The FBI just cost me $5 and a pizza.

[IdaBriggs]

Here is the story...and it is long!

So, I am one of the many people who already knew Hillary has been lying through her teeth about her email and private server situation before the "official formal confirmation" via the State Departments Inspector General report came out last week, but honestly, not until mid-March of this year.

Honestly, I had been tuning out "email stuff" along with anything related to "Benghazi" because I thought it was Republican whining. Granted, they hadn't been whining about her performance prior to Benghazi, but I *assumed* they just were starting things up again because maybe they were bored or something. Frankly, 2013 was still too early for me to believe they were gearing up against Hillary as a potential presidential candidate -- way too early, right? In hindsight, I realize they were doing what they were supposed to as "loyal opposition in a two party system" but it is still annoying sometimes, right?

So when I read a thread entitled so here's what we know from the newest dump of HRC emails. (http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511509720) on March 16, 2016 I was really surprised. I did not know about Sid Blumenthal, or him being banned from the White House, or his business contacts in Libya, or him getting paid by the Clinton Foundation!

Then I read Clinton Foundations biggest beneficiaries are the Clintons (http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511513340) on March 17, and my suspicions grew.

I started following threads here at DU on the topic, and began putting the pieces together. It was extremely upsetting. I have a thirty year IT background, and the more I read, the worse it looked.

IT Trivia: a "personal email account" is a different thing than a "private server in a basement"; pretending they are the same and "all the other Secretaries did it" is a Big Red Not Telling The Truth Flag.

Finally, on April 4, 2016 I wrote Hillary's Email Scandal for Non-Techy People (http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511643968) which hit the Greatest Page with 101 recs. I really need to update that thread. Sigh.

The more I read, the worse it got. The FBI was keeping a pretty tight lid on things, but leaks were getting out via reputable sources, and everything kept getting confirmed.

-- Her IT guy was given immunity.
-- The hacker was extradited.
-- The law was excruciatingly clear.

By April 22, 2016 I was actually having to chew on some crow when I discovered actual reporting from two FOX News reporters. The world had officially gone mad! I shared the leaks here on a thread titled Hillary People - Trash this Thread; Others - Consider it FYI (http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511810912) with appropriate caveats, and it received 131 recs.

I still had policy issues with Hillary (I won't link to those posts, but they are in my journal). Meanwhile, DUer PaulThompson of the famous "911 Timeline" began working on a similar project for the "Hillary Clinton Email Scandal" and reading it turned me officially wrathful.

I wrote She's SUCH A LIAR. And she thinks people are STUPID. (http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511880685) on May 2, 2016 and it hit 226 recs. It should also be updated. Sigh.

My "speaking truth to DU" came with a price: a new level of "alert stalking" was created especially for me and shared in the Hillary Group. Please alert this post to the administrators. (http://www.democraticunderground.com/1107122402) was written the same day, and received 15 recs. Other posts of mine began to be alerted with regularity; most failed, but today my transparency page shows. I am okay with that -- none are abusive or inappropriate, although my scorn for the "corporate whore" nonsense was particularly biting.

But let me also hasten to add a very good thing in this story: my appreciation for this community, which I shared in a very special post on May 8, 2016 My 10,000 Post & Almost 12 years on DU! (http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511924563). This is a good place!

I've really distracted from the point of this story, haven't I? How those lazy bastard FBI folk cost me $5 and a pizza? Well, it goes back to Hillary. You see, the more I read, the more convinced I became that there is no way in Hell this woman is going to be our nominee because I think the FBI is going to recommend she be indicted. All the dates I was reading kept sayin "May" so I put my money where my mouth was, and made a few "fifty cent" bets that she would either be indicted or out "due to personal problems" before Memorial Day, with the proceedings going to DU. Oh, and the same bet with a dear friend for some awesome local pizza.

And I was wrong!!!

Those folks are still doinking around -- they've interviewed the aides, done a plea deal with the hacker, granted immunity to the IT guy, and even have the official report from the State Inspector General - why are they taking so long?



