A thoughtful suggestion to the Bernie holdouts...

[brooklynite]

1. You lost the nomination fight...

2. You lost the VP nomination fight...(not sure if you wanted it)

3. You got what you could on Platform and rules, (see 1)

If at this point you CANNOT support our nominee...

Maybe you should go home and beat the traffic; your seats won't go to waste.

[merrily]

2. IOW, you would rather send an FU message than give them time to grieve

and see if they come around. Odd.

[Trust Buster]

4. This grieving process is getting a bit old. Bernie is still alive and well.

[think]

7. And so are the excuses for what the DNC did. Brad Marshall is STILL the CFO of the DNC....

[Trust Buster]

9. Bernie used the DNC for his political purposes. His staff tapped into Hillary's database. It was a

two way street. This "grieving meme" has lost it's mojo.

[think]

15. Brad Marshall suggested using Bernie's religion against him. How it that fair and neutral? Why is he

still there?

[FSogol]

23. He suggested it. Did he or anyone else do it? Nope.

[think]

28. He's still there is he not? How would you feel if a member the DNC suggested using Hillary's

religion against her?

Did anyone even admonish him for his comment? No! And there were MANY other incidents of the DNC tipping the scales. That's just one of the more disgusting ones....

[FSogol]

30. Sure, his suggestion was crappy, but it was a private conversation that should not have been made

public. No action taken on it = no harm, no foul.

[think]

41. Harry Reid, Ed Rendell, and Howard Dean can all admit the DNC was unfair. Why can't you?

o

[FSogol]

45. Why do you think that only 3 Democrats ran for President this time?

I don't include Webb and Chafee, because they did nothing more than file the paperwork and go to a debate. Neither hired staff nor did more than cursory fundraising.

It was because all the other potential candidates knew that HRC had already locked up major supporters and donors.

O'Malley, I suspect was just making a practice run for next time.

Sen Sanders, just joining the party, HAD to have known that it would be a major uphill battle. Only some of his holdout supporters (very gullible and politically inexperienced) don't seem to realize that fact.

PS. Reid, Rendell, and Dean (Pelosi too) are only trying to mend some fences with the holdouts. It was obvious to them too.

[think]

47. Who cares how many others were running? How does that justify what transpired at the DNC?

[FSogol]

53. Did you just read the subject line and ignore the argument I laid out?

[think]

55. Please show me how your argument is anyway related to what the DNC did as that was what we

were discussing...

[tonyt53]

82. To hell with what the DNC did or didn't do. What did the voters do?? That matters the most.

[think]

83. So DWS just resigned for fun right?

[Trust Buster]

99. Did Sanders fire the staff members that accessed Hillary's database at the DNC ?

[think]

100. The one RECOMMENDED by the DNC? Yes. He sure the hell did....

Now a campaign adviser says that Josh Uretsky, the data director fired by the campaign, was recommended to the Sanders campaign by DNC officials and a staffer at NGP VAN.

“It’s not as if we conjured this guy Josh from thin air. This is an individual … who was recommended to us by the DNC and NGP VAN," the adviser told Yahoo News.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/sanders-adviser-dnc-josh-uretsky

[redstatebluegirl]

105. I don't imagine the Sanders campaign would like to have their emails and phone conversations

released to the public. EVERYONE in a heated campaign say things they should not have, suggest things that would make your eyes roll at best. I've worked in enough of them over the years, when you are tired and trying to win, you do stupid things sometimes. Things you regret in hindsight. Plus you would never imagine they were not private.

Would you want your private conversations at work out there? Of course not! Have you used email to vent to a co-worker or a friend? If those became public would it make you look good?

I'm not defending them, but for the love of pete this is a national campaign, local ones are even worse. I'm growing weary of everyone getting their feelings hurt over things that are pretty normal in the scheme of things. It doesn't make it right but good grief.

Two things you don't want to see made are laws and sausages, I would offer a third, the election process underground.

[think]

107. Bernie Sanders had the right to expect the DNC to act professionally and impartially. That did not

happen.

Instead of being impartial there are multiple accounts of the DNC choosing to favor Clinton over Sanders.

Everyone KNEW it was happening. This is just evidence of of what happened.

The DNC members had every opportunity to STOP being partial to one candidate and instead they continued to the very end.

