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Fri Jan 10, 2020, 10:54 AM

What does "Jesus died for our sins" mean?

Does it mean, we are absolved for our sins up to that point in history? (Would that include the original sin in Garden Eden?)

Or are we also absolved from our future sins?

If we are absolved for our sins, why do we still go to hell for our sins?

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Reply What does "Jesus died for our sins" mean? (Original post)
DetlefK Jan 2020 OP
dchill Jan 2020 #1
ArcticFox Jan 2020 #2
greymattermom Jan 2020 #3
ArcticFox Jan 2020 #15
mahina Jan 2020 #4
LakeArenal Jan 2020 #5
MineralMan Jan 2020 #6
Cartoonist Jan 2020 #7
guillaumeb Jan 2020 #14
Cartoonist Jan 2020 #16
guillaumeb Jan 2020 #17
CaptYossarian Jan 2020 #8
Major Nikon Jan 2020 #18
JustFiveMoreMinutes Jan 2020 #19
Lulu KC Jan 2020 #9
packman Jan 2020 #10
Lulu KC Jan 2020 #11
Major Nikon Jan 2020 #13
Major Nikon Jan 2020 #12
JustFiveMoreMinutes Jan 2020 #20

Response to DetlefK (Original post)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 10:58 AM

1. I truly don't think you should worry about it.

He did or he didn't. Either way, you're covered.

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Response to DetlefK (Original post)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 11:06 AM

2. As long as you believe in Jesus as your savior

You'll go to heaven. All your sins will be forgiven.

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Response to ArcticFox (Reply #2)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 11:10 AM

3. It means that Jesus

is a get out of sin free card. I never understood this either. If you can be forgiven of anything, why isn't ok to do anything? Is it bad to be forgiven?

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Response to greymattermom (Reply #3)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 02:32 PM

15. I think that's the whole point

As in, just keep coming to church, and don't worry about the rest of life. It's really a terrible message, morally, and explains why so many devotees of Jesus don't feel a need to care about others as they say he did.

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Response to DetlefK (Original post)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 11:14 AM

4. As I understand it, it's a carryover from pagan traditions. "Lamb of God, you take away the world

Like a sacrifice.

Thatís how it was explained to me anyways eventually. For what itís worth, I believe in Jesus Christ and none of the above that if that makes any sense to me at all other than from an anthropological perspective

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Response to DetlefK (Original post)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 11:18 AM

5. Well there is no hell. Pope said so as well

Vatican has a hissy. But he did say, sinful souls disappear.

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Response to DetlefK (Original post)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 11:22 AM

6. That's a very good question.

Old Testament Judaism did animal sacrifices to appease their finicky deity. You had to kill a lamb or a kid (goat) or something and roast it on a fire to make a nice smell for the ever carnivorous deity. Heck, sometimes, the deity demanded that a leader sacrifice his son. "Just a joke, Abe," it said, just before the knife came down. "Here's a goat. That's fine."

So, it stands to reason that the deity would send down his "son" to be sacrificed to make up for the sins of humans. Sort of, anyhow, if you're into that blood sacrifice king of state of mind. Symbolism, see, is big in religion.

So, Jesus is Abraham's kid (son), somehow, but this time the kid (son) doesn't get a goat as a substitute offering. But, that's OK, because the deity can revive him three days later. Magic ensues.

Or something like that. It's all tied up in ancient religious practices that even the Jews don't follow any longer in the modern world,

Jesus is the "lamb" or "kid" of God, see. That's all you need to know. Now, please place your money offering in the plate as it passes by. There's a good lad.

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Response to DetlefK (Original post)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 11:25 AM

7. Jesus took a nap for three days for your sins.

I take a nap every day. You can keep your sins.

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Response to Cartoonist (Reply #7)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 01:40 PM

14. You take a nap every day?

Tell people that you meditate every day. It sounds more mentally productive.

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Response to guillaumeb (Reply #14)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 03:48 PM

16. I'm old

I like naps. Actually, they're more of a drugged slumber.

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Response to Cartoonist (Reply #16)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 03:57 PM

17. I find that if I take a nap I have trouble sleeping later.

But occasionally I "meditate" on the couch, or on the porch. My wife accuses me of sleeping, but she does not understand that meditation can look much like sleeping to some people.

