Why Hillary Needs Sanders to Drop Out of the Race (and Sanders Has No Need for Hillary to Drop Out)

[Attorney in Texas]

Hillary has only two responses to Sanders.

Either Hillary lies about Sanders' record:



Or Hillary molds her flexible "core values" to become more and more like Sanders (as brilliantly parodied by SNL):



This second option is interfering with Hillary's election strategy because she is planning to swing hard right in the general election after she plans to get the nomination based on empty promises to the left, and the Sanders campaign is fucking with the timing of Hillary's about face.

Sanders does not have a similar problem because he's going to campaign in the general election on the exact same platform he's using to win the nomination.

This -- as much as anything -- is a key difference between the two campaigns.

[farleftlib]

1. It's obviously becoming more difficult for her to keep up the pretense

She seems to be losing it more and more every day. She is no progressive and the strain of the act is starting to tell.

Thanks for the OP. K & R

[reformist2]

2. This is a really good point. If she is the nom, Hillary is going to look so silly swinging right

after the convention. Everyone will know she just spent months trying to be just like "socialist" Bernie, and we'll all be watching in amusement as she morphs into an economic moderate war hawk for the general election. And Hillary won't see the absurdity of it all. She'll be a laughingstock.

[Peace Patriot]

6. Nope, I'm not going to be "watching in amusement as she morphs...".

I frankly don't know what I will be doing but amusement is not one of the options.

[SusanCalvin]

7. Really.

This whole primary season, on both sides, would be hilarious if it weren't dead serious.

[Karma13612]

30. +1000. It is way beyond just the Supreme Court.

Its our very trajectory into the heart of the 21 century, the climate, the planet as a whole.

Although I feel our US President needs to focus mostly on the US, they do have to consider the world as a whole, more so now than in past elections.

I don't like Hillary being mostly focused on her Global view (Clinton Global Initiative), but it's true that our candidates have to have a really good grasp of world issues.

I think Bernie walks the line well. He puts the US at the top of his list of priorities and yet has a great sense of the world and it's trajectory in light of global sociopolitical an climate issues.

[RoccoR5955]

12. And should Clinton get the nod, don't dare criticize her here or on Kos

You will get thrown out on your ass, and under the bus.
That's what Marcos and the admins have essentially said here.

[7962]

20. Hell, you can get a hide NOW for trivial crap!!

[Enthusiast]

26. I told Kos to get fucked.

[Raster]

31. I think Marikos needs to keep in mind just what side his...

...Daily Kos bread is buttered on.

If he STUPIDLY tries to force Hillary on the Kosacks before it is absolutely fucking clear that she is the nominee, which very well may NOT BE THE CASE, he will see mass defections of very unhappy people. Once that happens, KOS will be a shell of it's former self... I don't think Marikos will be quite the media "darling" with a badly damaged website, and damage, I might add, of his own making.

[zentrum]

23. I don't think she cares.

Her arrogance in relation to ordinary people is quite evident. She thinks they're so short attention span and low information, they won't remember. She'll pull Bill out of the woodwork to smarm them and keep telling them her version of history. I think that's her theory.

[PyaarRevolution]

46. Her proof is the Reagan comment on AIDS.

To say ANYTHING positive about that administration when it comes to minorities means you either don't know jackshit about your constituent's history, a real problem or that you DO know and just don't care how it comes off. That's messed up, either way.

[Lorien]

45. Well, it is where she feels most at home:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BC3pZHPPseD/

[staggerleem]

59. To whom, exactly, will she look "silly"?

To the few political junkies here on DU and over on KOS, Alternet, etc.? How much do we count for in the general election? The media EXPECTS (and, truth be known, WANTS) her to tack right, so they're not gonna tell the low-info crowd that she'd doing anything silly - so they won't think it's silly at all! It'll be taken as a "politics as usual" move - nothing more & nothing less.

Here's what I KNOW will happen on the morning of November 9th if a Democratic Candidate wins the election. If it's Bernie, his first move will be to build a transition team and start making cabinet nominations. If it's Hillary, her first move will be to fund the PACs & Super PACs for 2020.

