I am sick to death of the idea that Democratic women must support Clinton

[fleur-de-lisa]

I am a 50-ish woman living in the South. My only child is female. I have 2 sisters and 1 brother. My entire family, including my elderly mother and my somewhat republican sister, as well as all my nieces and nephews (including 1 gay nephew), all support Bernie.

Most of my family are middle-class, working Americans. No one in my family supports Hillary.

She does not represent my interests, as a woman. As a matter of fact, her high standing with Wall Street and Corporate America works against me and my whole family. Most of us are college-educated, but don't believe that Hillary is working for us.

I own my home, have a 401k account, and have done everything that Corporate America says I should have done to secure my future, while the Wall Street fucks continue to steal from my retirement account.

I am somewhat comfortable TODAY, but have no confidence that this level of comfort will continue under a Hillary presidency. She is not working for me or my family. I want a better future for my daughter and my nieces and nephews.

Hillary supporters, don't presume that you speak for me! You don't!

[Cali_Democrat]

1. Support the candidate you want.

Nobody is holding a gun to your head.

[fleur-de-lisa]

15. You seem to be bothered that a woman is publicly

supporting Bernie over Hillary. Why?

[Cali_Democrat]

18. I seem bothered because I told you to support the candidate you want? nt

[fleur-de-lisa]

26. 'Holding a gun to my head'?

How is that in any way, shape or form appropriate?

[hrmjustin]

29. It is a figure of speech. Stop looking for a fight.

[fleur-de-lisa]

39. Not looking for a fight.

Looking for honest dialogue.

[hrmjustin]

42. That is fine but nobody is telling you that you have to vote for her.

[fleur-de-lisa]

49. Obviously you use the Internet.

How do you not understand the pressure put on women? Not a woman, then you wouldn't get it.

[hrmjustin]

56. Try being a Hillary supporter here.

[fleur-de-lisa]

59. Okay, but she doesn't support me

why should I support her?

[hrmjustin]

64. I'm not here to change your mind.

And there are more eloquent posters than I.

[fleur-de-lisa]

65. Agreed.

[Squinch]

76. Justin, you are one of the most eloquent.

It's good to see you back around here.

[hrmjustin]

81. Thank you.

[Squinch]

82. Back at you!

It's chilly in here! We have to hold onto each other!

I know that we are in the same general area. Are you watching our first snow out there?

[hrmjustin]

101. I am. Glad it did not stick.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

130. FIXED

Justin, you are one of the most eloquent and sincere...
It's good to see you back around here.

[Squinch]

132. Yes! But post it to him. I agree with you. And kindest.

[CorporatistNation]

186. Excellent! People Who Think For Themselves... Leaders Not Followers!

!

[7962]

205. HAve to agree with you there. People need to lighten up.

That phrase has been around for who knows HOW long

[Squinch]

34. You know that if you reach too far it's just silly, right?

[fleur-de-lisa]

41. What is silly about my request?

[Squinch]

48. You are trying to create a fight where there is no fight. That is silly. No one here is telling

you that you have to vote for Hillary because you are a woman, and yet you are sick to death of all the people here who are doing that. Of whom there are none. Silly.

[fleur-de-lisa]

52. Why do you take offense

regarding my statement that I feel pressured from people on the Internet that imply that I owe allegiance to Hillary?

[Squinch]

54. Why do you assume I am taking offense when I am simply pointing out a fact?

[fleur-de-lisa]

63. "You reach too far it's just silly".

Why is my opinion silly? This is a public discussion board.

[Squinch]

67. See posts 1,2,4,29,42,48. Why do you keep asking the same question when so many have answered it

for you?

[fleur-de-lisa]

70. I stated an opinion. Why is it silly?

[Squinch]

74. Why do you feel like you have to keep asking the same question when it has been answered?

[fleur-de-lisa]

75. The question hasn't been answered.

[Squinch]

77. See post 67. Why do you feel like people are not answering you, even though they are?

[fleur-de-lisa]

83. Calling my opinion silly

Is not really an aduquate answer now, is it?

[Squinch]

86. You didn't give your opinion. You said that people were telling you you have to vote for Hillary.

Cali Democrat said you should vote for whoever you want, and no one was holding a gun to your head.

You took great offence to her use of that common figure of speech, and seemed to be trying to start a fight that didn't exist. THAT was silly.

No one said your opinion that people are saying you have to vote for Hillary is silly. I am saying, though, that no one is telling you that you have to vote for Hillary.

So why are you thinking that people are telling you something that they aren't telling you?

[fleur-de-lisa]

90. I took 'great offense'?

You are reaching. I stated an opinion and you and others of your ilk seem to believe I am not entitled to that opinion. When I ask for clarification, I am told, throughout this thread, that my opinion is silly. Even though, when requested down thread, I stated my reasons for my thoughts. It seems that some here don't think I am entitled to my opinion, even though I have clearly stated my reasoning.