[merrily]

70. Didn't he? I saw Hillary campaign surrogates on Sunday talk shows

talking about how low atheists poll and therefore Bernie might not be electable in November, if he got the nomination. (Implied, of course, so, Hillary was the far safer choice for nominee.) At about that time, I also debated with at least one DUer. I wrote an essay about the subject at about the same time, asking if religious bigotry would work this primary.

Could have been pure coincidence. Each of Marshall and the campaign could have come up with this independently. Or it or could have been a suggestion he made to the campaign after he had this brainstorm. We are unlikely ever to know. When people are doing things on the down low that they should not be doing at all, certainty is difficult to come by.

[classykaren]

92. Don't worry he might not be more audio tapes are coming out.

[George II]

77. Weren't those (selectively) released emails ALL written AFTER......

.....the Sanders Campaign hacked the DNC voter database and trolled Clinton's contact list for almost 8 hours collectively (4 separate people for about 2 hours each)?

Seems like the bar was set in December 2015.

[Sheepshank]

78. Apparently the Revolution continues. They are grouping and formulating.

They continue to fight for and try to influence local progressives. NO ONE has shut down the revolution. It continues. I was told this is what it was all about....what is there to mourn any more?

[FSogol]

26. Like an Italian widow, they should wear black clothing for the rest of their lives....

[merrily]

59. I don't mean grieve for Bernie.

[NCTraveler]

21. Grieving is one thing.

Booing a civil rights leader is something completely different.

[merrily]

24. I am not defending anything. And that's done and history at this point, anyway.

What is the ultimate goal and how best to get there?

I'm guessing snarking pointlessly at Bernie's supporters on the internet isn't the best way.

[NCTraveler]

36. I'm not that bothered by them at this point.

I view them as useful idiots. They are generating a little buzz and excitement and that gets people to tune in. When they tune in they are being greeted with amazing stories about Clintons tireless progressive work. They are being greeted by speakers talking about Clintons excellent progressive platform. It resonates.

[merrily]

43. smh

[NCTraveler]

51. No thanks. Not into violence.

[merrily]

52. That went over my (shaking) head.

[NCTraveler]

56. Was just trying to be lighthearted.

I have often seen it described as smack my head. As in one smacking their own forehead in a response to stupidity. Very similar to shaking ones head. As I said, just being lighthearted. Made me smile. That's enough sometimes.

[merrily]

57. I got that you were trying to be lighthearted. I just did not know about "smack my head."

I guess I won't use smh anymore.

[NCTraveler]

65. SMH works well as a response to foolishness.

A place I often go.

[classykaren]

97. lol

[NurseJackie]

25. Grieving time is over. Time's up! Everyone has had over a month to accept reality.

These delegates (and their defenders) need to grow up and act like adults who know how to accept disappointment, deal with it, and move on.

IOW, you would rather send an FU message than give them time to grieve
and see if they come around. Odd.

No, that's not odd. Why tolerate the bad behavior of a few who want to ruin it for everyone? One's willingness to do that is what's odd.

[merrily]

34. Just curious what you think an OP on DU is going to do to get those

delegates out of the convention hall today?

[NurseJackie]

50. It will have about the same effect as the posts from their defenders and other provocateurs.

[merrily]

62. I'm good with that. Pretending it will result in empty seats in the convention hall

is beyond delusional.

[NurseJackie]

66. DU is a fun activity and passtime, I enjoy it and like it for what it is...

... but in the overall scheme of things, it's just a place to discuss and argue, celebrate and complain. It's a small coral reef in a great big political ocean. Just a drop in the bucket. A single bubble in a fizzy soda bottle.

[EffieBlack]

58. I'm really over hearing about the "grieving process"

This is politics. No one died. It's always disappointing when your candidate doesn't win. It's rarely a tragedy.

The "you must give them time to grieve" is ridiculous. They've had months to do any grieving they feel entitled to. If that wasn't enough and they still are overcome with grief because a majority of Democrats picked someone else, they need to stay their asses at home and grieve there and let the rest of us who actually are interested in our party and our candidate and the campaign do what we need to do to win this election.

We don't have time to soothe their hurt feelings anymore. It's not my job or the job of the party to work them through their apparently endless stages of grief.

Maybe their families can help with that and, if not, they can find some support group to help them.