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Response to DetlefK (Original post)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 11:31 AM

8. These posts are all different from my take on it.

Because of my mother's Catholic upbringing, I was subjected to a lot of guilt. I'm thinking that Jesus dies a little every time we commit a sin or have an impure thought.

It's mind- and behavior control from some self-righteous pricks wearing dresses and touching children.

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Response to CaptYossarian (Reply #8)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 09:55 PM

18. Just think of baby Jesus crying when you masturbate

Come to think of it, maybe thatís why the RCC has a pedophile problem to begin with.

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Response to Major Nikon (Reply #18)

Sat Jan 11, 2020, 01:04 AM

19. Oy! Please no active imaginations need to play! LOL! n/t

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Response to DetlefK (Original post)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 11:38 AM

9. How I understand the concept (after much struggle to grasp it)

is that by turning toward God (away from "sin," toward "love thy neighbor as thyself" etc.) that you are beginning anew. Whatever you did in the past is wiped away--the death of Jesus took care of that part. The sacrifice part is analogous to sacrifice of animals, a familiar practice at that time.

The revolutionary part is the belief that all can be forgiven--that is in opposition to the eye-for-an-eye mentality of, for example, the Old Testament.

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Response to Lulu KC (Reply #9)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 12:14 PM

10. A good laff about that sin thingie

I worked with a guy who was a so-called born again Christian. He was also a shop-lifter who was addicted to that criminal behavior. He'd actually would brag about various things he shop-lifted - food items, tools, clothing, etc. He would also crow about swindling other people, not repaying debts, and having an affair with his friend's wife.

One day, I had enough of his hypocrisy - praising God and Jesus and behavior - and told him if he considered what he did as a sin. "No", he replied, "Jesus died for us and all I have to do is say 'Jesus forgive me' and I'm good to go."

Shook my head and walked away. BTW, after I transferred to another place, I heard he was caught in bed with a very young high school student, lost his job, and was thrown in jail.

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Response to packman (Reply #10)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 12:23 PM

11. Yeah--it's so easy to leave out that "repent" part! n/t




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Response to packman (Reply #10)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 12:57 PM

13. If you don't sin, Jesus died for nothing

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Response to DetlefK (Original post)

Fri Jan 10, 2020, 12:54 PM

12. It means whatever you want it to mean

There's no reference to this in the synoptic gospels. It's more of a doctrinal application of the religion which evolved long after the execution of the criminal Jesus.

Under Judaism the concept of heaven or hell is basically nonexistent, or is at least significantly different than is typically doctrinal for other Abrahamic belief systems. During the time of Jesus, many if not most sin required atonement. Covet your neighbor's wife and you would probably be struck by lightning, or your villiage might develop a spontaneous STD, or at the very least some other form of divine retribution was going to happen. So best to take care of that shit yourself through a series of penances performed commensurate with the sin committed. The local legal authorities under the theocracy in which you lived might also penance your sorry ass at the town whipping post, or you might get stoned just not in a good way. All of this was designed to cut down on things like raining frogs and locust swarms.

The concept of "Jesus died for your sins" didn't really come about until the hustler Paul needed to come up with some outside the box thinking for how to separate the richer, yet gentile Greeks and Romans from their wealth. Those folks were lining up with their coined filled purses for this Jesus craze, but unfortunately were still in possession of their hoodies which was a big no-no per mosaic law. The simplest solution was to send them down to the Rabbi for a turtlenectomy, but this was a pretty risky proposition in the days before penicillin. You stood a good chance of parts falling off at the least due to infection. The innovative solution was just to declare that "Jesus died for your foreskin", but the marketing department decided this was a hard sell. Better to be more inclusive as the whole coveting thing wasn't going over too well either.

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Response to DetlefK (Original post)

Sat Jan 11, 2020, 01:08 AM

20. To paraphrase an old saying "Love them all, and let God sort them out"

Key words.. Love them All (within human boundaries but not artificial divisions)... and fate will deal with us all.

I know this doesn't address the point of the question exactly... but in the larger grand scale... with everything said... you and I are not judge, jury, and executioner...

only a neighbor.

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