[Squinch]

96. There you go again: who has told you that you are not entitled to your opinion?

Show me where anyone said that.

And again, why are you bemoaning a situation that doesn't exist, namely people telling you you have to vote for Hillary because you are a woman?

I am perfectly willing to be proved wrong on that. If the posts telling you that you have to vote for Hillary because you are a woman are numerous enough to make you sick to death, surely you can produce one or two so we can see what you are talking about.

So prove me wrong. Let's get on the same page here. Produce a post or two that tells you that you have to vote for Hillary and that are so numerous as to make you sick to death.

[fleur-de-lisa]

99. I will not do your research.

Read down thread.

[Squinch]

104. I don't see anyone telling you that you aren't entitled to your opinion. Why do you feel

that they are saying that when no one is?

[fleur-de-lisa]

105. I can do this all day.

NO! Look for yourself.

[Squinch]

109. I did look. There are none. Why do you suppose you think there are?

[fleur-de-lisa]

113. NO !

[Squinch]

115. No, there aren't any posts telling you that you can't state your opinion? Because I agree with that.

[fleur-de-lisa]

120. Thanks for the repeated kicks!

Lots of excellent replies from Bernie supporters!

Please respond again!

[Squinch]

121. You're very welcomed! It's good to get it out there that no one is saying that women have to vote

for Hillary!

Because some people seem to think that people are saying that.

I wonder why they think that, but so far no one has come up with any answers.

[fleur-de-lisa]

122. #122 (I think).

Thanks again!

[Squinch]

123. Again, you're welcomed! Any luck finding those posts? Because being sick to death of them and

all, there ought to be a lot of them. If you came up with posts from anyone who was trying to force you to vote for someone you didn't want to vote for, I would support you in telling them it was wrong to do that.

[fleur-de-lisa]

131. And 91 recs!

Thank you!

[Squinch]

133. Good for you! And those posts? Because they ought to be really easy to find.

[fleur-de-lisa]

135. Now 92 recs!

Kickety kickety kick kick kick! Thanks!

[Squinch]

137. Wow, you're so POPULAR! I guess that's what is important to you. But I still don't see those posts!

[fleur-de-lisa]

141. Hey Squinch,

I have to go feed my feline friends. I adopted a blind feral kitten, as well as her sister and mother. It takes a while to feed them, along with my old man cat. Be back soon! Love ya, Fleur.

[Squinch]

142. OK. See if you can find those posts while you are at it!

[fleur-de-lisa]

150. My dear Squinchy . . .

(may I call you Squinchy? I feel we have bonded over the last few hours.)

I will not now or EVER do your homework for you, as much as I love you! Reading comprehension is your friend! Give it a try!

[darkangel218]

155. +1

[Squinch]

156. Well. I would think it would be easy, given that there are so many of them. But I haven't seen

them, and you won't produce them, so you haven't given anyone any reason to believe that they exist.

Still not sure why you said they do. Why do you say that?

[fleur-de-lisa]

157. Squinchy, Squinchy, Squinchy . . .

I have answered everything you asked, or told you where to find the info. And still you persist. Please have a drink or two before the debate. I think you need it!

And bless your little heart!

[Squinch]

158. And there you go again! Where did you tell me where I would find people telling you that

you have to vote for Hillary?

And though you told me that people in this thread were saying that you shouldn't voice your opinion, that simply isn't true. No one in this thread said anything of the sort.

You have provided nothing to back up any of your statements of how others are mistreating you!

I ask and ask, but there is nothing.

[fleur-de-lisa]

159. 112 recs and counting ! ! !

[Squinch]

160. Wow! That REALLY matters! You must be so proud. Does it take away the sting of the

imaginary people who are stifling your voice and your choices?

[fleur-de-lisa]

161. And 160 replies!

Thanks again for the kicks!

[Squinch]

162. Again, you're welcome! Glad I could help. Because it seems important to you!

[fleur-de-lisa]

163. Oh, Squinchy, I think I love you!

[Squinch]

164. Well, but you say a lot of things that you don't back up, so I won't depend on that.

[fleur-de-lisa]

165. Now I know I love you!

Please don't stop!!!

[Squinch]

166. Oh, I wish I could continue! But I have things to do, and it has become dull talking to

someone who doesn't back up ANY of her statements.

I truly pray that you get a handle on all your imaginary enemies who don't let you voice your opinions and all those posts that don't exist where people order you to vote for Hillary. And there are so many posts in this thread, and lots of recs. I'm sure that means a lot to you.

But I'll leave you with this thought before I go: even if you are tormented by voices in your head that are ordering you to vote for Hillary, you can say no. It's really not a big deal.

Good night!

[fleur-de-lisa]

167. Kisses and kisses and kisses!

Are you single, by any chance? You make my heart flutter!

