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Fri Jun 24, 2016, 10:21 AM

 

Brexit isn't exactly a topic relevant to AAs on first glance

But it's a good example of how aggrieved whiteness induces white people to vote against their own interests. The UK equivalent of nigger nigger nigger (as per Atwater) got abstracted into "sovereignty" and "bureaucracy" and "anti-establishment" and that's what drove this vote. This chart pretty much drive the point home.

This is the same stuff that drove all those votes for Nixon, Reagan and the Bushes, and is driving those Trump votes. Aggrieved whiteness in the face of "THOSE PEOPLE" starting to get the benefits of their society. So they, almost zombie-like, vote to ensure the benefits are reduced for everyone.

This is why white privilege is something akin to brainwashing.



(This will be part of a larger OP for GD)

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Reply Brexit isn't exactly a topic relevant to AAs on first glance (Original post)
forjusticethunders Jun 2016 OP
1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #1
forjusticethunders Jun 2016 #2
1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #5
lovemydog Jun 2016 #6
forjusticethunders Jun 2016 #8
Hortensis Jun 2016 #13
1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #14
lovemydog Jun 2016 #19
Person 2713 Jun 2016 #3
Quayblue Jun 2016 #10
Person 2713 Jun 2016 #11
Person 2713 Jun 2016 #12
Quayblue Jun 2016 #15
brer cat Jun 2016 #4
JustAnotherGen Jun 2016 #7
Starry Messenger Jun 2016 #9
ismnotwasm Jun 2016 #16
Number23 Jun 2016 #17
JustAnotherGen Jun 2016 #21
fleabiscuit Jun 2016 #18
JI7 Jun 2016 #20

Response to forjusticethunders (Original post)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 10:28 AM

1. Interesting and good catch ...

 

The UK equivalent of nigger nigger nigger (as per Atwater) got abstracted into "sovereignty" and "bureaucracy" and "anti-establishment" and that's what drove this vote.


Note the common language used by the American right AND the left, in recent days. I wonder if the usage has the same root (as you have indicated) as the UK?

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Response to forjusticethunders (Original post)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 10:32 AM

2. important to note in many cases it's been "big establishments"

 

who have been more responsive and thus have moved to implement the demands and wants of the marginalized. From the federal government pushing emancipation (at gunpoint) and desegregation (at gunpoint) on racist local/regional Southern authorities to big corporations responding to LGBT pressure and refusing to do business or cutting back business with places like North Carolina.

Of course, that doesn't constitute a defense of the *bad* things those entities do or preclude their change for other reasons but it's never black and white.

In this case the UK establishment, for all its faults, have tried to be inclusive and more accepting if only because it's better for business.

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Response to forjusticethunders (Reply #2)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 11:38 AM

5. I suspect this ...

 

important to note in many cases it's been "big establishments"


explains why so few African-Americans are on the anti-establishment/anti-Federal Government bus.

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Response to forjusticethunders (Reply #2)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 11:42 AM

6. Very interesting observations

and a great thread. I've read some posts here that are like 'oh, it's anti-establishment!' as though that's always a great thing. It isn't if the establishment issue being discussed is actually the thing that brings about more diversity and inclusion. For example, the legal profession (which often gets slammed as establishment) was one of the first to employ fairer hiring techniques. Many have benefitted from it and it has also greatly helped the profession itself.

Also to your points. I feel this way about some of the arguments against free trade as well. I think it's far too often white union people afraid of losing more who vehemently oppose free trade deals. Blinded by rhetoric and unable to see where strong, fair and free trade deals can help create more jobs, raise wages and level the playing field worldwide.

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Response to lovemydog (Reply #6)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 12:55 PM

8. I do feel that workers of all groups have lost with certain trade deals

 

But that's an issue with the structure of the deals, not trade deals themselves. A united working class can and should be a major player in the structure of globalization, both through direct action and union/labor representation, but the white workers get the vapors at the thought of having to interact with not-white workers.

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Response to forjusticethunders (Reply #8)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 02:25 PM

13. All too true. Very good thread and points, thanks.

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Response to forjusticethunders (Reply #8)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 03:37 PM

14. +1 ...