So, as an honorable person, I have now donated my $5 to DU and will be making my "pizza payoff plans". It's the right thing to do, and DU is totally worth it.

I still think the indictment is on its way. I think it would have been good for everyone to have their desks cleared before the holiday, but I can be sympathetic about a nice long weekend break with the family before the shit storm hits. Plus, I think the "gently breaking that Hillary has been lying" strategy with the State Inspector Generals report is a good one; the media has been propping her as the Annoited One since last year, and the shift is going to be painful for many people.

So yes, I still believe in the "Indictment Fairy" as some choose to call it. As I said earlier today,

"I *expect* her to be indicted; I will be *shocked* if she isn't. <snip> If the FBI does indict on RICO, I will actually be relieved because it will calm me down about "separate rules for the rich" and make me feel safer about being protected from criminal enterprises in the government."

I am still supporting Bernie Sanders, and trusting the owners of this site will figure out a way to maintain the community they have built while remaining true to their mission of supporting Democrats. I will not be happy if I end up banned and I am personally clueless as to how they will be able to play the "don't say anything bad about Hillary" game when there is going to be nothing except bad news about her until this situation is over. I am sure they have already discussed the headaches they anticipate, and I am somewhat cheered by the fact that is not my headache to deal with -- DU is not a democracy; it is a message board.

And despite my disappointment in the FBI not just finishing it up already, I am okay with DU getting my $5.

But if the FBI and DOJ drop the hammer this week, those guys are seriously going to owe me some pizza because the good stuff is NOT cheap!

[tritsofme]

1. The indictment will drop in 24 business hours. It's like Fitzmas all over again...

[Vinca]

2. You think? My bet is on the Friday before the 4th of July.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

12. ""Wish in one hand, crap in the other. See which one gets filled first." (REDUX)

[dchill]

36. What, no video?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

37. ...

[dchill]

39. Interesting choice, no crap, no hands...

And do you think saying "It's over, Johnny" made Rambo concede the point. That's not how it went...

[DemocratSinceBirth]

41. More Sly

[dchill]

43. I already did.

[reddread]

4. June 8th

[Fawke Em]

35. I'd love to have that present for my daughter's birthday. LOL.

That said: I think the FBI will recommend an indictment but the DoJ won't bite because of who she is; however, the leaks from the Intelligence community fed up with this behavior will cost her the presidency.

Not all workers at the NSA or the FBI are likely to keep their heads in the sand, as they watch very senior officials and politicians with their own agendas disregard laws to safeguard the nation’s security. We know what it is like to do the difficult, disciplined work of protecting information from being compromised by strictly abiding by what often seem to be cumbersome rules and regulations. We’ve been there; done that.

If you encourage the Department of Justice and the FBI to continue slow-walking the investigation, there is a good chance the truth will come out anyway. As you are aware, the Justice Department, the FBI, and NSA have all yielded recent patriots who, in such circumstances, decided that whistleblowing – rather than silence – was the only way to honor the oath we all swore – to support and defend the Constitution.

To sum up our concern regarding how all this plays out, if you order the Justice Department and FBI to pursue the investigation with “all deliberate speed,” so to speak, and Secretary Clinton becomes president, the juicy email secrets in the hidden hands of the NSA and FBI are likely to give those already powerful institutions a capacity for blackmail that would make J. Edgar Hoover’s mouth water. In addition, information hacked by foreign intelligence services or Guccifer-like hackers can also provide useful grist for leverage or blackmail.

http://www.commondreams.org/views/2016/05/24/intel-vets-urge-fast-report-clintons-emails

[JudyM]

42. That's what I'm thinking.

[B Calm]

19. Is that why Obama hasn't endorsed her?

[TwilightZone]

23. He's waiting until after she's declared the presumptive nominee.

He, unlike many, if not most, here on DU, understands that a united front behind the presumptive nominee is more important than a temporary boost in a race that's already over. Once Clinton is the presumptive nominee, he'll be more than happy to endorse her and campaign for her.

Ditto Elizabeth Warren.

