Religion? Your Thoughts? Open Thread.

[MineralMan]

This thread is designed to let everyone say anything they want to about religion. It has no specific topic. It cannot be hijacked, so everyone should feel free to post just about anything they want about religion as a reply to this post.

I'll start. I am an atheist. I do not believe that any supernatural phenomena or entities exist. Things that exist are real and have evidence of their reality that can be studied. That is what I think about religion. You might think something else. Please write what you think below:

[guillaumeb]

1. Yes, I am in favor of religion.

And all of the good that it does.

[MineralMan]

2. And the bad? What of that?

[guillaumeb]

4. I am opposed to that.

[Major Nikon]

21. What are the good parts exactly?

I realize on a personal level religion can help people deal with fear of the dark and other various insecurities, albeit not as well as more reasoned methods. I'm asking about the collective good to society.

[java108]

3. Toxic fairytale garbage

And I still haven't ruled out the possibility of an afterlife, mind you.

[Wellstone ruled]

5. Your thoughts

fully cover my feelings about religion.

[MineralMan]

6. OK. I'll bet we have some different ideas, though,

on the topic. That's a good thing.

[Wellstone ruled]

9. To many events in my personal

life convinced me to just say enough already,it is fake and I walked away some twenty years ago and have felt the freedom on not having someone do a guilt number on me or anyone in my family.

[redstatebluegirl]

7. My husband and I are both Unitarians.

I was raised Catholic, my husband Apostolic Christian by a crazy grandma. We both left organized religion early in our college careers. We have not been as active since moving to Oklahoma since we see Unitarians here as Christian light. Our church in Illinois was much more what we wanted. A church that understands the meaning of social justice, and that there are more than one way to be spiritual.

I believe we are judged by what we do here on earth, how we treat people, how we attack social injustice, what we do to give back.

[MineralMan]

8. Thank you for your reply.

[mahina]

10. Mine is my business and yours is yours.

[MineralMan]

16. OK. You are under no obligation here.

[mahina]

19. I might not have been been clear. I wasn't saying I didn't want to share my

thoughts about it, but that those are my thoughts about it, generally.

Everybody’s got a right to believe or not believe as they wish, and I’ve never seen any point in trying to change someone else’s understanding of God or God’s existence, or varieties of belief. Everybody gets to be right about what they believe. I don’t see any reason to waste one breath trying to convert anyone else.

Hope that’s a better explanation.

[Cartoonist]

11. I hate it

The teensy-weensy bit of good it does can't even begin to make up for the horrors and oppression of its past. It is still killing people today.

The worst aspect of religion is that we have a perfectly good reality that is replaced with the most nonsensical bullshit anyone can make-up. The disconnect between reality and myth is the major cause of strife in the world.

[rurallib]

12. I think many people are given their religious preference by their parents

and never question it. Those that do question their inherited faith are often shocked by what they find as they dig down.

Not sure but I tend to think that most people who question end up at some stage of agnosticism or atheism, because most gods wither under scrutiny. Those gods were usually created to explain things that simpler days humans couldn't understand and to maintain fear of many things.

As for me, raised catholic but was gone from that religion by the end of HS. Didn't really hit the questioning phase until @ 20 years ago and thus slid into a type of atheism.

[Major Nikon]

22. Given suggests it may be refused

In almost all cases forced or indoctrinated is a better descriptor, although I realize you are being generous with your statement.

[angstlessk]

13. I do not believe in the white bearded deity some want me to believe..

..however I did have an experience hard to explain..


My birthday is 9/14, my sisters is 9/27

I came back early from the funeral, my mother stayed another week or so.

I went to a grocery store I NEVER used, and proceeded to shop.

There was an aisle of greeting cards, and I decided to purchase birthday cards for my sister and her remaining children.

I purchased three cards, but one card kept sending me back to purchase a different card (my sister's card).

I chose several different cards, but was sent back again and again, till I was satisfied with the card.

When my mother returned to VA, in her suitcase was a birthday card for me.

IT WAS THE EXACT SAME CARD I HAD CHOSEN TO SEND TO MY SISTER!

