Seeking Advice and Suggestions for Home Defense

[Tuesday Afternoon]

Single Female living alone in fairly remote area.

Owning a .22 Pistol and a M48 Rifle

Where would be the best place in the home to keep these?

Loaded? Unloaded?

[Warpy]

1. Nothing will make a bad guy run faster

than the sound of a shell being racked into a shotgun. In addition, you don't need good aim if it's dark if they don't move fast enough.

It will make a hell of a mess, though.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

2. don't have a shotgun. have a rifle.

right now it is stored away in a safe place. there has been a rash of home invasions further up the road.

brother says to keep the pistol loaded and holstered in the nightstand by the bed

[former-republican]

6. The only thing I would mention to you

is a .22 pistol sometimes can be notorious for jams with bad rim fire ammo.
It can short cycle so please take it out and fire a few hundred rounds .

Know how to clear a jam and have a couple of extra mags.

Is the handgun an auto or a revolver?

[Tuesday Afternoon]

11. auto. shot off 23 rounds today. have an extra mag loaded.

are empty mags really $50.oo these days? brother said Yes

[former-republican]

16. yes they can be depending on model

It's nuts on some prices for mags.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

23. crazy

[glacierbay]

7. Your first line of defense

is making it as difficult as possible for the criminal to get in the house, there are several cheap ways to harden your house against home invasions, next, get a noisy dog, doesn't have to be big, just noisy, make sure you have a safe room you can retreat to, keep a cell phone handy at all times, don't go looking for a prowler/burglar, call police and stay where you are, If you live alone, you can keep your .22 out and loaded but don't chamber unless your life is in danger, shooting someone is a last resort that will, I guarantee, change your life forever.
A .22 is just as lethal as a .45 if it strikes the right place on a human body.
Your best weapon is your what's inside your noggin, try to stay calm and think clearly.
Hope that helps.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

13. sorry can't do the dog thing. (see below) do have a safe room.

[glacierbay]

21. I tell people that if having a dog is not an option

have a recording of a dog barking, just the noise will usually scare off the perp, unless of course, they've scouted out your house and know you don't have one, but that's when the fortifying of the home comes in.
Bottom line is make it as hard as possible for the perp to gain access to your home.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

22. house is pretty well locked down tight at night and when I am not home.

[glacierbay]

25. One more thing

get a decent alarm system, they're reasonably priced these days.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

27. good idea. need to research that. thanks.

[safeinOhio]

48. Here are some ideas that are cheap.

On your door hinges and striker plates, replace the short screws with 3 inch ones. Windows, put a stick in between the lower sash and the top or drill a hole and install a stop so window is hard to open even if broken out. Put motion detector lights on all porches. They can be bought for less than $30. now. Put a dead bolt on the door in your safe room and keep a phone in there or take your cell with you. Even if you don't have a system, you can put up stickers that say you do on doors and windows. For about $8 each you can get alarms with a battery in them to stick on window that will sound an alarm if the window is messed with.
I have a small fake tv strobe light I leave on that makes it looks like some one is up and watching tv all night or when I'm gone. I also bought a phone for about $50 that has a motion detector built in. If there is movement, it will call my cell and I can listen in and hear what is going on. I keep the sheriffs non-911 number on speed dial on my cell also. Hope you are able to keep your car in the garage all the time so they won't know if you are home or not.
I carry a 22 and it is great if you are a decent shot. Shoot for hip or shoulder bones. For you at home, you may want to invest in a low cost 38 or a 12 gauge shotgun. Either one can be found used for about $200.
Best of luck and stay safe.

[glacierbay]

57. Good points

that's almost exactly what our dept. teaches home owners. I always tell home owners that a firearm should be an absolutely last resort as having to use it will change your life forever.
Good advice and post.

[safeinOhio]

66. This will work great in getting the cops there ASAP.

Hello, I'm calling from my safe room that I'm locked in with all of my guns and amo. When the intruder starts to kick in this door, I am going to start to open fire through the door to protect myself.

Code red, code red.

[glacierbay]

69. That has actually happened a few times with my dept.

and you're right, it does get LEO moving that much faster.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

74. yes, that is what I am prepared to do. brother talked me (today) into keeping pistol at bedside--

that is what inspired this thread because I had been keeping both guns in safe room unloaded.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

67. thanks for the tips. good advice in there. I will work toward these goals

[former-republican]

31. .........

