Pope Francis replaces German 'bishop of bling' over €31m residence

[DonViejo]

Monsignor Franz-Peter Tebartz-van Elst was removed from his post after church inquiry into the cost of his new complex

Associated Press
theguardian.com, Wednesday 26 March 2014 08.31 EDT

Pope Francis has permanently removed a German bishop who has been called the 'bishop of bling' from his diocese amid criticism of his €31m (£26m) residential complex.

Francis had temporarily expelled Monsignor Franz-Peter Tebartz-van Elst from Limburg in October pending a church inquiry.

At the centre of the controversy was the huge price tag for the construction of a new bishop's residence complex and related renovations.

Tebartz-van Elst defended the expenditures, saying the bill was actually for 10 projects, and there were additional costs because the buildings were under historical protection.

more
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/26/pope-francis-replaces-german-bishop-of-bling

[yeoman6987]

1. How can anybody criticize this guy?

Really we have never seen a Pope like this. Ok not perfect but wow he is really on a roll. I know some think it is a hoax and he is just doing these things for attention and even at first I did but he really has been taking some great actions lately.

[el_bryanto]

2. Well his position on Homosexuality and the situation in Uganda spring to mind nt

[yeoman6987]

3. His position on Homosexuality is "who am I to judge"

That is the best statement to date from any Pope ever. I am not aware of Uganda quite frankly. Haven't heard a thing.

[Goblinmonger]

5. So it's not a sin now?

He's going to support and let gays marry in his church?

What about women? Can they be priests now?

[yeoman6987]

6. No he will not

And just because he doesn't give everything everybody wants does not make him any less better than the other Popes. He is on the right track. The Catholic Church will probably never allow gay marriage or woman ordination. However, he still is better than the others.

[Goblinmonger]

7. Please explain how he is different than the last guy.

He is not. Sure he's a Jesuit. I have respect for Jesuits. But new guy has not said or done anything different than the last guy. Just better PR.

[840high]

26. This Catholic says - YES.

[Bluenorthwest]

8. Uganda has passed horrific anti gay laws. Uganda's largest religious group is

Catholic, 42% of the country being followers of Pope Francis. Francis has said absolutely nothing against this action taken by millions of his flock to abuse and harass their neighbors. The US and other governments have criticized Uganda harshly and undertaken punitive measures. Francis has said nothing, his Bishops have either supported these laws or remained silent about them. It is a great moral failing.
Any one who says another should not have equal rights is judging that other person. To claim otherwise is pure mendacity.

[el_bryanto]

10. Yes - that's what I'm referring to. While I feel that it is possible to be pleased with some of

what the Pope has said on economic matters, this particular silence tips the scales convincingly back the other way.

Bryant

[Bluenorthwest]

15. The same people who insisted his remarks on poverty would influence millions

because he has such a devoted following have fallen silent and are not calling on him to influence their faith mates in Uganda. In this thread, folks who promote him as a wonderful person claim they don't know a thing about Uganda.

[skepticscott]

27. No, that's not his position on homosexuality

And even if it were, it's not the position of the organization he leads, so he's either guilty of betrayal or hypocrisy.

Btw, has this pope given Bernard Law the heave-ho, or is he still comfortably ensconced in the Vatican, beyond the reach of US law?

[trotsky]

28. Sorry, but that is incorrect.

That quote, in context, refers only to homosexual priests who *refrain from engaging in homosexual sex*.

Accuracy is a good thing, I think.

[Brettongarcia]

4. It might be that the pope's very early liberal remarks are more true to HIM

Later remarks probably reflect growing institutional pressure from the more conservative Vatican and its staff, the "Curia."

As a Jesuit, the pope is from perhaps the most liberal/intellectual tradition in the Church.

But note, Francis is questioning literally, the institutions; even the ornate buildings.

[Bluenorthwest]

12. In Argentina he used such vicious anti gay rhetoric that the President of Argentina

said it was 'Medieval and suggestive of the Inquisition'. Before he was Pope he said LGBT families are Satan's idea, a destructive attack on God's plans. He went on and on and was a very aggressive opponent of equal rights for all. He was not liberal at all, he was just like the rest of his peers, anti gay and prone to demonological attacks on gay people. 'They are sent by the Father of Lies to deceive the Children of God' and such.
But sure, the Curia, blah, blah, blah. He's anti choice, anti gay, opposed to contraception. Not a liberal. A conservative.

[Act_of_Reparation]

14. Are you serious?

Tebartz-van Elst wasn't canned for spending a lot of money, he was canned for being a public relations nightmare. Der Spiegel had been reaming him for months, but it wasn't until German diocese began reporting significant drops in disenrollment that Frankie decided to do something about it.

