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cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 11:25 AM Mar 2016

Mother Teresa Was No Saint

On September 4 of this year, Mother Teresa will become Saint Teresa. This is unsurprising; she was beatified in 2003, which is sort of a one-way road to canonization. But it's the last thing we need. She was no saint.

To canonize Mother Teresa would be to seal the lid on her problematic legacy, which includes forced conversion, questionable relations with dictators, gross mismanagement, and actually, pretty bad medical care. Worst of all, she was the quintessential white person expending her charity on the third world -- the entire reason for her public image, and the source of immeasurable scarring to the postcolonial psyche of India and its diaspora.

A 2013 study from the University of Ottawa dispelled the "myth of altruism and generosity" surrounding Mother Teresa, concluding that her hallowed image did not stand up to the facts, and was basically the result of a forceful media campaign from an ailing Catholic Church.

Although she had 517 missions in 100 countries at the time of her death, the study found that hardly anyone who came seeking medical care found it there. Doctors observed unhygienic, "even unfit," conditions, inadequate food, and no painkillers -- not for lack of funding, in which Mother Theresa's world-famous order was swimming, but what the study authors call her "particular conception of suffering and death."

"There is something beautiful in seeing the poor accept their lot, to suffer it like Christ's Passion. The world gains much from their suffering," Mother Teresa once told the unamused Christopher Hitchens.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/krithika-varagur/mother-teresa-was-no-saint_b_9470988.html


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Mother Teresa Was No Saint (Original Post) cleanhippie Mar 2016 OP
Those in her "care" got almost nothing, while she enjoyed the best the West had to offer. trotsky Mar 2016 #1
Kritha's on a mission. rug Mar 2016 #2
So is someone else. hrmjustin Mar 2016 #3
Indeed. rug Mar 2016 #4
Justin, I had you on ignore for a long time. trotsky Mar 2016 #5
Oh Lord how the hell do I respond to this? hrmjustin Mar 2016 #6
That's mighty Christian of you. trotsky Mar 2016 #7
You are aware rug and I know you didn't really have us on ignore? hrmjustin Mar 2016 #8
How does one know that? Goblinmonger Mar 2016 #9
Better than what? hrmjustin Mar 2016 #10
This petty back and forth with rug Goblinmonger Mar 2016 #11
Yes it is just a shame rug and I are bringing down the standards of the religion room. hrmjustin Mar 2016 #12
Be the change you want to see, justin Goblinmonger Mar 2016 #13
back atcha' hrmjustin Mar 2016 #14
Very much try to be. Goblinmonger Mar 2016 #15
Good for you. hrmjustin Mar 2016 #16
Can't. We don't get banned for hides now. AtheistCrusader Mar 2016 #27
Welcome back. AtheistCrusader Mar 2016 #26
I am sorry you were the topic of my meltdown. hrmjustin Mar 2016 #28
It didn't bother me. AtheistCrusader Mar 2016 #29
I am sorry. hrmjustin Mar 2016 #30
Apology accepted. AtheistCrusader Mar 2016 #31
Thank you! hrmjustin Mar 2016 #32
No worries. AtheistCrusader Mar 2016 #33
Thanks. hrmjustin Mar 2016 #34
Thank you for that edhopper Mar 2016 #21
Her expertise is boundless. rug Mar 2016 #23
That is an interesting article edhopper Mar 2016 #24
The appalling Malcolm Muggeridge, agnostic-turned-Xian-bigot, mr blur Mar 2016 #17
Oh, THAT was Malcolm Muggeridge? trotsky Mar 2016 #19
Frankly, I stopped caring if she's made a saint or not, sainthood is a fucking joke, as is the... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #18
Sainthood is just an arm of their marketing department. trotsky Mar 2016 #20
Catholics doing the Hall Of Fame thing again? Iggo Mar 2016 #22
Miracles can and often happened edhopper Mar 2016 #25
Ginning up two "miracles" is dead easy skepticscott Mar 2016 #35
A good ham sandwich edhopper Mar 2016 #36
You could always slather it in something to kill the taste. bvf Mar 2016 #37
I hate Miracle Whip edhopper Mar 2016 #38
Oh, I agree completely. bvf Mar 2016 #39
I didn't form that joke very clearly edhopper Mar 2016 #40
I love Miracle Whip. trotsky Mar 2016 #42
Mayo and any meat edhopper Mar 2016 #44
I'd go to the church of Miracle Whip. trotsky Mar 2016 #45
Minnestota Lutheran edhopper Mar 2016 #47
I don't remember if we talked about his over Grain Belt Goblinmonger Mar 2016 #48
It's true, the Scandinavians (at least the ones who settled in MN) didn't exactly have the best eats trotsky Mar 2016 #53
C'mon. Who doesn't like lutefisk? Act_of_Reparation Mar 2016 #55
I'm not THAT Scandinavian. trotsky Mar 2016 #59
That's hilarious Goblinmonger Mar 2016 #56
Hey, that potato salad probably sat next to a bottle of mustard in the fridge. trotsky Mar 2016 #58
German Potato salad edhopper Mar 2016 #62
...and not just any ham, and not just any mustard Major Nikon Mar 2016 #50
Blasphemy. Act_of_Reparation Mar 2016 #54
Oh lord, forgive the ignorance of the heathens. trotsky Mar 2016 #57
Two thousand years from now... Act_of_Reparation Mar 2016 #60
Ham, swiss cheese, and mustard on caraway rye. trotsky Mar 2016 #41
But finding really good ham isn't easy. edhopper Mar 2016 #43
Oh no doubt. trotsky Mar 2016 #46
If you think that's tasty... Act_of_Reparation Mar 2016 #65
Only if that god isn't Allah or Adonai edhopper Mar 2016 #66
Their ways are not our ways. Act_of_Reparation Mar 2016 #67
True edhopper Mar 2016 #68
Blessed are Turbineguy Mar 2016 #77
and the cheese makers edhopper Mar 2016 #78
"Sonny, true love is the greatest thing, in the world Goblinmonger Mar 2016 #49
Princess Bride edhopper Mar 2016 #61
Look at it this way, maybe there is hope for Pete Rose Major Nikon Mar 2016 #52
Now THAT would be a miracle. Iggo Mar 2016 #63
I was behind Rose for the HoF edhopper Mar 2016 #64
I just don't see the problem here Major Nikon Mar 2016 #51
How could she have allowed substandard conditions in India? struggle4progress Mar 2016 #69
wow edhopper Mar 2016 #70
India census exposes extent of poverty struggle4progress Mar 2016 #71
Per capita at Rs 7,378 a month struggle4progress Mar 2016 #72
GDP per capita of India struggle4progress Mar 2016 #73
First you defend accomplices to child abuse... Act_of_Reparation Mar 2016 #74
Surely the loss of your friendly company, your urbane wit, and your inspiring devotion to the poor struggle4progress Mar 2016 #75
probably none of them were oldandhappy Mar 2016 #76