[fleur-de-lisa]

168. Don't go ! ! !

[fleur-de-lisa]

169. Please come back ! Missing you and your insights !

[Dr Hobbitstein]

197. AKA

I'm going to make a frivolous claim, and NOT back it up with any sources. The onus is on the person making the claim, not the one asking for proof.

[kristopher]

210. The exchange itself is proof

Squinch is engaged in harassment for one reason and one reason only - fleur-de-lisa's rejection of the pressure on her as a woman to support Hillary. That is 'lisa's perception and doesn't require "proof". The unrelenting demands by squinch are nothing other than a form of harassment brought to bear for lisa's crime in publicly stating her rebellion.

[underthematrix]

111. LAWD! Yes. I thought grownups knew they

could make their own choices.

[Sheepshank]

2. I'm sick to death of people pretending that a woman is being pressured to vote an any direction

Get a spine, and quit whining about people making posts on an anon bb, trying to voice their personal opinion.

[JonLeibowitz]

6. HRC seems to view them as a key part of her base

Yet they were not prepared for Mr. Sanders to become so popular with young people and independents, especially women, whom Mrs. Clinton views as a key part of her base. --NYT

Why else does she think women should vote for her over Sanders?

[murielm99]

19. Women are a key part of her base,

in spite of the whining and nay-saying in this thread.

[fleur-de-lisa]

30. "Whining"?

Why is it that when a woman states the reasons for which she is not supportive of Hillary, it is considered to be whining?

[emulatorloo]

31. FWIW Men get accused of whining on DU too. Just sayin'

Great to hear you are voting for Bernie

[kath]

206. Some of the most annoying whiners on DU are men.

They get sent on many forced vacations from DU, but keep coming back.

[Squinch]

53. You didn't state the reasons you don't support Hillary. You said you were sick to death of people

saying that you have to vote for her because she is a woman, though no one is saying that.

You are bemoaning a situation that doesn't exist. Is that a better way to put it?

[fleur-de-lisa]

69. No, that is not a better way to put it.

Try again.

I don't want more war over silly conflicts. Hillary is a war hawk.

I want much more oversight on the banking industry and Wall Street. Hillary doesn't.

I want income equality. Hillary merely parrots Bernie's positions regarding this.

I want my country to give a shit about poor people and homeless people. Hillary doesn't.

I want reforms to highet education, particularly free tuition. Hillary doesn't.

[Squinch]

73. But your OP is about you being sick of people telling you that you have to vote for Hillary, though

no one here is doing that.

And then when people pointed out the fact that no one here is doing that, you told them that they were trying to stop you as a woman from talking about why you don't want to vote for Hillary. Even though they were doing nothing of the sort.

Why do you feel the need to bemoan a situation that doesn't exist?

[fleur-de-lisa]

78. So because you say it doesn't exist

It doesn't? Okay then.

[Squinch]

80. I did ask below that you show two posts where you were told that you have to vote for Hillary

because she is a woman. So far I don't see any.

And I was not committed to Hillary till very recently, and I never saw any such posts, and as a woman I would have.

So why do you feel that they exist when they really don't?

[fleur-de-lisa]

84. Do your own search.

[Squinch]

87. I don't need to do a search. I know they don't exist. If you want to prove me wrong, you need to

come up with the proof.

So again, why are you bemoaning the existence of something that doesn't exist?

[fleur-de-lisa]

92. Your reasoning is flawed.

[Squinch]

97. Then by all means prove me wrong by producing the posts.

[murielm99]

58. It is only considered to be whining

when it IS whining.

[fleur-de-lisa]

103. 'Whining'? You really used that word?

Ugh!

[fleur-de-lisa]

7. Are you implying that, since I am a woman

I am "whining"? I merely stated my opinion. How is that "whining"?

[Sheepshank]

179. I think you are whining to attempt to substantiate made up shit

are you telling me that only women whine? I find that very sexist.

[fleur-de-lisa]

180. Please elaborate on the 'made up shit'.

[Sheepshank]

183. Your op is a complete fabrication. It's a mere wish or hope to aid the Bernie cause

It's a big fat whopping pile of crap.

[BeanMusical]

189. Please read posts 17, 60 and 61.

[sabrina 1]

8. The woman has a spine. I noticed it. Very presumptuous of you to think you needed to

lecture her.

[Sheepshank]

177. ...while you attempt to lecture me...pretty rich. nt

[chervilant]

114. Oh, puh-leeeze!

Quite a number of people on this very forum have made snide comments to and about female DUers who are supporting Senator Sanders instead of HRC. Those of us who ARE supporting Bernie already have a spine, and it's well within our rights to comment on the crass attacks we've witnessed/experienced.