If Frankie is "new" or "different", it is only insofar as he knows how to handle crisis. All Benny knew how to do was stand there and look evil.

[LiberalAndProud]

21. I'm not convinced that his motives are pure.

officials in Limburg and other communities that are part of the bishopric, are reporting significant increases in the number of people leaving the church -- a step that requires registry at local administrative offices.
http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/german-press-assess-scandal-around-limburg-catholic-bishop-tebartz-a-927944.html

To stem the tide of falling membership and falling tithes may not be as charitable as we might wish for in a church leader.

[Bluenorthwest]

9. Meanwhile, the Bishop of NJ is doing a half million dollar remodle on his own

mansion.
Reuters) - The Roman Catholic archbishop of Newark, New Jersey, is facing mounting criticism over his plan to spend $500,000, mostly from the sale of church assets, on a extension to a countryside house where he will soon spend his retirement.......
The house was originally bought by the archdiocese in 2002 for $700,000 and is currently used as a weekend escape from downtown Newark by Myers.

It has five bedrooms, three bathrooms, a three-car garage, an elevator and a swimming pool set in 8 acres of one of New Jersey's more expensive and peaceful corners in Hunterdon County."
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/03/05/us-usa-catholic-archbishop-idUSBREA241HJ20140305

I guess that is what Bishop Bling should have stuck to, a mere mansion for a single man aged 75. Elevators, indoor pools, all of this is fine with the Vatican.....

[MADem]

11. I don't know if that has come to the attention of the Vatican, yet...!

The New Jersey Bling Bishop may be next!

[Bluenorthwest]

13. Been going on for weeks and weeks, selling Church property to pay for it.

Let's also note that the estate has served as this Bishops's 'weekend retreat' for many years. It's not like it is news that these guys live it up, charter jets, build lavish party nests....it's only been going on for centuries.
Francis has not even spoken against the Uganda laws. Too busy auditing his personal bank to increase profits.

[MADem]

19. I think Francis takes things into consideration.

First, he's very good at timing a comment to get optimum publicity.

Second, he's very good at preparing the flock to accept the comment.

Third, he's very good at making sure that when he opens his mouth, he's like EF HUTTON--people actually LISTEN and make a change.

I think he is a very vital and change-making political leader. I think his best days, assuming no one tries to off him, are well in front of him.

You, by your comments, want him to be an authoritarian dictator who moves his prejudiced and ignorant flock by decree. If you don't want that in political leaders (mainly because it doesn't work), why would you want it in a religious (who is also political) leader? You also seem to think that just because he heads a religion, that he has absolute control over it. Ask JP One how that worked out for him...oh, wait, he's dead...and some say he didn't bite the bullet naturally, either. No wonder Frank likes to cook his own meals!

Bottom Line: Francis has to make the sale before he can deliver the product, IMO.

That's my view from a distance. I have no dog in this fight. YMMV and I'm sure it does--so keep griping if it matters to you; I'm out!

[DonViejo]

16. What makes you think it is "fine with the Vatican"...

your deep seated animosity for the RCC or some news articles (link, please) reporting on Vatican approval?

[Bluenorthwest]

17. The lack of criticism of the mansion expansion by the Vatican suggests it is fine

with them. I am openly opposed to anti gay organizations for being anti gay. Do you hold great affection for groups that call your family a device of Satan?
I do not care for posts which promote anti gay and anti choice clerics as being something other than anti gay and anti choice. Particularly when those promotions cheery pick facts and get upset when context is offered.
Here is what defines Francis: Uganda.

[DonViejo]

20. To answer your question...

I hold no affection for anyone or anything that is anti-gay. I was born and raised an RC until I left the Church; I formally left Christianity in 1989. It's taken several months for the Vatican to respond to the criticism of the Bishop of Bling's stupidity, I'm thinking it will do likewise for it to respond to Bishop Myers's as well. Heightening public outrage, as reported in the March 5, 2014 article you posted, above, will speed the decision of the Vatican, just as the public outrage did for Bling.

[rug]

25. "The lack of criticism of the mansion expansion by the Vatican suggests"

I hope that's not what you consider evidence to be.

[cbayer]

18. Excellent. Now I hope he goes after the guy in NJ.

[hrmjustin]

22. Hope he fires the guy in Jersey.

[okasha]

23. Maybe Francis can find the NJ bishop

a nice little room in a Trappist monastery. So he can recalibrate his focus, as it were.

[hrmjustin]

24. That would be a change for him. lol.