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
5. Justin, I had you on ignore for a long time.
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 12:36 PM
Mar 2016

I took you off when I heard about the amnesty announcement. I had heard about your anger-filled blowup and thought you might come back from that somewhat changed.

I beg of you to reconsider this kind of snarky back-and-forth with a fellow DUer who was ALSO spared from serving the rest of his timeout for conduct. I know that in the past you have refused to acknowledge anything wrong with how rug acts (perfect example right in this thread - rather than discuss the topic, he engages in an ad hom against the author of the piece), but I really think you're better than that and would love to see you help raise the level of discourse.

 

Goblinmonger

(22,340 posts)
9. How does one know that?
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 12:51 PM
Mar 2016

You an admin?

But seriously, I think you're better than this. You and rug were the ones on forced timeout. Maybe reflect on that and act differently. Or not, I guess.

 

Goblinmonger

(22,340 posts)
11. This petty back and forth with rug
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 12:55 PM
Mar 2016

It really does come across as two people that were on a forced time out coming back to do more of the same given amnesty.

 

hrmjustin

(71,265 posts)
12. Yes it is just a shame rug and I are bringing down the standards of the religion room.
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 12:59 PM
Mar 2016

I feel so ashamed!




Do me a favor and stop the your better than this line.

 

Goblinmonger

(22,340 posts)
15. Very much try to be.
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 01:09 PM
Mar 2016

I think I've done pretty well lately.

And given I haven't had any hides for while and have never been on a 5-hide vacation, I'm pretty happy with how I'm doing.

 

hrmjustin

(71,265 posts)
28. I am sorry you were the topic of my meltdown.
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 05:28 PM
Mar 2016

I should have never have said thise things to you.

We don't get along much but you did not deserve what I said to you.

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
29. It didn't bother me.
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 05:44 PM
Mar 2016

I note the language of non-apology in your apology though. Very clever. Might even fool a few of the observers of this thread.

edhopper

(33,543 posts)
21. Thank you for that
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 02:19 PM
Mar 2016

she is absolutely right about this, we should get rid of DST.

Right about Teresa and DST, 2 for 2. I will read more from her.

 

mr blur

(7,753 posts)
17. The appalling Malcolm Muggeridge, agnostic-turned-Xian-bigot,
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 01:45 PM
Mar 2016

(you may remember him from the 70's TV programme where he and a bishop attacked the Pythons John Cleese and Michael Palin for making Life of Brian and thus being beastly to Baby Jesus) once made a programme on this odious woman in which he claimed that Gawd had sent a mysterious Heavenly light into her hospital while he was there filming so that her saintly features would be visible on the film. There was apparently no other way that the interior of the gloomy, pokey little hospital would be visible.