Much as I'd like to see a woman as POTUS, I do NOT want to see HRC as POTUS--and, not only because of her ties to Wall Street. However, if--by some stretch of the imagination--HRC becomes our nominee, I will hold my nose and vote for her. Then, I'll hope like hell that she does more for the 99% than her buddies on Wall Street.

[Sheepshank]

184. No one has made snide comments to a Bernie supporter because they are a woman..no one

[chervilant]

196. Yeah, right...

Typical usage of absolutes to refute someone else's experiences...

Welcome to my IL.

[leftofcool]

3. Vote for who ever you want!

Good grief!

[fleur-de-lisa]

10. I certainly will.

You seem to be upset that I am stating my opinion. Why?

[leftofcool]

71. Your poutrage is showing.

Nobody gives a shit who you vote for but you seem to think they do.

[fleur-de-lisa]

85. Excellent response

And very mature!

[Skittles]

190. this is a Democratic board

we ARE supposed to be interested in who people are voting for and why

[sufrommich]

4. No one has made such a claim. More

manufactured outrage.

[fleur-de-lisa]

16. How is my opinion 'manufactured outrage'?

[MrWendel]

140. Because...

your desperately looking to be offended. Manufactured outrage when you can't even come up with a viable source for your argument.

[fleur-de-lisa]

154. My OP was perfectly clear.

And there was nothing desperate about it. Why do you consider a post by a woman to be 'desperate'?

[Bleacher Creature]

139. So can we call it a "strawwoman"? nt

[BeanMusical]

188. Please read posts 17, 60, 61

[Skwmom]

5. Same here. I don't know what female voters they are polling (and I live in a swing state). n/t

[dorkzilla]

33. I don’t know a solitary woman who is voting for Hillary

They’re all voting for Bernie, including some independents that usually vote Republican.

Actually let me update that - I don’t know a solitary person voting for Hillary, irrespective of sex.

[cheapdate]

9. It's your vote. Use it anyway you want.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

11. Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection

Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost. John Quincy Adams

Voting for a woman because she is a woman is exactly like voting for a white man because he's a white man.

[Fawke Em]

12. And you can speak for me.

I'm a woman in her late 40s living in the south. I have a son and a daughter.

I agree with everything you said!

[JoePhilly]

13. Who told you that ?? .... let's go kick their ass!!!!

Oh wait, no one is saying that.

Never mind.

[fleur-de-lisa]

20. I have to assume you are a man since you use

'Joe Philly' as your moniker. This meme is all over FB and DU and has been for weeks. If you fail to recognize it, that may be due to the fact that you are a man. Not my problem.

[JoePhilly]

32. It's a dumb meme.

And I'm not saying THAT as a man.

[fleur-de-lisa]

44. Yes, I agree

that assuming women will vote for Hillary is a dumb meme. Thanks for your concurrence!

[JoePhilly]

46. The only thing dumber is believing that meme ...

.... and getting upset about it.

[fleur-de-lisa]

57. Who is upset?

I wrote that I am sick of people assuming that I owe allegiance to a candidate who doesn't represent me. My OP and all following responses have been logical and unemotional. Why do you use the term 'upset'?

[bvar22]

14. Hillary made life much worse for women...

...in the Middle East, especially Iraq and Libya where the radical faction we "helped" have instituted Sharia Law.
And, of course, the hundreds of thousands of innocent women and children that were violently murdered or maimed from our Freedom Bombs.

For some, even in the Democratic Party, Brown People don't count.

[Gman]

17. Well that's too bad

That your family chooses to work against women. It's almost like supporting the war on women

[Green Forest]

22. lol

How ridiculous.

[fleur-de-lisa]

23. Nope, Bernie has a stronger record voting for issues that matter to women.

Do your homework before you presume to lecture me.

[Gman]

60. So why do you hate women

And support Sanders?

[fleur-de-lisa]

88. How in the world did you come to the conclusion that I hate women?

I am a woman, my only child is female. I believe Sanders has a better record in supporting issues that are important to women. Why did you choose to misinterpret my OP?

[Dr. Strange]

178. I suppose the word is...

Why did you choose to misinterpret my OP?

Gmansplaining?

[peacebird]

28. Silliest response ever.....

Bernie is extremely strong on womens issues, and - guess what? As a woman myself I view the economy, climate change, and war/peace to all be issues that matter to women! Bernie is better on all issues that matter to me, and HE had the good judgement to see through and vote against the IWR. Unlike Hillary.

[cui bono]

173. How is that working against women? How is it "almost like supporting the war on women"?

Please explain. I can't for the life of me see how you got to that conclusion.

.

[Green Forest]

21. Amen, sister! Same here in NY. My state rep is for Bernie, too. He detests the Clintons.

Awesome smackdown!

[MissDeeds]

24. I know only one woman who supports HRC

My mother-in-law. The only reason she can give is that Hillary is a woman and she wants a woman to be president.

