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amborin

(16,631 posts)
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 10:37 AM Mar 2016

WAPO: Arizona's Primary: Was It Just A Big Mistake? Or Something More Nefarious?

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/arizona%e2%80%99s-primary-was-an-utter-disaster-but-was-it-just-a-big-mistake-or-something-more-nefarious/ar-BBrb3H0?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=HPCDHP

Arizona’s primary was an utter disaster. But was it just a big mistake, or something more nefarious?

...If the botched election happened in a vacuum, perhaps the long lines might not have become such an explosive political issue. But voting rights activists who were on the ground that day say there are too many parallels to past fudged elections in Arizona not to wonder whether there's something more sinister going on.

"We don't know if they were honest mistakes or not, but there's certainly a pattern of mistakes," said Shuya Ohno, director of the Right to Vote campaign at the nonpartisan civil rights organization Advancement Project.

Voting rights advocates say Latino voters didn't want to mail in their ballot because many recalled the bottleneck during 2012's heated election when controversial Sheriff Joe Arpaio was on the ballot. People in minority communities waited in long lines, and eventually many had to cast provisional ballots that weren't counted until almost a month later. That same year, the county sent out a Spanish-language announcement that had the wrong voting day on it.

Going back to March 22's election, voting rights activists say they have evidence the poll closures were heaviest in the most disadvantaged areas of the county, like West Phoenix, which has a big minority population. They add they did not find nearly the volume of independent voters officials said there were.

They also argue that Arizona's voting laws don't suggest an openness to minority voters. Arizona's governor signed a bill making it a felony for third-party groups, like nonprofits, to collect and submit early ballots on behalf of voters. It's a move advocates say further discourages minority voters from participating. And Arizona is one of two states that required voters to prove their citizenship when applying to vote (though the courts recently said the states can't require a proof-of-citizenship document for voters registering via a federal form).

This is the first national election since a 2013 Supreme Court ruling on the Voting Rights Act meant that Arizona no longer has to review its changes to polling locations by the Department of Justice. Some wonder whether this would have happened if the federal government had a chance to intervene.


The bottom line: No one knows (yet)

People wait in line to vote in at Mountain View Lutheran Church in Phoenix.© David Kadlubowski/The Arizona Republic via AP People wait in line to vote in at Mountain View Lutheran Church in Phoenix.
Stepping back from the rhetoric, it's unclear what county and state officials would have to gain from trying to disenfranchise Phoenix-area voters. They or their colleagues weren't on the ballot, and you could argue that cutting polling locations by 70 percent would have been a pretty brash and conspicuous way to go about using this election for political gain.

It was also a primary, meaning disenfranchising certain voter groups like Latinos wouldn't necessarily have accrued to Republicans' benefit. The parties were simply picking their presidential nominees, after all -- not casting their electoral votes.

But suspicion will remain until Arizona officials give more definitive answers about what happened. Right now, there's not one person or action that frustrated voters can point to to explain what went wrong. The uncertainty only fuels partisan theories. Plus, there's still the fact that in the United States of America in 2016, thousands of people had to wait in line for hours to vote.

