2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumI've noticed HRC supporters have been really quiet since she channelled her inner neo-con
Re: Iran sanctions.
Jump the Shark?
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)They are playing double down triple down and f'n talking both sides of every f'n issue.
Major Nikon
(36,814 posts)On Sun Jan 17, 2016, 07:48 AM an alert was sent on the following post:
Nah they are still to dang loud and obnoxious at least the ones still hanging out here
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1018105
REASON FOR ALERT
This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.
ALERTER'S COMMENTS
rwnj?
You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sun Jan 17, 2016, 07:59 AM, and the Jury voted 0-7 to LEAVE IT.
Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Alerter: I don't see your point. You need to describe what's offensive about the post, not comment about the person who posted.
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: stone.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
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Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
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Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
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Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: He's alerted because he disagrees with the OP? Weak tea alert. First jury call in three days and its for one of the lamest alerts ever. Put it in the dumb alert pile.
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)PDittie
(8,322 posts)It was 4-3, but still...
They're here, lurking, trying to systematically eliminate their challengers and opponents. It feels tightly organized and coordinated, and I would have thought that outlandish and even a little paranoid before it happened to me.
I just don't see how these divisions are going to be mended after the nomination is decided. This cycle has a totally different dynamic than anything in Democratic political history over the past 40 or so years -- my personal adult history, that is -- that I can compare it to (Kennedy and Carter in 1980 comes close, upon reflection). There's always been squabbling between left and right wings, yes, but the antagonism is so amplified now by social media and online conversations such as here.
Maybe it'll all blow over, but I have grave doubts.
erlewyne
(1,115 posts)I even got blocked recently .... caught me by surprise.
It was their loss. I did not intend to be hurtful.
well, keep up the good work.
PDittie
(8,322 posts)Maybe I shouldn't quote Dan Quayle.
erlewyne
(1,115 posts)Please do not discourage them and you HRC supporters, please
don't quit ... Hillary won't. Great coffee this morning!!!
Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)Feeling the Bern
(3,839 posts)and demanding Iran sanctions put back on.
If I wanted a Republican, I'd vote Republican.
Helen Borg
(3,963 posts)Or something.
Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)Also racism and socialism. eom
Kall
(615 posts)as the Senator from NY.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)Maybe after the primary when attention shifts to the general?
Kall
(615 posts)then no, it won't. And it shouldn't. Say Anything was a movie, not a Democratic campaign slogan.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)the frontrunner with enormous advantages Bernie still has to overcome.
DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)Being a compulsive liar carries consequences.
LondonReign2
(5,213 posts)Our centrist pragmatists are far more comfortable on the right-of-center side than the left-of-center side.
Purveyor
(29,876 posts)merrily
(45,251 posts)sick.
erlewyne
(1,115 posts)They do not want us to collect the Social Security
we paid for because we should work until we are 80.
And cut this neo con Iran sanction stuff. Hillary
is not suffering dementia. She would not promote
sanctions against Iran. The voters do not want
war and she's not that disconnected!
merrily
(45,251 posts)In her shoes, I would not bring up either of those issues because O"Malley is the only Democratic candidate they would seem to help.
Then again, they don't pay me the big bucks to run a campaign, so what do I know?
Proserpina
(2,352 posts)it's their day off.
sarge43
(28,939 posts)However, as I have most of them in the Ignore box, that's just a guess.
I think a lot of those click farms are in "dry" countries.
Lizzie Poppet
(10,164 posts)Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
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Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: frivolous alert. ridiculous to hide this. leave it.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: It's funny. Suck it up.
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Sod off, alerter...stop wasting my time.
nxylas
(6,440 posts)The result was pretty much what I expected too. Edited to add: but thanks to the jurors anyway.
Lizzie Poppet
(10,164 posts)But can't say I'm surprised at this...
bvf
(6,604 posts)the same old canards (how long has it been since the Bernie-is-sexist crap was last regurgitated?) to deflect attention from Clinton's war dance until after the debate tonight (which, of course, she's already won).
Make this the second thread I've bookmarked today in anticipation of some good laughs.
Metric System
(6,048 posts).
enid602
(8,524 posts)Why are some people still talking about Hill's stance on sanctions? Didn't the Prez just approve sanctions, confirming Hill's suggestion that they are in order? How does this even benefit the Bernie Bunker?
Squinch
(50,773 posts)I kid you not, there is one.