[B Calm]

24. We'll see.

[nadinbrzezinski]

26. No he understands that as CiC he cannot talk on an ongoing

Investigation. Oh and he has no idea where this is going either. But I am proof positive he was not amused by tje OIG state report.

As to unity...

[TwilightZone]

31. Oh, please.

We're not talking about commenting on the email nonsense, Johnny one-note. We're talking about endorsing her for president. If you think he's not going to endorse her, you're going to be sorely disappointed.

Ditto Elizabeth Warren.

[nadinbrzezinski]

32. Whether he endorses or not is up to him

But it is to your peril to continue to dismiss this. Go ahead, have her nominated by God herself (I an going with the sacred feminine here) have the Dems commit suicide. You are enabling the election of trump. You think this will not destroy her? Just wait sanders has not touched this. Trump just got started.

By the way, the seriousness of this shit is starting to dawn among some party leaders. You will be the last one to realize this. Next to last is the owner of this site.

[tokenlib]

56. Well said..not sure how bright the party leaders are however...

..and do the bought and paid for superdelegate receipts have a null and void clause?

[nadinbrzezinski]

57. I particularly don't give two shits about them getting it

but I think they are. People way, and I mean this WAY above the pay grade of posters here.

[greiner3]

89. OwnerS of this site

Skinner has some serious skin in it for the establishment and so does his wife. Just sayin

[nadinbrzezinski]

90. Nada to do with thick skin

Though his wife works for the campaign, so he might get wind before you do

[lmbradford]

46. This is more than emails.

That private unsecure server with no password.

Mishandling classified info.

Hiring Blumenthal against his direct orders.

The emails are problematic, the rest is criminal.

[scscholar]

53. The server had a password!

It was a desktop that didn't. Bernie fans are misstating facts.

[scscholar]

75. Lewis Lukens, executive director of the executive secretariat for the State Department

Claimed that, but he probably had a reason to lie.

[lmbradford]

45. He wont now.

This is Obamas IG that put out that report. He wont put himself out there as supporting a criminal. He cant condone this behavior.

Whats more, im betting he is pissed.

[senz]

65. And that's why Warren is the only female Democratic senator not to endorse Hill?

It wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that her views almost perfectly align with Bernie's and are miles apart from Hillary's?

[leveymg]

77. The FBI will find she violated her security clearance. Leave it to AG to decide to indict.

Doesn't matter because all this has been known since March 2015. She will be eventually pardoned but will have to release her delegates and won't be the candidate.

[eridani]

81. Oh goody. Some fall guy like Scooter Libby will take the hit and everyone else is off scott free n

[bigtree]

3. just a little Dem-bashing fun

[hrmjustin]

5. Enjoy your pizza.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

13. You are denigrating the seminal poster's impending martyrdom.

[barrow-wight]

22. Yeah, I've noticed nobody can question her.

[Buddyblazon]

83. Sure you can, extremely brand new Hillary DU supporter.

....who joined a few days ago....Check it out....

Hey, Ida...cheese or pepperoni?

[barrow-wight]

84. OMG! Wow!

I'm new here! Isn't that exciting? In fact, I just emerged from the ocean froth like Aphrodite only the day I joined the site. I was but a spark in the ethers, without ever having had a political thought or idea before I came here.

[EndElectoral]

6. Ida, thanks for the great posts, links, and supplying pizza to fellow Democrats.

[EndElectoral]

7. My guess on the indictment. November 9th.

[CrispyQ]

15. You could be right.

Then we'd have 4 years of impeachment/nothing-gets-done government & a repub prez in 2020. Either way, she's a one term prez if she gets to the White House.

[2banon]

8. Love your humor Ida, great post!

this part of the quote nails it:

separate rules for the rich" and make me feel safer about being protected from criminal enterprises in the government.

[grasswire]

9. and thanks to all the good DU-ers who have...

...brought material here for us to digest and make sense of. It's a cooperative effort, and so many do so much! (And get vilified for it.)