[dorkzilla]

37. So do I, but I’m waiting for Senator Warren or Zephyr Teachout!!!

Very happy to elect one of them the first woman president. Just because a woman wants to be president doesn’t mean she should be.

[draa]

51. Yeah, that's something that's bothered me for a while.

I've heard a few women on different forums like DU say that were voting for Clinton because she's a woman. Now I'm fine with their choice, and I support their right to make it, but if a men had said he was only voting for Sanders because he's a man? Well, we would be called sexists and chauvinists. Women would be calling us Republicans because that's the stuff they do. It's just strange that women get a pass on this when men likely wouldn't

[MissDeeds]

108. I agree completely

If gender is the litmus test, then Palin (if she were running) or Carly could be considered viable. It would be nice to have a woman, but she needs to be the absolute best possible candidate.

Frankly, I want the best damn 'person' for the position, regardless of gender. The stakes are too high.

[chervilant]

143. Same here--only one of my friends (female) supports HRC,

and she has stated unequivocally it's because HRC is a woman.

I have seen a number of posts castigating DUers who are supporting Senator Sanders, because -- apparently -- HRC is the "inevitable" one. I find that highly unlikely, given the surge in Sanders' supporters we're seeing.

[FarPoint]

25. As long as you support a real Democratic...

I'm fine with that choice.

[Agschmid]

27. Why do you allow the Wall St. fucks to continue to steal from you?

Are you required to put money into a 401k? Seems like an odd comment?

But you can vote for whomever you choose, that's for sure.

[fleur-de-lisa]

35. In a way, I am bound to put money into a 401k.

It's tax deductible and my employer matches my contributions, 100%, up to 4%.

If I put that money into a traditional bank savings account, I get almost nothing in interest.

But I am at the mercy of the unscrupulous tactics that Wall Street has devised to secretly charge fees to my 401k account. Never mind the volitility of the market due to the risky practices of Wall Street.

Perhaps I could stash my savings in my mattress?

[Agschmid]

40. Yup you could.

But you want reward on your investment, in other words as long as it worked in your favor you'd be fine with it. Except it's doesn't always work in your favor, you could also reallocate your 401k into bonds which are much more secure but again have a smaller upside.

Maybe you should reallocate?

[fleur-de-lisa]

47. I have reallocated.

The greedy assholes on Wall Street still hold all the cards. Either I don't participate or I am subject to the laws they implemented to favor themselves.

[Agschmid]

50. What allocation mix do you have?

ETA: I'm mosty stocks and will retire near 2050, I have had an 11.8% return on my investment plus my 4% employee match. It's certainly not a bad return so far...

Sure it's not a pension and I get that but I think people should really reallocate if they aren't seeing a return.

[JonLeibowitz]

45. If you change jobs that is an event which would allow rolling a 401(k) into a tIRA

And in the tIRA you could use a low-cost provider like Vanguard. Doesn't help with the volatility, but the cost-cutting provides enormous advantages in getting the best return.

Just something to keep in mind.

Of course, you may not want to leave your job.

[Squinch]

36. Show me two posts that say that Democratic women must support Clinton.

[Blanks]

38. Sick to death - of the idea...

Bummer.

I'm glad that there aren't any ideas out there that make me 'sick to death'.

Because that would surely suck.

[Warren DeMontague]

43. Look at the thread! You're being graciously permitted to vote for who you want.

Isnt that nice?

You have no doubt been added to the "lists", now, though. This will go on your permanent record.

Oh, you can be sure of that.

[Cali_Democrat]

102. What lists? nt

[Warren DeMontague]

107. right.

[Cali_Democrat]

117. left

[Warren DeMontague]

125. Up.

[RandySF]

55. I think everyone made it clear they're speaking for themselves

And other Clinton supporters that make up the majority of Democratic women.

[Karma13612]

62. I stand with you, fleur-de-lisa, and with Bernie.

Very nice diary!

#Bernie16

[dem in texas]

66. This old lady supports Hillary this time around

When she ran against Obama back in 2008, I did not support her and voted for Obama. Back then, I was so against her vote to go to war in Iraq. I still don't like the idea that she did that - but the most important thing for the Democrats this time around is to have a candidate who can win and I don't Bernie can do it. I love what he says and he seems to be a nice, honest person, but the stakes are too high to let your heart guide your vote. For this election, you need to let your brain rule and think about all the things that could happened if a Repub wins - like another Scalia on the Supreme court, like ending Obamacare, like getting into another war, like more restrictive laws against abortion, more laws that give tax breaks to the rich, this list could go on and on. Democrats need to look at the big picture and vote for the Democrat who can beat Republican candidates like Trump, Cruz or Rubio. I don't care if it is a male or female, it just so happens in this case, I am voting for a female.

[fleur-de-lisa]

98. My heart, my brain, my pocketbook

and the futures of my daughter, nieces and nephews are guiding me.

