Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at Salt Lake grocery store

[thetonka]

Link

SALT LAKE CITY (ABC 4 News) - A citizen with a gun stopped a knife wielding man as he began stabbing people Thursday evening at the downtown Salt Lake City Smith's store.

Police say the suspect purchased a knife inside the store and then turned it into a weapon. Smith's employee Dorothy Espinoza says, "He pulled it out and stood outside the Smiths in the foyer. And just started stabbing people and yelling you killed my people. You killed my people."

Espinoza says, the knife wielding man seriously injured two people. "There is blood all over. One got stabbed in the stomach and got stabbed in the head and held his hands and got stabbed all over the arms."

Then, before the suspect could find another victim - a citizen with a gun stopped the madness. "A guy pulled gun on him and told him to drop his weapon or he would shoot him. So, he dropped his weapon and the people from Smith's grabbed him."

By the time officers arrived the suspect had been subdued by employees and shoppers. Police had high praise for gun carrying man who ended the hysteria. Lt. Brian Purvis said, "This was a volatile situation that could have gotten worse. We can only assume from what we saw it could have gotten worse. He was definitely in the right place at the right time."

Dozens of other shoppers, who too could have become victims, are also thankful for the gun carrying man. And many, like Danylle Julian, are still in shock from the experience. "Scary actually. Really scary. Five minutes before I walk out to my car. It could have been me."

Police say right now they have no idea what caused the suspect to go on the dangerous rampage. (We will update as soon as we learn new information.)

So far, police have not released the names of the suspect, the victims or the man who pulled the gun.

[mvccd1000]

1. Has to be BS.

Why are you linking to right-wing sources?

Everyone knows guns in public is bad, bad, bad.

The only thing that happens is the unprepared gun-toter (would-be mass murderer) will have his gun taken away and used against him.

(All sarcasm, by the way. Nice work to the prepared citizen who stopped a violent crime in progress. I hope he didn't offend any of the victims by using a gun to do so... we've all seen the posters here who don't want any crazed gun owners protecting THEM.)

[movonne]

51. Is this story suppose to be "good gun" story..let also talk about even

more stories of mass killings with guns..

[gejohnston]

52. he was being snarky

[Remmah2]

2. Multiple stabbings oh my!

Assault steak knife with a black handle.

Where do you attach a bayonet to a think like that?

[Clames]

5. Needs a laser sight.

I put a 10x scope on my crowbar for precision long range bludgeoning.

[Remmah2]

7. Burris or Nikon?

What kind of reticle? Being a tactical crow bar I would suspect mil-dot.

[rrneck]

3. I guess we need to ban those assault knives. nt

[unblock]

4. i'm guessing it should be "man carrying gun" unless the gun really did carry the man.

"gun-carrying man" would also do the trick.

[Hoyt]

6. Glad he didn't follow advice of gun culture to shoot when pull your weapon. I give him credit, but

sounds like he could have accomplished same thing with pepper spray, (and yes) a can of beans, or a staff (which works great against a knife).

Glad no one got shot. Sounds like knife guy may have been mentally ill -- so I'm happy he wasn't sentenced to death by one of the hardened gun culture members.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

10. Here in NJ...

...it's difficult to get a permit for a concealed carry staff. I'll have to stick with the food items.

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

12. Conversely, I was thinking that the gun-guy could've saved the city alot of legal costs.

I would have to imagine morticians and autopsies cost less than lawyers and judges.

Being emboldened by that knife, I'm not sure threatening words or a can of beans would have assuredly prevented anyone else from being stabbed. Although, this is a great example of how a gun was used to diffuse a situation with no one ending up dead. As clearly evidenced by this article, not all toters are rude citizens with itchy trigger fingers just looking for an excuse to shoot someone... not that anyone here ever makes any such accusations ( ).

[Hoyt]

13. There's the gun culture mentality fostered by NRA. Save a few bucks by killing him sounds

familiar to me . . . . . .where did I hear that before?

Fact is, guy might have a mental problem and unless there was no other choice, this gun carrier did the right thing.

[Jenoch]

16. In the heat of

the incident the mental capacity of the madman with the knife is not relevant.

[Hoyt]

17. You are wrong, but TBaggers everywhere will nod in agreement with you.

The man with the gun did the right thing -- didn't listen to gun trainers who tell you to fire if you pull your weapon.

