Believe me Clinton supporters understand there is a rage

[boston bean]

that occurs with some when they are faced with the possibility of voting for her to keep a republican out of the white house.

c'est la vie.

[cantbeserious]

1. Republican Lite - Avowed Republican - Not Much Difference To This Voter

eom

[hifiguy]

108. You speak for me.

She's a repuke who is pro-choice. Nothing more, nothing less.

Repuke trickle down economics, repuke war mongering.

[Duckhunter935]

2. I will not vote for her

in the primary and my state does not matter in the general anyway

[djean111]

3. Oh, no rage. And no one will be 'forced" to vote for her, much as you seem to actually relish the

thought. And I would say disgust would be a much more accurate word than "rage", n'est-ce pas?

There's that wishful thinking hyperbole again! It actually sort of diminishes any point you were trying to make.

[boston bean]

4. What thought am I relishing?

be specific.

[djean111]

6. Sounds to me like you are relishing the thought of people who do not want to vote for Hillary

being full of "rage" if they feel they must do that. "That Believe me Clinton supporters understand" and the "c'est la vie." are pretty smug and condescending. As was intended, I believe.

[Chan790]

21. They're counterproductive at a minimum.

I'm long on the record that I won't vote for Hillary...but her supporters have really cemented that. I probably would have held my nose and pulled the lever if CT was going to be close and the GOP nominee was bad enough...

but...

now, given a choice between:

*grudgingly voting for Clinton to keep the GOP out of the WH

*not voting for her--letting her lose with the hope that it would be the death-nail for Clintonism, corporatism, 3rd Way and the DLC. That we might take back the WH in 2020 having purged the Democratic party of Clintonites and fake Democrats.

I'm kind of leaning towards option 2. If holding the WH is so important to Clinton supporters, they can capitulate.

[boston bean]

47. I'm relishing that some feel rage and won't vote for hillary... OK.. nt

[djean111]

56. To be clear - I think that you are relishing the hoped-for rage. C'est la vie and all that. n/t

[hifiguy]

109. Smug and condescending is what

that one does best, and exclusively.

[HassleCat]

5. Something to consider when the primaries are over (eom)

[last1standing]

7. We don't understand the lack of rage over 224,000 slaughtered human beings.

Just so a politician could look tough when she ran for president.

But at least she has a "D" after her name. Whew! All those deaths would have been meaningless if it hadn't been for that "D".

[boston bean]

9. where was your rage for Kerry? I suppose there wasn't any.

Cause I assumed you voted for the man.

[last1standing]

14. More deflection from the fact that you're supporting someone who voted to slaughter Iraqis.

Just to look good when running for president, unless she thought our military was shooting Nerf darts.

[boston bean]

17. It's all relative, if I am to not vote for Hillary because she voted for the IWR

than why did you vote for Kerry? I assume you did so. What those pesky principles found their way out a window??? And why???

And then add in, I am to overlook Bernies stances on gun issues, which I think are harmful to this nation and it's citizens.

So, if you want to use that measuring stick, use it on yourself, as well as me, please.

[last1standing]

19. You're still not answering why you support a polititian who voted to slaughter Iraqis.

Much like your preferred candidate, you're putting base political maneuvering over good policy.

If you can't answer my question without Damning your candidate, just admit it.

[boston bean]

20. Did you support one, EVER?

[last1standing]

22. LOL! No, I never supported the slaughter of 224,000 human beings just to look tough on TV.

You really got me there!

Now stop deflecting and tell me why it was worth slaughtering 224,000 people so that Hillary could look tough.

[boston bean]

23. So, you didn't support Kerry when he ran for president?

even more interesting. Who did you vote for then?

[last1standing]

25. Deflection after deflection. Do you really not care that 224,000 people were slaughtered?

Because that's how it's starting to look since you won't answer my simple question.

[boston bean]

29. You assume my support of a candidate is not caring about 224,000 killed.

I am to assume that the question you won't answer is that you supported a candidate that voted for the IWR as well, and in doing so you really don't care about 224,000 people killed?

[last1standing]

40. I assume your not answering a simple question is not caring that Hillary voted for 224,000 killed.

Deflect all you like, but Hillary voted for the slaughter of innocent people just so she could look tough on TV.

[boston bean]

41. Shall we do this all day? Did you or did you not vote for a person who voted for the IWR when

they were running for president in 2004.

If you did, you mustn't have cared about it either. If you want to measure a persons "caring", use it on yourself as well.

[last1standing]

45. Well, I'm going to lunch so we can talk about your deflections when I return.

Do you think Hillary will come out in support of going to war against even more brown people before then?

