Bernie’s 'Political Revolution' is Actually Happening, but M$M Won’t Tell You That

[99th_Monkey]

Not to mention that Rachael's 'analysis' totally ignores the Independent voters who turned out
in YUUGE numbers.

~~~ * ~~~ * ~~~ * ~~~ * ~~~ * ~~~ * ~~~ * ~~~ * ~~~ * ~~~ * ~~~ * ~~~ *

Bernie’s 'Political Revolution' is Actually Happening, Although the Corporate Media Won’t Tell You That
Don't rely on the media to tell you what's going on.
By Thom Hartmann * AlterNet * February 14, 2016

Bernie Sanders has made voter-turnout history, getting about a third more votes than any other primary candidate in the history of New Hampshire primaries, but much of our media is reporting the opposite; that it’s no big deal what he’s accomplishing. ~snip~

It turns out that fewer people showed up to vote Democratic in New Hampshire and Iowa this year than they did in Obama’s 2008! If that’s the case – and it is – then how could Bernie possibly claim that he’s “energizing” “new” people? He must be running a con on us, or he’s just a deluded old man who dreams of revolution but nobody’s really showing up.

Time to doubt both Bernie and his ideas, right?

After all, as Rachel points out, “40,000 fewer people voted in this year’s New Hampshire Democratic primary than did in 2008,” she said. Adding, for emphasis, the three-word sentence: “Forty thousand less!” ~snip~

Clearly Bernie’s campaign is running a scam, right? The entire rationale for his candidacy is built on sand. His “revolution” isn’t happening so far, so why might it happen later? Time to doubt that Bernie’s claims of political change are even possible, much less reasonable.

However… Rachel missed a few facts – something unusual for her usually brilliant political analysis.

First, Bernie’s main premise wasn’t that he could get more people to vote for him (although he’s asserted that and is actually doing it, as I’ll get to in a moment). His main premise is that, unlike President Obama, he will ask the American people to be very, very, very involved in the political process. He’s talked over and over about how if, as president, when he’s trying to get meaningful legislation through, he’ll invite millions of people to come to DC to let Congress know what they think.

But more importantly, in this story (played out in other media as well as MSNBC) the numbers were passed along to us from their source in an astonishingly confusing fashion, given their context.

http://www.alternet.org/election-2016/bernies-political-revolution-actually-happening-although-corporate-media-wont-tell-you

[cantbeserious]

1. We Us Together - Vs - No Can't and Impossible -- The Choice Is Clear

eom

[JFKDem62]

2. There is a revolution going on in both parties

No matter who wins....

[UnBlinkingEye]

32. I agree

Think it is great and long overdue. Jeb and Hillary must be feeling a little gobsmacked.

[Helen Borg]

3. Haha, they remind me of Comical Ali

[Live and Learn]

4. Yep, it has begun, though some here are apparently missing it. nt

[99th_Monkey]

9. The thing is, the longer 'they' don't see it, the better for us.

[tk2kewl]

5. of course it is and of course they won't tell you

it's been building since at least WTO Seattle '99.

[99th_Monkey]

10. Yep. and that was on Bill's watch.

I was actually there, it was a wild time.

[tk2kewl]

13. i bet

thanks for being there
hope you didn't get hurt

[99th_Monkey]

16. Tear gassed is all,

played havoc with my athsma but I escaped to lower ground at the waterfront
before it got too bad.

Had an amazing conversation with a cop who was standing frozen in a line to
keep protesters from getting closer to WTO event, and I just talked with him
about "did he have any children?" and he nodded ever so slightly and gave me
eye contact, so I went on ... about how the reason I was there was for my kids
and their future, etc. until we were both tearing-up & he began visibly emoting
with me, and his supervisor finally came and took him off-line ... now that made
the whole trip (from Portland)more than worth it. I'll never forget that moment.

[tk2kewl]

18. that is a great flower in the rifle barrel story!

good for you!

the un-televised revolution, is of course, the other half of why Bush gave us 9/11, patriot act, DHS and the war on terra

[Kip Humphrey]

6. Has Rachel corrected her erroneous record on this yet? Has she yet attributed the lower

total Democratic turnout where it belongs to the Hillary Clinton campaign?

[TTUBatfan2008]

14. She should attribute at least some of it...

...to her network for giving Bernie about 1% of the TV coverage while they drooled over Trump in 2015.