The nation's eyes will likely stay on Arizona for the near future, and not just on the potential legal and political fallout from Maricopa County's botched election: The state still has three
36 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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WAPO: Arizona's Primary: Was It Just A Big Mistake? Or Something More Nefarious? (Original Post) amborin Mar 2016 OP
Just more Republican cost cutting foolishness and nothing more. Trust Buster Mar 2016 #1
Hillary benefits from so much of the malfeasance and we need to acknowledge and discuss that CoffeeCat Mar 2016 #2
Many voters still operate under the illusion of a two party system. NorthCarolina Mar 2016 #5
People should not be afraid to discuss this. We shouldn't avoid discussing this CoffeeCat Mar 2016 #6
Discussion will never transpire as long as New-Dems call the shots in the party. NorthCarolina Mar 2016 #7
I wholeheartedly agree CoffeeCat Mar 2016 #17
I copied that PDF if you are interested (the one that was hidden then scrubbed), I still have it Dragonfli Mar 2016 #13
Thank you for that CoffeeCat Mar 2016 #36
Yeah, well maybe, but the OP states that most of the poll closings were in minority areas brush Mar 2016 #4
Republicans control the state of Arizona. They hate Hillary. Did they artificially raise the costs Trust Buster Mar 2016 #3
But if Republicans wanted to rig the General Election CoffeeCat Mar 2016 #8
Excellent point! Scuba Mar 2016 #10
Not all Republicans actually hate Hillary Clinton. PufPuf23 Mar 2016 #11
^^ this ^^ a lot of them prefer her over their candidates amborin Mar 2016 #15
Bingo marions ghost Mar 2016 #25
What about all of the other states? Skwmom Mar 2016 #9
A lot of states are trying to take their elections BernieforPres2016 Mar 2016 #12
Bernie is going after the Republican governors in his Pittsburgh speech right now BernieforPres2016 Mar 2016 #16
Every time I hear Bernie say this me b zola Mar 2016 #18
No doubt the establishment Dems will piggyback on these efforts when it benefits them BernieforPres2016 Mar 2016 #19
Nothing about people's party affiliations being changed?? xynthee Mar 2016 #14
It's a conspiracy !!! cosmicone Mar 2016 #20
Oh, look. Hillary Supporter mocking voter suppression. frylock Mar 2016 #22
Oh look ... a tinfoil hat !!! cosmicone Mar 2016 #24
So this never happened then? frylock Mar 2016 #27
Hillary did it!!!! JoePhilly Mar 2016 #21
I didn't see that mentioned in the article. frylock Mar 2016 #23
So you hope GOP voter suppression hurts the Democrats in November? JoePhilly Mar 2016 #26
You don't seem to care that GOP voter suppression hurts the Democrats in March. frylock Mar 2016 #28
I can care about voter supression in March ... JoePhilly Mar 2016 #30
Nothing in THIS post even suggested that. frylock Mar 2016 #31
I will, thanks. JoePhilly Mar 2016 #32
I'll be here in November to remind you of this conversation. frylock Mar 2016 #33
Sure, you can come to Hillary's victory party. JoePhilly Mar 2016 #34
Yeah, will do. frylock Mar 2016 #35
Doesn't need to be a conspiracy. Plenty of Repubs happy to act on their "own initiative." pat_k Mar 2016 #29
 

Trust Buster

(7,299 posts)
1. Just more Republican cost cutting foolishness and nothing more.
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 10:40 AM
Mar 2016

Flint wasn't a conspiracy either. It was cost cutting foolishness. Republican voters were subject to the same voting precinct closing.

CoffeeCat

(24,411 posts)
2. Hillary benefits from so much of the malfeasance and we need to acknowledge and discuss that
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 10:53 AM
Mar 2016

I'm glad to see the WaPo (of all publications) acknowledging that solely blaming Arizona voting problems on Republicans--is curious.

I just wrote this response in another thread. I'll post it here too. I think we need to start discussing how Hillary benefits from so much of the problems in these elections and caucuses. These problems have become epidemic. Our Democratic primary process has become a crazed shit show.
------------------------------------

I think party is irrelevant here--It bothers me that Hillary benefitted from these problems.

We see clear evidence that the power structure in modern-day US politics is comprised of both Republicans and Democrats who are in bed with the corporations. They're fiercely gripping that power with their collective talons.

Who benefitted from what happened in Arizona? I think it's important to at least discuss that Hillary Clinton was the biggest benefactor. More Bernie voters were disenfranchised, and it appears that Independents who switched to Democratic were hit the hardest. Furthermore, the drastic reduction in polling locations in Maricopa County definitely hit Bernie the hardest. Arizona State University is located in Tempe and is the largest university in the country.

Although these were Republican players Hillary benefitted. At the very least, this needs to be acknowledged and part of the discussion.