Not really clear on how it benefits the Bernie Bunker, but I think they are saying that sanctions amount to war mongering (Seriously? Yes. I think they are serious.)
passiveporcupine
(8,175 posts)Negotiations in December over the prisoner exchange delayed the US Treasury's imposition of the latest sanctions.
They were only announced once the plane containing the former prisoners had left Iran, reports said.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-35338901
When did the planes leave and when did Hillary mouth off about sanctions? Did she know the planes left and the prisoners were safely out of Iran before she voiced her concerns that they still needed sanctions?
(CNN)A plane carrying three of the four Americans freed by Iran as part of a prisoner swap landed in Germany after a brief stop in Switzerland on Sunday, two White House officials said.
http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/17/middleeast/iran-jason-rezaian-prisoners-freed/
There was still one prisoner not on this plane, but:
White House officials said earlier Sunday that recently detained student Matthew Trevithick was released -- but not as part of the prisoner swap -- and had left Iran.
So when did Hillary make her statement about more sanctions?
Jan 16 Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton on Saturday praised the release of Americans held by Iran, but urged new sanctions on Tehran over its ballistic missile testing program.
"I am greatly relieved by the safe return of American prisoners from Iran," the former U.S. secretary of state said in a statement following announcements of a historic and multi-faceted deal between Iran and the United States.
She said if she were elected president in November, her approach to Iran would be "to distrust and verify."
Clinton added: "Iran is still violating UN Security Council resolutions with its ballistic missile program, which should be met with new sanctions designations and firm resolve."
http://www.reuters.com/article/iran-nuclear-clinton-idUSL2N1500QQ
Hillary jumped the shark on this and could have put the prisoners at risk, as they had not yet been flown out of Iran, if I'm reading this correctly.
Squinch
(50,773 posts)You know, those Bernie kids, they're SO popular!
Feeling the Bern
(3,839 posts)BlueCaliDem
(15,438 posts)SwampG8r
(10,287 posts)Proceed to defend ber stance against single payer and her warmongering.
jfern
(5,204 posts)He ended some sanctions, and she immediately called for new sanctions. She stood with her fellow NY Senator, Chuck Schumer, in being a saber rattling warmonger.
OKNancy
(41,832 posts)that are not Bernielicious.
Squinch
(50,773 posts)Rose Siding
(32,623 posts)DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)Squinch
(50,773 posts)Not really the question of someone who has any interest in conversation.
Feeling the Bern
(3,839 posts)I'll keep waiting because I know there is no defense for it.
Remember, your candidate voted for the Iraq War.
oasis
(49,150 posts)Her policies are more aligned with mainstream Americans. That's where the votes are.
Feeling the Bern
(3,839 posts)can support center-right candidates.
How can people support someone who is against universal single payer and showed her warmongering by voting for the Iraq War and demanding more sanctions that only hurt the people of a country and not the government?
oasis
(49,150 posts)our nominee back in 2004. And btw, "warmongering" John Kerry was our choice back then.
beltanefauve
(1,784 posts)Squinch
(50,773 posts)Nonhlanhla
(2,074 posts)I know I have, as have others. I don't feel like repeating myself today, since I have to go finish a project now, but I at least want to mention that we have explained her war vote as well as her concerns with Bernie's health care ideas. So your suggestion that you're "still waiting" for Hillary supporters to address those issues suggests that you've not been paying attention.
The problem is that (some) Bernie supporters are so stuck in the rhetoric of "she's a bloodthristy warmonger/neocon" and "she is a lying lier who tells lies about St. Bernie's fabulous health care plan" that they can't hear what we have to say. Your foregone conclusion that "you know there is no defense for it" suggests that you're not really open to hear the message you say you've been waiting for.
joshcryer
(62,265 posts)I would have changed my mind.
But it was awfully quiet yesterday from Clinton supporters. It's all good though. Props to Clinton's team for a clever move.
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)the Clinton faction was swarming all over here demanding medical records, attacking Harry Truman's healthcare plan, doing their best to keep up with directives from HQ. I guess the bombiran twist was just a bit much.
joshcryer
(62,265 posts)...to hair brained defensive crap like over the data breach or BLM where I disagreed with every single supporter spouting illogical contortions and hate screeds.
notadmblnd
(23,720 posts)Did you happen to see the video posted where ladies sing "He's a man, he's a man, he's a mighty good man?" That was really clever and cute too.
Seriously though, I'm going to steal Bernielicious, I think it's adorable.
stonecutter357
(12,682 posts)Walk away
(9,494 posts)I think most Democrats are doing the same.
tazkcmo
(7,286 posts)Don't even know what DU is.
