possible hate crime? Concealed-carry permit holder. The man who shot up DC's Navy Yard two years ago? Concealed-carry permit holder. The man who went on a rampage at the American Civic Association in Binghamton, N.Y., in 2009? Concealed-carry permit holder.

[center][/center]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2015/10/26/people-with-concealed-carry-permits-have-committed-at-least-29-mass-shootings-since-2007/

[Human101948]

1. But a really small percentage of mass shootings overall...

So far in 2015, we’ve had 274 days and 294 mass shootings

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2015/10/01/2015-274-days-294-mass-shootings-hundreds-dead/

[gejohnston]

4. and that is using a source that counts

minor injuries with airsoft guns as "mass shootings".

[Eleanors38]

5. When did collecting "mass shooting" data begin?

[GGJohn]

2. Even if this were true, and I don't believe a word coming out of the VPC's mouth,

it's a miniscule percentage of CHL holders over a period of 8 years.
And what does having a CHL have to do with mass shootings?
Are you trying to say that if they didn't have a CHL, they wouldn't have gone on a shooting rampage?

Any comment there SecMo?

[hack89]

3. So you think that without the CC permits, they would not have killed anyone?

is that really your logic?

[Lizzie Poppet]

6. Even when you gimmick the data like this, a tiny percentage.

Thanks for the stirring endorsement of CCW permit holders and their responsible behavior...

[ileus]

7. and with all that data you still want to disarm folks....thanks for the concern.

but disarming me won't make me safer....I care about my safety.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

8. VPC redefines "mass shooting" as 3 or more when the FBI defines it as 4 or more.

Why the scare tactics?

[Silicosys4]

9. Outright lies and manipulated data, as to be expected from the VPC

http://bearingarms.com/washington-post-claims-29-mass-murders-concealed-carriers-lied/

6. The real number is 6 mass killings, when the numbers are adjusted to reflect the FBI's definition of mass killings, NOT the VPC's made up definition, which is of course manipulated to present certain results.

[GGJohn]

13. Great article.

Welcome to DU.

[SecularMotion]

10. KICK. N/T

[friendly_iconoclast]

11. Your OP claims that 1 out of every 4,000,000 or so permit holders commit mass murder...

...every year.

Do you honestly believe this demonstrates that permit holders are especially dangerous?

If so, you really don't grok 'counterproductive'...

[beardown]

14. So about 140 total.

I did not count the 10-15 shooter deaths who committed suicide. I guess if I wanted to pad stats I could say a CC stopped the shooters, but that would be an underhanded corruption of stats about a serious issue and not pay due respect to the people and or law enforcement that cornered the shooters.

Regardless of whether or not it's about 140 or 155, compare this against the 150-200 people a year that die from peanut allergies.

In a nation of around 340 million people, 155 over several years time is incredibly low for overall threat assessment and risk versus reward.

I'm more concerned about overall gun violence than mass shootings as mass shootings, especially by CC holders, are a minuscule piece of the overall deaths.

Having said this, I'd still prefer much more in depth training and standards for CC permits and even include funding and governmental resources to assist individuals that have difficulty meeting increased costs associated with increased training.

[GGJohn]

12. I don't understand your reasoning of kicking a thread that you started,

yet refuse to discuss.
Why are you so afraid to discuss a subject? Especially one you posted?
Are you afraid that you can't defend the subject?
Or are you just being obtuse?

[Kang Colby]

15. I know why...

SecMo just SecMo'd in a SecMo thread.

[GGJohn]

16. LOL.

That's priceless.