It's not extraordinary to ponder collusion here. She benefitted, not the Republicans. In fact, the whole theory that this was done as a "trial run" to help Republicans is ludicrous, in my opinion. This situation alerted everyone to a problem. The problem is being investigated. Changes will most likely be made. People will be on high alert during the GE. No....this benefitted Hillary Clinton.

The media also called the race for her with a very small percentage of the vote in. They did this while people were standing in line.

We don't need to have rock-solid proof to understand that our Democratic primary elections and caucus have been a collective shit storm. All of the chaos, dirty games, disenfranchisement, voter suppression and look at the fiasco that happened in my own state of Iowa.

In 2008, our Iowa caucuses had record attendance. This year--from top to bottom the entire process has been a hell hole. You had rampant cheating in so many locations. Some were caught on videotape. The caucus ended with a .2 margin between Clinton and Sanders. Iowans were finding errors. The head of the Iowa Democratic Party, Andy McGuire is a longtime Clinton supporter (she has the license plate that says "HRC2016&quot . She wouldn't even CONSIDER an examination of the caucus results, despite Iowans screaming that they were finding errors in the official counts--that were visible in a PDF on the Iowa Democratic Party (IDP) website.

It wasn't until the Des Moines Register wrote a scathing article, "Something Smells in the Iowa Democratic Caucuses" that McGuire was forced to relent and change a few errors. By Sunday, the PDF that was visible on the front page of the Iowa Democratic Party website had been removed. It was no longer visible. This means--no way for Iowans to find additional errors. This was only five days after the Iowa Caucuses!!!! Iowans were just learning that "something smelled" and that problems existed. But there would be no way for Iowans to check the official IDP results with their own precinct results---because the PDF that listed all officially reported precinct results---was gone.

This was the first state primary. My state. You tell me that this is nothing. All a big misunderstanding. A bunch of bad coincidences. You tell me that there is no proof and to just move along. But funny...all of these misunderstandings/coincindences/mishaps and ooopies benefitted Clinton.

How many states, and how many times, do we have to go through this? The common denominator here is the Clinton camp. Never, in the history of our Democratic primaries have we seen so much malfeasance, outright cheating, voter suppression, and unfortunate "coincidences"--all that benefit Hillary Clinton's campaign.

I think it's time to start asking some serious questions about what in the hell is going on!

 

NorthCarolina

(11,197 posts)
5. Many voters still operate under the illusion of a two party system.
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:00 AM
Mar 2016

In reality, what we have is essentially one party with two names. That is precisely why Bernie mentions in every campaign stop that his goal is to "fundamentally change the Democratic Party" to one that represents the people over special interest groups.

CoffeeCat

(24,411 posts)
6. People should not be afraid to discuss this. We shouldn't avoid discussing this
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:03 AM
Mar 2016

Because as far as I'm concerned, it's a big elephant at the polling place.

She benefits from all of the suppression, games, malfeasance, disenfranchisement (and in some cases) cheating--that we've seen in MOST of our primaries.

It's epidemic.

To talking-point this away with, "It's the Republicans" is beyond ridiculous.

We need to have a serious discussion as a party.

 

NorthCarolina

(11,197 posts)
7. Discussion will never transpire as long as New-Dems call the shots in the party.
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:05 AM
Mar 2016

They are fighting to preserve a way of life...theirs.

CoffeeCat

(24,411 posts)
17. I wholeheartedly agree
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:44 AM
Mar 2016

When all is said and done--it's people with power attempting to hold onto that power.

Dragonfli

(10,622 posts)
13. I copied that PDF if you are interested (the one that was hidden then scrubbed), I still have it
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:20 AM
Mar 2016

If I find where I put it, I will gladly PM you for an email address to send it to you if you are interested in seeing it again and believe you can use it to the benefit of a fair comparison that may be used to positively affect the election fraud (or appearance of such) where you live.

Let me know and I will look for it.

(ETA I found it, what i have is titled " 2016-IDP-Final-Precinct-Caucus-Results-PrecinctCandidateResults1.pdf" Is that what you are looking for?)

