I saw Hillary talking with..

[one_voice]

Chris Matthews and she made a very valid point. The congress how is anything going to get done with them?

I've thought about that myself.

[oasis]

1. Incremental changes are possible with sensible policy proposals. nt

[whatchamacallit]

2. Incrementalism: One step forward, two steps back

[oasis]

3. Pie in the sky: Treadmill to nowhere.

[bvf]

5. Vision vs. blinders. n/t

[pnwmom]

6. Obamacare was a major step forward. Twenty million more people so far

have insurance who didn't have it before.

And no one who gets sick or pregnant has to worry about losing their insurance now. And no baby is born already deemed uninsurable because of a preexisting condition.

[Jarqui]

4. Current congress is not. We the people have to fire them and get replacements

That's a key part of Bernie's revolution.

And that's a pretty simple pitch: "America, these bribed obstructionists have done a lousy job representing you, putting their own interests ahead of the people they serve, and they need to be fired. They're now in the way of getting rid of the rigged system and economy. On Nov (whatever), give them their walking papers and go with these candidates ...." (maybe primary them like the tea party did to the GOP)

I think it would be a great campaign pitch. Ask America to fire them for doing a lousy job.

[pnwmom]

7. Yet he's doing nothing to bring that about except talking. He isn't raising money

for anyone else, and that's what needs to be done.

[Jarqui]

19. He can't raise money for the DNC - they're in the bag for Clinton

He'd be raising money that could be used against himself.

He can start helping them out after the primary

[pnwmom]

20. He could raise money for the Senate Campaign committee, which has

entirely different leadership.

And he wouldn't be funding anyone who would be running against himself, but helping to build a majority in the Senate.

[Jarqui]

22. That's true - good idea/didn't think of it nt

[BOSNYCDC]

23. Raising enthusiasm and raising issues are as/more important than raising money eom

[pnwmom]

25. Not if it doesn't change the makeup of Congress. President Sanders wouldn't be

able to accomplish anything legislatively with the current Congress, and so far, he hasn't been doing anything to change it. If he waits to the next election, that will be halfway through his term -- and only 1/3 of the Senate seats will even be up for a vote.

[notadmblnd]

37. You just don't quit, do you? What do you think these lies will accomplish?

Just because he's not raising money for the DNC doesn't mean he isn't raising money for Democrats.

Clinton raised $18 million dollars for the Democratic National Committee, to be used in the general election to support Democratic candidates, while it appears Bernie Sanders has raised none. This is causing some consternation, with supporters of Clinton claiming that Sanders is not holding up his end of the bargain and is not interested in helping the Democratic party, while Sanders supporters claim he was given no opportunity to fundraise and that there is no reason for him to work for an organization that has been working against him. The money goes into the Victory Fund, to be shared by the national and state parties for whomever gets nominations in 2016.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/1/2/1465551/-Why-didn-t-Bernie-Sanders-raise-any-money-for-the-DNC

[BOSNYCDC]

41. I think my point might not be clear

Enthusiasm = new Dem voters
New Dem voters = new Congressfolks
New Congressfolks = new ideas and legislation

Raising $ for status quo candidates = status quo

[Dustlawyer]

32. He is bringing in millions of new Democrats.

That's what the money is for anyway, he just cut out the money part. With Bernie at the top of the ticket, more Progressives, Liberals, Democrats will come out to vote on election day than they would for Hillary. Straight ticket voting would help the down-ballot candidates much better under Bernie.

[pnwmom]

34. Many of his supporters here are threatening to leave if he doesn't get the nomination.

So we'll see how many are still around in the general.

[treestar]

13. Most voters are OK with their representatives and not likely to respond positively to that

It's still too vague just saying "revolution." People have to campaign in specific districts. Figure out which ones the Republican can be removed from.

[notadmblnd]

40. That's why congress has such high approval ratings. Right?

Cause most people are happy with their congress people.

[angel123]

15. Do nothing congress

What makes you think the voters will fire this congress. There is nothing you can tell them that has not been said before. All the republicans have to tell them is that people coming across the border are taking jobs that they should have. Talk about voter fraud. Lead them to believe that democrats are coming for their guns. Talk about abortion, same sex marriage, affirmative action, sharia law,
and the muslims are coming.

[Jarqui]

21. Congressional approval: approve +14 disapprove -76 (-61)

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/congressional_job_approval-903.html

Definition of insanity is to do the same thing over and over and expect a different result

People are responding to Bernie because he is addressing that through the issues he's talking about "rigged economy" "campaign finance" "Wall Street" etc

He's said he needs the support of the people if he's going to get it changed. That support has to come through the people changing congress. It's the only way to change the legislation.

And he is a spokesman for explaining to people what falling for the wedge issues does, etc

There are going to be dead heads who drag their knuckles following Trump around who will never buy in but we're about to find out if a majority of democrats will buy in.

Maybe they can take the Senate back this time and then work on regaining the house.

[backscatter712]

8. If she gets elected, she's not going to be taking much of a wave of Democrats with her.

Sorry, but she's not the candidate that really gets people fired up and ready to go.