[jillan]

3. Thinking that I hope Bernie goes last tonite at the townhall so he will be able to respond

to her crap. I'm certain that Brock Corp is going thru every bill that Bernie voted for or against to find a controversial amendment that was added to that bill - once again to tell Americans they are stupid and do not know how legislation gets passed.

Bring your tarp, Bernie, she is going down in the polls & you are going to need it tonite.

[Duval]

14. Unfortunately, it didn't happen. Sigh!

[ladyVet]

71. He goes first so she has to shift to meet whatever he said.

It's a brilliant strategy. She's always humping to keep up, and he just sails on, saying what he's always said.

I'd love to see him pull a joke on her, like that old Bugs Bunny/Daffy Duck skit: Bugs says it's duck season, Daffy says, no, it's rabbit season. They go back and forth for a while and then Bugs says, it's rabbit season, Daffy says it's duck season. Bam! No more duck.

[Land of Enchantment]

4. She has nowhere to go.

I keep posting she cannot grow her base. She started out at the peak of her support and has lost varying parts of her base as Bernie has become better known. She is NOT attracting new voters now and certainly will not in the GE.

Just sayin....

[Enthusiast]

27. You are right, of course.

It's true.

[PyaarRevolution]

47. Her message has been "No we can't".

For many of the things Bernie proposes and even some of the things she could easily change her mind on with no repercussions she steadfastedly attaches to, like talking about doing studies on the effects of Marijuana before legalizing it. WTF?! Oh wait, this is because her private prison friends are getting a cheap date and a good amount of profit with all those non-violent offenders.

[nxylas]

68. Nothing excites the voters like cautious incrementalism

With apologies to Tom Tomorrow.

[noiretextatique]

72. Yep

A real winning message that will mobilize the youth vote. The plan was to let Drumpfenstein loose to terrorize the villagers into voting for Hillary. Bernie is messing up the plan.

[pdsimdars]

54. That is the known reality and the data backs this up but . . .

The Hillarians refuse to comprehend it, just like global warming deniers refuse to accept that data.

[Bleacher Creature]

5. The is utter nonsense.

Her entire strategy thus far has been to recreate the Obama coalition, which won two general elections. That means appealing to PoC, single women, and other groups that certainly won't respond well to her moving "hard right." If we get our people to the polls, we win. This imaginary group of cross-over Republicans who will respond to her moving to the right doesn't exist.

You are welcome to your opinions, but this is factually wrong.

[PoliticAverse]

8. Her recent effusive praise of both Reagans was an early indicator. n/t

[winter is coming]

10. Her playing Hokey Pokey with whether she's a progressive or a moderate

is another tell. She claimed that "no one took a back seat" to her when it came to being a progressive, then a short time later proclaimed herself to be a proud moderate. Then Bernie's campaign failed to wither and suddenly she was a progressive, trying to cover all of Bernie's positions.

[Bleacher Creature]

11. Please tell me this is a joke.

Trying to say something nice at a dead woman's funeral is now a harbinger of a major shift in strategy?

Are the Bernie folks even listening to what they're saying anymore?

[markpkessinger]

16. She didn't just "say something nice" . . .

. . . Sanders released a nice statement. Nobody expected her to spit on Nancy's grave. But we sure as HELL didn't expect her to fabricate a non-existent history concerning the appalling obscenity that was the Reagans' (both of them) AIDS legacy!

[Enthusiast]

28. +1!

[PyaarRevolution]

49. She could've said something nice and safe about stem cell research.

Her pushing it. Instead she says the biggest, boldface lie on the Reagan Administration that all those in the GLBT community know is bullshit. I mean it's like seeing someone's fist a mile away and you run towards it.

[sarge43]

17. Lying at a dead woman's funeral is not "nice".

Of course, in an alternate universe the Reagan administration did put the full force of the federal gov't to work helping AIDS victims and finding a cure. It also made several public statements to that effect. In that universe Clinton did say something "nice".

Do Clinton supporters ever listen to themselves?

[Enthusiast]

29. +1!

[dflprincess]

35. They apparently don't listen to their candidate either. nt

[truebluegreen]

60. Even if we disregard that little bit of "misspeaking"

or "misremembering" or whatever it was, how do you characterize her recent offer to "compromise" on abortion? Like it should be up to any politicians. Ugh.