 

Last edited Sat Jun 25, 2016, 08:00 PM - Edit history (1)

And to this point:

A united working class can and should be a major player in the structure of globalization, both through direct action and union/labor representation,


I know this isn't a popular position, here; but, that is, exactly, why I'm taking a wait and see position on the TPP ... it is the first trade deal (to my knowledge) where labor protections, such as wage floors, minimum working conditions, and THE RIGHT TO ORGANIZE (with enforcement mechanisms) was written into the body of the agreement.

In the face of globalization, the American workers' winning strategy is to push for increased wages in the partnering nations, not pursuing the last war's strategy of tariffs and other forms of protectionism.

The fact is ... wages in Indonesia do not need to be anywhere near the wages here in the US to deter off-shoring (at least, in manufacturing), as there is an equilibrium point where the benefit of low wages is over-taken by the costs tied to time differences, engineering/production separation, and distance to market.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #14)

Sat Jun 25, 2016, 04:23 AM

19. Excellent points.

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Response to forjusticethunders (Original post)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 11:08 AM

3. Is tribalism, discrimination an intersecting part of a Venn diagram with racism ?

Look at how Greeks and Spaniards are depicted in the Northern press, let alone the Eastern Europeans. It’s based on discrimination and Islamophobia (Moorish rule in Spain & Italy, Ottomans in much of the rest of the South and East), Calls of “racism” in the case of Brexit even though a lot of the hate-mongering was about Poles and Czechs, is being used although not necessarily or technically about race per se.
IMO Be more concerned about how this can empower trump or gain him new voters as this gives normalcy to the kind of thought you post about

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Response to Person 2713 (Reply #3)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 01:29 PM

10. I am very confused about the anger towards Czechs and Poles.

I have some reading to do apparently.. I just don't see the logic behind it.

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Response to Quayblue (Reply #10)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 02:02 PM

11. Why some Labour Party hold areas backed Brexit it has to do with Slavic influx

We need to calmly maintain for 5 months and carry on with GOTV . IMO this gives trump a boost and that is a concern of mine

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Response to Quayblue (Reply #10)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 02:15 PM

12. Here is an article from spring when this was rising there

Listen to the Brit people saying they rather live with less and take a hit , to " get back their town" even though the immigrant work keeps the area economically healthy.
“There are far too many of them,” said Peter Chamberlain, 61, as he sat on a bench recently and watched two Polish men argue loudly in their native language. “I’d accept being less well-off to get the town back.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/15/world/europe/boston-england-immigrants-brexit.html?_r=0

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Response to Person 2713 (Reply #12)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 04:22 PM

15. Thank you! Will read when I get home!

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Response to forjusticethunders (Original post)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 11:09 AM

4. That is very interesting

and informative! Thanks for bringing it here.

K&R

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Response to forjusticethunders (Original post)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 12:53 PM

7. With the 'immigrant other'

Being Latino and Hispanics - even those folks who've been here for a hundred years.

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Response to forjusticethunders (Original post)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 01:03 PM

9. Wow, those charts. :(

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Response to forjusticethunders (Original post)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 06:59 PM

16. K&R

Great thread.

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Response to forjusticethunders (Original post)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 08:15 PM

17. You can see it in all of the crowing by mainly older, white faces throughout England. They are

thrilled by what's happened.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #17)

Sun Jun 26, 2016, 06:44 AM

21. Plus 1000 and if you get a chance

Search for auntpurl's OPs. She's giving some awesome insight into what the temperature is in GB.

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Response to forjusticethunders (Original post)

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 10:53 PM

18. IMHO it's bad governance if they go through with it.

Even with as many rotten apples we get in our houses of representation I wouldn't want a decision of this magnitude to be decided by a popular vote. Our system is set up with checks and balances, for better or worse, for a reason. I have no idea if the British government has the courage to not to vote for the legislation to make Brexit happen.

Wow, this feels like deja vu all over again. Someone must have reinserted the cosmic dvd.

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Response to forjusticethunders (Original post)

Sun Jun 26, 2016, 04:33 AM

20. the pro brexit people reminded me of a video of some white south africans i once saw

 

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