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Mon Feb 29, 2016, 04:44 PM

Go home CounterPunch, you're drunk

Why do so many black Americans support Hillary Clinton? Stockholm Syndrome. They are faithful battered wives. They are yoked to Hillary by co-dependency: “I’ve stuck by you and suffered to do so for so long that you owe me, and I have faith that you will reward me later if I help you reach your goal now.”

In their minds they have no such guarantee from Bernie Sanders (and of course from Hillary such a guarantee is an illusion). It is clear that Bernie Sanders has been successful without being dependent on them up to now. So (again, in their minds) he owes them nothing, and thus cannot be counted on to reward them after the election for their support during it.

What this sad diminished thinking shows is a lack of confident independence, an inability to reason that the best estimator of Bernie Sanders’ future trustworthiness is the consistency of his commitment to their fundamental cause for over half a century.

One has to acknowledge the detestable brilliance of the Wall Street and 1%-ist strategy of political purchase: own Hillary and Obama who in turn have enchained so many proletarian minds to their identity-politics personality cults: Pied Pipers leading their trusting conga lines into the Wall Street abattoir.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/02/29/the-cult-of-hillary-the-ultimate-junk-bond/

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Response to Blue_Tires (Original post)

Mon Feb 29, 2016, 04:47 PM

1. Definitely drunk ...

but thanks for posting.

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Response to Blue_Tires (Original post)

Mon Feb 29, 2016, 04:58 PM

2. Ok, I thought you were doing a satire piece

At first.

Holy shit, that is one odd article.

Mr. Garcia are you trolling us? Is this a distillation of hatefulness high points culled from DU, Discussionist, Crooks and liars etc.?

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Response to Blue_Tires (Original post)

Mon Feb 29, 2016, 05:06 PM

3. How the hell do you stand this crap, BT? As a black Sanders supporter, how do you stand it?

How do you feel when you see OPs from people screaming that "old" black people are now to be reviled? The folks that got their asses beat to give our black asses the right to fucking vote, to get us educated, allow us to work where we want, are now "the problem" because they are not rallying around the "right" candidate?

How do you stand it? That black people are stupid/uninformed now because most have rejected Sanders. That it's "Stockholm Syndrome" and not that people just don't want that man as their president.

You have never shit on Clinton as far as I can tell and Lord knows you don't just "stumble" into this forum just to prop up Sanders. You have always been an incredible contributor to this group and to this web site. You have ALWAYS been *here* and not just when it's convenient. But I want to know how you feel reading this stuff. Personally, as someone who is not enthusiastic about any of these people, I can barely stomach it. It is absolutely rage inducing.

How do you feel reading this kind of stuff?

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Response to Number23 (Reply #3)

Mon Feb 29, 2016, 05:38 PM

4. Well, for starters

I'm betting that "old black people" poster isn't one of us to begin with, so it's easy for me to disregard...

Yes, it pisses me off to no end reading BernieBro stuff (and DU is pretty mild to the madness I see on Twitter) but I guess I feel a personal bit of responsibility or something because I see a lot of myself in the BernieBros back when I was a naive 24-year-old grad student and a true believer in Ralph Nader...

I happen to like both candidates and hate to see people automatically believe that supporting one means making war with the other. And as far as true Sanders supporters go, I happen to love their passion, however misguided it may be....

Personally, due in no small part to the huge missteps I told everyone the Sanders camp was making with minority voters, this primary is pretty much all over except for the shouting. I can't think of a single southern state where Sanders has a snowball's chance, including my own... But I happen to like the man (although he's had some real assclowns managing his campaign, sadly), I happen to like many of the topics he's brought to the forefront, and for that he deserves my vote in the primary, which will be nothing more than symbolic at this point... And then we can finally put all this silliness behind us and focus our attacks on Trump...

I'm also sticking with Sanders so when I'm compelled to remind DUers that Hillary, Obama, and the rest of the so-called "establishment" aren't evil incarnate, they can't just come back with "Oh, but you're just shilling for Hillary!!" Once I wave my support for Sanders all around their faces, they can't say anything...

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Response to Blue_Tires (Reply #4)

Mon Feb 29, 2016, 05:52 PM

6. I support Bernie but will vote for and campaign for Hillary if necessary. I also believe

Bernie's policies, vs Hillary's, are way way way better for everybody.

But that is me, and I see things from the standpoint of a privileged white person.

I happen to also believe it doesn't matter because the stupids, as I call them, (cons, teaparty) arent going to allow anything good happen for anybody, including the planet itself.

