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jillan

(39,451 posts)
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:22 PM Mar 2016

Some explanation on what is going wrong in Az at the polls today.

You've been hearing the stories all day about people who checked in to vote couldn't vote because the registration was wrong.
I witnessed it myself when I went to vote. (not me - someone checking in at the same time)
Spoke with someone that has been a registered Democrat his entire life, checked in today and it showed him as a Republican.

People are bringing their voter registration cards in to the polling places to prove that they are registered as a Dem or Rep yet may are showing up as independents, or in the case above - the wrong party.

These people are being forced to cast a Provisional Ballot which does not get counted right away unless the election is too close to call. Or at the very very end, usually after the race has been called.
Hopefully you all know that

This only seems to be happening in Maricopa county, the largest county.

Just heard on our liberal talk radio that earlier this year the Sec of State office or Country Recorders office hired an outside firm to electronically count the ballots.
They feel that the problem happened when the state switched computer systems and info was not transferred over correctly.
And obviously they did not do a trial run. This is probably happening to the repugs as well.

Now this is the important part -
If you are on social media (twitter, facebook, instagram, etc) and you hear of anyone having these problems Tell them to STAY and fill out the Provisional Ballot and to get a receipt.
We need to get an accurate count on the number of people that were disenfranchised today at the polls to PROVE that is was not just a few voters that forgot to change their registration and that it is a problem with the state's system.


Help spread the word.

On another note - turnout is large and polling places are running out of ballots - which is a pile of crap that is happening.
73 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Some explanation on what is going wrong in Az at the polls today. (Original Post) jillan Mar 2016 OP
Great, useful post. K&R nt geek tragedy Mar 2016 #1
I C&P this and shared on FB. Very, very important..n/t monmouth4 Mar 2016 #2
Thanks - ya - we need to get the word out. jillan Mar 2016 #4
Running Out of Ballots noretreatnosurrender Mar 2016 #3
One polling place reported that are running out of REPUBLICAN ballots DesertRat Mar 2016 #53
This stands out to me and I didn't know that fact NWCorona Mar 2016 #5
I don't think that's correct. Wilms Mar 2016 #9
I've been trying to find out the same info NWCorona Mar 2016 #13
Here we go. Wilms Mar 2016 #16
I did change it a little, they are counted, but not right away unless it is too close to call. jillan Mar 2016 #21
That's not likely to be correct, either. Wilms Mar 2016 #28
Don't know about Arizona specifically, but I think that provisional ballots are usually not counted. eomer Mar 2016 #69
Very good digging! NWCorona Mar 2016 #22
Somehow, voting irregularities are NEVER addressed. CentralCoaster Mar 2016 #6
Hearing from unconfirmed sources that lawyers from the Dem Party are on top of this. jillan Mar 2016 #8
Seems every election problem seems to impact Bernie negatively. Funny thing that. / FlatBaroque Mar 2016 #7
Once is a fluke. VulgarPoet Mar 2016 #63
This year seems very odd Mike__M Mar 2016 #10
Well, think about this question in the same way and I think you'll come to a conclusion. aidbo Mar 2016 #36
jillian, I think the provisionals DO get counted. Wilms Mar 2016 #11
At the very very end. The election will probably be called before they get around to it. jillan Mar 2016 #17
Let's try to get the info out correctly. Wilms Mar 2016 #20
I fixed it. You're right. But this is Az we are talking about ........> jillan Mar 2016 #27
Right. Report EXACTLY that! Wilms Mar 2016 #29
Obviously we need exit polling and UN poll watchers Lorien Mar 2016 #62
That's right. n/t DesertRat Mar 2016 #52
They've called it with only 2% of the vote in from precincts that still have voters waiting in line! Lorien Mar 2016 #61
Wow.. that is really bad. DCBob Mar 2016 #12
NOT A DEMOCRACY! http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/princeton-experts-say-us-no-longer-democracy highprincipleswork Mar 2016 #14
"electronically count the ballots" hmmmmmmm.... amborin Mar 2016 #15
No problems here in Cochise County when I voted for Bernie this morning. panader0 Mar 2016 #18
That's good to hear that things are going well in Cochise. jillan Mar 2016 #19
Thanks for the update. Had a similar problem in NM in last year's June Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #23
This message was self-deleted by its author cyberpj Mar 2016 #33
Arizona has open records, if anyone wants to search PADemD Mar 2016 #24
Kansas has open records too. -none Mar 2016 #56
HOTLINE (704) 746-9120 If Forced To Use Provisional Ballot Erroneously... AzDar Mar 2016 #25
you can register to vote, change your party or DesertFlower Mar 2016 #26
The problem is, people did that. Many had their voter registration cards with them for proof. jillan Mar 2016 #30
This message was self-deleted by its author cyberpj Mar 2016 #32
This sounds more like total, complete incompetence by the repukes that run our state more jillan Mar 2016 #35
az has a history of election theft questionseverything Mar 2016 #73
i checked my registration on line and then voted by mail. DesertFlower Mar 2016 #34
Oh - you did early voting. I haven't heard any probs with early voting ballots - have you? jillan Mar 2016 #37
i always do early voting. i have scoliosis and DesertFlower Mar 2016 #39
I thought ? you are a Hillary supporter? jillan Mar 2016 #44
i am. i didn't get what you meant when i first read it. DesertFlower Mar 2016 #45
I'm on the permanent early voting list here too DesertRat Mar 2016 #48
my late husband was on the permanent list too. i wonder DesertFlower Mar 2016 #50
I'm sorry for your loss DesertRat Mar 2016 #57
thank you. he's been gone 4 years. DesertFlower Mar 2016 #64
The early ballots were identical to the ones at the polls today DesertRat Mar 2016 #49
The exact same thing happened here in Florida Lorien Mar 2016 #60
This message was self-deleted by its author cyberpj Mar 2016 #31
keep it kicked for AZ voters! pat_k Mar 2016 #38
Sounds to me like they are trying to screw Hillary out of votes. nt Jitter65 Mar 2016 #40
There are MANY new first time voters here who are Hispanic DesertRat Mar 2016 #47
Kick and R BeanMusical Mar 2016 #41
The MSM should agree NOT to call AZ until the provisional ballots are counted. n/t. Ken Burch Mar 2016 #42
Or until the people have all voted. People were waiting to vote when they called it. Now those jillan Mar 2016 #51
Fucking A. Ducey dukes on the voters. JEB Mar 2016 #43
And another reason for the large turnout here in Maricopa County... DesertRat Mar 2016 #46
Vote counting shouldn't be done by private companies. NT Eric J in MN Mar 2016 #54
It's a conspiracy !!! cosmicone Mar 2016 #55
Hillary voters were impacted as well. I hope you understand that. She may have lost 10 delegates jillan Mar 2016 #59
yep...disenfranchisement is just hilarious noiretextatique Mar 2016 #70
Why can't our elections be monitored by other, outside entities? -none Mar 2016 #58
K&R'd! snot Mar 2016 #65
Helen Purcell should resign. joshcryer Mar 2016 #66
This "outside firm" needs to be investigated. Waiting For Everyman Mar 2016 #67
Bernie doesn't have a network of corporate resources to tap into kristopher Mar 2016 #68
Exactly. nt Lorien Mar 2016 #72
Hold the Associated Press accountable as well Lorien Mar 2016 #71