[LongtimeAZDem]

79. ^^^^^ (nt)

[Lil Missy]

80. More like, Go Away. Regardless of whether they "come around" or not.

They don't have to grieve publically, they can grieve in private.

[merrily]

85. Nah. Nothing at all like that.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=2315996

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=2315988

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=2316333

[frazzled]

84. They've had months to grieve

Is there still a reality problem here? Did they really think there was a chance to reverse the elections? Have they never had a candidate lose an election before? It usually takes less than a week to "grieve." The guy is not dead. And we don't do hero worship in this party. It's about We the People, as President Obama reminded us last night, not about a single individual to become savior.

Jayzus, that poor mother who lost her son in Orlando recently has done a better job at grieving and picking up the pieces.

As we said during the 90s: Move On.

[merrily]

86. Not really. He did not endorse her months ago.

[frazzled]

87. Well, that's his problem

Had he done so, like any candidate of character, we wouldn't be talking about this. So don't get me started. It's over now. Bernie's Weekend as a Democrat has ended, and we all need to think about the country now, not about the past.

[merrily]

88. It's not his problem. His error, maybe, but not his problem.

[frazzled]

90. To the extent that his error means he has to own it

I think it's a problem. Had he been more realistic, and more gracious, and more of a team player, he could have (a) brought along more people and (b) ensured himself a bigger role in what is left of his career (I'm speaking of age, not anything else).

As one of his supporters said, you can't get the kids all hopped up on Mountain Dew and then tell them to go to bed. Promising revolution and victory, and leading the "unfair" charges for six months is not a fire you can dowse after its out of control. It wasn't responsible parenting.

Look, I realize I'm going over the top, but the anger I feel at the rude displays and vetching at this convention is raw, too. It scares me for what's ahead for us all.

[glennward]

3. I would rather they join US in trying to defeat the fascist-Rand cabal that now controls the GOP.

We truly need all the help we can get just to get rid of so many of them taking up valuable space in Congress. The SCOTUS issue alone ought to make them want to vote for Hillary.

[leftofcool]

6. But, they don't want to.

I say, they go on home, do what they need to do for themselves. The rest of us will pick up the slack just like we always do.

[brooklynite]

10. I watched the protests from the Hall last night...

They stood and protested the entirety of the President's speech.

They heckled Leon Panetta's speech.

I got photos of signs: "silenced by the DNC"; "free to cheat" (a code pink sign); and "Faux Democracy #electionfraud"

These are not people who can be reasoned with at this point.

[think]

19. The DNC wasn't fair or neutral. Ask Howard Dean, Ed Rendell, and Harry Reid....

[merrily]

37. "At this point" being key.

[B Calm]

5. And this is your way of unifying the party. .

[leftofcool]

8. No, it's his way of saying, we get it. Go your merry way and someone will take your place.

[B Calm]

11. Not cool man!

[MoonRiver]

12. Why? If they hate the DNC and Democrats so much why hang out with them?

Looks like it's just to cause trouble, and THAT is not cool.

[leftofcool]

13. Not cool? Not cool that many of us will be happy to pick up the slack?

That's what Democrats do. Some leave unhappy and the rest of us go on and work to get the Democrat elected. That is the way it has always been.

[merrily]

39. No. It's his way of stirring the pot on DU.

Let's be real. An Op on DU is not telling the delegates to leave the convention hall.

[apnu]

106. At this point, Bernie holdouts are not Democrats

They probably never were Democrats. Likely they were side-line progressives and liberals who, for whatever reason, refused to take part in Democratic politics and only got involved when an independent threw his hat in the ring so he could leverage the infrastructure, data and money in an established political party. Those Berniecats were never Democrats to begin with and won't be now, no matter how nice or not people around here or in the Democratic party are to them.

They will skulk home and go back to being the non-participants they were before.

I say all this as a Bernie supporter from the primaries.

[Buckeye_Democrat]

14. I personally

... want their presence and input. I don't like "my way or the highway" attitudes from anyone, whether it's from Hillary or Bernie supporters. That reminds me of many Republicans that I know.

[B Calm]

16. Best reply! +1

[freebrew]

74. Agreed...+1...nt

[LoverOfLiberty]

18. I don't want their presence and their input

if they are damaging the party and our opportunity to maintain the presidency and perhaps take the Senate. The whole Jill Stein clown show and so-called Democrats allying with her was a farce.