[edhopper]

17. Families

could easily find the same card meaningful for their relatives.
Coincidences happen. They do not necessarily point to anything more profound than a random coincidence.
With all the events that happen daily in our lives, it would be strange if the occasional coincidence did not happen. We just remember them and not the thousands of times nothing happened.

[Voltaire2]

14. On balance: toxic nonsense.

[msongs]

15. asked my neighbor if she wants to be forced to listen to religion music 24/7 from

a religion different than hers in rvery public place she goes. she was appalled by the thought. only her religion is allowed to do that of couse...

[edhopper]

18. Philosophically

I am a naturalist. I also feel in tune with existentialism.

[Major Nikon]

20. I differentiate between religion and organized religion

I'm apathetic as to what anyone wants to believe about anything. I do have a beef with organized religion and the negative effects it has on society.

As far as someone's personal beliefs go I'm an apatheist. I don't promote apatheism even within my family. I'm not going to assume anyone I meet on the street is an apatheist. I'm not going to greet someone with apatheist proverbs and salutations. If I get to know someone I might discuss apatheism if they bring it up, but otherwise they will never know I'm an apatheist because I'm going to keep it to myself. I think this is the polite thing to do and think the world would be a better place if everyone else did the same with what they believe or don't believe.

[Act_of_Reparation]

23. In the aggregate, religion as a practice is terrible

The positioning of certain ideas or practices as inviolable and sacred, offering divine imperative on a silver platter to anyone motivated and charismatic enough to make use of it, and the elevation of unreliable means of discernment make for a frothy triple-decker shit sandwich that has largely worked to hold us back.

[Major Nikon]

25. What about all the good parts?

World peace

Greater love for our neighbors

Greater understanding of the world around us

The promotion of human and civil rights

Healing the sick

Sheltering the less fortunate

Providing society with a truly moral foundation

The promotion of self reliance

Immunity to snake venom

Abstinence

Sobriety

Blue laws

Talking donkeys

Tolerance

Scapegoating natural disasters

Mother Teresa

[Act_of_Reparation]

33. Don't forget "taking all the credit for every centimeter of progress we have ever achieved".

Of course, those centimeters previously belonged to people no less religious than their progressive counterparts, but another perk of religion is the ability to denigrate those to whom you are opposed as "fake Christians" or, better yet, "atheists".

[Heddi]

24. I don't give a hoot what anyone believes

However, it needs to be kept in your heart, in your mind, and in your home.

I think organized religion has done more harm to this planet than people have, on the whole.

I am of the mind as Major Nikon is below.

My mother was a believer, and when she lay dying in the hospital bed, anyone who wanted to pray for or over her, I didn't stop them. I didn't participate with them, but they could do what they wanted because it was what she would have wanted and really, in those moments, it was about her, and not me for a lot of the time (and for those doing the praying). I found comfort in my own way.

Within a quarter mile of my home are 4 "mega churches' that clog up my roads every Sunday and Wednesday. They aren't willing to pay for traffic signals, so they get the police to come (no charge) and direct the traffic they'd otherwise snarl for hours (which they already do).

I have seen the assault on public health in the PNW as the catholic churches have obliterated a previously thriving secular and available healthcare system which is now whittled down to two hospitals that are not catholic owned or affiliated.

Fuck organized religion, and fuck those who try to make it 'not so bad.'

It's a blight on humankind. It may do *you* individually good, but I do not buy that overall it has done more good than harm.

[IamFortunesFool]

26. Religion is a living artifact from our social evolution.

History will rightly see "religion" as we view it in this modern age as the transitory concept it is, evolved from a more ancient celestial mythology, interpreted now through our hyper-subjective consciousness made possible through the never-ending, ever-growing complexity of metaphorical language. What was once allegorical has been made literal to suit the needs of social control. It is an increasingly fraught bargain on both sides and is destined to collapse into the dustbin of history as our species is forced to deal with the actual challenges of climate change, over population, and natural resource depletion.

This too shall pass...

];->

[MineralMan]

27. Now, that's optimistic. Thanks.

If we survive as a species, of course.