[friendly_iconoclast]

19. How is he wrong? Not everybody has your telepsychological skills, Hoyt.

And I rather doubt they had time to stop and administer a MMPI...

[geckosfeet]

35. Hmmm. And right now I am trying not to get into a battle of wits with an unarmed man.

So I will leave this thread...

[rl6214]

40. "unless there was no other choice, this gun carrier did the right thing"

You're finally starting to get it.

[Starboard Tack]

22. Is that what you mean by "diffuse a situation"?

"I was thinking that the gun-guy could've saved the city alot of legal costs. I would have to imagine morticians and autopsies cost less than lawyers and judges."

diffuse: verb transitive
1. To pour out and cause to spread freely. 2. To spread about or scatter; disseminate. 3. To make less brilliant; soften.

[Jenoch]

15. Do you really

believe that a madman with a knife would really be afraid of another man with a can of beans?

"Drop the knife or I'll throw this can of beans at you" just does not have the same fear factor of the possibility of being shot with a gun.

If the guy threw the can of beans, the madman with the knife would have turned on him. Good luck with the beans if you're ever in this situation.

By the way, where did you learn that the 'gun culture' advises to shoot instead of demanding the perp drop the weapon? Every conceal carry class teaches this sort of thing. I've read your posts and while I guess I can understand your fear of guns, I can also see the hyperbole in all of your posts.

[Hoyt]

18. You are a bit paranoid, but that's expected here.

[Missycim]

43. So have you

ever stopped a perp with a can of beans? or maybe if you want to kick a little ass throw a can soup at him?

[Hoyt]

49. Beats strapping a gun on before venturing out.

[Missycim]

53. Thats your misguided opinion

If not for the stinking state i live in (NJ) I could strap a gun or two on.

[Travis_0004]

38. So the situation ends about as good as it possibly could, and you still won't accept a gun helped?

Once the man pulled a gun, the violence stopped, yet you think a can of beans would have been a better solution?

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

9. High Capacity assault knives that can stab 100's of times before resharpening are a real problem...

Just imagine how many people could have stabbed and slashed before having to put a new edge on that blade. There's no reason knives should have to be that pointy or that sharp. They should come with some degree of dullness so as to limit the number of times they can be used as a weapon before having to stop and resharpen. I think a knife that can effectively cut six times before requiring honing is all that is needed.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

11. Knives clearly need to be made of softer materials. :) n/t

[Hoyt]

14. Obama would have done like in your signature, without need to resort to carrying a gun.

[friendly_iconoclast]

20. Yeah, well Cartoon Obama wasn't there, was he?

But I tell you what, Hoyt- not only do I support your right to try and subdue a crazy with a knife, I sincerely wish the best for you if you someday happen to.

[Hoyt]

21. And luckily none of our hardened gun culturists were either, or guy would have been shot mulitiple

times. Some would have reloaded too.

I'm not particularly worried about it.

I actually had a mental patient pull a butcher knife on me once when I worked in a store during the summer. It was obvious she was crazy. No one was hurt and the lady was admitted for observation.

[Union Scribe]

25. Wow, you just have a story for ever occasion

Hoyt, the most interesting man on the Internet

[ohiosmith]

31. This post was alerted on. The jury voted 5/1 to let it stand.

At Fri Jul 27, 2012, 06:12 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

And luckily none of our hardened gun culturists were either, or guy would have been shot mulitiple
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1172&pid=55312

REASON FOR ALERT:

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate. (See <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=aboutus#communitystandards" target="_blank">Community Standards</a>.)

ALERTER'S COMMENTS:

by "our" he's clearly talking about posters here, and he's saying that DUers he disagrees with would likely gleefully murder a guy, even "reloading" to shoot him some more.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Fri Jul 27, 2012, 06:25 PM, and the Jury voted 1-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: How does the alerter know that the poster is referring to DUers and not other "gun culturists" in general? Leave it.
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: The inference is too weak to support censorship.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to HIDE IT and said: Agree with alerter... and, although there are WAY too many Internet Tough Guys often involved in this subject, I did not really see any inappropriate behavior or Internet Tough Guy snark until this particular post. Inappropriate
and over-the-top snark and accusations.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: Who the poster means by "our" is open to interpretation. On my first reading I thought he was talking about gun enthusiasts in general.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: no it really isn't clear he was talking about a DU'er.