[sufrommich]

46. No,the BoBs (there's a difference between BoBs and normal

Bernie supporters) are very reminiscent of Tea Party republicans,they have e no intention of voting for the Democratic party and are perfectly willing to see Trump win this. Would you like some proof?

http://jackpineradicals.com/boards/topic/help-i-like-trump-a-little-bit/

[Buckeye_Democrat]

63. I know

I don't care for their "my way or the highway" attitudes either. They're not the majority of Bernie supporters, at least. I don't want to alienate the more reasonable Bernie supporters who can take the loss with grace and try to fight another day (like Hillary after she lost in 2008).

[LoverOfLiberty]

17. I do agree that, like Bernie

some of them are not Democrats and never will be. Unlike Bernie, however, they fail to see the gravity of the situation and would rather wallow in their sense of injustice and unfairness.

[merrily]

29. At this moment. Election day is not tomorrow.

Why do you think they are not being thrown out?

[Buckeye_Democrat]

31. I also don't want a repeat

... of what happened in 2000, with Nader voters probably costing Gore the election. Well, him in addition to butterfly ballots, phony African American felon lists, refusals to do a recount, etc.

I personally wish we didn't have this "winner take all" system in place because it's a strong incentive to have just two major parties. The parties have both changed over the years in order to appeal to particular groups for the sake of winning elections -- e.g., Nixon's Southern strategy. However, that's what we've got, and I think the Democrats will be better off in the long run to at least make appeals to the segments of the population who aren't so different in many ways.

[TheCowsCameHome]

20. Yeah, Hillary doesn't need them anyway.

She's going to waltz right in and beat Trump easily.

[Bobbie Jo]

22. If they're not on board at this point

It isn't going to happen.

Time to move on, we have an election to win.

[merrily]

42. How can you pretend to know what will happen over the next 3+months?

Why do you think Hillary asked Bernie to campaign with and for her?

[Bobbie Jo]

54. Seems like a colossal waste of energy

and resources to me.

If these people aren't swayed by the terrifying prospect of a Trump presidency alone, they're beyond our reach.

Look, Democrats have made their case for Hillary over the course of this convention. She made her case for the vast majority of Democrats over the course of the primary. To waste another nanosecond reaching out to "Bernie supporters" who don't get it by now - is foolish, IMO...

There are voters still out there who can be reached, who can be persuaded by a solid platform, who understand that a Trump presidency is unthinkable. We've wasted enough time hand-holding people who SHOULD know better. At this point they're feeling like dead weight and we need to move on.

[NCTraveler]

27. I think they are generating some buzz and more people are tuning in because of it.

Instead of PBS I decided to watch on NBC last night. The coverage was great. Tom Brokaw and Lester Hold both made excellent distinction between the two convention. Brokaw literally said Trump would be bad for America. I knew he felt that way but was floored he would say it when he did.

The more eyes the better. Clintons excellent progressive platform will get people excited. The more eyes the better.

[sufrommich]

32. The BoBs are never going to vote for Hillary,time to cut them loose

and stop pretending they're logical people,they aren't. They're perfectly willing to burn it all down.

[rjsquirrel]

40. That's because they were never democrats

Clowns.

[cherokeeprogressive]

33. Yawn.

[glowing]

35. Those ideas are not losers. They are items progressive's have been fighting for.

There are many battles in the fight. This is just one round. We absolutely need to get money out of politics. We should also have rules against joining lobbyist firms or any other revolving door type of special interest as well. Politicians should be representatives of the people, of the needs of the people, and NEVER be beholden to someone writing millions of dollars worth of checks into your Super PAC.

I Believe if Hillary believed in the American people as strongly as Bernie did, she would say, I'm not taking anymore corporate donations. I want to beholden to the people, and I'm asking you to help me, I think people would believe that she would be actually willing to work on the platform agendas that were passed. I also think she would increase her like ability and her numbers would become positive.

You know, I want that woman they keep talking about before she hitched her wagon to Bill! I want that young, hopeful, hard worker for social justice. I don't want the Walmart board member. I don't want the DLC, Koch friendly/ corprate takeover that occurred in the 90's.