[glacierbay]

34. Or that. LOL

that will certainly get their attention.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

44. heh - heh - heh

awesomeness

[Warpy]

29. A .22 does a hell of a lot more damage

because it bounces around off bone, tearing its way as it goes.

A .45 tends to go right through.

I have seen more gunshot wounds than I care to.

[glacierbay]

32. As have I

Too damn many. And your correct, that's why the preferred weapon of the Israeli hit teams is the .22.

[ManiacJoe]

8. Shotguns still need to be aimed.

The average spread of 00 buck from an 18 inch barrel is only 1 inch per yard of travel.

[former-republican]

3. odd choice of firearms for a female living alone

Has she ever shot the M48 8mm ?

Tell her to keep both loaded and the handgun on or near her side .


I'm sorry

I didn't know you were the female asking.

I thought the poster was asking for someone else he knew.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

5. no problem. both were cheaply acquired and Yes, I have shot the M48 although it has been awhile.

Shot the 22 today. why keep both loaded? the pistol is loaded and holstered in my nightstand.

[former-republican]

14. In case you're not near your pistol .

[Tuesday Afternoon]

19. ok. pistol is first line of defense. rifle is second line.

[nenagh]

4. Our Irish Grannie always recommended a 'barking' dog...

She had a beautiful German shepherd .... If anyone came near... The dog was very protective..

[Tuesday Afternoon]

9. dogs chase cows. neighbor has cows. I have cats.

[nenagh]

60. I understand...not a good idea, then..

Good luck...

[Kali]

89. ankle biters are better alarms, if not very serious protection

and the cows kind of just laugh at them

[rrneck]

10. I can only offer a genetal idea...

Keep doors and windows locked and the pistol near enough you can get to it when somebody tries to break in. Think if the perimeter of the house as a means to slow down your attacker and sound the alarm when he tries to breach it.

Locked doors and windows buy you time.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

15. these I am doing. however this time of year there is a nice breeze -- so windows are open at times

pistol is in nightstand. I am not worried so much during day. It is at night that I am concerned.

[rrneck]

18. Then next to the bed is probably best.

Of course if there's kids around think about a gun safe.

Eta: Self defense guns should always be loaded.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

20. home alone.

kids are grown and gone

[Tuesday Afternoon]

24. the pistol is loaded. rifle is not.

Maybe I should rethink the rifle . . .

[rrneck]

33. I wouldnt.

Maybe rounds in the magazine, but it's pretty big for home defense. I'd think about a different handgun or a shotgun.

My preferred combination.

Remington 870 18" bbl.



Colt 1911 .45ACP.



A. 22 will work as long as you think "head shot". But you'd need to really slow him down to bring a full sized battle rifle to bear. And depending on the surrounding area, be careful about over penetration.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

35. I would love to rethink but, budget constraints will not allow at this time.

I love my .22 I am not "thinking" anything except Stop.

My pattern is pretty tight. brother says that if I am aiming at chest area I will be fine. Also, for some reason I shoot better under pressure. we do different scenarios in target practice.

[rrneck]

38. Sounds like you're in pretty good shape.

If it looks like that .22 isn't gonna stop him, just cuss him. It'll make a helluva mess, but you gotta do what you gotta do.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

40. I really did laugh out loud. you know I can cuss someone to death, for real

[Tuesday Afternoon]

41. honestly, what I think would be good for me for home defense would be a

sawed off double barrel shotgun.

[rrneck]

49. I'd trade that rifle for one unless youre attached to it. nt

[Tuesday Afternoon]

51. oh, I would trade the rifle for a sawed off side by side dbl barrel in a heartbeat

[former-republican]

64. not a sawed off

Stay away from any guy that says that.
Go with a legal coach gun.

Cheap to buy and pack one hell of a wallop.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

68. not sawed off to be illegal. sawed off legal. but, yeah a side by side is what I would like

[former-republican]

75. Only reason I said it due to barrel length

There are people that do their own gun smithing but you just have to be carefull.
Some might unintentionally have it an inch or two shorter than legal.

You might be able to find a used coach gun for a couple of hundred dollars.

