Is this an attack ad?

[DisgustipatedinCA]

Please feel free to add commentary on why you think the ad is either an attack ad or not.

Thanks.

54 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited
	Yes
	1 (2%)
	No
	53 (98%)
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[stone space]

1. It didn't seem like an attack to me, but then...

...I teach math at a public university.



Perhaps if I ran a big bank, I'd feel differently.



I can certainly see how different folks might perceive it differently.

[SheilaT]

2. Anyone who thinks that's an attack ad

is probably spending a lot of time here on DU alerting on innocuous posts.

That doesn't remotely reach the level of "attack" for an ad.

[Motown_Johnny]

3. Not even close. n/t

[Bluzmann57]

4. Did someone say that this is an attack ad?

I ask because it most certainly isn't an attack. Senator Sanders just pointed out facts. If Mrs. Clinton (or anyone else) can point out Sander's misdeeds, and it's true, then how can it be an attack ad? In my opinion, an attack ad is when one candidate says half truths or outright lies about another. But truth is truth. And sometimes it hurts.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

8. Robby Mook, Hillary's campaign manager, called it an attack ad. Some here have done the same.

.

[senz]

62. Even her campaign manager lies! LOL, even her campaign manager.

[arcane1]

26. The cry is "Sanders went back on his promise not to go negative!!1"

Somehow said with a straight face.

[Dretownblues]

5. No not at all

But it sure as hell is an awesome ad, one of bernies better ones.

[in_cog_ni_to]

6. Only Wall St. thugs would think that's an attack ad. n/t

[underthematrix]

7. There's this line spoken by Bernie that should give everyone pause

Will they begin to play by the rules of our president? you better believe it!

We don't have presidential laws. We have the rule of law which is framed by our Constitution and other framing documents.

[tk2kewl]

9. he can have his attorney general actually prosecute the law breakers

to imply that he is saying he would have some special power beyond the law is disingenuous

[underthematrix]

10. We don't have presidential rules or presidential laws in this country

This is a fact. And what you are suggesting is what got Nixon and Bush in trouble.

[tk2kewl]

11. i didn't say we had presidential laws.

i said the president can have the attorney general prosecute law breakers.

[underthematrix]

12. The AG is required to act independently otherwise they could use the office to

go after their enemies. The President can frame his priorities but he cannot get personally involved in prosecuting them.

And no you didn't say it Bernie did.

[tk2kewl]

15. Bernie said they would have to play by the rules...

Last edited Thu Jan 14, 2016, 08:57 PM - Edit history (1)

I.e. Follow the law

You are trying to make that into something it's not and you know it

[underthematrix]

32. Thank you for your comment

I already tweeted this link out to my tweeple w/ my observation

[RoccoR5955]

20. That is in a perfect world.

The AG went after Eliot Spitzer, and nobody seemed to blink an eye!
Eliot was going to go after the banksters on Wall St, and they didn't like it, so the exec ordered the AG to find something out on him. Go check Greg Palast's site if you question this.

[underthematrix]

36. Yep. Unfortunately Elliot had the same sense

of arrogance as the people he was targeting

[RoccoR5955]

59. I take it

you never checked out the Greg Palast site, did you?
You do know that IOKIYAR though, as in the case of David Vitter, do you?
They live by double standards.

[underthematrix]

64. I looked at and there are lots of sites like the Palast one

It appears to be something you find helpful and that's good. Yes I know about the Republican and Democrat peen scandals. We let them live by a double standard.

[questionseverything]

34. why don't you show us in the Constitution where the attorney generals duties are named?

the executive branch enforces the law

btw it is ok to go after enemies if they are murders,and thieves

wish the current potus would in flint

[underthematrix]

40. Oh LAWD! Thank you for your comment

[eomer]

46. The President can direct the Attorney General regarding prosecution priorities and efforts.

Here is a description of an Executive Order issued by President Obama:

13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.
a. President’s Actions: President Obama has directed Attorney General Holder to
ensure that every appropriate resource is being used to prevent and prosecute gun crime. To
that end, the Attorney General will reach out to U.S. attorneys to determine if supplemental
efforts will be appropriate in prosecution failed background checks. Failed background checks
are notoriously hard to prosecute and the low number of filed cases has been a point of
contention in the gun violence debate.
b. Objectives: To ensure that existing laws are being enforced and prosecuted to the
fullest extent possible.
c. Affected: This executive order affects the Department of Justice and all its regional
offices.

https://law.depaul.edu/about/centers-and-institutes/international-weapons-control-center/Documents/obama_executive_action.pdf

Also, one of the duties of the President under the Constitution is to enforce the laws.

