I oppose the ACA as being both the beginning and the end

[mmonk]

concerning healthcare. There is no way in the end the ACA will hold down costs. One reason is that subsidizing our health insurance industry with all its lobbying power will not end up cheaper in the long term than single payer. The 2nd is that the government is not negotiating prices on drugs on behalf of our citizens. In the end, millions will still be left out due to states being able to opt out of Medicaid expansion. There also isn't protection from repeal from political interests. My two cents. Therefore, I support Bernie Sanders's position.

[underthematrix]

1. It's not an either or proposition. The political landscape is such that

we're still litigating Obamacare just as we did for many years with MEDICARE and MEDICAID when enacted in 1965 as part of Johnson's Great Society's War on Poverty.

the current political landscape doesn't work right now for single payer healthcare. it doesn't mean it won't happen in 10 years but it's not going to happen as a result of this election cycle.

[mmonk]

3. For one we do not know that. Another,

I'm beginning to hear Democrats making the same arguments against single payer as Republicans, not that it just can't be done this election cycle.

[emulatorloo]

14. IMHO That's your bias. Most democrats want single payer. There are arguments over how achieve it

I'm addressing your statement about Democrats making the same arguments against single payer as Republicans.

Some Dems believe you can get from ACA to single payer. Some Dems don't. That is an ok discussion to have.

[mmonk]

15. It's not a bias, merely my opinion

by observing.

[emulatorloo]

16. Just to be clear

I wasn't trying to be negative towards you by using the word "bias"

None of us are totally objective.

Just saying I felt your opinion might be acting as a filter and may be coloring your observations.

[mmonk]

17. I don't claim infallibility. But I do see it

as kicking solutions down the road.

[emulatorloo]

18. Fair enough.

[NCTraveler]

2. "I oppose the ACA as being both the beginning and the end"

As does every member of this site. As do all three of our candidates.

This is why I support Clinton for President.

Great point overall. The Democratic Party is the only sane place to be.

[ViseGrip]

4. 13k A YEAR SUBSIDY FOR A COUPLE! GIVEN TO THE INSURANCE COMPANY??

This money should be given to health facilities in the couples area. They are healthy, so no using the health care, outside of yearly visit. So instead of it going into the health care system, it's going to INSURANCE COMPANIES!

They always want more, and it's the reason the ACA is not sustainable. But like Obama said, this is phase one. Now it's time to kick them out and put the money into the health care fund.

Then join the rest of the world in cost controls on pharmaceuticals.

After all of these years....the last 50, Hillary says she'll fix this now????? Really?
She has taken speech money from Health care companies who don't want single payer. That's why she's flip flopping back and forth on this.

All of their millions....why do her and Bill use Medicare? Why not buy a private policy from one of their friends? And pay for it? They have been enriched by the government and they continue to take more. After watching her after SEC stint, and listening to her now, I can never vote for her.

[underthematrix]

5. You're making a buzz word argument which may make you feel better but

it does nothing to advance the discussion

[bvar22]

6. The ACA was "sold" as the "first step",

but at the debate, Hillary acted like it was sacrilege to even talk about changing it.

Like you, I also opposed it at the time because I knew that the "First Step" was bullshit.
The 1% got exactly what it wanted,
and as long as we vote for Hillary or support other Conservative Democrats,
subsidizing the Health Insurance Industry with BILLIONS without a National Public Plan is Locked In.


I've always found it ironic that Obama campaigned on a Public Option with NO Mandate.
In fact, in a 2008 Campaign Debate, Obama ridiculed Hillary without mercy for supporting a Mandate with NO PUblic Option, but THAT is exactly what the ACA became AFTER Obama was elected.

Remember that wonderful moment where Obama attacked Hillary's Plan with,
"If Mandates worked, we could solve Homelessness by mandating that homeless people buy a house." (debate crowd: Hahahahahaha)

..AND, "a Public Option is necessary to keep them (Health Insurance) honest."

I wonder if Hillary ever got pissed when Obama passed HER Republican, For Profit, subsidize the 1%, Health Insurance Plan?

...but NOW insists that we can't change it?

[mmonk]

7. Good points that weigh heavily on my mind.

[frazzled]

8. She absolutely 100% talked about changing and improving it

And in specific ways. You apparently weren't even watching.

[bvar22]

10. I watched, and re watched, but maybe I'm having a Senior Moment.

Please document the changes in detail which parts of the ACA Hillary is going to change?
She certainly is NOT going to work for ANY National Public Option, or expanding MediCare.

And she certainly is NOT going to stop or reduce the BILLIONS in subsidies going to her friends in the worthless, For Profit Health Insurance Industry.
Until we get those parasites Out of The Middle and away from the Tax Payer dollars,
nothing much is going to change except the campaign Talking Points

So help me out here and give me some specifics.
Bernie has already done so.

[mmonk]

11. The Clinton campaign has also expressed

a comparison with Bernie's single payer proposition with repeal and replace positions of the Republican Party.

[Doctor_J]

9. Most of those who claimed it was the "first step toward SP", now say we can't have SP BECAUSE OF

the ACA ("Single payer would make the ACA and the president look bad!!!&quot . Some of us knew at the outset that was actually an impediment to SP.

Campaign Obama: "We have to have public option to keep the insurance companies honest"
President Obama: "You friends and family need those insurance jobs"

[Zorra]

12. Recommend. nt

[mmonk]

13. Thanks