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Judi Lynn

(160,515 posts)
Thu Jun 28, 2018, 11:38 PM Jun 2018

New Caledonia Crows Have Shown They Can Do Something Never Before Seen In Animals, Besides Us



New Caledonian crows make tools with a sophistication that arguably surpasses any animal besides ourselves. There are signs crows can learn from each other, and their technology may even be advancing, but researchers have been puzzled how such unsociable animals, lacking in language, can do this. A new study shows that even though Corvus moneduloides are relatively solitary creatures, they are capable of learning new tool-making techniques and applying them from memory in a way never before seen in animals besides ourselves and our ancestors.

Although corvids in general are impressively intelligent birds, New Caledonian crows are something special. The bend twigs and tear leaves to make hooked tools to extract grubs in the wild, and have taken to shaping wire with enthusiasm. If this still doesn't impress you much take a look at this video and ask yourself how many humans could solve a sequential challenge so quickly.



Scientists are puzzled how they acquire some of these skills, since they don't appear to imitate each other, even in captivity. Dr Sarah Jelbert of the University of Auckland has proven that when shown a novel tool, and taught its effectiveness, these crows can learn to fashion something similar from memory. She proposes in Scientific Reports crows learn from watching their parents or by finding tools discarded by others, and sometimes make advances on these, leading to a developing technological sophistication.

Jelbert taught eight crows a trick they would definitely not have evolved in the wild. She created a crow vending machine, which rewarded them with food when they inserted pieces of colored paper (portraits of reigning monarchs or notable persons not required).

More:
http://www.iflscience.com/plants-and-animals/new-caledonia-crows-have-shown-they-can-do-something-never-before-seen-in-animals-besides-us/page-2/
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New Caledonia Crows Have Shown They Can Do Something Never Before Seen In Animals, Besides Us (Original Post) Judi Lynn Jun 2018 OP
There have been octopus studies like this lordsummerisle Jun 2018 #1
This has info. which sounds like your description: Judi Lynn Jun 2018 #6
These... Duppers Jun 2018 #8
Great! Returning to study that video in the daytime. Judi Lynn Jun 2018 #9
Definitely, "what a shame" is right. Duppers Jun 2018 #11
Birdbrainy: New Caledonian crows make tools using mental images Judi Lynn Jun 2018 #2
My little story about Crows and a Ferret is something I wonder about until today... JoeOtterbein Jun 2018 #3
That is spectacular! Wow. Thanks for posting it! Judi Lynn Jun 2018 #7
A clear example of intelligent design! BootinUp Jun 2018 #4
If these crows really want to impress me... BootinUp Jun 2018 #5
It is hard to make a tool to use on a tool. pazzyanne Jun 2018 #10

lordsummerisle

(4,651 posts)
1. There have been octopus studies like this
Thu Jun 28, 2018, 11:47 PM
Jun 2018

where octopuses were put into adjacent cages and they quickly learned behaviors from their neighbors. Sorry I don't have a link...

Judi Lynn

(160,515 posts)
6. This has info. which sounds like your description:
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 12:09 AM
Jun 2018

OCTOPUS'S GRASP SURPRISES SCIENTISTS
By Boyce Rensberger
April 24, 1992

The lowly octopus has a surprising intellectual ability, two brain researchers report: It can learn a task simply by watching another octopus do it first.

Learning by observation, which might in this case be described as "octopus see, octopus do," is considered a very advanced form of learning -- one that is possible, some argue, only in a brain almost on the verge of conceptual thought. Such mental capacities have been thought to be reserved to "higher" vertebrates (animals with backbones) such as mammals and not likely in the brains of invertebrates -- like the octopus, which is classified with slugs and clams as a mollusk.

The research was conducted by Graziano Fiorito, a neurobiologist at the Stazione Zoologica in Naples, Italy, a major marine biological research center, and Pietro Scotto of the Universita di Reggio Calabria, also in Italy. Their report is published in today's issue of the journal Science.

The octopus's ability to copy a model, the two wrote, is a skill well known in "humans and {other} vertebrates, and it has been considered preliminary to conceptual thought; in this sense it appears related to the cognitive abilities of the animal learning system {of more advanced species}."

Their finding was based on a simple experiment involving Octopus vulgaris, the common octopus found throughout temperate and tropical seas. Like all octopuses, its body is entirely soft. The largest individuals measure 10 feet from the tip of the head to the end of the longest of the eight tentacles.

In the first stage of the experiment, an octopus was trained to swim to one of two differently colored balls placed in their tanks. If the red ball was the "right" one in the experiment and the animal went to the white ball, it received a mild electric shock. But if it went to the red ball, it was rewarded by finding a piece of fish hidden behind the ball.

Once the animal learned to go to the correct ball every time, an untrained octopus was placed in an adjacent tank so that it could watch the first octopus choose between another pair of balls.

The scientists said these "student" observers watched the trained animals closely, their heads and eyes tracking the action as the trained octopus jetted across the tank and wrapped its tentacles around the ball to get the fish.