I have one and they are a lot of fun to shoot.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

77. I bet it is fun to shoot. brother would not let me buy anything illegal.

we have a very reputable gunsmith in the area and several gun shops with target galleries.

[formercia]

93. I like the Slug hole the best

Brennekes are right on at 50 Meters in mine.

[formercia]

97. You're welcome

[formercia]

92. And everyone understands the sound of a Rem. 870

having a round chambered.

I love mine.

[glacierbay]

94. That's what our Dept. issues us for our patrol cars

you're right, nothing like the sound of a 12 ga. slide being racked.

[former-republican]

42. center mass , always center mass

The head is what moves the most on a human body .



Just keep firing until the threat is down.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

45. yes, that is what brother says.

[rrneck]

47. With most guns yes.

And center mass might stop him long enough for a tap to the head, but I've shot a lot of animals with a. 22 that never slowed down.

A few rounds in the chest to start maybe, but I wouldn't count on it to stop him.

[former-republican]

52. sure , no argument there but unless he strung out on PCP

a few shot's in the chest will slow anyone down and make them rethink their plan.

I never try to compare animal pain thresholds with human ones.

I'm also a hunter and have seen white tails legs shot clean off and they still can run a mile.

Humans pain thresholds are quite different than an animals.

[rrneck]

61. That's very true. nt

[Tuesday Afternoon]

53. the mag holds ten rounds -- surely, if all ten hit center mass it will stop the mofo

surely

[rrneck]

58. I expect so.

You seem like the kind of person who wouldn't mind dumping a mag in him of that's what it takes.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

62. well, truth be told I would just want him/her/it to Stop Advancing. I will just have to stop my

inner Nurse from going over and assessing the patient

I know to dial 911 .... response time is normally 15 minute in my area.

[rrneck]

73. That's the idea. Shoot to stop. nt

[SDjack]

101. When I went through the analysis for what my wife can handle,

I decided on the Remington 870 18" 20-gauge for defense in our RV. The ammo is #1 Buckshot for targets less than 25 yards. I picked the 20-gauge because the thin walls of our RV will stop or slow the pellets enough that they will not penetrate a neighbor's RV. For a house, I would get the 12-gauge. I keep my shotgun loaded and next to my bed, a box of ammo within easy reach where I can grab it in the dark. For safety, I keep a Snap Cap (sold by Pistoleer.com) in the chamber, and 4 shells in the magazine. If a child finds the shotgun, deactivates the safety, and pulls the trigger, the hammer falls on the Snap Cap and nothing is fired. I now have to depend on the manual pump lock release to stop the kid from loading a live shell. When I'm ready to shoot, I pump once to eject the Snap Cap, load a live shell, and make that scary slide noise.

I decided against an automatic and a double-barrel because of the lack of a scary loading sound. Also, a double-barrel is a little heavy for my wife, and re-loading in the dark will take longer than for a pump. A sawed-off pump may cause legal problems, so I decided against all modifications.

As another commenter pointed out, the noise of the slide as the shell is chambered is frightening. Probably, that sound is the most well-known in world.

I previous decided against getting a pistol because of possibilities of penetrating a neighbor's RV. Maybe a 22-cal will be OK -- I'm going to take another look. Also, I would like for walking my dog at night, as we frequently encounter poisonous snakes.

[rrneck]

102. Sounds like you're set up.

I loves me some 870. Thousands of rounds and nary a fail. I'm not sure about that whole sound of the slide racking sound thing. I wouldn't want to hear it, but it might just mark your position for the wrong guy.

Someone asked me once what was the best security light to stop a home invasion. I told them "muzzle flash".

Good idea to have a pistol for hostile critters if they're about.

[safeinOhio]

54. If you use a stop or

a stick wedged in between the lower sash and the top you can keep the window open a few inches and it can't be raise any more. I saw those stick on window alarms with a battery in them for $8 at ACE hardware the other day. If you live in the country, try a few guinea hens. Not only good for an alarm, they are a riot to have, plus they will eat every tick in your yard.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

71. oh yeah, guineas are cool. want some of those. thanks.

[oneshooter]

99. Be carefull of what you post. A "genetal" idea?

[rrneck]

100. Gah!

Especially in a group with more penis cracks than the lounge.