Lastly, politics has always been pretty rough and tumble. Telling people to sit down and shut up that make up 1/2 the party is pretty stupid. Who do you think actually covers the the streets and sits around phone banking? It's certainly not the board members throwing corporate sponsorship behind the convention this week. And I personally don't see that groundswell in FL for Hillary like we did for Obama. Shoot, I see more Bernie bumper stickers than I do anything for any Democrat. And of course, a ton of Trump stickers... I don't feel FL is going well for her at all. The ads are playing, but I don't see that they are effective.... We get so many in FL that many have learned to tune out political ads. And so many people have in their minds a narrative about the two.

I had my boss ask me if it was against some sort of rule that Hillary couldn't pick Bernie as her VP, and I said no, she could have asked him to join her ticket... She's not too political, votes in the GE, but stays away from the more mundane day to day items... If Bernie actually caught her attention, and she like those ideas, well Clinton should really be sticking with his narratives. She's a business owner, immigrant to this country, and she's a woman. She's exactly the type of person that Hillary should have no problem reaching to vote for her. She can't even understand why she picked a running mate that wasn't Bernie... Doesn't make sense. And that was her first judgement call on the job. Those are the people that are going to decide this election. For Dems, it's making sure she shows up and bothers to vote.... It's not me.

[DanTex]

61. Hillary doesn't take corporate donations. Corporations aren't allowed to donate to campaigns.

[rjsquirrel]

38. Lol

You did better than me.

All I have to say to the shouters and disrupters is "bite me, you naive, childish fools."

We need to rid this party of our own tea party types before we go down the road the GOP has followed and only appeal to extremists.

The simple solution: candidates and delegates must have at least two continuous years as a registered democrat before we let them run or serve.

[tecelote]

44. Thanks for the snark.

There's not enough of it on DU these days. I mean until Bernie supporters are alienated to the point of... Hmm. What is the point?

Inclusion might be a better way to gain their support. Just sayin'.

[sufrommich]

49. 80% of Bernie are already with us. It's the BoBs that need to go.

I don't recall endless pleas to embrace the PUMAs in 2008,why are we seeing so much concern for the very same sort of people now?

[4lbs]

67. Some of the BoB and NeverHillary folks remind me of the infamous lady that was recorded on video

filled with vitriol towards Obama in 2008. She was a New Yorker.

"The Democrats are throwing the election away! For what!?!?!? An unqualified black man!!"

As a Hillary supporter in 2008, that after the primaries, enthusiastically supported Obama in 2008 and again in 2012, I was embarrassed by that overtly hostile Hillary supporter's statements against then Senator Obama. She definitely seemed to become a PUMA.

If she is still alive, I hope she is nowhere near the 2016 DNC. An embarrassment then, and now.


Many of the BoB and NeverHillary folks act the same way towards Hillary as that lady above did towards Obama. They call her names, boo whenever Hillary's name is mentioned, and even parrot some of the RNC memes against her.

It is shameful.


The 85% or so of Bernie supporters that are fortunately sensible, should distance themselves from the BoB or NeverHillary groups.

[sufrommich]

69. I was a Hillary supporter too and agree with you.

The PUMAs were embarrassing idiots.

[democrattotheend]

116. I believe she passed away a few years ago

I won't celebrate someone dying but I can't say I was sorry to see her go.

[B Calm]

48. Is this your idea of unifying the party Chris?

[TheKentuckian]

60. That shit only applies to warmed over Republicans.

Big Tent and Unity are catch phrases for accepting conservative politics particularly on economics, hobbling civil liberties, and aggressive foreign policy either by embracing the ideology outright or at least complicit silence.

[EffieBlack]

64. At what point do the Bernie holdouts have any responsibility for "uniting the party."

It sounds to me that "uniting the party" is just an excuse that's being given for insisting that Democrats indefinitely put up with the divisive crap from the Bernie holdouts. No matter what those folks do or say, how rudely they do it or say it, how often they disrupt and how nasty they are, they insist that Dems must be patient with them, not respond, not criticize, not push back because any response other than "yes, yes, you poor wounded babies. We understand. What ELSE can we give you to make you feel better?" means that we're not "uniting the party."

I'm over it. At this point, they can either join forces with the movement or get left behind. If that means they're not going to vote for Hillary, so be it. I can't imagine what anyone can do or say at this point that would convince them to vote for her if they haven't already figured it out. I'm not wasting any more of my time or energy trying to soothe crybabies. We have an election to win and they're just an unnecessary distraction.