The general statements by Bernie fit well within the duties and authorities of the President.

[underthematrix]

54. yes I believe I wrote that in my post that you are responding to

and thank you for your comment

[eomer]

60. What then do you think Bernie meant by those very few words?

You think he meant that he's going to somehow make rules other than through the well-established authorities of the Presidency? If so then keep an eye out and let us know when it happens. I'll worry about the massive violations by the elite that are intentionally let slide by his predecessors, so you won't have to.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

61. I think your concise reply completely dispenses with this goofy line of reasoning.

[Motown_Johnny]

14. Executive actions constitute rules.

[underthematrix]

25. If Bernie meant EOs he should have said EOs but

that would have presented another problem for him. It would have been an admission he is unlikely to get his policy through Congress; the body that makes and fund laws.
here's the definition of Executive orders
United States presidents issue executive orders to help officers and agencies of the executive branch manage the operations within the federal government itself. Executive orders have the full force of law when they take authority from a legislative power which grants its power directly to the Executive by the Constitution, or are made pursuant to Acts of Congress that explicitly delegate to the President some degree of discretionary power (delegated legislation).[1] Like both legislative statutes and regulations promulgated by government agencies, executive orders are subject to judicial review, and may be struck down if deemed by the courts to be unsupported by statute or the Constitution. Major policy initiatives require approval by the legislative branch, but executive orders have significant influence over the internal affairs of government, deciding how and to what degree legislation will be enforced, dealing with emergencies, waging 72-hour length strikes on enemies, and in general fine-tuning policy choices in the implementation of broad statutes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_order

BTW it is not an attack ad to me. It is a dishonest ad.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

35. Praytell, why do you think Bernie Sanders' ad is dishonest?

[underthematrix]

37. The implications of his ad are

the too big to fail banks are not following the rules. The current president is not making them follow the rules. There are no rules. i will make them follow the rules.

that's dishonest

[DisgustipatedinCA]

38. I see. Well, your defense of large banks is admirable, but I've actually worked for banks for a long

time. I've worked for one of the largest banks on the planet, and I've worked at a small (20-branch) regional bank.

And I can tell you, the BIG banks are corrupt--so are many of the small ones, but that's for another thread. Thousands of pages could and have been written about this. I see that your favorite rejoinder is "thank you for the post", so I'm not going to spend any further time with you on this, but large banks are most freaking certainly corrupt. Look into it.

[underthematrix]

39. Thank you for your comment

[DisgustipatedinCA]

41. Thank YOU for answering my question.

[underthematrix]

42. You're welcome

[Motown_Johnny]

49. So now you argue that we do have Presidential Laws? So your previous post was wrong?

as you posted


Executive orders have the full force of law when they take authority from a legislative power which grants its power directly to the Executive by the Constitution, or are made pursuant to Acts of Congress that explicitly delegate to the President some degree of discretionary power (delegated legislation).




You seem to be contradicting yourself.

[Enrique]

19. he says "if I'm president"

it doesn't make sense if he said "of our president"

[underthematrix]

23. Breaking up the too big to fail

http://www.wsj.com/articles/has-the-government-made-it-too-expensive-to-be-a-big-bank-1452731317

Thank you President Obama

[hootinholler]

48. Actually, we do.

They are called regulations. Congress has delegated the details of law to the Executive by passing laws that contain the framework but not the detail. That is how the FAA, for instance, can regulate Drones with the force of law behind the regulations the FAA makes.

Every department in the Executive branch operates this way. So yeah, he's not wrong nor mistaken. Quite the contrary he understands how it actually works.

[mhatrw]

52. The line was "When I am President."

[Oilwellian]

65. Except that's not what he said

so your argument is moot.

