Watching MTP. It looks like we're not alone.

[hedda_foil]

Chuckie refers to Iowa poll that asked Iowa Democrats if they considered themselves socialists or capitalists and 43 percent said socialist and just 38% said capitalist. That's a .massive sea change that's never been seen in my lifetime, and I remember Harry Truman.

Iowans are as middle-American as middle-Americans can be. And they're claiming the socialist mantle. My jaw is lying on the floor. Could someone help me pick it up?

[Live and Learn]

1. Wow. That is amazing. K&R nt

[roguevalley]

8. my grandpa owner of FAIR DEAL DAIRY would be happy. He was an avowed socialist and proud of it

so am I. I have always been a socialist.

[daleanime]

2. Oh, hell yes....

It's a nice feeling, isn't comrade.

[passiveporcupine]

45. Comrade

[Motown_Johnny]

3. That is 43% that won't vote for Hillary. He just needs 8% more.

I think that is very doable.

Needing 13% above that 38% is going to be much harder. There is only 19% to play with if we assume all the Socialists vote for Bernie and all the Capitalists vote for Hillary (which is a pretty big assumption). Getting 13 out of 19 seems very unlikely to me.



Edit due to Freudian slip (hard to do while typing, but I did it).

[m-lekktor]

5. Oh I don't know I have seen a few Hillary supporters at DU claim to be socialists!

[cannabis_flower]

17. Yeah, and I'm guessing..

there are a few who claim to be capitalists who will vote for Bernie.

[Eric J in MN]

16. Actually, a third of Iowa Democrats who call themselves 'socialists' are for Hillary Clinton.

"...a remarkable 43 percent of likely Democratic caucus participants describe themselves as socialists, including 58 percent of Sanders’s supporters and about a third of Clinton’s."


https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/can-clinton-find-the-spark-to-fend-off-the-challenge-from-sanders/2016/01/16/a6b4d98a-bc6f-11e5-829c-26ffb874a18d_story.html

[MADem]

19. Oops! nt

[Punkingal]

4. In the words of Mr. Dylan...

[Motown_Johnny]

6. and in regards to how we finance our elections....

[mimi85]

29. Great album...

it definitely was underrated.

[Green Forest]

7. IMO, Iowa Democrats are among the most highly informed of all Democratic primary voters.

They wear the mantle of first-in-the-nation with integrity. I am not surprised.

People underestimate Iowans but they were ahead of the curve in 2008 before any other state.

[rurallib]

20. thank you for the compliment as an Iowa Democrat

and welcome to DU.

[Green Forest]

28. Thanks for the welcome!

I volunteered for Obama in Des Moines from 2007-2008 and in doing so, I gained a healthy respect for the caucus process -- it's the closest thing to the Athenian concept of pure democracy we have in the U.S. when done correctly -- and "Iowa Nice" Iowans.

I'd ask you more but do not want to put you on the spot. Thanks again for the welcome!

[rurallib]

49. sent you a private message so we can talk

referred to as a 'PM' around here (PMed you)

click on the yellow banner when it comes up or click on 'my inbox' in the upper right corner.
will be busy for a few hours but will check back before end of day

[Green Forest]

52. Aw, thank you!

I was hoping we could "talk" but wanted to respect your privacy. I will PM you back later, too.

[jwirr]

33. Iowan's take pride in being the first and they do the research

and work to do a good job. I trust them to know that Bernie is a good choice.

[Green Forest]

40. They sure do. They also hate negative campaigning and have a finely tuned bullshit meter.

Ergo, the result in 2008.

[MBS]

63. " " " " n/t

[MBS]

68. I trust Iowa caucus-goers, too

They deserve to be proud of their role. I have huge respect for them, and look forward to seeing what happens in this caucus in particular.

[MBS]

42. I agree.

I did telephone-campaigning for Kerry in 2003/2004, and found Iowa voters by far the most knowledgeable and most serious voters I encountered in the entire campaign.
They really took their caucus responsibilities seriously.
I found myself thinking, "If all voters were like this, our country would be in better shape than it is."

[Green Forest]

54. How true and how I wish that were so.

Are you doing anything now for any candidate? I was crushed by what happened to Kerry in 2004 but have been very proud of him since, especially now as he is the absolute best Secretary of State in my lifetime. Honestly, he deserves a Nobel Peace Prize.

[MBS]

61. agree!!!

I was all in for Kerry and Obama, but I am not committed to anyone yet (except to voting for the Dem candidate in November). Also, unfortunately, I am forced by circumstances to focus on keeping my home fires burning right now.

But my Iowa phone-banking for Kerry was truly a wonderful experience. People were so open and earnest and knowledgeable. I know I swayed at least one undecided voter, too. She had been featured on NBC News as an undecided voter; from what had been revealed about her background, I knew just how to reach her. (Key themes of my pitch revolved around 4-H and Pella Windows ). So, after blissfully ignoring the phone-bank supervisor's rules about which phone lists to call that day, I hunted her down (at her office! on a Saturday!), and then, when she told me that she and NBC News were going to be at a tea with Teresa Heinz Kerry, I passed the info onto the Powers that Be. Then, on caucus night, she announced her choice for Kerry on NBC News!! When asked what swayed her, she said, " A phone call from Sen. Kerry". (Good! He/they did exactly what needed to be done!).But I think I get to take credit for starting the ball rolling in the first place. A proud moment - too bad I can't list it on my resume!

