2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumHillary Goes Full-On Rovian
Clinton Campaign Attacks Sanders for Being the First Candidate to Go Negative
Really Hillary?
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/1/15/1465670/-Hillary-Goes-Full-On-Rovian
Autumn
(45,058 posts)MisterP
(23,730 posts)it's what they do whenever they say "Sanders doesn't care about X people"--wonks know the record says otherwise, but the crybullies can smirk and say it's just denial that confirms their point: all you're allowed to do is kneel and beg forgiveness
the only way to win is to not play the game
roguevalley
(40,656 posts)I also think when you focus on attaining something to the detriment of reason and a clear view of things you do things that will surprise you later on.
PatrynXX
(5,668 posts)they lay out trap you fall in and I guess this proves Faux right (Hannity usually)
840high
(17,196 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Time for a change... time for Bernie!
Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
djean111
(14,255 posts)don't you?
I think "Full-On Rovian" is a perfect description of her campaign, and sincerely hope it gets the same results that it got in 2008.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Say hello to President Sanders.
Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Thirties Child
(543 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Go Bernie!
Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
rusty quoin
(6,133 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)libdem4life
(13,877 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)by some "Dark Horse" candidate has to smart. And I get why she's so vicious...it's like Custer's Last Stand. this is it. But I don't excuse it one bit. In fact, For Shame, Hillary. (That's what she said to someone in the past...I think it was Obama)
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Hillary is using the classic Karl Rove technique of attacking an opponent on their biggest strengths.
A prime example of the Rovian strategy was the Bush campaigns attacking the much decorated war hero John Kerry as a dishonorable vet whom other vets disdained. Bush himself avoided service in Vietnam with his cushy Air National Guard gig in the so-called Champagne Squadron for rich Texas kids, and even then he was AWOL for a year. Kerry was also a child of privilege but went to Vietnam anyway. That should have been a big difference between the two candidates, but by mounting that successful "swift boat" attack, Rove managed to take that whole subject of military service off the table.
Now Hillary is trying to take on the thing that most differentiates the two candidates: INTEGRITY.
If she can take the whole discussion of integrity, honesty and fair play off the table, then she will have greatly hurt Bernie.
Of course, this is not the first Rovian broadside that Hillary has delivered. It started almost immediately, right after the first debate, when Hillary attacked Bernie for, of all things, being RACIST. Bernie, who literally marched with MLK, who was arrested for protesting segregation, who supported and helped Jesse Jackson win Vermont in his Presidential bid, was now just a run-of-the-mill racist:
'There are some who say that it is an urban problem,' Clinton stated. 'Sometimes what they mean by that is: It's a black problem. But it's not. It's not black. It's not urban. It's a deep profound challenge to who we are.'
Ridiculous on its face. But that was not the only Rovian smear that the Clinton campaign was able to create out of whole cloth from the first debate:
You know, Ive been told to stop, and I quote, shouting about gun violence. Well, first of all, Im not shouting. Its just [that] when women talk, some people think were shouting.
Again message clear: Bernie, who has stood for womens rights, abortion rights, ERA, equal pay for decades, is really nothing more than an old-fashioned sexist who cannot stand or even understand strong women.
This week saw another Karl Rove masterpiece: Hilary is attacking Bernie on one of his core principles and one of his most passionate aims: single payer health care as a right. Hillary wants to keep allowing private insurance companies to make a profit on sick Americans. Bernie wants to make it an entitlement. And that basic philosophical difference is resonating with voters so, taking another page out of Karl Roves playbook, Hillary is literally trying to scare voters about Bernies plan:
"His plan would take Medicare and Medicaid and the Children's Health Insurance Program and the Affordable Care Act health care insurance and private employer health insurance and he would take that all together and send health insurance to the states, turning over your and my health insurance to governors," Clinton said. "We had enough of a fight to get to the Affordable Care Act. So I dont want to rip it up and start over."
This is really starting to get bizarre. But apparently the Clinton camp will adhere to the Rove strategy to the bitter end.
The latest barrage, namely attacking Bernies integrity, is the final straw. Bernie has always maintained that he has never run a negative ad, and that has been a hallmark of his campaign and a cornerstone of his reputation among the voters. To attack Bernies integrity and his honesty (he is not levelling with the American people) is to attack the very foundation of the Bernie Brand.