[boston bean]

50. And if I'm around we can also continue to discuss your deflections.

I know all those brown people that are killed right here in the US probably mean nothing to you, cause you support Bernie who has voted for some of the worst gun legislation and voted against the Brady bill.

Again, your measuring stick, not mine.

I really don't think any of those things about you, cause guess what I'm not going to hold you personally accountable for every single shooting in the US because of the person you support for president.

[last1standing]

110. 224,000 slaughtered and you want to deflect from that. I understand.

I'd be ashamed to admit that the candidate I support voted to do that, too.

Hillary "We came, we saw, he died" Clinton has pushed for wars against brown people every chance she's gotten. Hundreds of thousands slaughtered, millions of women and children sent into poverty, starvation, slavery, and homelessness.

But at least she got to look tough on TV for the Faux viewers.

[beam me up scottie]

26. This is the primary, people are choosing to support a candidate who didn't vote for the war.

You have no idea who that person voted for in the 2004 primaries or if they were outraged.

Stop dismissing people who are still appalled by the illegal war in Iraq, it's a rational response.

The question is why aren't you outraged?

[boston bean]

44. And the OP was about what???

[beam me up scottie]

52. I was referring to your interrogation of a poster who was angry about the war.

Instead of saying "you have a point, I am outraged too" you implied that they weren't outraged by Kerry's vote.

boston bean (24,549 posts)

9. where was your rage for Kerry? I suppose there wasn't any.

Cause I assumed you voted for the man.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=643393

[boston bean]

53. The OP was about the general election.

[beam me up scottie]

58. The poster you responded to wasn't talking about the ge, they were expressing their opinion.

[boston bean]

63. really, where do you get that, since their response was to me regarding the GE.

[Scootaloo]

64. The choice was between an architect of the war and an enabler of the war

And I didn't want Kerry. I still feel a little gross for voting for him in 2004. Especially since, being in Alaska at the time, my vote was basically pissing in the wind.

"better than Bush" was the mantra, but even you need to realize, that's a fucking low bar

[boston bean]

65. So, we are discussing the possible choices of this GE.

You think any of those clowns are better than Hillary?

[Scootaloo]

72. I've answered this question frequently.

And each time, I wonder at the enormous balls it must take for a PUMA to ask it.

[boston bean]

73. What question? The one you make up that someone is discussing the primaries

when in fact they are discussing the GE and others vociferous opinions they would never vote for Hillary

[Scootaloo]

79. It's like those notes from grade school.

"DO U VOTE 4 CLNTN CHECK Y OR N"

And I've been answering since at least 2013.

Yes. I will vote for Clinton over a Republican. In 2016.

Now, make a fucking note.

[boston bean]

81. Again, you just skim right over all those little love letters

from "grade school" as you like to call it, saying they will NEVER vote for Hillary under any circumstance including the GE.

But glad to know you will vote for her if she is the Nominee. However, that doesn't negate all the other posts that you obviously forget, skim over or just plain ignore that state they will NEVER vote for her under any circumstance.

If the note wasn't sent to you, then the note wasn't sent to you.

[Scootaloo]

83. I'm sick of it coming across my desk

Especially coming as it does from people like you who will 100% absolutely ditch for the Republicans if a Jewish man becomes the Democratic nominee.

[boston bean]

88. I'm sick of a lot that passes my desk.

But I don't necessarily take it as a personal affront and assume it is all about me.

You also make a lot of assumptions which are untrue.

You want to talk about PUMA, read DU today in this thread who will never vote for her.

[Scootaloo]

94. I have seen nothing to make me assume different

Hillary supporters shit themselves and ran to mcCain when the Democrats nominated Obama. And if you guys did it once, you'll do it again. Especially given the rabid, irrational hatred I've seen thrown at Sanders.

Clinton supporters are the ones who need to be pinky-swearing their loyalty to us every day, instead of demanding it.

[bvar22]

113. Hillary never had a problem voting against Democrats.

The MAJORITY of Democrats voted AGAINST the IWR,
and called for Party Solidarity to oppose the Bush Invasion.

Hillary turned her back on the Democratic Party and crossed over to vote with REPUBLICANS
so Republican President Bush could get his WAR ON.
The single most important vote in her life,
...and Hillary was standing in the Republican line, voting AGAINST the Democratic Majority so she could help a REPUBLICAN President get his War On.


You have a lot of nerve dissing people for not standing in line behind you.
After all, they are just following Hillary's example.

You also have a lot of nerve demanding to know WHO anyone voted for in 2004.
Are you aware that the Secret Ballot is one of our most sacred democratic traditions?

[yurbud]

106. AFTER the primaries

[treestar]

84. The majority don't have that rage

Over Senators voting to give the President authority in 2004 - some of them even supported it. This was closer to 911.

