Re: Bravenak, look how upset some folks get when a strong black woman has an opinion

I miss her presence here. K&R.

We women need to know our place. Sit down and shut up.

I've seen post after post after post waxing indignant about that comment. A careful study might reveal that that one line has been responded to more often than everything else that Will Pitt posted, combined.

What I gather from this OP is that, whenever there is any disagreement with a statement by a black woman, the criticism arises solely because of gender and race. It is apparently not conceivable to some that such criticism might be, as it is in other instances, content-based.

That is a simplification to which I do not subscribe.

PS. This is the African American group that you are posting in.

wrong.

where they allowed Hillary to be called the C word.

I do know that as a Group Host - and a quick review of your posts over the years - you generally only pop in here to disrupt.

I can't overrule a jury. I can say this - when I wake up and see messages from DU in my email box that resolve to posts at DU in this Group . . . I'm not a happy host.

And on that note - count me among the 'simpletons'.

Just simple enough to clearly state - I've no patience. Please do not come back. There's a Trash Group option for all groups. I've got quite a few on mine - the Religion groups, the men's group, politician specific groups.

Why? I can't add anything of value there.

I was wondering about the implications of sheshe2's response. The implication seemed to be that, in the AA Group, an accusation of racism is sacrosanct and may not be controverted. For example, suppose someone says that Governor X is a racist because he hasn't appointed any blacks to his Cabinet. Suppose a post in response links to an article about to his appointment of the Transportation Commissioner, an article showing that the commissioner is black. The implication of what sheshe2 wrote is that such a response is unwelcome in the AA Group.

I was reluctant to draw that conclusion, because it didn't comport with my personal view of intellectual integrity.

Your post, however, has convinced me that my initial reaction was correct, or at least close enough to correct to make me very uneasy. The silver lining is that, as I infer from your post, at least four DUers agreed with me about what's appropriate. (There would be a different issue if I had actually called you or any other DUer a simpleton -- but I didn't. Your putting that word in quotation marks is misleading.)

Incidentally, I don't "pop in here to disrupt." I mostly read DU by surfing the Greatest page. When something there catches my eye, I respond.

Trashing the AA Group would cut me off from one source of valuable information at DU. Nevertheless, in light of your post, I will honor your request and trash the Group. At least I'll still be able to benefit from the discussions of racial justice elsewhere on the site.

Your gatherings always seem to be this same erroneous gatherage.

She speaks for many.

Un-fucking-believable.

She is a shallow and fairly stupid. But she can memorize those lines!

They're probably loooooooving the chaos that is going on right now. Because, you know, that's how Suzie thinks the revolution is going to start.

She's a lot like Manson that way.

I didn't know her gender until recently.

I didn't know her skin color until this thread showed up on the Home Page.

So, certainly not as "telling" as you may think. Despite that, the general point has merit; it is just not this situation that can automatically draw the stated conclusion in the thread title.

I don't understand why people post no-context responses to other threads in places other than those threads. If what you have to say is so important that it needs its own OP, at least include enough info so that people who don't live and breathe DU and read every thread have some idea what you're talking about.

But I do know Bravenak's work from past threads. We often disagreed in the primary days, but I respected her posts.

....didn't know until yesterday that Bravenak is a black woman.

A vocal black woman. Never hid it.

the majority of us don't post at DU at the rate we used to.

That's why she was called words like "Fat black bitch".

I think this is an opportune time to call Trump a Fat Orange son of a bitch. It has said a lot of racist and antagonistic things so it has it coming.

Off to to peep to 45/140.

if they didn't know then it means they haven't been paying attention or are new and wouldn't make the comments they do.

the fact is much of the problems started when white people started telling her they knew what was best for her and other black people and how they ddin't know any better.

it was all about race and gender.

And then after they do that . . .they try to gaslight you and say it didn't happen.

Funny - I saw a thread with posts about people "almost" driven off and all I could do was smirk and think - you people need mirrors.

And tot let it go. Those issues/complaints are soooooo early 2016.*smdh*

I try to avoid assumptions about gender and genetics.

I read what people write.

I was giving you the 'facts'. I've been a group host here for several years - and she was a frequent poster in the group. As well, I'm friends with her on Facebook.

Just the facts.

Was there anything else you wanted to say in the African American group? Anything else to show us how 'above it all' you are? I mean - kudos to you for being above it all.

It must be a burden posting here.

Facts? You don't really read the posts you respond to. This is what you have to post here:



This is how you, the group host, treat people sympathetic to the cause.

You were one of the folks I received a message about this morning.

Just go.

There is no 'cause' - it's just a discussion board.

Unless you pay my bills and taxes - you are not a part of my 'personal cause'. Capice?

Your narrative seems irrelevant... at best.

Imaginative more likely.

and threats of rape and injury to her family certainly did.

And yet there are many here who are cheering that.

Things that make you go, "hmmmmm."

I corresponded with her for quite a while. (Lost because I didn't remember the throwaway email for my old user name without the space, after the hack.)

She did not lash out for no reason (although she had a temper, like all of us to one degree or another), and believed in facts.

That's what I saw here, anyway.

Hey, brave!

Says the old white chick from Fairbanks. I miss her.

in some of the long threads here are very telling, as you said. Her enemies are really piling on.

It reminds me of the way they piled on her when she was here.

Of course, they did the same thing to Hillary, even after she became the nominee.

Or self examination, or insight, or take a fuckin class on American ethnicity, or talk to ones “black friends”—IF the level of of friendship is actually appropriate for discussions of race and racism

But no. For so many it’s a time of attack and deflection. And “I’m not a racist but” or “I/they/you/he/she can’t be a racist because”— insert relationship or experience with someone not white.

have life experience we dont.

For instance no man should ever explain anything to a woman about how to handle menstruating, for instance, unless that man is an expert in the science of the field, as in a doctor or representative of a product or something.


It goes to reason that therefore no man should explain anything to a woman about reproductive healthcare, abortion, etc. Unless that man is a doctor giving medical advice.

No white person should explain anything to any POC about anything to do with racism, for the same reason and said white people should shut up and listen.

She was one of those DUers who were stalked, constantly alerted on, and driven away from DU. I recognize people in the threads yesterday who were part of that.

What a shame it all is...

They are still here?

Sad.

Bravenak says it about a Trump(R) surrogate-once-removed and gets threatening racist and sexist comments in reply, we must all set our hair on fire with outrage and defend the surrogate.

Because....

.... I have no idea why. It makes no sense at all.

Really. None.