I love my fucking phone.

[formercia]

12. The M48

I assume you are describing the Yugoslav M48 in 8x57js. I have one and like it. You might check the bore and look for pitting. The one I bought had a terrible bore, so I re-barreled it. If you need to defend yourself, finding and loading it would be problematic. You can put cartridges in the Magazine and leave the chamber empty, that way, if someone were to examine it, the only way it could fire is if they loaded a round into the chamber. Don't use the cheap surplus ammo that is available. It's very corrosive. Lapua, Norma and Nosler make some very effective Ammunition that will do the job when Hunting.
For the 22, I would recommend CCI Stinger or Velocitor Long Rifle rounds. They are effective and make a lot of noise.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

17. yes, that is the rifle.

PPU/made in Serbia is the ammo I have for it.

[former-republican]

26. That's fine , that's new production

[Tuesday Afternoon]

28. good to know. thanks

[krispos42]

90. Got a bayonet for it?

If things get close and personal it might be critical if an attacker tried to rush you while you're working the bolt. It's also intimidating.


Keep it sharp.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

30. forgot to say that the ammo for the .22

is remington thunderbolt -- loud enough, I think. high pitched Ka-rack!! I wear ear plugs for target practice. can't stand that sound.

[Jenoch]

96. You said your .22 pistol was a semi-auto.

If I recall correctly, Remington Thunderbolt .22 ammunition is just a lead bullet. That is real dirty ammo (cheap, but dirty) as it leaves a lot of residue in the action and barrel. You should consider buying jacketed ammo. That is ammo that has a copper coating on the lead bullet itself.

I have a Ruger MKII .22 pistol that is a pain to breakdown and put back together to clean the action. I stopped using the Thunderbolt ammo because it is not jacketed.

[tularetom]

37. I have a S&W 640 (.357) in the nightstand

and a coach type shotgun (hammer gun) in the hall closet loaded with "buck & ball" rounds.

We also have the perimeter alarmed although we forget to set the alarm about half the time. And three large dogs on the porch.

Sometimes I think I'm a little paranoid but we are really in a remote area (only one neighbor within a mile).

[Tuesday Afternoon]

43. you are prepared! I am not so remote as you. kind of glad --

the older I get the more I think about "female, living alone" ... ugh.

[tularetom]

63. Yeah our neighbor is 75 and she lives alone

Her kids are always trying to get her out of there but she's really dug in her heels. She's kind of a cowgirl, still keeps horses and rides and she's a pretty good shot as well. A retired lawyer but I like her anyway.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

70. heh! good on Her!! I know how she feels. There is no place like home.

[MercutioATC]

46. It sounds silly, but scream like a banshee if you see an intruder.

Yes, put as many of those .22 rounds into his chest as you can, but scream while you do it. Our society doesn't wire us for insane screaming. It's really unnerving.

Shoot and scream. Don't worry about what you're screaming...the less sense you make, the better.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

50. well, I probably will be or else cussing like a sailor

[MercutioATC]

56. The crazier you sound, the better.

Getting shot and screamed at by a crazy person can be a HUGE deterrent.

As for the rest, keep the .22 loaded but not cocked if you're concerned. It's nothing to rack the slide if you need to. Get used to it. Practice, practice, practice.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

65. yes. practice and scream like a Banshee! will do, thanks

[oneshooter]

55. My Loving Wife prefers her Colt Lightweight Commander in 45acp

and her High Point 99 carbine in 9mm with a BSA red dot sight.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

59. your loving wife is lucky to have you

loving husband that you are

[oneshooter]

80. Ya, I'm just a big softy.

The 45 was my CHL gun. Until she started shooting it, I was then informed that it was hers, and I needed to choose another to replace it!

I really do miss it!

[bowens43]

72. A big dog is far more effective and much much safer.

You are more likely to die yourself or kill someone you love than you are to actually encounter a situation in which you can successfully defend yourself with a gun.

Guns are next to useless for self defense.

[glacierbay]

78. BS

guns are used frequently for self defense, yes, a dog is a good line of defense, but if a perp gets past the dog and you are in imminent danger, than having a firearm to stop the threat is a good thing.
Quit giving bad advice on self defense, you just look foolish.