And that is precisely why my vote still goes to Bernie!

[840high]

185. Excellent. I have a

daughter and 2 grandsons. Bernie!!!!

[djean111]

68. A year ago, it seems to me that the Clinton campaign rolled out with, not issues, but

with the assertion that of course the women would vote for her because she is a woman. Which is, IMO, about as sexist and misogynistic statement, because it implied that we women did not care about issues and past actions, all we cared about was the ovaries, a bunch of statements/speeches, and some polls and how much Hillary wanted to be president. Mostly, though, because Hillary is a woman. Throw in a long long list of stuff Hillary has said at one time or another, trotted out as "accomplishments".

We were even told by one poster (I have not seen lately) that the only reason anyone did not support Hillary was because we were afraid of strong women or because (seriously) we had mommy issues. I went from being pissed off to being incredulous at the tone-deafness of it.

I didn't feel like I was being TOLD to vote for Hillary because I was a woman, but was being told that if I did not support Hillary, there must be some problem I have with a woman as candidate. That just started sounding really really stupid. And I have not met one woman who is going to vote for Hillary.

[Warren DeMontague]

72. Her people seem to have figured that "vote for me because I'm Hillary Clinton" would be enough.

And when she's forced to compete on the basis of actual policy positions, she flounders.

[djean111]

79. Exactly. n/t

[zentrum]

89. No one in my family supports her either!

None of the women, myself included!

[crim son]

91. I understand the reasoning behind it but

I believe the U.S. is ready and able to vote for a woman for POTUS, if she's the right woman, and not simply because she's female.

[Beacool]

93. Then don't vote for her. Why the drama?

I have no intention of voting for Sanders (in the primary), no matter how much Hillary is trashed on this site. Vote for anyone you want.

Gee..........

[Squinch]

100. This seems to be a hard concept for some.

[Beacool]

110. No one is being forced to vote for anyone.

I don't get why some have to act like the party is putting a gun to their head and forcing them to vote for Hillary in their state's primary. Frankly, I don't give a flying fig who they vote for.

[Squinch]

118. I'm with you. It seems odd to me to be bemoaning something that isn't happening. I'm trying to

get to the bottom of why someone would do that, but so far no luck.

[seaglass]

194. Based on the responses above and the lack of any evidence I am guessing this OP was started only

for the Recs and number of responses. Some people are really into that.

[fleur-de-lisa]

116. I will, and I don't see any drama.

But thanks for the kick!

[Tanuki]

138. No, of course you don't see any drama. It's like in a theatre, only the audience

sees the drama. The actress on the stage doesn't.

[fleur-de-lisa]

147. I post an opinion, and a Hillary supporter

calls it 'drama'. Typical.

[PatrynXX]

94. bout as insane

as telling people hey males. you gotta vote Male and white if your white. and if your voting for someone who's black only blacks can vote for blacks. Thats not how it works!!! smh. if I was a single issue voter I have a feeling I'd be voting Republican. But I'm not. Republican or Democrat I'll vote for whoever is best for the job..

[joanbarnes]

95. ditto, ditto, I could have written this myself. 62-year-old radical feminist. No Loyalty to HRC.

AT ALL.

[MrMickeysMom]

106. I get this when I call to ask who people will be voting for...

I've had at least one woman try to bait me with, "I can't understand why EVERY SINGLE woman I talk to doesn't support having a woman for president!"

I don't have to say a thing. They've stated what the goal is for themselves. I don't have to tell them that to support women, and every single person who has a right to have health care, have time with bringing a new life into the world, having pay equity and a minimum wage that is not a poverty wage would be the best way to support any woman running for president.

These are qualities for those who really care about women. The vehicle of leadership should qualitatively support the United States of America. It should not be limited by the sex of the leader.

[martalcd]

112. It's Bernie all the way...

I agree with you 100%. I'm another life-long progressive Democrat who isn't a fan of Hilary. She doesn't represent me, either, or any of my struggles. After Chelsea saying all the mistruths about Bernie and Medicare, none of the Clinton family deserve to be elected to office. They lack ethics and morals if they spread lies like that.

401K plans are nothing but a tactic to steal more money from the 99%. I've worked since I was 13 part-time, and since I was 18 full-time...I'm no farther along than any other middle class person. You watch while your husband is on Workmen's Comp, getting less than he made before he was hurt, while the insurance company his employer uses for this pockets part of the money. You picket for your job during a strike, which takes you years to recover from. It's all stacked against the 99%.

Bernie may not be able to correct everything but he's trying to be as honest as he can be and will do what he can. I've always been a fan of his, from his days being interviewed from the Senate building by Ed Schultz to today.

Marta

[Codeine]

119. Nobody is saying they must.

But it seems they mostly do.

