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Sat Feb 22, 2014, 04:25 PM

What's the deal with Richard III?

Ok, I admit, I'm a nerd who has long had a fascination with medieval English history. Initially, it started with the Tudors, but after I read a spectacular book by Sharon K. Penman about Richard III (Sunne in Splendour), I've expanded that interest to the Plantagenets. And the past two years have been amazing for those interested in the story of Richard III, with the "discovery" of his remains. I "knew" that when they found bones on day 1 of the dig, that they had found Richard. I don't know how I knew, I just did in my gut. (BTW, if you're even remotely interested in pre-Tudor England, I highly recommend any of Penman's books)

Note: If you only paid slight attention to the story, you'd think "wow, what a lucky guess" when they essentially struck pay dirt on Day 1 of the dig, but in reality, they started digging right where an "R" had been painted on the parking lot. Turns out, the spot where Richard was buried has been marked since the early 1600's, first by a statue of some sort & then with a simple "R." So, they knew where he was, just scientists saying "it's only speculation, not proved" keep the falsehood of "grave unknown" alive. (I was curious as to where this R came from & this is what my searching, after the discovery, found; I did not know any of this when I first heard the news of this dig.)

Along with this is 500 years of anti-Richard propaganda, helped by the fact that records of this time period are sketchy & most of what survives comes from (shock) those who were beneficiaries of the Tudors or were wanting to keep their heads on their shoulders.

But now it seems that there are Richardians everywhere! One in particular spearheaded the project which recovered his remains, & now there is a highly-contested case over where the King's remains should be officially interred. Discussion of this topic was so heated, that it is now banned on the Richard III Society's FB page! WTH

I admit, when I saw the facial reconstruction of Richard III, I gasped. Chills ran up & down my spine. There is one depiction in particular, with a rendering of this reconstruction under the word "Justice" that has really shaken me up.

WHY? It just does. I mean, I know that the Truth comes out, but why now, 500 years after he died? What purpose does it serve? Why are so many people still so emotional over where to bury someone who's been dead for half a millennia?

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Arrow 22 replies Author Time Post
Reply What's the deal with Richard III? (Original post)
WolverineDG Feb 2014 OP
Squinch Feb 2014 #1
WolverineDG Feb 2014 #2
Squinch Feb 2014 #3
okasha Mar 2014 #4
WolverineDG Mar 2014 #5
okasha Mar 2014 #6
LiberalEsto Mar 2014 #12
okasha Mar 2014 #13
murielm99 Mar 2014 #15
okasha Mar 2014 #16
LiberalEsto Mar 2014 #17
SheilaT Mar 2014 #7
WolverineDG Mar 2014 #8
SheilaT Mar 2014 #9
WolverineDG Mar 2014 #10
SheilaT Mar 2014 #11
okasha Mar 2014 #14
okasha Mar 2014 #18
WolverineDG Mar 2014 #19
okasha Mar 2014 #20
WolverineDG Mar 2014 #21
okasha Mar 2014 #22

Response to WolverineDG (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2014, 04:38 PM

1. I LOVE all this emerging about him.

I don't know what, in astrology, might explain it. But the uncovering of his body in the parking lot made me re-read "Daughter of Time." Have you read that one? It's FABulous!!!

I'm off to find an image of that facial reconstruction under the word Justice to see if it's the same facial reconstruction I have seen (In which he is perfectly nice looking.)

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Response to Squinch (Reply #1)

Sat Feb 22, 2014, 05:32 PM

2. Yes, I got a copy of that book from my cousin but misplaced it

so I ordered it again from Amazon last night.

I really recommend reading "Sunne in Splendour." At some points, I felt as though I was "re-living" or watching what was happening as opposed to reading the book. Was I there? Who knows? All I know is that my reactions to the facial reconstruction hit me in my core & that only happens when I encounter something from a past life.

Do somethings about Richard's story "sound" false to you? Do you get feelings that something is not "right?" If so, those are the feelings I get.

Anyway, here is the link to the Smithsonian show .


and the best I could do on the photo:

Ihave the link to the entire document; I couldn't download or save it on my computer, but I can send it PM to you ifyou like (it's just various renderings of Richard's portrait)



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Response to WolverineDG (Reply #2)

Sat Feb 22, 2014, 05:57 PM

3. Oh! look at that!

I will get Sunne in Splendour tomorrow. I'm sure it's in the local library. Thanks!

Read Daughter of Time! It goes into exactly WHAT is wrong with the whole Richard story. It takes detail by detail and shows where the party line story simply doesn't make sense. It also goes into the history before and after, and the people who REALLY benefitted from the princes deaths, and how the timeline of Richard killing them simply doesn't work.