[appalachiablue]

63. Rachel's segment on this fasehood was just shown as part of

Hartmann's Big Picture segment tonight on the new media theme that Bernie and his political revolution isn't happening.

Not holding my breath that R. corrects this. However, Chris Hayes just apologized for recent brief remarks made by Bill about Obama that MSNBC showed, by airing video of Bill's full remarks on the show tonight. Hayes said, 'we shouldn't have done that.'

[yourpaljoey]

7. It is rising all around us

I have never seen a political/social movement like this.
The People will be heard!

[SidDithers]

8. Sure it is...nt

Sid

[geologic]

23. An if ya vacation each year with Henry K--

ya ain't gonna make it with anyone anyway...

[LWolf]

11. Yes.

In Iowa and New Hampshire, 2008 was a statistical anomaly, which makes it a very poor baseline. Democrats brought 171,000 voters to the Iowa caucus this year and 251,000 to the Democratic primary in New Hampshire. Both of these numbers are significantly higher than 2000, 2004, or any other prior year.

And if we are going to use 2008 as a baseline, remember what happened in the 2008 general (60% voter turnout in the general, Dems wins the White House, Dems win huge majorities in Senate and House).

So if Bernie can get Democratic turnout near those levels (which he is already doing despite having only one opponent), Dems have a very good election night in November.

Bernie’s candidacy has made history, regardless of where it goes from here. The revolution may not be as well televised as Sanders fans would like, but it is certainly rolling ahead at full steam with every possibility of taking the White House and taking back, like in 2008, both chambers of Congress.

[redstateblues]

12. Inviting people to Washington is a political revolution?

It's more like a bumper sticker slogan. A political revolution would involve a plan to win back state houses, The Senate and the House. If Bernie wins the nomination down ballot Democrats will be getting as far away as they can from him and his promises to raise taxes. The last Democrat that ran for POTUS on raising taxes was Walter Mondale. He won 1 state.

[Hoyt]

15. Yep, the MSM is avoiding a story that would increase viewer/readership (if it existed).

[DemocraticSocialist8]

17. I like Hartmann, but he's still ignoring the fact that more Republicans turned out to vote in IA

and NH

[Nanjeanne]

19. Can you imagine if any other candidate had gotten 18,000 people in Denver at a rally?

[MisterP]

21. with rallies one-quarter that the machine pols would be described as godlike,

that peace was about to unfold on earth, the GOP about to disappear, etc.

[Jenny_92808]

20. Go Bernie!

[SoLeftIAmRight]

22. What I like most about this revolution is that ...

they are not hitting us with clubs - not gassing us - not jailing us...

and it is pissing them off - they wish we were out on the streets

the backlash will be economic - but so many have so little now there is not much more they can do - the last weapon they have is hunger

[99th_Monkey]

30. they wish we were out on the streets

right This way we're more defuse and not so handy for pepper-spraying and
billy clubbing, and jailing. .. like with OWS.

[Dont call me Shirley]

24. Welcome to the Revolution, ostriches...

[oasis]

35. ostriches are looking for pie in the sand, 'cause it sure ain't in the sky.

[Dont call me Shirley]

46. LOL....

[oasis]

47. :)

[Ferd Berfel]

25. K&R

If Rachel isn't careful she's going to come in somewhere below dog poop on the smell test scale

[Uncle Joe]

26. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, 99th_Monkey.

[pangaia]

27. This is so simple. Bernie got 151,000 votes.

More votes than ANYONE IN HISTORY.

There were fewer TOTAL Democratic votes because- DUH !! - Hillary couldn't draw.

What's with Rachael? Or anybody, for that matter?


Next question?

[Enthusiast]

28. Kicked and recommended!

[bigdarryl]

29. There is no revolution the Democrats aren't voting like they did in 08 and 2012

Rachel Maddow talked about this on.her show on the number of Iowa voters for republicans vs.Democrats also in New. Hampshire there republicans are more enthusiastic this time around.The democratic party is fighting against history.

[brooklynite]

31. I thought the Sanders revolution wasn't about one man...

...but I haven't seen any sign that the revolutionaries are working to get any equally progressive House or Senate members elected as well. Guess I'll have to keep working on that.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

33. We are. It's discussed on DU and Reddit. n/t

[Beacool]

34. Good luck with that one......

"He’s talked over and over about how if, as president, when he’s trying to get meaningful legislation through, he’ll invite millions of people to come to DC to let Congress know what they think."