If she becomes President, she'll be dealing with a Republican Congress who will be highly motivated to be as hostile as possible to her. They'll be looking for an excuse to impeach, and just like with Obama, the rule will be "If she's for it, they're against it." Even if they used to be for it.

In fact, for that reason, I predict if she's President, she'll hardly be able to get jack shit done.

Bernie's inspirational enough that he has more of a chance of turning 2016 into a wave election and putting more Democrats in power.

[one_voice]

12. So you think he'll have a bigger impact down ballot?

What about the areas that are gerrymandered? Won't make difference.

Playing devils advocate here, how friendly do you think a conservative congress is going to be to someone that's talking about 'free' (that's what they'll hear) education & healthcare. Raising taxes.

It's a valid concern for either of our candidates. I think WE need to get our asses working for our congress just as much as for the White House. Just my .02

[treestar]

14. Not seeing any proof of that.

Not everything is "fired up" and it's not such a big drama. She had been raising money for lower level Dems. Of course that had to be "corrupt." Not everyone is a rabid Hillary hater.

[Nanjeanne]

9. Oh Yes - this Republican Congress is so eager to work with a Clinton

especially if they want to get primaried. You thought the anti-Obama contingent was bad . . . wait for it to work its magic against Clinton.

The only way to fix the mess we are in is to fix the big problems - and Hillary won't do that. Bernie may not be able to - but he will damn sure try.

[DefenseLawyer]

26. With all the Republicans lining up to get their pictures taken with Hillary, when will there be time

to get any work done? They love her!

[Avalux]

10. Novel idea: we work together to get rid of them.

I would like a Hillary supporter to tell me exactly HOW she will get anything done with a Republican Congress. She has declared Republicans her enemy, they went after her with a vengeance over Benghazi, they absolutely hate Bill - I just don't see how she will get anything done. The argument works both ways.

[one_voice]

16. I agree with your first sentence..

in fact I said it here : http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1123513

I wasn't arguing against Bernie. I asking a question. it's a valid point for both candidates. They will both have their struggles with a Republican congress.

[Avalux]

18. Got it. Bernie supporters know it's about US working with him - shared accountability.

It won't be easy for either of them, but I think it might be more difficult for Hillary with her history.

[loyalsister]

27. Or how she will convince the angry disaffected voters who respond to Bernie

not just because they like his message, but because his last name is not Clinton and he was not part of the Obama administration.
These are voters who are not going to skip the presidential candidate and vote down ticket. GOTV falls apart with a Clinton candidacy, and raising money for those down ticket candidates and the DNC can't fix it.

[arcane1]

33. I ask that question all the time and it goes unanswered. n/t

[treestar]

11. True other than vague references to Bernie's coattails

There seems to be no plan whatsoever. Once again, the plan is that this can all be done from the top.

Not one post here about any congressional district and who is running there, or any district now with a Republican that might be turned.

And the gerrymandering took place because the Rs do not do what the Ds do - they pay attention to the state and local.

Hillary is at least helping lower level Democrats and helping raise funds for them.

[JudyM]

17. Bernie is effective at working behind the scenes in congress. Here's one example. Community clinics

worked into the affordable care act:
https://theintercept.com/2015/07/06/gop-senators-support-sanders-obamacare-expansion/

He's been in congress for decades and is widely well regarded despite his non-mainstream positions. His word is trusted and he knows how to work within the system to make progress. Contrast: Hillary is widely vilified, whether warranted or not. So if we get a lot more seats, thats great; and if we don't, which would be the one more effective at getting legislation through?

[TCJ70]

24. With her recently acquired progressivism...

...aside from many stances she also holds closely, how would she get anything done? This isn't an argument against Sanders, as I'd rather have someone I trust to call out the BS, but more of an argument against congress.

[uponit7771]

28. Sanders whole movement is based on you not getting a practical answer to this questions. If you

...did then his criticisms of the "establishment" become petulant at best

[arcane1]

29. What PROGRESSIVE policies can Clinton get through congress that Sanders can't?

This seems to be a variation of the standard cop-out to me.

[uponit7771]

30. None, she's not the revolution candidate Sanders is

[one_voice]

35. I'm pretty sure my OP didn't say that Hillary could.

If it did I'd appreciate it if you'd point that out to me. Maybe I should have clarified further in my OP. Or maybe people shouldn't be so quick to rush to assume things. I'm not your enemy. I'm an undecided voter.

Even if I were a Hillary voter I'm not your enemy. Republicans are your enemy. I have no interest in 'fighting' with anyone. I will discuss any topic though. But if you come at me in a 'fight stance' not gonna happen.

It was a general statement. It wasn't against against Bernie or for Hillary.

Here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1123513

[arcane1]

36. I was speaking more to Hillary than to you personally.

She bills herself as the only one who can "get things done" but never lets us know what those things are, or why she's the only one who can do them.

[one_voice]

38. Gotcha.

[notadmblnd]

31. Just more- No! We Can't!

That's the only time she used the word "we." Any other time it is me and I.

[catnhatnh]

39. .....

I saw Lon Chaney, Jr. walking with the Queen
Doing the Werewolves of London
I saw a werewolf drinking a pina colada at Trader Vic's
And his hair was perfect