CoffeeCat

(24,411 posts)
36. Thank you for that
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 06:13 PM
Mar 2016

I saved the link too. Last I checked it was working--but it's nowhere to be found on the IDP website.

I would love to figure out how to put the doc to good use. I'd have to find the Precinct Chairs and Captains from each of the 1,700 precincts in Iowa, then ask them if they remember how many delegates were allotted in their precinct. The findings probably wouldn't be beneficial unless they had taken a pic of the results before handing them in.

If I start now, I should be finished by December.

But thank you for letting me know that you have this. That was kind of you.

brush

(53,740 posts)
4. Yeah, well maybe, but the OP states that most of the poll closings were in minority areas
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 10:57 AM
Mar 2016

I don't think there were many repug votes in those minority areas.

 

Trust Buster

(7,299 posts)
3. Republicans control the state of Arizona. They hate Hillary. Did they artificially raise the costs
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 10:56 AM
Mar 2016

of solar power in Arizona because of Hillary too ?

CoffeeCat

(24,411 posts)
8. But if Republicans wanted to rig the General Election
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:06 AM
Mar 2016

to benefit themselves, they certainly were doing themselves no favors by massively rigging the Democratic primary!

Their entire state is on fire with outrage about this. The entire nation is watching.

The cheating, disenfranchisement and outright FRAUD was so widespread that it couldn't be ignored.

If the Republicans wanted to cheat in the GE--then you cheat in the GE. You don't cheat in the Democratic primary as some "trial run" which draws attention to the cheating.

I don't believe, for one minute that this intentional fraud was Republicans acting alone.

PufPuf23

(8,754 posts)
11. Not all Republicans actually hate Hillary Clinton.
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:11 AM
Mar 2016

The formerly BFEE money and war wing of the GOP prefers Hillary Clinton to Trump and Cruz.

BernieforPres2016

(3,017 posts)
12. A lot of states are trying to take their elections
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:20 AM
Mar 2016

Back to way they were in Mississippi in 1964. They're just employing different methods than administering tests on the Constitution and poll taxes to deny the vote to groups of people who don't support them.

I wish we had a President and a Justice Department that will go to war with the Republican governors over this. Another reason we need to battle through the fraud and elect Bernie.

BernieforPres2016

(3,017 posts)
16. Bernie is going after the Republican governors in his Pittsburgh speech right now
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:27 AM
Mar 2016

"If you don't have the guts to participate in free and fair elections, get out of politics and get another job!"

me b zola

(19,053 posts)
18. Every time I hear Bernie say this
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:48 AM
Mar 2016

I get the distinct impression that he is not only talking to republicans.

BernieforPres2016

(3,017 posts)
19. No doubt the establishment Dems will piggyback on these efforts when it benefits them
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:51 AM
Mar 2016

The DNC is doing everything it can to rig the Democratic primary process. Minimize the number of debates, put them at times when people are least likely to watch, Superdelegates lining up behind Hillary, etc.

frylock

(34,825 posts)
23. I didn't see that mentioned in the article.
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 01:44 PM
Mar 2016

Should be fun to watch you guys get wadded if this effects Mrs. Clinton in November.

JoePhilly

(27,787 posts)
30. I can care about voter supression in March ...
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 03:51 PM
Mar 2016

... and also laugh at those who've been trying to develop a conspiracy theory suggesting that Hillary must be responsible for it.

I'm a multi-tasker!

pat_k

(9,313 posts)
29. Doesn't need to be a conspiracy. Plenty of Repubs happy to act on their "own initiative."
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 02:48 PM
Mar 2016

Not need to posit conspiracy. Criminal acts need not be performed "under orders." There are plenty of Repubs willing to commit crimes on their own in an effort to gain advantage.

The general attitude is "it ain't wrong if you don't get caught." Complicity of silence by witnesses is all that's necessary. (Next time one gets caught, listen carefully to the apology. Almost invariably they are apologizing for getting caught and thereby causing scandal. Rarely do you hear any regret expressed for committing the transgression.)

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