I worked in New Hampshire, too, but Iowa was the best.

[Fast Walker 52]

9. I would say the younger generation is even higher pro-socialism

[eShirl]

10. swing wide, sweet pendulum

[restorefreedom]

11. the revolution bus is coming

time to board or get out of the way.

i was amazed at the somewhat evenhandedness of chuck toaster pastries. he is almost starting to act like a real analyst and not a campaign hack.

[hedda_foil]

18. Agree. His interviews with HRC and Bernie were far more even-handed than the other three shows.

I was looking forward to Dickerson on FTN but his interview with Bernie was all attempted gotcha questions with a bizarre camera angle on the 2-shot that made Bernie look lilllputian.

[restorefreedom]

30. i didn't care for the ftn one either.

and i was hopeful initially. mtp did the best job.

wait.....what's happening to me???

[Bohunk68]

34. I hate to admit it, but I had on Chuckie Toad as well.

He was fairly evenhanded and that shocked me. Hillary, otoh was using dog whistles galore against Bernie, just like the rethugs he interviewed. Rubio was off the fricking wall. That guy is crazy.

[restorefreedom]

36. rubio is a spoiled brat lunatic. and yes, chuckie is surprising

many of us. he might turn out to be a voice of reason. wouldn't that be hilarious?

[Utopian Leftist]

41. Hot under the collar, "Little Man Syndrome" . . .

with an axe to grind.

I have a feeling about Rubio: what he wants, what he really, really wants? His finger on the button.

[restorefreedom]

50. Jesus that is a scary thought.

i wish i could disagree

but i can't

[MBS]

66. Rubio is a lunatic, all right.

A narcissistic, shamelessly careerist, unprincipled, completely irresponsible (especially about the responsibilities of his elected offices), lying, spoiled brat lunatic. I continue to marvel how he can reel out a superficially-fluent flow of words, without actually saying anything.
And, yes, Chuck Todd was good yesterday to my surprise as well. Hopefully, he'll keep it up.

[restorefreedom]

69. too bad the boy wonder is the establishment fave

but it won't do them any good this cycle...even the repubs are bucking the establishment. keeping fingers crossed that todd turns into a real pundit with fairness and evenhandedness..

[ish of the hammer]

12. Socialism for the BANKS! capitalism for YOU!

If true, Iowa Democrats are starting to get it.

[libdem4life]

51. Another version: We privatize the profits and socialize the losses.

[Ikonoklast]

65. Shut up with that Commie talk and pay your share, Citizen!

I need a new Lamborghini.

[libdem4life]

70. LOL...I'll settle for a Unicorn.

[99th_Monkey]

13. That reinforces my view, that Bernie is dispelling that antiquated paranoia "Eek he's a Socialist!!"

By simply saying so what? and reminding people of what socialism really is, and how
socialism works for ALL of us through SS, Medicare, etc.

[passiveporcupine]

46. He's doing what dems have been needing to do for a long time

changing the narrative. Challenging the excuses. Repeating the information often so it sticks.

[99th_Monkey]

48. Yup. And it IS sticking, as Bernie's overall trends keep rising, as people hear & study him. nt

[karynnj]

14. Fascinating

I think what happened here is that the question creates a "choice" leading most to choose one or the other.

The second thing is that it shows the combination of how the word "capitalism" has increased negatives, while socialism is - at least seen as more benign than capitalism.

Back in 2010, a British English teacher was telling us that she showed her students both the Obama hope poster and a 2010 Republican version that made Obama blacker and replaced "hope" with "socialism". The idea was to show the power of graphics and propaganda. It didn't quite work -- until she explained that in the US "socialism" was considered a bad thing!

It is interesting that this either shows that capitalist has become MORE toxic or socialism ( ie SS, Medicare etc) is becoming less demonized.

[TBF]

15. Prior to 1980 those midwestern states were heavy labor -

it seems to go in waves. We had heavy socialist voting back in the very early 1900s. The unions get strong and put up socialist candidates (or at least very liberal), they make progress w/hours etc., capital pushes back with ad campaigns & weakens the unions, conditions start deteriorating, workers start organizing again, rinse and repeat. It seems to go in cycles. The past 30+ years have been full of corporations/churches taking over in every possible way. People are starting to realize they are not the winners in that situation.

[JimDandy]

22. +1000. We, the people, are not the winners when corpoations and churches

take over in every possible way.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

21. Keep in mind that the people who hate socialism are anti-social.

[Enthusiast]

23. And that is Iowa!

[Duval]

24. Have to pick up mine first, hedda-foil!

[hedda_foil]

39. I'll pick up yours and you pick up mine and we'll trade!

[Katashi_itto]

25. K&R

[scottie55]

26. Modern Capitalism - Where The Powerful Get To Kill Anyone

Who gets in the way of their profits.