DesertRat

(27,995 posts)
53. One polling place reported that are running out of REPUBLICAN ballots
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 11:37 PM
Mar 2016

is what I'm hearing here. A huge turnout out for Trump.

NWCorona

(8,541 posts)
5. This stands out to me and I didn't know that fact
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:27 PM
Mar 2016

"These people are being forced to cast a Provisional Ballot which does not get counted unless the election is too close to call."

Thanks!

 

Wilms

(26,795 posts)
9. I don't think that's correct.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:34 PM
Mar 2016

I've been trying to track the law, itself. But so far, I am finding reports of elections where they were counting the provisionals.

NWCorona

(8,541 posts)
13. I've been trying to find out the same info
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:37 PM
Mar 2016

But it looks like every state might do it differently? This stuff should be spelled out plainly.

Very frustrating!

 

Wilms

(26,795 posts)
16. Here we go.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:41 PM
Mar 2016
Why did I have to vote a provisional ballot?

A provisional ballot is given to anyone who is not on the polling location’s roster or if the voter was unable to provide a valid form of identification. There are a few reasons why your name was not included on the roster.

You recently moved and did not update your voter information in time
You voted at a polling place not assigned to you
You requested an early ballot by mail
Your voter registration is no longer active or you are not registered at all

If you voted at the correct polling place, provided proper identification and are registered to vote in the county in which you voted, your provisional ballot will be counted.

http://www.azsos.gov/elections/voting-election

jillan

(39,451 posts)
21. I did change it a little, they are counted, but not right away unless it is too close to call.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:44 PM
Mar 2016
 

Wilms

(26,795 posts)
28. That's not likely to be correct, either.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:56 PM
Mar 2016

I wrote elsewhere on the thread that they will first have to verify that the provisional will be allowed. Then they will count it. And that DOES take time.

eomer

(3,845 posts)
69. Don't know about Arizona specifically, but I think that provisional ballots are usually not counted.
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 07:33 AM
Mar 2016

And that would be even if there are enough of them to change the results of an election. Of course in a proportional delegate primary, counting or not counting them would often change the resulting allocation of delegates, much more often than in a winner-take-all situation.

