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Mon Feb 26, 2018, 05:58 PM

What would the conversation be if

the loser in Parkland actually used an automatic weapon, be it from the black market or made in the back shed Luty or STEN?

16 replies, 4106 views

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Response to gejohnston (Original post)

Mon Feb 26, 2018, 06:11 PM

1. What will the conversation be when the first mass shooting happens from a 3D printed gun

someone made at home?

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Response to gejohnston (Original post)

Mon Feb 26, 2018, 06:21 PM

2. Squirrel!

What causes the conversation isn't as important as the conversation itself.

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Response to HopeAgain (Reply #2)

Fri Apr 6, 2018, 01:07 PM

8. Something,

but the conversation is pointless if it is one sided or not totally honest. Right now, you have one side (mostly grassroots) who are knowledgeable about firearms, firearms laws, and crime statistics and are using facts and reason. The other is mostly astro turfed by the "billionaire class" who misinform the well meaning but naive who know nothing about those subjects and use logical fallacies and dishonest statistics.

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Response to gejohnston (Reply #8)

Fri Apr 6, 2018, 02:18 PM

10. I'm pretty knowlegeable...

If you take Las Vegas, Pulse Nightclub and Parkland, 125 people were killed and 599 were wounded by just three people before anyone could stop them. There's nothing fallacious or dishonest about that statistic. That is an unacceptable statistic to me.

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Response to HopeAgain (Reply #10)

Fri Apr 6, 2018, 05:00 PM

13. could or wouldn't?

Pulse night club, Orlando cops played negotiator for three hours until the POS offed himself. At least half of those who died, died of blood loss and would have survived if medical attention arrived. From his wife's trial we know that his dad was an FBI informant because the POS' ties to ISIS and his first choice was Disney but was scared off by armed guards. Of course, many progressives blamed Christians for the murders. Of course, blaming any Muslim other than the POS would be wrong and bigoted. Blaming Christians and the shooting sports community is?????????

Parkland. Couldn't or wouldn't? Four BSO cops stood around outside and listened to the shots and did nothing. When cops from Coral Springs showed up and entered the building, Cruz was long gone and buying a soda at Wal Mart and BSO was still hiding behind their cars. Again, if the RO had guts or put the social contract above orders, lives would have been saved. Again, many died of blood loss and would have survived their wounds if EMS weren't prevented from entering.

We don't know that much about Las Vegas.
That gives us one spree, one terrorist, and one unknown (although ISIS doubled down that LV was their guy)
If you take Happyland Night Club and the New York truck attack alone gives us 95 dead without a firearm.

I agree that is an unacceptable statistic, but your argument is fallacious (appeal to emotion).

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Response to gejohnston (Reply #13)

Thu Apr 12, 2018, 05:33 AM

14. It is strange that we know so little about the Las Vegas shooting. ....

It is after all the deadliest mass shooting in U.S. history. Despite the fact that there are a lot of unanswered questions the incident has basically disappeared off the radar.

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Response to gejohnston (Original post)

Mon Feb 26, 2018, 07:23 PM

3. The reality of what was used doesn't change the desire to ban all guns

 

Probably would be exactly the same conversation.

They would still want to ban semi-automatic guns, in particular the AR-15.

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Response to Always Right (Reply #3)

Thu Apr 5, 2018, 10:57 PM

5. what percentage of people at DU want all guns banned?

Ooops, nevermind, you've been banned because every one of your posts is about guns and mostly defending DOING NOTHING.

Obvious poster is obvious.

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Response to CreekDog (Reply #5)

Fri Apr 6, 2018, 01:01 PM

7. What is the difference between doing nothing vs doing something

that does nothing but trash the BoR?

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Response to gejohnston (Reply #7)

Thu Apr 12, 2018, 09:48 PM

15. i asked you what percentage of people here want guns banned

is it a large percentage or small percentage or about half?

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Response to CreekDog (Reply #15)

Thu Apr 12, 2018, 10:11 PM

16. I have no idea, and

frankly I don't care. I don't base my opinions on what is popular.

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Response to gejohnston (Original post)

Thu Apr 5, 2018, 10:53 PM

4. Probably surprise since it's easier legally get an AR-15 and cause the deadliest mass shooting

in US History.

I know what you want us to say...that we'd all scream that automatics should be banned, but that they aren't are and the ban didn't work.

But your hypothetical is hypothetical against numerous actual occurrences that used legal or legally-obtained weapons.

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Response to CreekDog (Reply #4)

Fri Apr 6, 2018, 12:10 PM

6. the gun is the tool, not the cause.

Unless you are believe in animism. The Las Vegas shooting might have been a combination of AR-15s and AR-10s, but is still under investigation. The worst mass shooting in the past couple of years was with (illegally obtained) automatic weapons at a concert, which is why the band is calling bullshit on American gun control activists.

I know what you want us to say...that we'd all scream that automatics should be banned, but that they aren't are and the ban didn't work
Actually, I don't think activists and politicians wouldn't be saying anything about guns because it wouldn't serve a political purpose.
If it was a basement made Luty or Sten, Chris Coumo might be walking through Home Depot telling us what to buy. If it was a black market weapon, I'm guessing Bloomberg's favorite Monsanto executive would be tweeting some bullshit about the "gun show loophole" or find some other way to demonetize their opponents. Maybe, just maybe, the focus would be where it belongs: on the corrupt and incompetent Scott Israel who knew before going to CNN that four deputies cowered outside, but claimed that he showed "outstanding leadership". The story is now that their captain ordered them to stay out because of the lack of body cameras. That isn't counting the 39 times (including the two where Cruz called the cops on himself). Then the worthless POS has the balls to demand more arbitrary police power when he had more than enough power to deal with it, but didn't, for fuck knows why.

If he killed more people with something other than a firearm (like the bomb planted at a Utah school that same week, but it fortunately malfunctioned or the mass stabbing in PA that same week.) Both of those were local stories.

In the US, these occurrences, while well publicized, are actually very rare when compared to the rest of the population. On a per capita basis, we are something like 11th behind several European countries. There are even fewer than 20 years ago, most school homicides are beatings and stabbings.

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Response to gejohnston (Reply #6)

Fri Apr 6, 2018, 01:41 PM

9. Let us know, the next time somebody attempts a mass murder....

....with a Winchester Model 70, bolt action, 5-shot capacity deer rifle. Different sorts of firearms feed different sorts of fantasies.

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Response to Paladin (Reply #9)

Fri Apr 6, 2018, 02:20 PM

11. Besides Charles Wittman

And some Canadian on Parliament Hill? One thing about Afghanistan, WW1&2 era bolt actions trump assault rifles on distance and power.
Home Depot trucks are not hypothetical.

I see you missed the point entirely.

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Response to gejohnston (Reply #11)

Fri Apr 6, 2018, 02:31 PM

12. And Derrick Bird in the UK ...

... whose bolt action was a humble .22 and whose shotgun was a traditional double-barrel.

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