The cameraman later expressed his appreciation for the new, sensitive Kodak film that he was using - for that very reason. But let's not let reality stand in the way of a good dose of bullshit, right?

But, hey, here's Hillary Clinton hand-in-hand with the Poison Dwarf:



Checkmate atheists!

 

Humanist_Activist

(7,670 posts)
18. Frankly, I stopped caring if she's made a saint or not, sainthood is a fucking joke, as is the...
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 01:49 PM
Mar 2016

Catholic Church itself. An immoral organization from the top down, a religion with few redeeming qualities and plenty abhorrent beliefs.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
20. Sainthood is just an arm of their marketing department.
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 02:14 PM
Mar 2016

Got an area of the world where your flock is drifting? Name a saint.

Iggo

(47,545 posts)
22. Catholics doing the Hall Of Fame thing again?
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 02:38 PM
Mar 2016

Did she rack up her three miracles in order to qualify?

And remember, voters, this is the modern era, where "changed someone's mind on something" qualifies as a miracle.

Not like the good old days when magic ruled the earth.

edhopper

(33,543 posts)
25. Miracles can and often happened
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 04:42 PM
Mar 2016

after the person is dead.
"I had a tummy ache, I thought about Teresa, tummy ache gone, poof...miracle!"

 

skepticscott

(13,029 posts)
35. Ginning up two "miracles" is dead easy
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 06:13 PM
Mar 2016

To paraphrase, the catholic church could canonize a ham sandwich.

 

bvf

(6,604 posts)
37. You could always slather it in something to kill the taste.
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 07:20 PM
Mar 2016
?2a2f4482644572f9785125e3a93471b6

 

bvf

(6,604 posts)
39. Oh, I agree completely.
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 10:14 PM
Mar 2016

I think I misunderstood. I was thinking you meant you hated ham sandwiches so much that a good one would be...

Let's just say I overthought it.

Back to the topic: Poupon Mother Teresa.

edhopper

(33,543 posts)
40. I didn't form that joke very clearly
Thu Mar 17, 2016, 10:39 PM
Mar 2016

I love a good ham sandwich. But only with great ham. So much ham is bland,wet tasteless loaf.
A smoky black forest ham...as Homer Simpson would say...uuuuuuhhhhhhh.

An yeah, Teresa was a crazy bitch.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
42. I love Miracle Whip.
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 09:23 AM
Mar 2016

But NOT with ham. You are right, mustard with ham. Miracle Whip with turkey.

edhopper

(33,543 posts)
44. Mayo and any meat
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 09:25 AM
Mar 2016

doesn't work for me. I even keep it off my BLTs.

You know Miracle Whip is the perfect analogy for Christian miracles.

Just a mix of chemicals masquerading as something real, and then calling it a "miracle".

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
45. I'd go to the church of Miracle Whip.
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 09:32 AM
Mar 2016

In fact, the church I grew up in (Minnesota Lutheran) probably could have been called that, given the usual sandwiches served.

 

Goblinmonger

(22,340 posts)
48. I don't remember if we talked about his over Grain Belt
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 10:02 AM
Mar 2016

but where I grew up in ND was in a very large Slavic Catholic outpost in the middle of very Scandinavian Lutheran ND. When we were going to go to a wedding, we had to figure out if it was a Slavic or Scandinavian dinner afterward. The Slavic weddings meant coffee, bland potato salad and lots of Miracle Whip. The Slavic wedding mean plenty of beer and good food.

Side note: We need to get beer and pizza again some time.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
53. It's true, the Scandinavians (at least the ones who settled in MN) didn't exactly have the best eats
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 10:25 AM
Mar 2016

But don't you tell them that!

I'll never forget the first gyro I had. "What? Food is allowed to have FLAVOR? There are other seasonings besides salt? MIND = BLOWN!" Though I will always have a soft spot for a good hotdish.

I'm always up for beer and pizza, my man. Anytime you are coming through town.

 

Goblinmonger

(22,340 posts)
56. That's hilarious
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 10:57 AM
Mar 2016

because I remember my first Scandinavian potato salad. LOVED my mom's. Lots of mustard and spices and flavor, so I took a big heap and was like "What the everloving hell is this?"

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
58. Hey, that potato salad probably sat next to a bottle of mustard in the fridge.
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 11:22 AM
Mar 2016

That counts as seasoning in the Lutheran cookbook.

