Cops Successfully Disarm A White Person Without Killing Them - Supplemental 25/09/16

[MrScorpio]

Jesse Williams: “We know that police somehow manage to de-escalate, disarm and not kill white people everyday.”

West Allis man points gun at police officer in dispute over lawn



West Allis -
All summer is how long Kim Murphy said she's had to look at her neighbor's overgrown yard.

Fed up, she called the City of West Allis. An ordinance states that grass over six inches tall is a violation and a $300 fine if the city has to come out and cut it. The city sent the homeowner notices about what was going to happen.

"So they came out that Thursday and he yelled at them," she said. "They left and came back the next day."

But the forestry department crew didn't come alone. West Allis police officers showed up too, to protect them from George Toeller.

"He's a loose cannon you just never know what he could've done next," Murphy said.

According to the criminal complaint, Toeller, 73, started arguing with officers about the city cutting his grass, when all of a sudden, he pulled out a loaded gun and pointed it directly at the officer. The officer was able to "push the gun up and away" to get control of it, take it away and arrest the man.


http://www.cbs58.com//story/32512083/west-allis-man-points-gun-at-police-officer-in-dispute-over-lawn

[pipoman]

1. The Neighborhood of Make Believe again?

In fact, as of July 9, whites were 54 percent of the 440 police shooting victims this year whose race was known, blacks were 28 percent and Hispanics were 18 percent, according to The Washington Post’s ongoing database of fatal police shootings. Those ratios are similar to last year’s tally, in which whites made up 50 percent of the 987 fatal police shootings, and blacks, 26 percent.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2016/07/18/police-shootings-and-race/?utm_term=.16520fce81f9

Why lie about it? Wouldn't it be more impactful to consider all police shootings..

[heaven05]

2. no lies in OP about the murder/executions

of AA's, men, womem and childdren. I see diversion and distraction from your using one suspect source. The Guardian(british) 'The Counted': People killed by police 2016, show a disparity in killings by race, by police, that can't be ignored or diminished with distraction and diversion using a poll by a reichwing newspaper. All these diversion tactics from facts are well known to people here. Won't work.

[pipoman]

3. There is no suspect to the truth that year over year

Police shootings are around 50% white, 30% black, and most of the rest are Hispanic. The FBI, BJS, and every other fact based source have these very numbers. Statements like, "Jesse Williams: “We know that police somehow manage to de-escalate, disarm and not kill white people everyday.” A lie when white people are killed in almost twice the numbers of any other race.....why lie?

[heaven05]

4. Hey

I just don't believe it. No doubts about my living reality in america. White are more of the population and whites ARE more than likely to be disarmed and given EVERY benefit of the doubt before lethal action is used. NOT true in cases involving AA. I know, truth can be uncomfortable to many here. As my daddy used to say, "deal with it"!!

[pipoman]

5. You don't believe what? That you are being lied to? Google is your friend...

Or pretend your disbelief trumps facts I suppose....Interesting that nearly 2 white folks and 1/2 Hispanic person are killed by police for each black person and you hear about none of them...why would we ignore over 60% of police shootings while trying to make the case for police shooting reform? Insanity or lies....?

[heaven05]

9. lied to?

not true. My eyes see murder and executions of unarmed and non-threatening AA, some who lay in the streets for hours. Of course reality says there are some "bad dudes" out here who are armed, dangerous, threatening black, white and Hispanic who deserve what they get. One recent post of a citizen protecting her home proves that. No problem with me there. So while your point is understood, I stand by what I said. I don't believe any google BS or polls that say AA ARE NOT targets and never will, every since zimmerman all the way up to and including these two latest high profile executions of police committing murder. Really way before then. But I know it would be a waste of time to expound that fact. I'm done with this. Got to move on to more substantive issue that can be debated. Like what the fuck is wrong with americans who love their new fuhrer in the person of the current reichwing candidate.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

7. Think about it. The RATE of AA killings is higher. Whites are about 5/6 times the population of AA.

Your claim of a "lie" is the suspect statement because you are using a simple number and not properly accounting for the difference in percentage of population.

Fact: African Americans are killed by police in a disproportionate rate compared to the rate for whites.

Your own statistic proves this.

[pipoman]

8. This statement is a lie...

"Jesse Williams: “We know that police somehow manage to de-escalate, disarm and not kill white people everyday.”

Rate has nothing to do with it. For every black shooting there is over 2 of other races...why are 2 out of 3 police shootings OK with you based only on the race of the person shot? Odd....

As for rates, it is about the same racial division as murder convictions....

[Bernardo de La Paz]

10. Rate is very important and has everything to do with it. Jesse Williams is correct.

Please debate civilly. Nothing I have written would lead a reasonable person to write the crap you have written about me:

why are 2 out of 3 police shootings OK with you based only on the race of the person shot? Odd....

It is not OK. http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=8186252

-----

To date in 2016 there have been 793 people in the US killed by the police. For Black citizens, the number killed by police is 4.86/million; for White citizens the number killed by police is 1.96/million.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=8186062


In confrontations with police, they are more likely to negotiate with white people. They are more likely to issue orders calmly and give the white person enough time to comply. Obviously not in every case either way, but more often than for African Americans.

For black people, the police are more likely to shout multiple orders in quick succession. They are less likely to de-escalate. Also I think that when the bulletin comes over the police radio that a "black man" has a gun or is "committing" a crime, the police are more likely to have prejudices kick in, most often not fully consciously. Again, obviously not in every case, but more often than it happens with whites.

The key concept is the "tipping point". Whenever there is a binary event (a shot is fired or not fired) the tipping point analysis is enlightening.

The thing is that there are so many moments in confrontations where a small difference might be the tipping point. Plus small differences of escalation versus de-escalation add up.

In a confrontation if there are (for example) ten moments, and whites get the benefit (de-escalation, sufficient time, etc.) in 6 of 10 versus 5 for AAs (for example), then in thousands of confrontations the tipping point will be reached in more cases with blacks than whites.

-----

As to murder convictions, the same principles apply: whites get better lawyers, better presumption of innocence, less like to be the subject of DA / prosecutor / police / jury prejudice, and the benefit of small incremental differences that can add up to acquittal or reduction of charge. Even subtle things like more likely to have a suit to wear in court and more likely to speak with educated / "standard" American English add up.

But this is not to forget a huge difference: blacks are more likely to get charged in the first place, again for multiple reasons many of which are very subtle.

[pipoman]

11. "Williams is correct" I'm done. It is a lie and there isn't any other honest interpretation.

Jesse Williams: “We know that police somehow manage to de-escalate, disarm and not kill white people everyday.”

2 white people for each and every black person shot by police is a fact...again, you obviously base your concern for police shootings entirely on race....it isn't helpful...

There are not a lot of unsolved murders...the conviction rates are accurate for commission of murder by race...

[Bernardo de La Paz]

12. Do not accuse me of being a racist, & do not try to put words in people's mouths they didn't say. nt

[lostnfound]

13. Not real strong in math? And there are tons of unsolved murders

In Chicago over 80% have no suspect charged.

Your approach to math is absurd.

[MADem]

14. If blacks made up nearly thirty percent of the nation, your statistics would have a point.

But your quote, with its figures, basically proves that police kill black people at a higher rate than they are present in the population. If they were shooting people in accordance with census figures, about 13 percent of those shootings would be black people, and about 65 percent white, with the balance other ethnicities and/or mixed.

[Cryptoad]

6. Thug Cops,,,,,

have no race preferences.