[shawn703]

13. What was it Obama's chief of staff called progressives

When we took issue with him pivoting right and dropping the public option? Why do you think one Wall Street candidate will be any different than the other?

[passiveporcupine]

15. So why do you think she has swung so hard to the left

during this campaign? Doesn't it worry you at all? It isn't natural to swing like that and then stick to it after you win.

[pdsimdars]

55. Bernie and the Republican vote

Thom Hartmann says that he used to live in Vermont and Bernie routinely got 20% of the Republican vote because they knew him and trusted him.
That ain't happenin' with Hill.

[Nickel79]

9. Comedy and satire

are such an effective way of communicating the truth, as evidenced by people such as Jon Stewart and Bill Maher.

[rocktivity]

18. You're welcome.

rocktivity

[dflprincess]

37. I saw that last night - one of the best things SNL has done in a long time

and so honest I'm sure it was painful for her supporters to watch.

[geardaddy]

61. This should be its own OP.

[turbinetree]

19. The ultimate game...................................

Honk-----------------------for a political revolutions Bernie 2016

[Beacool]

21. Sanders can stay until the convention, Hillary will still be the nominee.

Pledged delegates and popular vote.......

[Gore1FL]

22. Maybe. But we'll actually want to have elections and count the votes. n/t

[leftofcool]

32. Hillary will still be ahead in the popular vote and delegates.

[Gore1FL]

34. Maybe.

But we still will want to have the elections and count the votes.

[greiner3]

25. If Hillary doesn't have the magic number of delegates

Prior to the convention and only gets in by SDs then the stink will be heard through the election and through her only term.

[leftofcool]

33. She will have them. She is more than half way there already

[Gore1FL]

39. You define "half" differenlty that I have seen it used in the past.

According to CNN she is ahead by 221 pledged delegates

That isn't half.

Even if you include super delegates 1244/4765 is less than 50%.

[onenote]

76. I think the point was that Clinton is halfway to the 50.1 percent mark in delegates

Which is what it takes to win the nomination.

2383 delegates are need to win. Halfway there is 1192. According to CNN, Clinton is at 1096 in pledged delegates, or less than 100 delegates shy of the half way mark relying only on pledged delegates. If super delegates are included, she's at 1568, which puts her well past halfway to a winning margin (two-thirds of the way if my math is right).

[anothergreenbus]

40. She won't have a term.

If we want to return to progressive values let them try this and see what happens.
In four years there will be hell to pay.

[Beacool]

43. Then it'll be like 2008.

In that election neither Obama nor Hillary had the necessary pledged delegates to win the nomination outright. Obama was ahead in both the popular vote and in pledged delegates by a small amount (I think it was something like 104 delegates). For the sake of the unity of the party, at the convention Hillary released her super delegates from any commitment to her and they switched to Obama.

If there's a similar situation this year, the super delegates will go with the person who is ahead in pledged delegates. That will probably be Hillary.

[Ken Burch]

52. only at the moment. Most Dems haven't voted yet.

n/t.

[Major Hogwash]

69. Michigan.

Ohio. Florida. Illinois. New York. California.

[Beacool]

73. Delegates......

He only won MI by 1.5%, which meant that she got almost as many delegates as he did.

He will not get a blow out win in the remaining big states. Hillary is ahead by 208 pledged delegates.

[warrprayer]

24. K&R

For Bernie

[anothergreenbus]

36. Brilliant A in T.

That sums it up perfectly.

[Uncle Joe]

38. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, Attorney in Texas.

[Dustlawyer]

41. +1!!! Yes, commentators and pundits talk about a shift in earlier campaign promises

as if this is the way things should be. By their open discussions of the expected shift for the General Election, they get their audience to accept that this is the way things are, and that its ok. Basically, they admit that the candidates have to say one thing to one group, and something else to another.

Bernie doesn't play that way. The MSM doesn't know how to handle it (see Tweety's interview of Bernie). If it weren't for their marching orders to be dismissive and repeat Hillary's smears, they would be lost.