[B Calm]

68. How is this any different than the MSNBC reporters running around the convention stirring up shit?

[demmiblue]

93. That is a good point. n/t

[brooklynite]

71. Allow me to clarity my point...

I don't say they have to agree with Clinton on every policy, and they don't need to stop fighting for the issues they care about. But protesting in the Convention Hall --NOW-- is uncalled for. The Primary is over; the platform and rules fight is over. As delegates to the Democratic Conevntion, they are representatives of thr Party. If they can't support the Democratic nominee and respect the Democratic Preodent, they shouldn't be here.

nb - last night, fights were close to breaking out over seats; ifyou can't support he ticket. You're taking a seat from someone who does.

[merrily]

76. Since you are there, why don't you use all the access and influence you keep telling us you have

with Dem party bigwigs and suggest they have the hall cleared of protestors?

Wouldn't that be far, far more likely to achieve your desire than making a DU Op about it?

And after you talk to them, please, please do make an OP about their reply to you.

[ananda]

72. As Biden said: show some class.

Sanders' supporters will, for the most part, vote for Clinton.
I will if she's competitive in Texas.

But it's always good to remember that we don't take kindly
to ugliness in the way you ask us to support Clinton.

[jalan48]

73. Message to Hillary supporters.

You need to focus on the undecided independent voters, especially the poor whites who may be leaning towards Trump. To continually bash Bernie supporters is both futile and counter productive. You are driving away more voters than you are gaining with your words.

[democrattotheend]

75. How is this helpful?

As a Bernie supporter who is committed to supporting Hillary and trying to bring some of my fellow Bernie supporters along, I really think that threads started by primary Clinton supporters bashing and taunting Bernie supporters is counterproductive at this point. I don't agree with disrupting the convention by heckling but the continued attacks on Bernie and/or his supporters here are doing nothing but dredge up lingering anger that even people like me still have.

[retrowire]

81. dont be that way. nt

[Pharaoh]

91. I believe this breaks TOS

[pkdu]

103. Not sure about that...but your Bernie 2016 gif does. nt

[B Calm]

111. Really

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=2303131

[pkdu]

112. Yes really...( from your link)

...Imagine you are someone who will be voting for Hillary Clinton in November (and if you are posting on DU you are supposed to be)

I read that as "Bernie" is fine , "Bernie 2016" is not

[kaliamanita]

94. note to self

begin a list of commenters to avoid like plague.

[Thinkingabout]

95. As taught in the union hall we are only strong as our weakest link. It does not serve future

movements.

[KPN]

96. What were you hoping to accomplish with this (thoughtful?) OP?

The intolerance is striking. Can't for the life of me see anything positive that it would come of it.

[Cjas]

98. I've been a democrat

I've been a democrat all my life. Knew Reagan was bad news but didn't pay close attention till Su preme Court gave presidency to Bush. Since then have tuned in daily and closely. Found a home here at DU, but now feel lost. I was a Bernie supporter. But willing to vote for Hillary. But the venom directed at Bernie supporters, the fall in line mentality or drop dead, seems like what I dislike about Republicans. The angry hatefulness doesn't bring Bernie supporters in but drives them away.

[democrattotheend]

115. Welcome to DU

I'm a fellow Bernie supporter willing to vote for Hillary and I mostly agree with you. However, I hope that does not change your decision to vote for Hillary. Just as I don't think Bernie should be held responsible for his overzealous supporters, neither should Hillary.

[gg4usa]

101. I love Bernie, but he is/was an Independent and just became a Democrat to run as President

[onecaliberal]

104. And that independent voted for the ACA, which WOULDNT

Have passed without him. He has caucused with dems for his entire career. You're not being helpful.

[gg4usa]

113. Yes, and Bernie's probably the most progressive of the bunch

but he did kinda snub his nose at the Democratic party by not putting a D behind his name until he needed it.

[onecaliberal]

114. He never planned on running. He did it for the people. He has never ever been selfish.

[JCanete]

102. at least you're intentionally being ironic. nt

[Android3.14]

108. What a counterproductive post

[RoBear]

109. Might I add...

1. Go home
2. GROW UP!
3. Say "hi" to whoever sent you, and tell them that you couldn't shake the Dems into giving in and voting for sTrump. That IS why you were sent, isn't it??????

[Hiraeth]

117. appreciate the thought.