Walk away
(9,494 posts)tazkcmo
(7,286 posts)are the few here so yes.
mmonk
(52,589 posts)BainsBane
(53,001 posts)I've been busy phone banking to Iowa.
riversedge
(69,715 posts)I will be doing that when my state gets geared up--which is not till later. I enjoy the door to door canvasing also.
Have a nice day.
Skidmore
(37,364 posts)It is a busy time. I have been helping out with organizing in my precinct. Not much free time to pay attention to the foolishness here. A quick read is enough.
BainsBane
(53,001 posts)We can go back and forth here for eternity, and it amounts to naught. We've got caucuses and primaries to focus on.
99Forever
(14,524 posts)How about her new found hatred of Universal Health aka Medicare for All?
Inquiring minds want to know.
Feeling the Bern
(3,839 posts)They can't defend warmongering and the attacks on single payer.
BainsBane
(53,001 posts)and none of those have come up. Even the most disengaged voters have to know single payer isn't a possibility. Bernie himself declared it a non-starter in 2009, when we had a Democratic majority in both houses. Fortunately, I'm not faced with having to defend a politician who makes promises he knows full well he can't keep.
Hillary's statements on foreign policy stack up well against Bernie's any day. The key difference is not in "warmongering," as you call it, because Bernie also supports coalition-based military action against ISIS. The difference is in knowledge. Clinton knows, for example, the difference between Jordan and Turkey and Sunni and Shia. She doesn't make laughable statements having to do with Iran and Saudi Arabia joining together to fight ISIS. A friend of mine told a Middle Eastern guy she knows that Bernie proposed that, and the guy broke out laughing. That degree of lack of familiarity with the history and politics of the region is disconcerting--particularly from someone who has served in federal office for some 25 years!
Squinch
(50,773 posts)still_one
(91,946 posts)Feeling the Bern
(3,839 posts)Instead of making snarky, meaningless attacks on my thread.
Defend her positions please. Tell me how she is a Democrat while spouting neo-con POVs.
BainsBane
(53,001 posts)And if Clinton is a warmonger, so is Bernie. He supports the same coalition-based military action against ISIS that Clinton does.
Feeling the Bern
(3,839 posts)Hillary's attacks on single payer.
Hillary comes out to demand more sanctions on Iran, undercutting Obama completely.
EPIC FAIL!!! For her, and you!
99Forever
(14,524 posts)... is yelling "lalalalalalalalalalala I CAN'T HEAR YOU !!!"
Another Camp Weathervane Epic Fail.
one_voice
(20,043 posts)I watched Obama this morning when he had his press conference and it would appear they agree..
Obama:
http://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2016-01-17/obama-claims-credit-for-smart-diplomacy
Hilllary:
Iran is still violating UN Security Council resolutions with its ballistic missile program, which should be met with new sanctions designations and firm resolve, she said.
http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/266173-clinton-calls-for-new-sanctions-on-iran
I'm an O'Malley supporter that finds the nastiness displayed in this thread a reason to stay away from DU. *Accusing Hillary supporters of being drunk faced down in a gutter...really? Classy.
*a comment in this thread.
BainsBane
(53,001 posts)on certain organizations and individuals. That's one strike. Obviously Clinton knew that was in the works. She follows foreign policy closely, knows key actors and disputes. She doesn't just spout stuff off out of nowhere.
This isn't 2001. If you think Bernie isn't willing to use military force against ISIS, you haven't been paying attention at all. He has made it clear he does, only he has an absurd notion that he can get Saudi Arabia and Iran to put aside centuries of enmity to take on ISIS together. The notion is ludicrous and shows a frighteningly poor knowledge of the foreign policy and the history of the region. You'll have to excuse me if I want a president who knows the difference between Sunni and Shia, or Jordan and Turkey.
The link you provide is an attack on taxes on the middle class, which only worsens the already skewed income distribution. The article contains no quote of Clinton attacking single payer. All of that is the editorial comments of the writers, not at all supported by their own evidence in the article. Hillary was the one who tried to implement universal healthcare. She has done FAR more for healthcare than Bernie. Bernie talks a lot but didn't lift a finger to press the issue of single payer when the Democrats had the majority in 2009. In fact he declared it dead in the water then. I'm not stupid enough to believe he even thinks he can now magically implement it with a GOP House and Senate. It's campaign rhetoric. Nothing more. I put zero stock in empty promises from politicians, and the more grandiose their promises the less I believe them.