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Response to Blue_Tires (Reply #4)

Tue Mar 1, 2016, 01:12 AM

9. There is alot of truth and wisdom in this post. I think that if more people here had your reasoned

intelligent response to stuff around here, this place wouldn't be such a cesspool.

I'm betting that "old black people" poster isn't one of us to begin with, so it's easy for me to disregard...

I ain't saying nothing. Except to say, I've scratched my head at so much stuff that person has posted over the years that I'd be lying if I said I hadn't thought the exact same thing more than once. And still do. He's not alone though. Unfortunately there are a couple of others here that are all too willing to shit on black folks to get their pats on the head from a certain crowd here. By the looks of it, these folks deserve each other and they can HAVE each other. Good riddance.

I can't think of a single southern state where Sanders has a snowball's chance, including my own... But I happen to like the man (although he's had some real assclowns managing his campaign, sadly),

I've said the same thing about his campaign. One of the worse run I've ever seen. And every black poster here that's tried to get through to these people has been screamed at and shouted down. The fact that -- as usual -- we were (SHOCKINGLY) right about our own communities is kind of pointless now. Perhaps if folks here had been a bit more inclined to listen to the black folks -- supporters or not -- who were actually trying to tell Sanders that waxing endlessly about deeds done 50 years ago was not a winning strategy to make black people feel that a candidate is plugged into our issues today, he wouldn't be feeling the hurting that he's feeling right now.

As for Trump, all of these folks screaming that neither Sanders nor Clinton could beat him are wrong. Minorities have proven to be the backbone of this primary season and there is no way in hell we'll stand by and do nothing and let that man gets into office.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #9)

Tue Mar 1, 2016, 11:59 AM

10. Even before the Civil Rights talk...

Sanders made a huge strategic mistake early on by 'running' against Obama. I don't know what dudebro bubble they were living in to grossly underestimate Obama's popularity among Dems...

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Response to Blue_Tires (Reply #10)

Tue Mar 1, 2016, 01:23 PM

12. IMHO Weaver and Devine have drawn most of their talking points from DU

That's the bubble, and that's why they are assclowns. If I were Bernie I would have fired them early on. But he didn't.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #9)

Tue Mar 1, 2016, 01:25 PM

13. I'll tell you ...

 

As for Trump, all of these folks screaming that neither Sanders nor Clinton could beat him are wrong. Minorities have proven to be the backbone of this primary season and there is no way in hell we'll stand by and do nothing and let that man gets into office.


As I wrote before, Black folks will crawl, bare-kneed, over glass through hell in gas soaked draws to vote against trump ... I suspect, so will women, and the LGBTQ community and Latinos and all of the rest of the (President) Obama coalition.

But the question remains, will the white working class ... sadly, Massachusetts seems to be answering that question:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1378189

This and the general Democratic lower turn-out suggests that the "snag the disaffected white working class" movement is failing ... miserably!

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Response to Blue_Tires (Reply #4)

Tue Mar 1, 2016, 01:11 PM

11. Wait ...

 

I'm betting that "old black people" poster isn't one of us to begin with, so it's easy for me to disregard...


I was roundly taken to task ... by white folks (and our recently, self-identifying PoC folks, for reasoning that question, indirectly).

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Response to Blue_Tires (Original post)

Mon Feb 29, 2016, 05:50 PM

5. Will you stop talking to us

like we are seven year old. You want to know why your candidate is in trouble, this right here.

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Response to Coolest Ranger (Reply #5)

Mon Feb 29, 2016, 05:53 PM

7. That is the part I dont get. I advocate for Bernie, but I do it with the knowledge

that I have no fucking clue how his policies will or wont work for anyone but my privileged white ass.

I am far more interested in what you want to say, then what I want to say, I know what I want to say.

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Response to Blue_Tires (Original post)

Mon Feb 29, 2016, 06:42 PM

8. such a POS article, patronizing and insulting and just plain wrong

If Senator Sanders had started his campaign a LOT earlier and devoted a lot of time listening to and understanding the AA community, he might have had a chance. He's probably going to get decimated on Super Tuesday. My understanding is, unless he wins several states, his campaign is all but over.

If Secretary Clinton is the nominee, I will gladly support her and vote for her. DU is going to get pretty empty pretty soon, I think.

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Response to Blue_Tires (Original post)

Tue Mar 1, 2016, 11:29 PM

14. Any thoughts on how the game may change ~

When President Obama and Vice President Biden join the campaigning?

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