[yodermon]

10. Dunno, Ida. I was really, really sure

Cheney was going to be indicted. Someone punked Jason Leopold & will pitt really bad. (did we ever find out who Jason's source was? Ah well bygones, good times)

I can't shake that same vibe. We'll see.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

11. Eight more days per the owner of this site, fifteen on the outside. (REDUX)

Star Member Skinner (61,708 posts)
1. When the voting is over the primary is over on DU.

This has gone on long enough. Once the voting is done I have no interest in pretending everyone doesn't already know the outcome.

My opinion is that Donald Trump represents an unprecedented threat to this country, and I have no interest in providing a platform for people to act like a Trump presidency isn't such a big deal. I have permitted it during primary season because many people seem determined to pretend we live in a fantasyland where Republicans don't exist -- but once the primary is over reality sets in and we can no longer afford to ignore our Republican opponent.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/125910453

[Rattlesnake Chaser]

27. I guess DC doesn't count - June 14th.

`

[DemocratSinceBirth]

29. Eight more days per the owner of this site, fifteen on the outside.

Eight more days per the owner of this site, fifteen on the outside.


HRC should exceed 65% in our nation's capital.

[nadinbrzezinski]

33. You get your safe space.

How cool...the scandal will continue whether you hide in a safe space or not.

[nadinbrzezinski]

28. Yup, and I will treat this place with the same humor as Free Republic

The bunker mentality is a sign of a mature scandal

But a place for laughs and nothing more

[CrispyQ]

14. TPTB want HRC over Trump. There will be no indictment.

And I say that as an O'Malley/Sanders supporter.

[Gothmog]

16. I am amused that you are praying to the indictment fairy for help

[BillZBubb]

52. The Denial Wizard is much more powerful.

Hillary, if the IG report is correct, has committed indictable crimes.

You can't keep your head in the sand forever, mog. You'll have to look at the real world soon.

[rhett o rick]

58. The sad part is they don't cares what she has done. It's Authoritarian Adulation.

[BillZBubb]

64. It's a cult.

[rhett o rick]

66. I think it's very similar. nm

[Gothmog]

60. Read the report or have someone read it and explain it to you

No crimes were broken.

[BillZBubb]

62. "No crimes were broken"--Classic!

The IG investigation was not a criminal investigation. It was not in the portfolio of the IG to make criminal recommendations. So, no such recommendation was made. The IG, however, made it clear that legal violation occurred.

I've read the key parts of the report and, sorry for you, laws were broken by Hillary and her immediate staff. Let me give you one example: Hillary by statute was required to turn over all emails related to her SoS work AND the private server. She failed to do so, but when pressed she handed over 55,000 pages of emails THAT HAD BEEN SCRUBBED by her attorney. Hillary's claim was that she retained all personal emails only and DELETED THEM! Several key emails were not turned over but showed up in the report. The IG got them from someone else. That is not just another Hillary lie, but a crime.

The emails related to attempted hacking of the server and Hillary's real reason for having the server. Naturally she and her attorney wanted those to never see the light of day. Too bad for her the IG and the FBI have sources other than Hillary's scrubbed submission.

[Gothmog]

68. You really think that is siginficant

That is so cute and adorable. Clinton provided her e-mails. Where are Condi's and Collin Powell's e-mails. The system is based on old technology but without the server, Clinton's e-mails would not have been preserved.

[cui bono]

87. No, she did not provide her emails. That would mean she provided ALL of them.

We all know she did not do that.

Why would you defend someone when it requires you to ignore facts? Don't you think there's something wrong with that? You have to be willing to overlook an awful lot to do that.

.

[femmedem]

17. Thank you for this and your many other thoughtful and informative posts.

I usually use DU as a political news source, and most of the posts I read link to other sites. But I very much appreciate the DUers who take the time to write original, well-researched, well-thought out content. Your posts are among the best.

[IdaBriggs]

21. Thank you!

What an incredibly wonderful thing to say!

[Voice for Peace]

38. ditto to the above poster

much appreciation for your threads here, Ida.