Then there is another point. I don't owe you or any stranger on the internet explanations for my vote. I am not Hillary Clinton. My views are not identical to hers. I don't post threads demanding Bernie supporters take responsibility for gun violence in America and immunity for the corporate gun lobby, though I've seen plenty defend all of that simply because Bernie takes the position. I don't reshape my political views to accommodate politicians. I make a decision to vote based on who I think is most qualified, and there is absolutely no question that Clinton is far more competent and qualified.
Bernie knows full well he wouldn't be able to get virtually any of what he promises enacted if, by some miracle, he became President. The sad thing few of you even care about that. There is nothing I can do about any of that. And frankly, I don't give half a shit who you vote for. I will cast my vote and do what I can to get the only competent person elected. Whatever the rest of you do is entirely up to you.
Lucinda
(31,170 posts)You make entirely too much sense!
Cary
(11,746 posts)Last edited Sun Jan 17, 2016, 10:37 AM - Edit history (1)
One day she called me up to her desk and I refused to go. She gave me a note to summon my mother to class. My mother came to school and the teacher told her that I wasn't getting breakfast and had no energy to come up to her desk when called
My mother assessed the information and told tbe teacher no, it wasn't a matter of energy. He refuses to come up to your desk because you're nasty and he doesn't want to talk to you.
DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)jeff47
(26,549 posts)(While also being unaware of their candidate's two blood clots, family history of stroke, and unexplained fainting spells.)
Alfresco
(1,698 posts)mcar
(42,209 posts)Who posted smears of HRC about this issue will quickly delete their posts and apologize. Then we can get back to a discussion of real issues.
comradebillyboy
(10,119 posts)Obama on Iran policy. Not really surprising since she was his Secretary of State.
hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)Feeling the Bern
(3,839 posts)Sanctions do nothing but hurt the people of the country.
Sanctions haven't stopped North Korea or most other "regimes" we don't like.
So, why should I vote for a "Democrat" who voted for the Iraq War that created ISIS, attacks single payer and supports the same ideas Republican neo-cons support?
Why not just vote for a Republican?
hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)She was right and so was the president.
You should actually read the link and you will see they are not designed to hurt the nation.
You were wrong and Hillary was right.
Vinca
(50,168 posts)he had a "Carly Fiorina" moment when Hillary started talking on one of the Sunday shows today. What that means is that he can't even stand to listen to her anymore and turns down the sound until she's off the screen. I was doing some baking (jalapeno cheddar rolls anyone?) in the kitchen and was listening in there and kind of had the same response only with doughy hands I was stuck listening. I had expected I might begin to like Hillary a little more as things went along, but the reverse is happening. I think Chelsea's less-than-truthful performance was the tipping point.
Walk away
(9,494 posts)The sight of him on TV make everyone in my house groan and reach for the remote.
Squinch
(50,773 posts)loons with a middle school mentality, though.
Walk away
(9,494 posts)But now I find him vomitous.
Squinch
(50,773 posts)think there is value to that.
I just don't see anything practical from him in terms of plans that make any sense.
We can't afford an "ideas" guy in the White House. We need someone who can do the nitty gritty and inch the ball as far as it is able to go, rather than the cheerleader who is loud but doesn't move the ball at all.
Also, and I am sure the vultures will swoop on this one, I'd love to see a competent woman in the White House, and I think Hillary is that.
Walk away
(9,494 posts)wants to sue the DNC in the middle of an election season any credence at all, is bizarre and counter productive.
FarPoint
(12,207 posts)There are many other Democratic Discussion Boards to utilize where the focus is about real Democratic Candidates.
Gothmog
(143,999 posts)Sec. Clinton was correct to mention these sanctions
I do not want Iran to develop a ballistic missile program
Beacool
(30,244 posts)As the U.S. just imposed the sanctions that Hillary was referring to:
Iran: US imposes new sanctions over missile test
The US has imposed fresh sanctions on Iranian companies and individuals over a recent ballistic missile test.
The new sanctions prevent 11 entities and individuals linked to the missile programme from using the US banking system.
The move came after international nuclear sanctions on Iran were lifted as part of a deal hailed by President Barack Obama on Sunday as "smart".
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-35338901
Of course no one will have the grace to rescind their previous comments. Class is not in abundance on this board.....
elias49
(4,259 posts)That troubles me more than voices on an internet forum.