Octopus eyes, though they evolved completely separately from vertebrate eyes, are structurally similar and can focus at varying distances to provide highly acute vision. The observer octopuses were allowed to see the trained animals perform four times, watching as their neighbors found food and ate it. Then the observers were isolated and given a pair of balls without reward or punishment.

The observers consistently chose the right ball right away, the scientists said, having learned much faster than the human-trained animals, which took an average of 16 trials to learn to go to the red ball consistently and 21 to go to the white.

In the first four trials of the observer animals, by contrast, they scored an average of 86 percent correct when the red ball was the "right" one and 70 percent of the time when the white ball was "right." (Something about red balls, apparently, was more attractive.)

Even when the observer octopuses were tested five days after watching the human-trained animals, they scored about as well.

The finding accords with other research showing that the octopus has the most complex brain of any invertebrate. In some ways, in fact, their brains compare with those of mammals.

More:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1992/04/24/octopuss-grasp-surprises-scientists/9f705509-b3d6-40bb-95d4-3ae926da7947/

Thanks for mentioning reading about this. It's really interesting!

Duppers

(28,118 posts)
8. These...
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 12:51 AM
Jun 2018



Plus this:

Here's Otto, the octopus that figured out how to put the 2000 watt annoying light above his tank out; yet more proof that octopuses have higher intelligent than people have given them credit for.

"Once we saw him juggling the hermit crabs in his tank, another time he threw stones against the glass damaging it. And from time to time he completely re-arranges his tank to make it suit his own taste better - much to the distress of his fellow tank inhabitants."

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=96476905

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/3328480/Otto-the-octopus-wrecks-havoc.html

Judi Lynn

(160,515 posts)
9. Great! Returning to study that video in the daytime.
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 01:17 AM
Jun 2018

It looks like it's going to be terrific.

Thanks for posting the video, and the other link.

What a shame it took human beings so long to start waking up about intelligence in animals. We assumed so much, and apparently a lot of it was dead wrong.

We need a whole new look at everything.

Duppers

(28,118 posts)
11. Definitely, "what a shame" is right.
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 02:15 AM
Jun 2018

Most folks still don't understand, Judi.
Dolphins, crows, octopuses, elephants have surprisingly exceptional intelligence that rivals some primates'.

On dolphins:
"...based on years of research that has shown dolphins and whales have large, complex brains and a human-like level of self-awareness....
Ethics expert Prof Tom White, from Loyola Marymount University, Los Angeles, author of In Defence of Dolphins: The New Moral Frontier, said dolphins were "non-human persons".
...
"We're saying the science has shown that individuality - consciousness, self-awareness - is no longer a unique human property..."
...
Psychologist Dr Lori Marino, from Emory University in Atlanta, told how scientific advances had changed the view of the cetacean brain. "We went from seeing the dolphin/whale brain as being a giant amorphous blob that doesn't carry a lot of intelligence and complexity to not only being an enormous brain but an enormous brain with an enormous amount of complexity, and a complexity that rivals our own."

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-17116882

Judi Lynn

(160,515 posts)
2. Birdbrainy: New Caledonian crows make tools using mental images
Thu Jun 28, 2018, 11:51 PM
Jun 2018

Study finds birds have design templates in their minds and may pass them on to future generations

Agence France-Presse
Thu 28 Jun 2018 20.38 EDT

New Caledonian crows use mental pictures to twist twigs into hooks and make other tools, according to a provocative study that suggests the notoriously clever birds pass on successful designs to future generations, a hallmark of culture.

“We find evidence for a specific type of emulation we call mental template matching,” co-author Alex Taylor, director of the Language, Cognition and Culture Lab at the University of Auckland, told AFP.

“Put simply, crows can reverse engineer tool designs using only a mental image of that tool.”

A long-simmering debate among evolutionary biologists asks how much of the crow’s tool-making ability is genetically programmed, and how much is acquired and transmitted through learning and memory.

More:
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/jun/29/birdbrainy-new-caledonian-crows-make-tools-using-mental-images

JoeOtterbein

(7,700 posts)
3. My little story about Crows and a Ferret is something I wonder about until today...
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 12:05 AM
Jun 2018

...I often (as their grand-dad) baby-sit two funny little ferrets very often.

One day I was working at my computer when I heard a bunch of Crows making racket out front of the house. There is a Crow's nest in the tree near the road where I live, so I hear them all the time. But this was different. So I checked it out. And there was a little ferret looking trough the glass door like he wanted to get in.

It seems someone left the door open and the little guy, "Baby Ferret", got out and wanted to come back in.

I still wonder if the super-smart crows in the tree were warning me.

BootinUp

(47,139 posts)
5. If these crows really want to impress me...
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 12:09 AM
Jun 2018

They should do something about the orange menace in our White House! Lol.

pazzyanne

(6,547 posts)
10. It is hard to make a tool to use on a tool.
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 02:01 AM
Jun 2018


Or maybe they are just waiting for a bald eagle to scare the orange one to death?
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