He actually said "Will they begin to play by the rules if I'm president?

Big difference.

[tk2kewl]

13. Of course the ad is not negative, but Team Clinton wants people to think so...

so that when they get their smear machine in full gear they can try to claim "he started it"

[DisgustipatedinCA]

17. I agree on both counts.

If this IS a negative attack, I'd like to know how a candidate could possibly draw a distinction between themselves and another candidate without being "negative". It's a little ludicrous to call this an attack ad.

[joshcryer]

16. "it's OK to take millions from big banks and then tell them what to do"

Is not an attack but the truth. That was literally Clinton's argument in the debate.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

18. Thanks, johshcryer.

I mean, it's clear he was referring to Clinton, but there does need to be some way to distinguish yourself from the other candidate, and that inevitably means drawing comparisons. I think this ad was one of the more tame ways he could have pointed out those differences.

[joshcryer]

22. What's funny is Clinton was embracing this.

And now they are backing away from it.

They need to just embrace it and reframe and not with the dumb 9/11 argument. Call up Obama, ask how he got those donations without being called on it.

[JonLeibowitz]

33. What makes you think he wasn't called on it? Too big to jail was Obama's AG's policy after all.. n/t

[joshcryer]

45. Obama managed it very well.

Clinton falterers.

[Kenjie]

21. No this is not an attack

This ad simply uses what both candidates have said openly on the debate stage to point out the differences between the two.

[Matariki]

24. Here are some facts

Top Contributors
Senator Hillary Clinton

?1

https://www.opensecrets.org/politicians/contrib.php?cid=N00000019&cycle=Career

[libdem4life]

28. Some people just have to bring up tacky little things like facts. LOL Be careful, you

may be attacking someone, these days you never know.

[arcane1]

29. They're just nostalgic about 9/11, or something. Yeah, that's it.

[pangaia]

27. No. It is not.

THIS is an attack ad.

https://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=AluZlw10CCjiGnAu1fFAfBabvZx4?fr=yfp-t-901-s&toggle=1&fp=1&cop=mss&ei=UTF-8&p=nuclear%20bomb%20political%20ad

[madokie]

30. Not at all

When talking about the issues as he is here and the different ways to solve the problems presented it is NOT an attack ad

[DisgustipatedinCA]

31. At this point: 80 votes, One Hundred Percent say this is not an attack ad.

[Renew Deal]

43. Is there someone that said it was?

[DisgustipatedinCA]

44. Yes. Clinton's campaign manager. Also a few people here, among other places. nt

[Renew Deal]

47. The ad is fine.

[brooklynite]

50. Not what the pledge was...

Sanders said he never ran "negative" ads. A negative ad criticizes an opponent rather than focusing on the candidates positions. This is arguably "negative".

[paleotn]

58. Arguably my ass.....

....no one was named and the bulk of the ad focused on Bernie's ideas and message. It's a compare and contrast ad, with no candidates, Democratic or Republican specifically called out.

But then again, if the shoe fits, Cinderella, where the damn thing.

[mhatrw]

51. If you think this is an attack ad, then you must think it is bad for your candidate to

be taking millions from Wall Street and big banks.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

53. At this point: 101 votes. 100 say not an attack ad, 1 says it is an attack ad (99%, 1%) nt

[azmom]

55. No it is not, and claims that it is are

Laughable. The Clinton campaign has gone off the rails.

[Mike Nelson]

56. I'm going with...

...comparison ad rather than attack ad. Hillary has done the same (in speeches, often, recently). They compare their idea with the opponent's idea, putting it in an unfavorable light. They all do this... but, it's a good ad and would have been one without the comparison. Also, Bernie's is very mild - he doesn't even mention her name!

[jalan48]

57. Wow!

This is the best political ad I've seen in decades.

[John Poet]

63. You can't really be an "attack ad"

without naming a candidate whom you are supposedly attacking....

Anyway, it's comparative, not "negative".

Negative ads more generally just attack someone's votes or positions,
they don't necessarily offer any better course that should be followed,
except maybe "vote for this candidate, not that one".

[Donkees]

66. Sounds like Mook's amygdala has been hijacked