I don't have that response to that image, but I have had recurring dreams about a house that I had never seen and then stumbled across, decades after the dreams began. So I know that "hits your core" feeling.

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Response to WolverineDG (Original post)

Sat Mar 1, 2014, 10:41 PM

4. The thing that struck me most forcefully

about the facial reconstruction was how much Richard did in fact resemble other members of his family, after 500 tears of being described as the "odd one out." (The dark one in a blond family, the short one in a tall family, etc.) It's harder to see in the surviving potrait of Edward because he'd gotten heavy by the time the original painting was done. But look at the portrait of Margaret as a young woman. The likeness is very strong.

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Response to okasha (Reply #4)

Sat Mar 1, 2014, 11:06 PM

5. It's funny he was called "short"

Because Edward was 6'4". Anyone, scoliosis or not, would be "short" in comparison. Even with a bent back, Richard stood about 5'7 or 5'8, still taller than most men of the time period.

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Response to WolverineDG (Reply #5)

Sat Mar 1, 2014, 11:58 PM

6. The scoliosis may not have affected

his height or stance as much as many articles published immediately after the discovery of the bones claimed. I showed the online photos to an RN friend who also has lateral curve scoliosis and asked how Richard's compared to hers. Hers is worse, and her only visible symptom before they put steel rods down her spine for compression fractures suffered in an auto accident was one shoulder carried slightly higher than the other.

Another novel Ricardians will enjoy: The White Boar, by Marian Palmer.

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Response to okasha (Reply #6)

Tue Mar 4, 2014, 08:07 PM

12. Also: "The Murders of Richard III" by Elizabeth Peters

 

It's a mystery novel about a group of Richardians in England having a conference to unveil s new discovery. A fun read.

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Response to LiberalEsto (Reply #12)

Wed Mar 5, 2014, 12:02 AM

13. Anything by EP is a fun read.

I love Amelia Peabody.

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Response to okasha (Reply #13)

Wed Mar 5, 2014, 12:27 AM

15. You know Ms. Peters died not long ago.

I will miss Peabody.

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Response to murielm99 (Reply #15)

Wed Mar 5, 2014, 01:19 AM

16. I had wondered

sibce there has been nothing new for so long. I will miss her. I still miss Dorothy Dunnett, whom Ms. Peters also admired.

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Response to murielm99 (Reply #15)

Wed Mar 5, 2014, 10:22 AM

17. I saw her obituary in the Washington Post

 

She lived in Frederick County, MD. I live in a neighboring county. Years ago she reviewed books in the Post.

Rest in peace, Barbara Mertz/Barbara Michaels/Elizabeth Peters

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Response to WolverineDG (Original post)

Mon Mar 3, 2014, 03:47 AM

7. I want to recommend the novel

 

Daughter of Time by Josephine Tey. A police inspector, laid up with a broken leg, starts looking into the Richard III thing. Fascinating. In my opinion it is the best analysis of that portion of history ever. Still in print. Read it.

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Response to SheilaT (Reply #7)

Mon Mar 3, 2014, 01:20 PM

8. Yes, very good book!

My cousin gave me a copy but I lost it, so I've ordered it again. Thanks!

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Response to WolverineDG (Reply #8)

Mon Mar 3, 2014, 03:58 PM

9. In my opinion everything Josephine Tey wrote

 

was very good. Do look at some of her other novels if you get a chance.

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Response to SheilaT (Reply #9)

Mon Mar 3, 2014, 06:22 PM

10. I didn't know she wrote anything else

Thanks for the suggestion!

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Response to WolverineDG (Reply #10)

Mon Mar 3, 2014, 11:05 PM

11. Yes. Not too many books, and she died rather young.

 

They are all worth seeking out.

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Response to SheilaT (Reply #7)

Wed Mar 5, 2014, 12:07 AM

14. DOT turned out to be more insightful

than anyone knew. Inspector Grant comes to the conclusion that Richard survived a devastating and painful childhood illness. He siggests polio, whose effects can indeed be similar to those of scoliosis.

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Response to WolverineDG (Original post)

Wed Mar 12, 2014, 10:41 PM

18. For anyone interested

THE University of Leicester is offering a free online course on Richard and his times. Isigned up for it today.

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Response to okasha (Reply #18)

Thu Mar 13, 2014, 11:00 AM

19. I signed up for it too!!

Looking forward to it. Supposed to start before June.

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Response to WolverineDG (Reply #19)

Thu Mar 13, 2014, 11:31 AM

20. Great!

We can compare notes.

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Response to okasha (Reply #20)

Thu Mar 13, 2014, 01:25 PM

21. Starts June 30!

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Response to WolverineDG (Reply #21)

Thu Mar 13, 2014, 01:39 PM

22. Even better.

I should be just abput done with summer class at that point. Can't wait!

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