[Tarc]

18. *CLAP*CLAP*

[msanthrope]

30. Still no Tinkerbell. Nt

[CorkySt.Clair]

20. ...

[Waiting For Everyman]

25. An excellent post, IdaBriggs!

I started paying attention to this at roughly the same time you did, and for the same reasons. So this post is almost like reading my own thought progression, and your posts along the way have been so helpful.

A number of DUers have been hugely informative and spot-on through this whole email-foundation issue.

The alert-stalking that all of you have experienced is despicable and absurd. Those responsible for it should know that hiding from reality only works for a short time, there comes a day when the truth is going to be known. I'm reminded of an R.E.M. lyric from the song "Belong", "these barricades can only hold for so long".

All of us choosing to face this are acting responsibly on the right side of history, and anything we can do to prevent the political disaster we are facing, will be vindicated by events in the near future.

I remain shocked by HRC's behavior, and we know that more official reports on this will be forthcoming. I am un-cynical enough to expect that major charges will be brought because it is obvious that serious law breaking has occurred. If that does not happen, there is no doubt in my mind that if elected, a swift impeachment will substitute for court justice denied.

I do not believe this will be swept under the rug. That definitely will NOT happen. That, I would bet much more than a pizza on. The public is sick of this type of shit.

[laserhaas]

34. Everybody is missing the bigger picture of Quid Pro Quo

While she was Sec. Of State the Clinton Foundation took in millions of dollars...from foreigners..who benefitted from her rulings

That's quid pro quo ....undeniable

An issue compounder by scienter (knowledge of what is wrong) because she was in the White House and Senate

She knows right from wrong; and FOIA protocols!

Further condemning is the mens rea ( intent to circumvent auspice and laws) by intentionally setting up the server...and then lying about it ( many times)

Don't forget..she's an attorney at law!

Compounding all of this are the glaring ...100% Undeniable acts .....ofOBSTRUCTION of Justice, with the Destruction of potential evidence.

All made morose by her IT guys emails also vanishing

No frigging wall all of his communications can be touted as personal

It's all so ridiculous that we are quabbling about such heinous & egregious behaviors.

FBI & DOJ are remiss, in dragging their feet...on this

Its like they are all hoping to be rewarded, for doing her this staunch refusalto prosecute..solid



Shhheeessshhh

[Voice for Peace]

40. .... and

waiting for hrc responses
https://soundcloud.com/groovyone/cricket-house-96khz-slowed

(very nice slowed down cricket sounds)

[John Poet]

78. This whole spectacle is akin to the Republicans

renominating Nixon in 1974 amidst the Watergate scandal boiling over
(if that had been a presidential election year)

[laserhaas]

82. its like the DNC and Dem powers are trying to race to

The bottom and beat Drumph on who could be worse

[COLGATE4]

79. Can I get some ranch dressing

with that legal word salad?

[LiberalArkie]

44. Thank you.. Very good post..

[JoePhilly]

47. Start with the conclusion ... then work backwards ...

... to connect the dots ... and if you can't get them all connected ... no matter!!!

Declare victory anyway!!!

And then accept, no request, your self-proclaimed martyrdom.

[HereSince1628]

49. Indicting Clinton would harm Obama's legacy, he and his staff undoubtedly got emails from HRC

that show the address. So that raises questions about slack supervision, etc etc. Bad for Obama but not nearly as bad as would be a pre-emptive pardon for which there would almost surely be pressure to produce... If Obama did that, it's likely to become the most memorable act of his presidency, it would certainly dwarf memory of his Peace Prize.

So I don't see an indictment during the Obama administration.

I -DO- see the possibility of more Congressional hearings that could greatly interfere with the GE campaign in the Fall. I can't help but see the outcome of such hearings being some sort of censure of HRC.

Moreover, -if- things get revealed in that process that look criminal whether it's Clinton email or the State-Foreign Intere$t$-Clinton Foundation/Global Initiative, there will almost certainly be a move for impeachment as soon as HRC is sworn in.