[fleur-de-lisa]

127. You should see my Facebook page!

Lots of my female (and some male) work and personal acquaintenances spouting the 'you must vote for Hillary cause she's a woman' meme. My family and I don't agree. I want a better future for the next generation.

[seaglass]

195. Then go complain on Facebook - geez they're your connections, maybe you need a better group

of friends and acquaintances.

[SheilaT]

124. I am with you on this.

I am in my late 60's, no daughters, but two grown sons. I also have two sisters.

Over and over again I have seen it either explicitly said or strongly implied (and no, I'm not going to scroll through hundreds of posts on this topic) that women ought to all be supporting Hillary. Yeah, I'd love to see a woman as President in my lifetime, just not Hillary Clinton.

Here's something else that back last spring and summer was either said or strongly hinted at: Republican women by the millions would of course cross party lines and vote for Hillary Clinton, the inevitable Democratic nominee. That meme has largely disappeared, but I'm not sure to what extent her most fervent supporters do not fully understand how very hated she is outside of a relatively small circle. And no, I'm not suggesting any of us here on DU hates her. But not very many support her. And those who do over and over come back to the question, Don't you want to vote for the first woman President? Of course, I'd love to. Just not Hillary.

[abelenkpe]

126. I'd love to have a female president

But I'd like a candidate who push the country further to the left. For too long the country has been moving to the right. Voting for President Obama was what I hoped would begin the pendulum swing back to the left. I voted for President Obama in 2008 because I felt he was to the left of Hillary Clinton. I still feel that way. I want the country to continue moving to the left. It pains me to hear Hillary argue against Single Payer and against Bernies plan to make college education debt free.

[fleur-de-lisa]

134. Amen!

[Tikki]

128. I am surrounded by Democratic women, State reps, US reps and local Gov and party and NONE of.....

these Democratic women have ever expressed to me that I have to vote for a women because
I am a women.

But, maybe, it is because of where I live and all.

Tikki

[WillyT]

129. K & R !!!

[zwyziec]

136. If Bernie does not win the nomination.....

will you vote for the Democrat Party nominee, or will you not vote and let the Repugs have the presidency? If it's the latter, you will be in big financial trouble. Save your money.

[Kalidurga]

146. What is up with this not voting question?

You do realize there are alternatives to not voting right?

-you can write in your choice if your choice is not on the ballot

-you can leave the presidential spot on the ticket not filled in and vote down ticket

-you can vote third party for president and vote for Democrats down ticket or just say "fuck this shit" and vote third party

-and while I think this is the worst option anyone could take someone might think voting Republican would send a stronger message to the DLC

IMO I think Hillary will destroy the Democratic Party by driving away even more people. Right now Independents are the largest voting block. I think Hillary would increase their numbers by 15%.

I think if Donald Trump is nominated by Republicans he will destroy the Republican party. Unfortunately he will destroy nearly everything else along the way.

[tammywammy]

144. I'm not sure where you're reading that

I've never been told I had to support Clinton because I'm a woman.

[fleur-de-lisa]

152. I think the OP was pretty clear.

If you don't agree, fine.

[Tikki]

200. Where in the OP does the poster site an example of someone(s) telling her to vote for a woman...

for President? Does that, also, include Ms. Warren for President?

Nobody is following anyone into the booth, mail box, computer screen as they vote for
whom ever they please.

Tikki

[Buzz cook]

145. You seem to mistake polling data for

Personal demands made on you because of your sex.

The polls strongly indicate that women that fit your demographic support Clinton. But you might not be aware that just because a poll indicates a majority of a group thinks one way, that doesn't mean all members of the group agree.

And a person pointing out a poll result is not demanding obedience to the results of that poll.

[fleur-de-lisa]

148. Nope.

I posted an opinion based on my experiences. I feel no need to justify my opinion to you. Try again.

[Buzz cook]

174. No

nt

[fleur-de-lisa]

175. Thanks for your riveting contribution to the discussion.

[CharlotteVale]

149. I'm a woman and when I look at Hillary I see pure political

ambition. She will say and do anything to get elected, while being totally beholden to and on the side of the rich. Her gender is completely irrelevant to me. No thanks.

[fleur-de-lisa]

151. Exactly! Great points!

[get the red out]

153. Singing my song

I will hold my nose and vote for Clinton in the GE if I have to, but I am no fan of hers. It is rather sexist to assume a woman will vote for another woman no matter what. My 79 year old mother says she isn't voting if Clinton wins the primary. I hate that but it's hard to get her to budge.

[fierywoman]

170. feminist not sexist

I've been a feminist for about the last 55 years. I'm not a sexist -- I won't support a candidate because she has two breasts and a womb since she obviously is and works for the 1%. I've been for Bernie for a l-o-n-g time.

[Zorra]

171. Well said, thank you. nt

[Thespian2]

172. K & R!!!

In case the latest data has been missed...

the 1%er barely beats tRump...Bernie smashes him...

the 1%er LOSES to KKKruz...Bernie smashes him...


