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Sun Mar 27, 2016, 10:42 AM

Easter Is Not Named After Ishtar, And Other Truths I Have To Tell You

Easter Is Not Named After Ishtar, And Other Truths I Have To Tell You
If there is one thing that drives me absolutely bananas, it’s people spreading misinformation via social media under the guise of “educating”. I’ve seen this happen in several ways – through infographics that twist data in ways that support a conclusion that is ultimately false, or else through “meaningful” quotes falsely attributed to various celebrities, or by cobbling together a few actual facts with statements that are patently untrue to create something that seems plausible on the surface but is, in fact, full of crap.



Richard Dawkins peddling false information.
It's scandalous, I tell you.
I suspect he looked up all in information on the Internet.

27 replies, 2373 views

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Arrow 27 replies Author Time Post
Reply Easter Is Not Named After Ishtar, And Other Truths I Have To Tell You (Original post)
Agnosticsherbet Mar 2016 OP
skepticscott Mar 2016 #1
Agnosticsherbet Mar 2016 #8
skepticscott Mar 2016 #13
Cartoonist Mar 2016 #2
edhopper Mar 2016 #3
skepticscott Mar 2016 #4
edhopper Mar 2016 #5
skepticscott Mar 2016 #6
Igel Mar 2016 #7
edhopper Mar 2016 #9
Leontius Mar 2016 #10
edhopper Mar 2016 #11
Cartoonist Mar 2016 #12
edhopper Mar 2016 #15
skepticscott Mar 2016 #14
Leontius Mar 2016 #16
skepticscott Mar 2016 #17
Leontius Mar 2016 #18
skepticscott Mar 2016 #20
mr blur Mar 2016 #21
struggle4progress Mar 2016 #25
cleanhippie Mar 2016 #27
okasha Mar 2016 #19
mr blur Mar 2016 #22
Post removed Mar 2016 #23
skepticscott Mar 2016 #24
skepticscott Mar 2016 #26

Response to Agnosticsherbet (Original post)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 11:09 AM

1. And?

 

The author likes mental masturbation and to fling ad homs. Was there actually a significant point to be made that justified such a long-winded post over an insignificant meme, or was this just the author saying "Look at me! Look at me! I'm smarter than Richard Dawkins!"

If pressed, would the author admit the only important point, that the resurrection story is mythological bullshit that never happened?

Oops...not supposed to say that on easter, am I? It's "sacred". To everyone who really, truly believes that people can die and come back to life, I suppose. To everyone who thinks that Adam and Eve existed, and ate some fruit that condemned all of mankind to hell unless Jesus saved them.

But nonsense is nonsense, no matter what day of the year it is. The detrimental effects of religion are in effect every day of the year (check the news from North Carolina), so why should it get a break from critical examination?

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Response to skepticscott (Reply #1)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 12:35 PM

8. Richard Dawkins was caught in the act mental masturbation, peddling false facts

to support his agenda.

Dawkins sacrificed fact on the alter of h is on agenda.

Using lies to bolster argument about fact is is detrimental to fact.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #8)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 03:59 PM

13. Hardly

 

If you actually read your own link, you'd see that the author has a hard time actually pinning down anything important that the Facebook post he tries to critique was fundamentally wrong about. He is honest enough to admit that the main point, that Easter(among many other Xstian festivals) has roots in earlier pagan celebrations, is unquestionably true. He just makes a lot of minor quibbles about the etymology of the word and exactly what goddess was most closely associated with it, and if you read the comments, even those quibbles are by no means indisputable.

And how would you evaluate your source saying the following:

be polite and respectful when you enter into a debate, even when the person you’re debating with loses their cool. You want to prove that you’re better, more enlightened than Christians? Great, do it by remaining rational and level-headed in the face of someone who’s willing to stoop to personal attacks. To behave otherwise is to be just as bad as the people you’re debating.

given his personal attacks on Dawkins, whom he dishonestly refers to as a "noted misogynist and eugenics enthusiast"? I'd call him a raving hypocrite. How about you?

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Original post)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 11:14 AM

2. Read the comments

Many good points are made that show that history is never clear cut. Especially when much of it is passed down orally.

While the graphic may not be literally correct, there can be no argument that it is true in its claim that Easter is not an original concept of Christianity.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Original post)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 11:17 AM

3. No it was Eastra,

a Saxon Goddess. Or maybe Astarte, a Phonetician Goddess, who is mythically related to....wait for it....
Ishtar.

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Response to edhopper (Reply #3)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 11:21 AM

4. None of that matters

 

because DAWKINS!!!SS!!

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Response to skepticscott (Reply #4)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 11:31 AM

5. BTW

as far as i can tell, Dawkins did not say this, it was put up on the Dawkins Foundation Facebook page.

And so was this.

[IMG][/IMG]

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Response to edhopper (Reply #5)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 12:07 PM

6. It's also quite ironic

 

that he would say this:

If there is one thing that drives me absolutely bananas, it’s people spreading misinformation via social media under the guise of “educating”.

While in the same post introducing Dawkins as a "noted misogynist and eugenics enthusiast". Aside from the snarky ad hom (which the author apparently thought would help him score much needed points with his target audience), the latter, in particular, is a blatant lie, as the author would know if he bothered to read his own link.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Original post)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 12:13 PM

7. It's truthy.

That's about it.