Act_of_Reparation

(9,116 posts)
54. Blasphemy.
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 10:44 AM
Mar 2016

Book of Condiments 1:15- Consume not the imitation mayo, for creamed vinegar is an abomination before the LORD.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
57. Oh lord, forgive the ignorance of the heathens.
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 11:20 AM
Mar 2016

Miracle Whip is not "imitation mayo," it is a separate holy substance unto itself.

Act_of_Reparation

(9,116 posts)
60. Two thousand years from now...
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 11:57 AM
Mar 2016

...people might stumble upon our words and mistake them for a serious theological debate, and we might have inadvertently played a significant role in the Great Miracle Whip Pogrom of 4016.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
41. Ham, swiss cheese, and mustard on caraway rye.
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 09:22 AM
Mar 2016

A perfect one of those will have this atheist saying "Thank you, god."

edhopper

(33,543 posts)
43. But finding really good ham isn't easy.
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 09:23 AM
Mar 2016

Boars Head doesn't do it for me. I am picky when it comes to ham.

Act_of_Reparation

(9,116 posts)
65. If you think that's tasty...
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 01:53 PM
Mar 2016

...I give you Cubanos.



Ham and turkey, Swiss cheese, and mustard (pickles optional) on French bread, flattened in a hot press until the bread is crispy and cheese melted.

If by chance I'm wrong and there is a God, this is the sandwich it eats when it gets hungry.... unless it's Cthulhu. It eats people when it gets hungry.

 

Goblinmonger

(22,340 posts)
49. "Sonny, true love is the greatest thing, in the world
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 10:03 AM
Mar 2016

-except for a nice MLT – mutton, lettuce and tomato sandwich, where the mutton is nice and lean and the tomato is ripe. They’re so perky, I love that."

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
51. I just don't see the problem here
Fri Mar 18, 2016, 10:22 AM
Mar 2016

If Christians can turn a convicted felon into a zombie deity, why can't they turn a woman into an anointed one that embodies the principles of a felonious zombie deity?

struggle4progress

(118,268 posts)
71. India census exposes extent of poverty
Sat Mar 19, 2016, 07:13 PM
Mar 2016

By Ritika Katyal, for CNN
Updated 8:32 PM ET, Sun August 2, 2015

Of .. 300 million households surveyed, an overwhelming majority (73%) live in villages. Of this rural population, less than 5% earn enough to pay taxes, only 2.5% own a 4-wheeler vehicle and less than 10% have salaried jobs.

... Only 3.5% of students graduate and around 35.7% of residents can't read or write.

... the bulk of the Indian population is still overwhelmingly poor ...


http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/02/asia/india-poor-census-secc/

struggle4progress

(118,268 posts)
72. Per capita at Rs 7,378 a month
Sat Mar 19, 2016, 07:19 PM
Mar 2016

PTI Feb 9, 2015, 09.06PM IST

NEW DELHI: India's monthly per capita income, the measure of standard of living, is likely to be at Rs 7,378.17 (USD 118.68) this financial year, up over 10 per cent from last year, after a revision in the method of calculations ...

http://articles.economictimes.indiatimes.com/2015-02-09/news/58967932_1_capita-income-constant-prices-central-statistics-office

On average, that is, a person in India has a daily income of about US$0.33

struggle4progress

(118,268 posts)
73. GDP per capita of India
Sat Mar 19, 2016, 07:33 PM
Mar 2016
The per capita net national income (NNI) of India at current prices during 2014-15 is estimated at 87,748 indian rupees ... http://statisticstimes.com/economy/gdp-capita-of-india.php

Current conversion rates are around $0.015 per Indian rupee, so per capita GDP is around US$1316. The average Indian gets about 1/12 of that annually. The affluent do rather well in comparison:

... The average annual household income of India's affluent is Rs 1.5 million while the average age is 34 years ...
PTI | Jul 1, 2015, 05.40 PM IST

So "affluent" in India means an annual income around US$22500: this is about 200X the average annual per capita income there

Act_of_Reparation

(9,116 posts)
74. First you defend accomplices to child abuse...
Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:11 PM
Mar 2016

...now you say it's OK to give half-assed medical care to Indians because they're poor.

You know what? I'm fucking sick of your foul presence tainting my internets. To the iggy list with you. Give the others my regards.

struggle4progress

(118,268 posts)
75. Surely the loss of your friendly company, your urbane wit, and your inspiring devotion to the poor
Sat Mar 19, 2016, 11:10 PM
Mar 2016

will leave a great void in my life

oldandhappy

(6,719 posts)
76. probably none of them were
Sat Mar 19, 2016, 11:27 PM
Mar 2016

I'm interested in some of the things I read that Saints have done. But realistically I doubt what we are told today is what happened. I respect people who try to wholly give of themselves. I guess I'd rather see societies make it possible for all people to have a chance to be whole and to live in a cooperative supportive creative way. Yes indeed, I am pollyanna!

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