Seems as though the Dems need Bernie if they want to win the presidency...and perhaps gain control of the Congress and some of the Repukkkian states...

[loyalsister]

176. Not many I know do

Although I hear a lot of "we should kick their asses" machismo support. Then there are a few guys who love her for her loyalty to a philanderer.

[wildeyed]

181. That is offensive and wrong.

As is the idea that I only support Clinton we are both women.

This female Hillary Clinton supporter assumes that you know your mind and will vote for the candidate you think is best.

[Lorien]

182. You can't be a feminist

and vote for anyone on the basis of gender. Feminism is about being treated fairly and evaluated objectively REGARDLESS of gender. Voting for anyone because they are a woman is anti-Feminism. It's about ideas, vision, track record and character, not X or Y chromosomes.

[Jack Rabbit]

187. You have the right to support the candidate you think is best

Just don't anybody tell you otherwise.

That's liberation.

[Still In Wisconsin]

191. Careful, the Hillbots will swarm-alert you for statements like that... you could be banned n/t

[CobaltBlue]

192. 'I am sick to death of the idea that Democratic women must support Clinton'

I am a 50-ish woman living in the South. My only child is female. I have 2 sisters and 1 brother. My entire family, including my elderly mother and my somewhat republican sister, as well as all my nieces and nephews (including 1 gay nephew), all support Bernie.

Most of my family are middle-class, working Americans. No one in my family supports Hillary.

She does not represent my interests, as a woman. As a matter of fact, her high standing with Wall Street and Corporate America works against me and my whole family. Most of us are college-educated, but don't believe that Hillary is working for us.

I own my home, have a 401k account, and have done everything that Corporate America says I should have done to secure my future, while the Wall Street fucks continue to steal from my retirement account.

I am somewhat comfortable TODAY, but have no confidence that this level of comfort will continue under a Hillary presidency. She is not working for me or my family. I want a better future for my daughter and my nieces and nephews.

Hillary supporters, don't presume that you speak for me! You don't!

There is no excuse for the United States having failed, so far up to this point in history, in not having elected a woman to the presidency of the United States.

This doesn't say specifically who must become the first woman president in the history of the United States. But, it should happen with the Democratic, not the Republican, Party. Republicans carry men before women. Democrats carry women before men. The last Republican president elected with stronger support from women than men, nationwide, was the 1956 re-election of Dwight Eisenhower.

I prefer Bernie Sanders over Hillary Clinton. It simply has to do with Sanders coming closer to where I am at politically and with respect for the direction I think the nation needs to take.

I will not engage in trashing Hillary Clinton. I don't have to do that. I don't make my living in politics.

After the primaries are over, and the two parties have their nominees, what will happen is that there will be overwhelming support from self-identified Republicans and self-identified Democrats who will vote for their party's nominee in the general election. This is not assumed. It is what typically happens. Even a losing candidate will get at least 85 percent of the vote from his self-identified partisan voters.

This time of the year is primary mode. I don't expect to see everyone playing nice within the party. (They're not doing that on the Republican side as well.)

This is actually good!

[BlueMTexpat]

193. Sheesh, and please don't

presume that I am not a progressive because I believe that Hillary Clinton is the most comprehensively qualified candidate. That she happens to be a woman is a bonus for me.

But I also happen to believe that a lot of the unhinged Hillary hatred here and elsewhere is driven by latent sexism.

You can certainly disagree with me, but no one can tell me with a straight face that a male candidate with the same intelligence, education, and experience of and in public office, along with the consistent championship of minority causes, that she has had at both the national and international levels would receive even a tenth of the slurs cast upon her on a daily basis.

Obviously, her experience as First Lady wouldn't apply to any male in this election.

Please, by all means, support whom you choose.

[onecent]

198. I second this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am DEFINITELY NOT FOR HILIARY

She would keep these wars in FULL FORCE.

[Live and Learn]

201. Hillary voted to send other women's children to Iraq. K&R nt

[Faux pas]

202. Thank you fleur-de-lisa!!!!

[jwirr]

203. K&R

[7962]

204. You're from the South, so you're instantly disqualified from having an opinion!

Cause we all dumb down here, ya know?
At least thats the way a lot of folks here portray us!

[LS_Editor]

207. Thank you so much for bringing this up.

I have stated many times that Hillary Clinton asserting being a woman is a qualification for being president, and one she further asserts is a qualification other women should automatically see as the primary reason for voting for her, smacks of some pretty atrocious logic.

Using Hillary's logic, all women should vote for Carly Fiorina or demand Sarah Palin enters the presidential race.

Complete bullshit.

[glinda]

208. +1

[Progressive dog]

209. That nust be why so many women support Hillary,

they are told they must-subliminally.