[alittlelark]

79. I don't know if they are next to useless, but I agree about a dog.

Even a medium to small dog will go ballistic w/ barking. Very distracting and disturbing to all unfamiliar w/ the creature, and a warning to those who are.
I am a cat person, but I have almost always owned a med-large dog (that I love) for home protection.
They love unconditionally and will do anything to protect you. Fortunately none of mine were ever put to the test
They are the best deterrent one can get.

A 12 gauge shotgun is the 2nd line of defense.



PS- I have never posted in this forum before. I stumbled on this post.

[glacierbay]

82. Very good advice

welcome to the our group.

[former-republican]

85. welcome to the group

[Redlo Nosrep]

86. My First DU Post...

Hubby and I are also cat people, no living breathing doggie on the premises. However, Rex the Wonder Dog has electronically made us feel much safer, along with the shotgun by the bed.

http://www.amazon.com/ED-50-Electronic-Watchdog-Barking-Alarm/dp/B002XITC5G

Visual props on the porch include a big dog bed with chew toys, half-filled food and water dishes, and a Frisbee. Out in the front yard is a chain leash hooked up to an overhead pulley system next to a large-sized Dogloo.

The finishing touch is a picture of a mutt on the front gate, with the caption, "Hi, my name is Demon and I live here."

I know, I know -- probably safer and easier just to go ahead and get a REAL demon dog!

P.S. As an aside, I've lurked on DU for years and finally got up my courage to join your fascinating conversations.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

87. Welcome to DU, Redlo Nosrep!

I'm glad you decided to stop lurking and become part of the family.

This is a very cool place.........it's my electronic home!

[EvolveOrConvolve]

88. Welcome to DU!

[glacierbay]

91. A warm welcome to DU.

[Eleanors38]

83. I am sure Tuesday is aware of the truth...

You know, there is a point when your unsupported opinion borders on being irresponsible in this real-life situation.

[tech3149]

76. Seriously, you don't say what kind of area you live in but it's bad enough you have to worry

I think you should worry more about how connected you are to your community. I've lived in the NE all my life. Quite a few of those years were in areas that were considered "crime ridden", others fairly affluent that were prime targets for the less well off looking for an easier income. I never felt the need or had the use for lethal weapons to defend myself.
Now I'm back home with my 91 y/o mother. I've got two long guns. A 22 and an 8mm. I put a rifle rack above my bed and keep a few rounds in the same room with the rest in a locked ammo box.
Even on the odd chance that there would be a problem, those few rounds should be all I need. If not, either one could bust a skull when up close and personal.
Being more rural I don't think you'll ever need your guns for anything other than varmints and predators. In that case keep them close to the door(unloaded).

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

98. Hope this helps

Knowledge is power so be aware and stay informed. Watch your perimeters often. Know your neighbors whether they're across the road or on the other side of the hill. Friends are a great asset. Watch the news and talk to your neighbors. If there have been break ins in your area, make sure those same means of entry to your property are secured.

Make a safety assessment of your property and structure(s). Identify risks and issues. If there are remote locations (e.g. a pier on the water, barn, shed, wooded area...) these can be deadly if you are assaulted or get injured there. Always have a means to communicate. If cell service is poor or unavailable at your home, Motorola (and probably others) offer cordless phones that offer optimum ranges to 900 feet or more. Get a realistic idea of worst case law enforcement response times. Your safe room should be hardened enough for twice that long. Make sure to change your locks if you have reason to distrust anyone who had a key in the past. It's not a bad idea to add a manual slide bolt to any outside doors and to the safe room door. Slide bolts can't be picked.

A fence is a good idea. People don't "accidentally" climb over a fence.

Budget wise, I would spend 75% of any security budget you have on upgrades to your home (doors, windows, communications, alarms...) and 25% on arms and weapons training. I wouldn't rely on anything longer than maybe an M1 carbine indoors. They're hard to maneuver. It's good to have a firearm that easily operates quietly and be practiced at quiet operation. While the sound of chambering a round in a 12 gauge will cause most folks to run, the same sound will also give away your location. Practice everything you may need to do in an emergency.

While quite amusing, the USMC rules contain some good advice: http://www.snipercountry.com/articles/gunfightrules.asp

Best of luck.