[99th_Monkey]

37. That's what Obama said too. Why are you trashing Obama's wonderful ideas? nt

[Beacool]

38. Have you listened to what Obama has said now that he's been in office for seven years?

It's not the same tune. He found out the hard way that wishing for something does not mean that it will be accomplished. Hillary already has those scars from 1993 and Obama has his from 2010. Sanders is over promising. I don't trust anyone whose entire agenda will only get to pass if we have a "political revolution". That's just B.S.

[99th_Monkey]

40. I prefer "Think Big, Yes We Can" to "Forget it. No we can't"

and I know most American voters pretty much agree with me.

Peddling intransigent incrementalism is about as inspirational as getting a root canal.

[Beacool]

48. There's a middle road between both extremes.

I think that Hillary will advance Democratic goals, but she knows what she would have to deal with (Congress) if she becomes president. Sanders seems to close his eyes and ears to reality and assumes that millions of people will uprise. That is just unrealistic nonsense.

[99th_Monkey]

49. Raining on Bernie's Parade only waters his garden.

Please proceed.

[Beacool]

50. I'm not worried.

When all is said and done, I think that Hillary will prevail.

[Gothmog]

36. Sorry, Bernie Sanders. There is zero evidence of your ‘political revolution’ yet

No one has seen any evidence of the so-called Sanders revolution https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/02/10/sorry-bernie-sanders-there-is-zero-evidence-of-your-political-revolution-yet/

Bernie Sanders recorded a resounding victory in New Hampshire's Democratic primary Tuesday. He crushed his rival, Hillary Clinton, with no less than 60 percent of the vote. If Sanders hopes not only to win the election but to achieve his ambitious progressive agenda, though, that might not be enough.

To succeed, Sanders might have to drive Americans who don't normally participate to the polls. Unfortunately for him, groups who usually do not vote did not turn out in unusually large numbers in New Hampshire, according to exit polling data.

https://img.washingtonpost.com/wp-apps/imrs.php?src=&w=1484

...As for Sanders, he credited his victory to turnout. "Because of a huge voter turnout -- and I say huge -- we won," he said in his speech declaring victory, dropping the "h" in "huge." "We harnessed the energy, and the excitement that the Democratic party will need to succeed in November."

In fact, Sanders won by persuading many habitual Democratic primary voters to support him. With 95 percent of precincts reporting their results as of Wednesday morning, just 241,000 ballots had been cast in the Democratic primary, fewer than the 268,000 projected by New Hampshire Secretary of State William Gardner last week. Nearly 289,000 voters cast ballots in the state's Democratic primary in 2008.

To be sure, the general election is still seven months away. Ordinary Americans might be paying little attention to the campaign at this point, and if Sanders wins the nomination, he'll have the help of the Democratic Party apparatus in registering new voters. The political revolution hasn't started, though, at least not yet.

Without this revolution, I am not sure how Sanders proposes to advance his unrealistic agenda

[99th_Monkey]

39. M$M spins-away a Bernie/60% v. Hillary/38% drubbing .. "Nothing To See Here"

It's fascinating to watch the denial-in-action .. I truly hope all Hillarians continue to think
that Bernie's revolution is a 'non-starter'..

[Gothmog]

41. Where are the million and millions of new voters?

[99th_Monkey]

42. Bernie wins NH by 22%, and you ask, "where are the voters?"

[Gothmog]

43. The turnout in 2016 was far less than 2008

Again, the premise of the Sanders revolutions is that millions and millions of new voters will rise up and call for change. Where are these new voters?

[99th_Monkey]

45. The new voters came, I guess tepid Hillary leaners stayed home.

other wise she would have won.

[Gothmog]

55. Bernie Sanders’ “Revolution” Isn’t Good Enough

I am not the only one wondering about the effectiveness of the revolution concept http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2016/01/bernie_sanders_revolution_isn_t_good_enough.html

To make a more practical analysis, a political revolution might put Sanders into the White House and win the Senate for Democrats, but it doesn’t change the landscape of House districts—where the Republican Party holds a firm advantage—and it doesn’t diminish conservative ideological intensity. In the wake of a Sanders win—as we saw in the wake of Obama’s 2008 victory—conservatives will push back.....