Easter is from the Germanic word for "sunrise". That a lot of the religious background is similar to what's seen in other pagan religions stands to reason. The nearness in pronunciation is an accident.

It pays to note that there are also some rather big differences between the pagan rites taken over as Easter and the pagan rights with Astarte or Ishtar. Just as there are some rather big differences between "Easter" (and how it was pronounced 1500 years ago) and "Ishtar." We see similarities when we want to show similarity; we see differences when we want to show difference.


A lot of the information found on the Internet goes back before the Internet. A lot of people forget this. In this case, I'm going to guess a significant source of a lot of this drivel is Hislop's _The Two Babylons_, who cites some even older sources. Hislop's work dates back to the 1850s. That would be the 1800s.

And, yes, Hislop often either gets his sources wrong, his sources were wrong, or Hislop has no idea how to handle the then relatively new discipline of historical linguistics. Much like many pop culture folk have no idea nowadays how to handle modern conceptions of quantum mechanics or genetics, but given a preset goal always find a way of making the newish fields say exactly what they want them to say.

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Response to Igel (Reply #7)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 01:10 PM

9. OED says

it's both Germanic "East' and Goddess Eastre.

But it would be foolish not to see it as the Christian version of the Spring Festival, rather than see it as real first century dates.

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Response to edhopper (Reply #9)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 02:55 PM

10. No what's foolish is to keep pedalling this crap when you know the truth.

 

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Response to Leontius (Reply #10)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 03:39 PM

11. You don't know the timing of Easter

is because of earlier Spring Festivals?
Including Passover, which itself is just the Jewish co-opting of Pagan Spring celebration.

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Response to edhopper (Reply #11)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 03:58 PM

12. Expect a Babylonian reply. nt

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Response to Cartoonist (Reply #12)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 04:34 PM

15. I hate

Assyrian apologists.

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Response to Leontius (Reply #10)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 04:03 PM

14. It would have been even more foolish

 

if he'd been peddling it.

But this was posted years ago. What evidence do you have that it's still being "pedaled"?

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Response to skepticscott (Reply #14)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 07:58 PM

16. Well let's see, today is Sunday March 27 2016

 

and this crap is still being brought up today. Is that evidence enough for you? Maybe all those hidden posts you have in the last week or so have you confused.

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Response to Leontius (Reply #16)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 08:10 PM

17. Other people are linking to a years old post

 

That refers to a Dawkins Facebook post that isn't even up any more.

Feel free to explain how that amounts to Dawkins "still pedaling" this.

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Response to skepticscott (Reply #17)

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 09:57 PM

18. Amazing how fixated you are on Dawkins.

 

Put your blinders back in the barn.

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Response to Leontius (Reply #18)

Mon Mar 28, 2016, 06:08 AM

20. Amazing how you fail miserably

 

in providing evidence to back up your claim, Leo. Did you think no one would notice?

And "fixated"? I'm not the one posting two year old hit pieces on Dawkins. If you have a problem with fixation, talk to the OP or the hypocrite he linked to. Or any of the other posters here who seem obsessed with making him look bad, as if that will magically make atheism be wrong.

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Response to Leontius (Reply #16)

Mon Mar 28, 2016, 06:39 AM

21. Well let's see, today is Sunday March 27 2016,

 

and people are still bringing up this crap about a magic Jewish criminal rising from the dead and floating up into the sky to be in Paradise with his dad (who is also himself) and all the credulous fools who believe this drivel.

Maybe your recent vacation from DU has you confused, or the fact that the buddies in your little cabal have themselves been on vacations and unable to back up your bullshit for a while.

Still,

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Response to mr blur (Reply #21)

Mon Mar 28, 2016, 01:29 PM

25. Yes, we do teach that the King of the Universe

appeared as a homeless man and was very cruelly executed by the Roman conquerers

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Response to Leontius (Reply #10)

Mon Mar 28, 2016, 04:38 PM

27. QED

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Original post)

Mon Mar 28, 2016, 01:17 AM

19. I really hate amateur linguistics.

In most Indo-European languages, the word for Easter is some variation of Pesach,, Passover, which preserves the historical linkage between the two celebrations.

The difficulty in connecting Ishtar to Easter lies in the fact that "Ishtar" comes from a Western Semitic language long extinct by the time the Germanic tribes were Christianized. There is no plausible route of linquistic transfer.

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Response to okasha (Reply #19)

Mon Mar 28, 2016, 06:42 AM

22. I really hate it too,

 

although it comes as no surprise to see you indulging it it:
In most Indo-European languages, the word for Easter is some variation of Pesach,, Passover, which preserves the historical linkage between the two celebrations.

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Response to mr blur (Reply #22)


Response to Post removed (Reply #23)

Mon Mar 28, 2016, 01:15 PM

24. Did you really think your post qualifies as anything

 

but amateur linguistics, that anyone could get off of Wikipedia, okasha? Seriously?

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Response to skepticscott (Reply #24)

Mon Mar 28, 2016, 01:36 PM

26. Actually it did qualify as something else

 

a substitution of a shitty personal attack for actual discussion.

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