[winter is coming]

42. Well said. I've seen some pushing the idea that we need to

"unite the party" behind a nominee now so we'll have a leg up for November. Seriously? We need seven-and-a-half months to unite?

We don't need that time to unite. HRC needs that time to evolve again without looking like a rubber band snapping back into place.

[dana_b]

44. That may be true but he has said that he's in it until the convention

so she better start telling the truth and embracing her positions, or coming up with a new game plan.

[senz]

48. Thanks, AiT. The two campaigns couldn't be more different.

Hers is forced and fraudulent, his is natural and truthful.

[hay rick]

50. She's going for the lesser evil vote.

It's all she wants from me and the most I have to offer. At this point I view her candidacy as a powerful demonstration of the need for a third party.

[Vote2016]

51. kicked and rec'd

[Onlooker]

53. Hillary and Sanders have their own separate strengths and weaknesses

Sanders is an ideologue, Hillary is a politician.
Sanders lived where he rarely had to compromise, Hillary lived where she had to compromise.
Sanders grew up with the privileges of being white and male, Hillary grew up with the challenges of being female in a sexist time.
Sanders views are 50 years old, Hillary's views have evolved.
Sanders will be presented by the right as a Communist, Hillary will be presented as dishonest.
Sanders has difficulty with people of color; Hillary has difficulty with millennials.
Etc.

[asuhornets]

56. No. The key difference

is if Sanders is the Democratic nominee, the Dems will lose the general election. I still don't get why you guys think Bernie will win in the GE. He doesn't even look like a president. The political revolution does not exist, and if it does, it is not a diverse coalition. which is what he needs to win the GE.

[Major Nikon]

57. Results...

On Mon Mar 14, 2016, 07:52 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

No. The key difference
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1487560

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

"He doesn't even look like a president." Really? Are we back to attacking candidates' looks? Disruptive and inappropriate.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Mon Mar 14, 2016, 08:01 AM, and the Jury voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Oh my. Silly alert.
Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Inappropriate body-shaming.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Brilliantly stupid post, but suggest saving the lame alerts for the hillbots.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Seems like an opinion to me.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I'm not sure what is the correct "look" for a presidential candidate to have. Nonetheless, let the post stay as part of the discourse, so that those who disagree with him can get in their two cents. - mahatmakanejeeves
Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: We do not attack personal appearance.

[asuhornets]

58. Oh well

[gcomeau]

62. All polling on the matter says you're full of it.

[AlbertCat]

64. He doesn't even look like a president.

Uh.... neither does Hillary.

But looks, in case you don't know, are not the main concern when choosing a president. Neither is gender nor are surnames.

[GreatGazoo]

65. What the heck does "He doesn't even look like a president" mean ?

also:

[asuhornets]

66. Well I don't want to get too personal, with all the alerts and all...n/t

[GreatGazoo]

67. maybe you could describe what a president looks like and I'll fill in the blanks?

Here is what I have heard already: suit fits too loose, too much hand waving, the iconic Yoda/Albert Einstein hair... (?)

None of those matter to me and I'm not sure they matter to others. 8 years ago this country, thankfully, elected a man who not only looked like no prior president but also had what many considered a funny name. I take that as proof that that stuff doesn't matter anymore. Or at the least, it does not matter more than their record, their platform and the alternative candidate.

I hear you on the alerts. Personally I don't expect everyone on here to agree with me and I am not easily offended. I don't believe that the alert system should be used to drive others off of DU. MIRT does fine in extreme or obvious cases. I come for an open discussion and have generally enjoyed them until about 2 months back...when the alert wars started.

[lumberjack_jeff]

70. Exactly! He hardly looks presidential at all! Not like Obama or Hillary who totally do. n/t

[bvf]

63. Perfectly logical take on this.

The lies have just begun, and will become even more vile, but will not go unanswered.

[Cali_Democrat]

74. Still think Hillary should drop out?

After she won all five states tonight?

[revbones]

77. Yes. nt

[Demsrule86]

75. Sander can not win after last night

Sanders only hurts the Democrats chances by staying in...there is no point. He needs to suspend his campaign and turn towards the general.

[revbones]

78. Aside from that being false

Hillary stayed in the race in 2008 and it didn't seem to hurt Obama...