But the bottom line is that, as I understand it, provisional ballots are typically counted only if the voter goes through a process to resolve the problem that kept them from voting a regular ballot in the first place. That is usually not possible for a voter to accomplish because the bureaucracy blocks out any ability to do so. And most voters don't try anyway, either because they don't know it's required or because they don't take the time to do it.

 

CentralCoaster

(1,163 posts)
6. Somehow, voting irregularities are NEVER addressed.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:30 PM
Mar 2016

Problems in 2000 and 2004, hell, in every election, we find them, we're shocked, yet never are charges brought or wrongs righted.

Then, four years later, same problems.

Where is the FEC, where are the state auditors, why does this happen over and over again?

jillan

(39,451 posts)
8. Hearing from unconfirmed sources that lawyers from the Dem Party are on top of this.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:33 PM
Mar 2016


Hope that doesn't mean DWS!

Mike__M

(1,052 posts)
10. This year seems very odd
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:35 PM
Mar 2016

I've been an election-night result viewer since I was twelve (Nixon/McGovern), and except for the 2000 revelations, I never remember this many cases of questionable polling.
I know that for most of those years all we had to go on was the three TV networks, backed up by AP and UPI the next morning; then we got cable and public radio. Now we have live reports from anyone with a mobile device. Is that the difference? Is it because ordinary people are watching closely now? Or is something really gone wrong with voting?

 

aidbo

(2,328 posts)
36. Well, think about this question in the same way and I think you'll come to a conclusion.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 09:04 PM
Mar 2016

Do you think that back before smart phones (or even just personal video recorders) with video capability came about, there were just not as many cops harassing or beating people of color?

In my opinion, shit like this has been going on since the beginning. It's just that now people have a way to get the word out.

 

Wilms

(26,795 posts)
11. jillian, I think the provisionals DO get counted.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:36 PM
Mar 2016

I can't find the law, but there are articles referring to them being counted.

But it will take time. They need to first verify it, then count it.

 

Wilms

(26,795 posts)
20. Let's try to get the info out correctly.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:44 PM
Mar 2016

They will be counted. If an election is really close, I think the number of provisionals will be part of the reportage and consideration before anyone calls it.

jillan

(39,451 posts)
27. I fixed it. You're right. But this is Az we are talking about ........>
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:55 PM
Mar 2016

Arizona 2012 Provisional Ballots not counted.



On Thursday, more than a hundred people — activists, high school students who worked for months to register voters, and voters who said they were forced to use provisional ballots — protested outside the election center.

http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2012/11/09/us/20121110_BALLOTS-2.html
The whole story is told at the link.

There was a similar problem in 2004 where boxes of uncounted ballots were found in an Airplane Hanger months after the election.

 

Wilms

(26,795 posts)
29. Right. Report EXACTLY that!
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:58 PM
Mar 2016

Long story, but for the people working to increase election integrity, it really helps to keep the info accurate.

Lorien

(31,935 posts)
61. They've called it with only 2% of the vote in from precincts that still have voters waiting in line!
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 12:04 AM
Mar 2016

I've never heard of the AP jumping the gun like this before. Stinks to high heaven!

DCBob

(24,689 posts)
12. Wow.. that is really bad.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:37 PM
Mar 2016

I hope they get that sorted out. No excuse for that type of incompetence.

Thanks for letting us know.

panader0

(25,816 posts)
18. No problems here in Cochise County when I voted for Bernie this morning.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:42 PM
Mar 2016

The polling place was moved from the fire station that I've voted at for years to a church.
The voting machines were new. You were issued a paper ballot that was fed into the machine.
There was only one race on the ballot. I cast my vote for Bernie and then took my paper to another
machine, and that was it. I'm still not happy with the way votes are cast and counted.
It should be standardized nationwide and verifiable.
The people working the place were very polite and I thanked them for their work.

Land of Enchantment

(1,217 posts)
23. Thanks for the update. Had a similar problem in NM in last year's June
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:46 PM
Mar 2016

primary. I've been a registered Dem since 1971, never changed anything. But, the THING in charge (who resembled Roach Man from 'Men in Black' who was indeed a republican woman) tried to tell me I was not on the rolls. I produced my state registration card and they 'found' me after about 20 minutes. This is bullshit and I really hope AZ laws count ALL provisional ballots. Just creeps me out.





Response to Land of Enchantment (Reply #23)

 

AzDar

(14,023 posts)
25. HOTLINE (704) 746-9120 If Forced To Use Provisional Ballot Erroneously...
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:50 PM
Mar 2016
https://www.facebook.com/geoff.woods.148/videos/10205656258717439/

It was in the upper 80's today... @ what point is it 'suppression'?