Even with a viable political revolution, a President Sanders would have a hard time persuading or budging a Republican House—still intact because of a powerful partisan advantage, cemented through gerrymandering and geography—that represents radically different, opposing values. The distance between his plans and their priorities is so great that it’s hard to imagine a world where the two sides can be bridged. You could pressure those Republicans through grassroots action, but they weren’t elected by the “political revolution.” Why would they listen?

Indeed, when you take disagreement and political pluralism seriously, it is difficult to even conceptualize the revolution that Sanders describes and touts as the key to success. Does it emerge in America’s conservative bastions? Does it overcome decades of conviction, habit, and organization, the forces that gave John McCain and Sarah Palin nearly 60 million votes in an election almost designed to give a historic victory to the Democratic Party? The truth is that, even under the best scenario for Sanders—a growing economy, huge enthusiasm, and a weak opponent—it’s hard to imagine a world where he beats Obama’s total from 2008. Unless the revolution is truly that—a movement that overcomes partisan barriers—it, at most, leaves liberals where they were at the beginning of 2013.

President-elect Sanders would enter the White House with gridlock ahead of him. And if the conservatism and moderation of places like Virginia and Missouri are any indication, then he would also face a split in the Democratic Party, among lawmakers who backed him and his socialist label, and those who ran from it. His campaign promises to challenge the establishment. Would these moderate and conservative Democrats challenge the establishment too? If they don’t, would Sanders challenge them?

[99th_Monkey]

57. Bernie's candidacy is both historic and unprecedented

by any number of measures, i.e. his YUUUGE crowds, his garnering unprecedented number
of small donations, raising $5-6 Million within hours of his also historic win in NH (the FIRST
Jewish candidate to do so).

I see no reason to buy into "conventional wisdom" when it comes to assessing or predicting
how Bernie's political revolution will play out. Bernie's game-changing mojo is a moving target
that's usually 2-3 steps ahead of mainstream punditry.

I am however rather enjoying how it's forcing Hillary and her surrogates to double down on
"NO we can't" ... "It's just too hard .. " ... "That will never happen." because -- as a Bernie
supporter -- I know that's good news for Bernie, who has good news for voters: i.e. "when we
all stand up together ...

"YES WE CAN, and this time WE WILL"

[Gothmog]

58. Where are the millions and millions of voters?

The premise of the Sanders revolutions relies on millions and millions of new voters joining the political process. No one has seen this surge yet?

[99th_Monkey]

59. Nope. Don't see that anywhere.

[Gothmog]

60. Numbers do not lie

Fewer people caste votes in Iowa and New Hampshire in 2016 compared to 2008. Those millions of voters did not show up

[99th_Monkey]

61. A LOT more "showed up" than would have, if it was a Clinton v. O'Malley race,

Income Inequality would not even be on the radar, much less a central issue in the
Democratic Primary.

[Gothmog]

62. That is a very weak revolution that will have no chance of influencing the GOP

Again, the theory that Sanders keeps preaching is that if millions and millions of new voters show up, then the GOP will become more reasonable. Those new voters are not showing up which undercuts the premise of the Sanders campaign.

[99th_Monkey]

64. You can keep repeating "NO YOU CAN'T" over and over

until yore blue in the face, and it still doesn't change these facts
FACT #1 Bernie came from single-digits on day-one, to
FACT #2 Tying Clinton in Iowa, and
FACT #3 Trouncing Hillary in NH, by 22%.

The Revolution is on baby, like it or not. Something is happening that has
never happened before, and even the M$M (of all people) .. even they admit
exactly that, that this election is "anyone's guess" what's going to happen.

Even a stopped clock like the M$M gets it right twice a day.

[FSogol]

65. Shows how little you know about O'Malley

https://martinomalley.com/category/15-goals/

[99th_Monkey]

66. Well, I looked at his top six issues

and like that "increasing ave. family net worth" goal as number one on his list.

Dont' get me wrong, i like the guy, and these polices DO generally help us 'little
people' get-by financially ..

But where is "break up the big banks", or "reinstate Glass–Steagall" or "taking on
Wall St." .. don't see any of that.