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

[shadowrider]

32. Get used to it. Anti's can say anything they want and with very few and isolated

incidents, their comments are allowed to stand. In any other forum or group they'd be tombstoned.

Mention regional bigotry however, that's another story.

[Lizzie Poppet]

48. Because the jury system is made of fail.

far too many jurors seem to vote on the basis of whether or not they agree with the post, not on whether or not it's a violation. Fail.

[rl6214]

41. "I actually had a mental patient pull a butcher knife on me once"

Of course you did...

[Missycim]

44. he must have used that laser scanner gun to confuse/disarm her.

or there always was that trusty can of beans to fall back on.

[rl6214]

50. He's experienced absolutely every scenario out there

[Starboard Tack]

23. A stun gun/taser would've worked perfectly.

Obviously, the gun carrier succeeded without being shot by another gun carrier who may have been shot by yet another etc. etc. all in the name of freedom and protecting each other.
As long as we have a relatively sane minority of gun carriers, we will continue to see these wonderful outcomes. However, as more and more guns enter the public stage, we will eventually arrive at a point of diminishing returns. Imagine, for example, that there had been 20 or 30 gun carriers in the Aurora theater. All looking for a clean head shot, in the dark, with pandemonium all around. Oh yeah!
You guys who carry in urban environments are fucking it up for everyone else who wants to own a gun to protect his home and family, go hunting, target shooting, or just enjoys collecting. You give everyone else a bad name, the same way as all extremists.
Those who carry may not see themselves as extremists, but their behavior is extreme, as is most reactionary behavior. The Taliban are a great example.

[gejohnston]

24. actually this is the vast majority

that is the problem I find with the "not so thrilled about gun rights" crowd. Lame arguments. Some, like this one, are based on stereotypes and scenarios that has yet to happen. The subtext is "CCW holders are too stupid to tell the good attacker from the kid at the soda fountain". Another is inane rants that calls empirical data from the FBI and ATF as "NRA talking points" while stringing together various logical fallacies and insults.
The worst, and more common in GD than here, is what amounts to hate speech.

[sylvi]

33. I particularly like the ones about Evil Toters™ carrying in restaurants

I particularly like the ones about Evil Toters™ carrying in restaurants or other crowded places and someone drops a tray of glasses, or a car backfires, or someone sets off a firecracker and they all clear leather and start banging away at one another. It's kind of like Bigfoot - I often hear about it but have never seen it. Sounds more like a hopeful but sick fantasy on the part of gun-fearers than anything with a real chance of happening.

[shadowrider]

34. Don't think they don't dream about any incident to push an anti-gun agenda n/t

[Union Scribe]

26. Have fun getting that close to a knife-wielding maniac

Amazing how you took this story and made the person who stopped the violence the "extremist."

[Starboard Tack]

36. I have on more than one occasion. One guy had a machete.

Always managed to talk them down. Surprisingly easy when the only weapon you have is your brain. A handgun will work too, most of the time and garden shears can be used for cutting hair.

[Missycim]

45. I think a gun is far easier

and less prone to misunderstanding.

[Starboard Tack]

47. Lots of things in life are easier

Unfortunately, easy doesn't mean best. Today's easy can often lead to tomorrow's nightmare.

[rl6214]

42. "gun carrier succeeded without being shot by another gun carrier who may have been shot...

by yet another etc. etc."

Yeah I know, just like all the other times this has happened, right?

Oh wait, this has never happened before.

[Iggy]

27. So Gun Wielder Did Not

actually shoot the perp but merely had to threaten him to get him to think twice
and stop. nice

this fits w/ my thought regarding how most perps are cowards.. if you confront with a
superior weapon... coulda been a larger knife in this case, they're going to back down

[gejohnston]

28. or a sword cane,

battle ax, whatever.

[Iggy]

29. Sort of Unwieldly, No?

but yeah, whatever it takes to get the psycho perp to stop, and doesn't harm
innocent bystanders.. I'm good.

this case is instructive as it shows you don't actually have to shoot the buffoon

hope the guy had a permit for the forearm

[gejohnston]

30. I think he did

but if he were in Wyoming before 2010, he would need a permit for the sword cane (being a non resident, he still would. Wyoming is "green" only for legal residents) Their law was passed in the 1880s, but I digress.

[Iggy]

37. OK, thanks for the info

You an AF veteran? If yes, thank you for your service.

Retired AF in the family here

[gejohnston]

39. retired AF

[ileus]

46. Knives stab people.