[IamFortunesFool]

28. I tend to think it's likely we will survive the inevitable bottleneck...

Whether by nuclear holocaust, cosmic impact, pandemic, alien invasion, environmental collapse, or whatever combination of factors eventually force us to address our future as a species, as a species-wide common cause, I do believe in both our proven and unshakable adaptive genius, as well as our sheer numbers. It will take a geological level extinction event to get rid of all 7+ billion of us...and the number continues to explode exponentially, only heightening the quickening and absurd theatre of it all!

[trotsky]

36. That's a great observation.

Religion was a way to codify rules of behavior and put some authority behind them. There is no "check" on the usefulness or validity of these rules, the important thing was to make everyone in the group abide by them. Religion was enormously successful in this regard, and got intertwined with the evolution of our brains to live (and thrive) in groups. It reinforced both in-group altruism and out-group hostility. Today we recognize the bigger problems that result from this approach, and while some religions have expanded and do a better job of recognizing that we are ALL the "in-group," most have not - and as I mentioned, there is no guaranteed process by which all religions will engage in this self-correction. Heck, there's not even a way to make sure the religions that ARE more tolerant, continue to stay that way.

[marylandblue]

30. I'm an agnostic.

There is only one type of evidence for the supernatural. People claim to have mystical experiences, to see supernatural phenomenon or to have particularly evocative dreams. Often they find these experiences emotionally compelling but difficult to describe. When they can describe it, it is usually in terms that are consistent with their culture that includes stories of others who have had similar experiences.

In other cases, people find emotional satisfaction in engaging in religious traditions or studying texts. Here too there is an experience they find difficult to describe.

Most likely these experiences are mental states produced by our own brains. But I don't dismiss the possibility that there is something more to it. Whatever they are, they are experiences of God or the supernatural. I use "God," "supernatural" and similar terms phenomenologically without judging whether they are objectively true or not, but simply observing that the experiences exist and the people experiencing them use those terms.

[sprinkleeninow]

40. For you, at this point in time,---»» 💙

[marylandblue]

41. Well, nobody knows what tomorrow will bring.

[sprinkleeninow]

42. That dint sound exactly charitable, did it?

Alrighty then--at all points in time henceforth and forevermore. 💙

[marylandblue]

43. It's okay, I think I knew what you what you meant

And I wasn't saying no, so it's all good.

[sprinkleeninow]

44. Special delivery 💌 :

[Pope George Ringo II]

31. Religion is an assault on humanity. For example...

&t=73s

[randr]

32. Currently studying Buddism

Never really understood how believing in any religious dogma made any improvements on the planet

[trotsky]

34. Steven Weinberg said it best, I think.

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion."

[MineralMan]

35. He said it well, I think.

There is plenty of evidence of his conclusion out there.

[Cartoonist]

37. Reading the tea leaves here

I count one vote to be pro religion.
Several indifferent.
Many anti.

Did I read them wrong?

[MineralMan]

38. I don't know, really. I just thought I'd post an open thread and

let it take care of itself.

We have a few religionists in the Religion Group, but they are a minority, I think. Most active members question the validity of religious belief, it seems to me.

[The Genealogist]

39. I see it mainly as a tool for social control

Let me tell a story. When I was a child, my mother and her mother had a method for making me behave: scare the ever-loving shit out of me. Instead of teaching me right from wrong, or simply telling me to cut the crap, something was going to get me. I was scared to death of many things. For example:

Lightening (Chiffon butter TV ads "it's not nice to fool mother nature" included a thunderclap that drove me screaming to my room)

Mannequins (I can still remember being in a dress shop my father was doing work on, screaming in terror that "the atticans are going to get me!&quot

There were many, many other things I feared in similar ways. As I grew up, it became obvious that mannequins and butter ads were not really scary, and that I had been sold a phony bill of goods by elders who couldn't be bothered to properly teach good behavior. You might see why now "the devil is going to get you" doesn't really pack a punch with me. To me, religion functions like that phony bill of goods I was sold as a child, except on a larger scale.