Proserpina
(2,352 posts)and so, she couldn't attack them even if she tried.
Nor could she pull her sorry performance up to his level.
Bernie's strength is people like him, like how he behaves, like what he says, like what he's done....and she can't touch those.
Furthermore, people don't like Hillary, how she behaves, what she says, nor what she's done.....and since she's made no attempt to redesign any of it, she's not making any progress.
The more people learn about Bernie, the more they like him. As Sally said:
Voice for Peace
(13,141 posts)Vinca
(50,269 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)unlike our beloved Bernie!
Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
Punkingal
(9,522 posts)bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)bvar22
(39,909 posts)So why not try the Naked Rove move?
Not a very high degree of difficulty, but moving for Republicans when executed well.
in_cog_ni_to
(41,600 posts)TeeVee appearance and word YOU have ever spoken, given, gave or held. You can't BLATANTLY LIE anymore because Bernie's extraordinary Millenials who know technology like the back of their hand, are going to find you being the first person to go negative during the debates. It's out there. You can't LIE and get away with it anymore.
PEACE
LOVE
BERNIE
Manifestor_of_Light
(21,046 posts)It was the summer of 1992 and she was campaigning for Bill. Spoke for over an hour to a private function in some rich lawyer's backyard. No notes whatsoever --I filmed it all standing right in front of her, and she sounded like a liberal.
Boy has she changed.
Odin2005
(53,521 posts)Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)It's going to get much, much worse...
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)understand that the progressive movement is far larger than one man? It's a Democratic movement. Bernie could drop dead tonight and it would continue because ALL of our Democratic candidates are committed to rebuilding our nation and advancing the welfare of all our people.
Imagining one can win a war by attacking one's own generals and trying to drag them down is incredibly foolish. The very first step is to IDENTIFY who are allies and who are enemies, and no one posting so far has even done that basic step yet.
Proserpina
(2,352 posts)This movement is too young to have anyone ready to succeed Bernie.
He at least needs a VP--preferably one who also walks the walk.
Unfortunately, people like Bernie are thin on the ground, inside or outside the party.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
Proserpina
(2,352 posts)I don't think she wants the job. Imagine her as Senate Majority Leader, though!
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
Ned_Devine
(3,146 posts)Cal33
(7,018 posts)people in America - and this includes many Republicans - are more than simply being
tired of the status quo. They cannot understand that we want change. We want nothing
less than REAL change!
Voice for Peace
(13,141 posts)It is fear, dishonesty, duplicity, arrogance.
Comes often in pretty packages, but has a distinct stench.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)SoapBox
(18,791 posts)And she would wonder why her numbers are falling?
Of course sucking up to millionaires and billionaires, sabre rattling for war plus shape shifting on nearly every position AND going full throttle on dirty politics....
And people wonder why so many of us don't support her?
Cal33
(7,018 posts)she has always been, and this is the way she will remain. She cannot change. She
doesn't know how to change, nor does she wish to.
PatrynXX
(5,668 posts)Lying is negative accusing without fact is negative. pointing out facts is not negative. kinda like the screaming. Hey alot of the folks screaming are guys. I didn't know they were female.
hopemountain
(3,919 posts)but he is just too much for the people and speaks clearly and with sense about how we, the people, have the power to make the change - and we will do it together. all hillary can do is assert the negative: "nope". "no we can't." "it will never happen."
Bad Bad JuJu
(22 posts)because : "nope". "no we can't." "it will never happen."
BeanMusical
(4,389 posts)elias49
(4,259 posts)riversedge
(70,197 posts)candidate on a Democratic board. shame on you.
elias49
(4,259 posts)She's a liar, a cheat, an ego-maniac and so my post stands.
Suck it up.
riversedge
(70,197 posts)elias49
(4,259 posts)Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=822917
She's early.
Jenny_92808
(1,342 posts)I do not like your NOPE message.
Armstead
(47,803 posts)kenfrequed
(7,865 posts)She has been having surrogates go negative for months now. She has finally given up having learned that the wonkenistas that make up the professional political pundit class on the cable networks are not delivering the message or that the message is being rejected.
So now she officially is going negative.
She embraced the politics of Rove last summer.