DesertFlower

(11,649 posts)
26. you can register to vote, change your party or
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:50 PM
Mar 2016

just check to make sure your registered to vote on service arizona.

https://servicearizona.com/applicationFAQ/voter

you can do other things too -- a very useful site.

jillan

(39,451 posts)
30. The problem is, people did that. Many had their voter registration cards with them for proof.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 08:58 PM
Mar 2016

The info was different on the system used to check in. It's not just a few people. That's why people need to fill out those provisional ballots so they can get an accurate count.

Like I said, they believe this happened when they went to a different system to count the votes.

Response to jillan (Reply #30)

jillan

(39,451 posts)
35. This sounds more like total, complete incompetence by the repukes that run our state more
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 09:03 PM
Mar 2016

than anything else.

Not putting on that tinfoil hat - yet

questionseverything

(9,631 posts)
73. az has a history of election theft
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 01:46 PM
Mar 2016
http://www.sweetremedy.tv/fatallyflawed/media/RTA_Fraud_Flyer_3_7_12.pdf

if you read that evidence and deny that az elections can be stolen, i don't know what to say

we the people have every right to oversee our elections from beginning to end, demanding that right does not require "tinfoil"

jillan

(39,451 posts)
37. Oh - you did early voting. I haven't heard any probs with early voting ballots - have you?
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 09:06 PM
Mar 2016

This was happening today at the polls.

That actually would make sense tho. Because the early ballots were probably sent out from the SoS office, and were different than the computers in polling places? I don't know - I'm just thinking out loud right now

I'm sure we will find out soon enough.

Yay that both of us didn't have any problems except for cancelling out each other's vote.

DesertFlower

(11,649 posts)
39. i always do early voting. i have scoliosis and
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 09:21 PM
Mar 2016

can't stand for more than a few minutes.

thank goodness for voting by mail.

did we cancel each other's vote?

DesertFlower

(11,649 posts)
45. i am. i didn't get what you meant when i first read it.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 11:03 PM
Mar 2016

i was a bernie supporter and about 6 weeks ago changed to hillary.

DesertRat

(27,995 posts)
48. I'm on the permanent early voting list here too
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 11:27 PM
Mar 2016

As are all the members of my extended family. It makes life so much easier. I like to mail mine back and my dh likes to take his in person on election day. But at least he can go straight to the head of the line and drop it off.

DesertRat

(27,995 posts)
49. The early ballots were identical to the ones at the polls today
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 11:30 PM
Mar 2016

So glad I'm on the permanent early voting list.

Lorien

(31,935 posts)
60. The exact same thing happened here in Florida
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 12:02 AM
Mar 2016

and poll workers said that there was nothing they could do.

Response to jillan (Original post)

jillan

(39,451 posts)
51. Or until the people have all voted. People were waiting to vote when they called it. Now those
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 11:34 PM
Mar 2016

people will go home.

Dammit.

jillan

(39,451 posts)
59. Hillary voters were impacted as well. I hope you understand that. She may have lost 10 delegates
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 12:02 AM
Mar 2016

tonite.

Laugh away.

noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
70. yep...disenfranchisement is just hilarious
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 09:52 AM
Mar 2016

Remember that when you are imploring people to vote in November.

-none

(1,884 posts)
58. Why can't our elections be monitored by other, outside entities?
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 11:58 PM
Mar 2016

You know like we do certain other countries? The are international agencies that monitor elections, but we do not allow them to monitor ours. That needs to change.

How can Bernie Sanders draw such big crowds, but get so few votes in so many states? Something is not right.

BTY, Arizona looks kinda like Florida in 2000, except for the Supreme Court appointment. Debbie, is that you?

My bullshit meter is pegging.

Waiting For Everyman

(9,385 posts)
67. This "outside firm" needs to be investigated.
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 02:35 AM
Mar 2016

Because this sounds like some bullshit.

Several states already have been highly questionable, and enough is enough with this too. Bernie needs to get some legal teams on this and catch whoever is interfering with the vote red-handed.

And why are we not hearing about this happening on the Republican side in any of these same questionable states?

My strong hunch is the DNC is doing this, the wholly owned subsidiary of ClintonCorp.

kristopher

(29,798 posts)
68. Bernie doesn't have a network of corporate resources to tap into
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 03:05 AM
Mar 2016

Being outside the established network of power is part of the "uphill" and the "slog".

But you're right, so I guess I'll try to to chip in.

Lorien

(31,935 posts)
71. Hold the Associated Press accountable as well
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 12:01 PM
Mar 2016

Hit the AP's Facebook page. They called it for Hillary with only 2% of precincts reporting, while people were still standing in line to vote and while they KNEW that massive election fraud was taking place with over one million newly registered Democrats (re-registered within the past year) being turned away from the polls: https://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Associated-Press-450-West-33rd-Street-NY-NY/123605331021842 You can call or write them as well: (212) 621-1500 Associated Press: 450 West 33rd St. New York, NY 10001

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