Chevron / Texaco Kills Thousands
http://www.amazonrainforestnews.com/2009/09/ecuador-vs-chevron-saga-of-death.html

Millions Starve From Goldman Sachs Crisis
http://foreignpolicy.com/2011/04/27/how-goldman-sachs-created-the-food-crisis/

The list goes on, and on, and on.

Murder for profit.

Anyone see why some might consider Capitalism anything less than perfect?

By they way, after killing thousands, or millions, no one went to prison.

That's how the world turns right?

Bernie, and Us can stop this madness. Once and for all. Before it is too late.

[questionseverything]

27. from your second link

The result of Wall Street’s venture into grain and feed and livestock has been a shock to the global food production and delivery system. Not only does the world’s food supply have to contend with constricted supply and increased demand for real grain, but investment bankers have engineered an artificial upward pull on the price of grain futures. The result: Imaginary wheat dominates the price of real wheat, as speculators (traditionally one-fifth of the market) now outnumber bona-fide hedgers four-to-one.

Today, bankers and traders sit at the top of the food chain — the carnivores of the system, devouring everyone and everything below. Near the bottom toils the farmer. For him, the rising price of grain should have been a windfall, but speculation has also created spikes in everything the farmer must buy to grow his grain — from seed to fertilizer to diesel fuel. At the very bottom lies the consumer. The average American, who spends roughly 8 to 12 percent of her weekly paycheck on food, did not immediately feel the crunch of rising costs. But for the roughly 2-billion people across the world who spend more than 50 percent of their income on food, the effects have been staggering: 250 million people joined the ranks of the hungry in 2008,

//////////////////////////////////////////

this article explains why wall street is so dangerous to us all

[PatrickforO]

32. The problem is that we now serve Wall Street.

But if we realize as a people that we can turn that around so that banking and Wall Street serve the common need instead of enriching just a few, then we could make this country and this world a pleasure for everyone to live in.

Yank the Fed's charter, repeal the Federal Reserve Act of 1913 and nationalize the central banking system. Ellen Brown has it right in 'Web of Debt.'

[questionseverything]

35. imagine if "fractured interest" benefited WE THE PEOPLE

instead of enslaving us

people point to reagan as the turning point but it was actually 1913

[PatrickforO]

31. If a thinking person is given a choice between socialism and

capitalism, there can only be one decision.

That is why I'm supporting Bernie Sanders.

[A Simple Game]

38. Unregulated capitalism has to fail. Only so much money goes to the top before it all falls down. n/t

[KingCharlemagne]

37. Well, the word may hav lost much of its sting in the 25 years since the collapse of the USSR. But

I'm sorry to inform you that Sanders, bless his soul, is as capitalist as the day is long.

I like him a lot but let's be honest: Most Americans don't have the slightest idea what socialism is or what it means.

[passiveporcupine]

47. Capitalism is necessary for a wealthy country,

but it needs to be neutered with socialism. Together they work. Alone they each have problems.

[The Wizard]

59. Any system left unfettered

becomes totalitarian and in the end destroys itself.

[Odin2005]

67. We Millennials roll our eyes when Boomers start ranting Cold War anti-socialist BS.

[WillyT]

43. K & R !!!

[sabrina 1]

44. Chuckie should do some research before he asks these questions. Eg, 7 in 10 young people in this

country WANT a Democratic Socialist Govt. And nearly half of all Americns would vote for Dem Soc candidate.

The old cold warriors don't understand that their propaganda doesn't work in today's world where people can educate themselves on what the world Socialist means.

[totodeinhere]

58. I am skeptical. Most young people I know don't even know what democratic socialist is.

They are more concerned with making sure their cell phone gets charged. In fact a lot of them don't even know who Jimmy Carter or Richard Nixon are.

[FarPoint]

53. What this tells me.....

The republicans really want to run against Sanders.

[dreamnightwind]

55. They better be careful that they wish for

A candidate like Bernie is uniquely qualified to expose the illegitimacy of the Republican Party. They in no way represent the will of the people, instead using wedge politics to win elections for their rich donors' interests. Since Hillary and other establishment Democrats are slightly better versions of the same process, the GOP lie is not exposed by most in our party, but Bernie can and will show how wrong they are.

[stevenleser]

56. That's not a change. 59% of Democrats had a positive view of Socialism in the last Gallup poll.

But 50% of Americans overall have a negative opinion of Socialism.

[ChiciB1]

57. OKAY, Guess You're The Winner... No Change!!

Psst, I think it's gathering a LOT OF MOSS! And the numbers will grow larger for Socialism. We've only just begun to "talk about" Socialism in the las 7 to 8 months.

IT'S EARLY!

[Spitfire of ATJ]

60. Capitalism has come to mean the same as Oligarchy.

[greymattermom]

62. People hear the word "social" a lot

and now it just means society, like social medial, social security, social club. It used to be connected with Communism, but no one talks about that anymore. Those polls should ask folks what they think Socialism and Capitolism mean, and it's probably people vs banks and Wall Street.

[Odin2005]

64. As a socialist this makes me happy.

[ViseGrip]

71. They know the sea change watching social media. Polling better there, just look at those stocks!