All that may not amount to any serious penalty for HRC, but the effort would certainly side-track her administration for 24 months or more by making Congress hostile and making foreign governments reluctant to deal with a person under such a shadow.

[Yurovsky]

54. Not indicting in spite of an FBI recommendation to indict...

would be worse for President Obama's legacy. I think most people can discern that this was just a rogue move on Clinton's part, and not authorized by the President.

Of course, the GOP will bitch regardless, but that's nothing new.

[HereSince1628]

55. Seems Obama can probably run the clock out, keeping it 'under review' by DOJ.

It seems pretty common for the DOJ to take nearly a year to organize itself into acting. That might not seem necessary as the FBI and various IGs will have done much work. But I suspect it's nonetheless still plausible enough to use.

[tularetom]

61. This has reached a point where its gonna bite Obama in the ass regardless

Unless he takes some positive action to throw her under the bus. And disavow any knowledge of what she was doing.

If he proactively steps in to stop the FBI investigation or if he refuses to prosecute after receiving recommendation to do so by the FBI, he's toast. If he receives no such recommendation, 50% of Americans will believe he got it anyway. He'll be defending himself over this for the rest of his life. Maybe even in an impeachment action by the House.

The president's only hope of avoiding getting caught in the shit storm of this mess is to distance himself from this disloyal hack asap. Publicly, vocally and emphatically. And immediately.

[HereSince1628]

63. Obama is a lame-duck with little more that can be accomplished other than

not doing something stupid and messing up his legacy.

It's a bad spot to be in. Because act or not he's going to make some people unhappy, but his 8 years of decisions include a number times he's kicked the can down the road when things were tough.

I have no special knowledge, but based on celebrity political status alone, my money is on no recommendation for indictment of HRC. As insolation from prosecutions goes, being rich and powerful is better than being rich... If we're going for a decision after a recommendation, my bet is no action... the can is just left on the roadside.

[senz]

70. Well, I like Obama and hope he won't let Hill drag him down.

[Metric System]

51. Maybe you'll get a tombstone pizza in a week or so.

[IdaBriggs]

59. And aren't you just a charmer!

Keep making this a great site!

[Bleacher Creature]

67. Is Rush even this obsessed with this story??

[politicaljunkie41910]

69. Hillary's still not going to be indicted. Hope you enjoyed your $5.00 and your pizza.

Having a server is small potatoes in the grand scheme of things. The following post discussed the only cases which have ever been prosecuted by the DoJ and Hillary doesn't even come close to any of these acts which were deliberate and intentional acts.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=2068211

[IdaBriggs]

73. I'll settle for her withdrawal for "personal reasons" but am

Worried that if there aren't consequences, the next people will get away with it longer.

It's up to the FBI and DOJ.

[COLGATE4]

80. We don' need no steenking facts. nt

[senz]

71. Thanks for all the good information and links, Ida!

[Uncle Joe]

74. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, IdaBriggs.

[quickesst]

76. "I wrote She's SUCH A LIAR. And she thinks people are STUPID."

Well....sometimes they really are.

[Ichingcarpenter]

85. Great post ... I always follow your writings because

you have keen well thought out logical arguments

I don't know if she will be indicted because I don't think TPTB will let that happen on this round. Even though the evidence shows otherwise, but I'm sure the the next round in the Senate and the house will be disastrous for the party and her rep.

On a side point I do think the other server she had in a bathroom in Colorado should raise some concerns for national security

[cui bono]

86. I think your biggest problem was allowing yourself to think that Hillary would ever drop out.

Maybe if that weren't factored in you would not have made the bet.

Every cell in her body is alive and functioning solely for the purpose of her becoming president. It doesn't matter if the pursuit of that will ruin the country's future and the lives of its citizens. It doesn't matter if it would ruin HER life. They have been programmed and there is no stopping it. The programming included increasing ruthlessness and hubris and the erasing of integrity and compassion. Yes, it really is a Clinton machine and it has gotten a life of its own.

We need Dave!

[B Calm]

88. K&R