I feel Bernie fully deserves credit for putting these^ issues at or near the top of
the Democratic primary list of issues under consideration and debate. Clinton
certainly wasn't going to bring them up, and so why would O'Malley do it either,
except perhaps in oblique ways like increasing "ave. family net worth"

[FSogol]

67. O'Malley called for breaking up the big banks and reinstating glass-steagal before Sanders did.

All of his plans are listed here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/12813600

You should check out: Holding Wall Street Accountable
https://14d2r744okfe40r1ug1oqm6y-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/OMalley-Wall-Street-Reform.pdf

and actually, Warren probably deserves the credit for putting this all on the agenda.

I'll repeat, you really don't understand what you are talking about when you lump O'Malley in with HRC's campaign.

[99th_Monkey]

68. Bernie's been talking about this for decades. O'Malley & Warren are newcomers. nt

[FSogol]

69. I'm obviously talking about in this election cycle. n/t

[Gothmog]

70. Imagine Bernie Sanders wins the White House. Then what?

Sanders' plans for adopting his proposals depend on these new voters. Here is how Sanders thinks that he will be able to force the GOP to be reasonable http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/2/21/1483791/-Imagine-Bernie-Sanders-wins-the-White-House-Then-what

Bernie Sanders has made some very big promises when it comes to his legislative priorities: He says he’ll make college free, pass a constitutional amendment to overturn Citizens United, and institute a generous single-payer national health insurance program. And when he’s asked how he’ll turn these promises into reality, he says that he and his supporters will help bring about a “political revolution.”

That’s a phrase Sanders uses often, but what does he mean by it? Sanders has said that if he wins the presidency, his victory will be accompanied by a “huge increase in voter turnout”—one that he thinks might end Republican control of Congress. But Sanders acknowledges that the House and Senate could, in spite of his best efforts, remain in GOP hands come next January.

Given that likelihood, Sanders offers an alternate means for achieving his political revolution. He says he knows that a Democratic president can’t simply “sit down and negotiate” with Republican leaders and forge a series of compromises. Anyone who's observed the GOP’s behavior over the course of Barack Obama’s presidency would not dispute that, and in any event, no compromise with Republicans would ever lead to single-payer anyway.

So what then? How would a President Sanders get Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan to pass any of his big-ticket items? This is the model he proposes:

What we do is you put an issue before Congress, let’s just use free tuition at public colleges and universities, and that vote is going to take place on November 8 ... whatever it may be. We tell millions and millions of people, young people and their parents, there is going to be a vote ... half the people don’t know what’s going on ... but we tell them when the vote is, maybe we welcome a million young people to Washington, D.C. to say hello to their members of Congress. Maybe we have the telephones and the e-mails flying all over the place so that everybody in America will know how their representative is voting. [...]

And then Republicans are going to have to make a decision. Then they’re going to have to make a decision. You know, when thousands of young people in their district are saying, “You vote against this, you’re out of your job, because we know what’s going on.” So this gets back to what a political revolution is about, is bringing people in touch with the Congress, not having that huge wall. That’s how you bring about change.

The rest of the DK article debunks that concept that Paul Ryan or Mitch McConnell could be influenced by these new voters but we never get to this issue and Sanders himself admits that he will not bet elected without this revolution. So far we are not seeing any evidence of this revolution. Again, Sanders's whole campaign is based on this revolution and so it is appropriate to ask where these new voters are?

It is hard for me to take Sanders' proposals seriously including the ones you want to talk about unless and until we see some evidence of this revolution.

Again, where are these millions and millions of new voters?

[oldandhappy]

51. Let the revolution rise slowly.

Do not want to peak too soon.

[99th_Monkey]

53. Yes, timing is everything

and Team Bernie is doing a fantastic job so far, trending just gradually enough
to keep The Bern building momentum into the next primary/caucus.

[GreenPartyVoter]

54. Agreed! Need enough momentum to win the primary, and then need

a huge spike in time for the GE.

[Waiting For Everyman]

52. Wow! Very interesting numbers there, thanks!

[Gothmog]

56. I trust Rachel Maddow's analysis here

"We need a political revolution of millions of people in this country who are prepared to stand up and say, 'enough is enough' ... I want to help lead that effort."
~ Sen. Bernie Sanders

That means that millions of people need to come out and so far there are fewer votes in Iowa and NH than 2008. Where are these millions and don't they need to vote. For the revolution to succeed, Sanders needs sufficient voters to gain the attention of the GOP in Congress which will be difficult since most republicans in the House are in gerrymandered districts and are safe from any sort of pressure from this "revolution."

Again, for Sanders to be viable and be able to keep his campaign promises, it might me nice if this revolution involves some actual voters