To make this point at the cost of having an R in the WH just asks for more deaths as they will start other wars if they possibly can get the nation to go for it. Admittedly not likely now, as the nation is now tired of the whole thing. But it's the Republican way. They love the idea of American world supremacy and the use of the military to get it.

[whatchamacallit]

8. This is an OP?

[Thinkingabout]

10. Yes Hillary is a Democrat, has followed Democratic ideas, has advocated for Democratic ideas.

She is strong, smart, has experience and the willingness. She has worked across lines while in Congress.

[Chan790]

30. Rebuttals.

Hillary is a Democrat. So is Randall Terry. Anybody can register as a Democrat.

Hillary has followed Democratic ideas. Really? I see someone who has never had a grand proposal she didn't crib from conservatives, the Heritage Foundation, or get from the DLC who cribbed it from one of the previous.

Hillary has advocated for Democratic ideas.

She is strong, smart, has experience and the willingness.
-I don't care about how much she can leg-press; she certainly not emotionally-strong if that was what you were getting at.
-You can't sell smart...I know Hillary. She's not stupid but she's definitely not smart; she reminds me of my freshman year roommate who managed to become a lawyer despite having a below-average intelligence because he was diligent at studying and addicted to Red Bull.
-Hillary has no experience as the chief executive of a nation, state, company or anything else...so that's speculative. If you want to point to her reign at the State Dept. I'd argue that she as below acceptable competency at the position.
-I'm not sure being willing to be President is a qualification.

She has worked across lines while in Congress. Collaborating with maniacs and the deluded is not a virtue.

[leftofcool]

35. Hillary is evil Bernie is good. I think we have heard this before.

[Thinkingabout]

46. In short, I guess you are not for wage increases, interested in wage disparity, Citizens United,

college tuition, rape on campuses, climate change, criminal justice reform, violence against women, early childhood education, voter suppression, gun violence, health care, immigration reform, social security, substance abuse treatment, small business, work force and skills, and women's rights and opportunities, then you may not be a Democrat, I am a Democrat and I care about these issues.

[beam me up scottie]

67. And Hillary is the only candidate who is addressing those issues?

She's pro-fracking, against a federal minimum wage of $15 and universal healthcare.

Those are just three of the issues where Bernie is a better candidate and in no way is her record superior on the others.

[Chan790]

100. I believe she only supports the others as far as she can see a way to enrich her benefactors...

if she can't find a proposal that will benefit the monied interests that own her, then she won't do anything but lip-service them.

Hillary Clinton: Protecting the reproductive freedoms of women so they, unburdened by children, can be more efficiently exploited by Wall St. since 1992.

[Thinkingabout]

101. Since Bernie is on some of the same issues, who is he helping? Guess by this standard he is helping

the same benefactors. Voting for the Commodities Futures Modernization Act of 2000 helped create the financial crisis, helping Wall Street would be helping Bernie's benefactors.

[pinebox]

74. If you care about those issues

Then why choose a candidate who has spoken out about such things and only puts half her ass forward in doing something?

*Wage disparity? She doesn't support a $15/hr national wage. Bernie does.

*College tuition? Kids and families would still have to pay. Bernie's plan wouldn't require them to. In fact, this http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/college_guide/blog/the_hillary_clinton_college_pl.php

*Criminal justice reform? Why are private prison lobbyists raising cash for Hillary? https://theintercept.com/2015/07/23/private-prison-lobbyists-raising-cash-hillary-clinton/ …

*Renewable energy & climate change? Out of the top 3 candidates you're supporting the one which is least effective. Let's take a look at cleantechnica which is part of ThinkProgress http://cleantechnica.com/2015/08/12/hillary-clinton-vs-bernie-sanders-vs-martin-omalley-climate-plans-chart/ O'Malley has the best of the 3 here.



On and on it goes. I think you're painting something for Hillary which she's not, that or you aren't educated on the issues or where she stands. No offense intended, I just woke up and can't find better words. I would urge you to study things more in dept and find out where it is your candidate stands because there's better choices for much of what you've mentioned.

[Thinkingabout]

90. I am for the candidate who thinks these issues are important, these issues is a partial list from

Hillary's stand on the issues. Thank you for realizing the importance.

[virtualobserver]

38. her willingness to reach across the aisle to enable the Iraq War

stunning achievement

[SMC22307]

59. ...

[restorefreedom]

11. wow i did not think

there were any new ways to present the pledge, but you came up with one. kudos.

i will be voting for bernie in primary and general

no rage here....just pride and satisfaction

[Armstead]

12. It's a "rage" that extends far beyond her as a person

IT is an anger and frustration at a larger tendency she represents of a Democratic Party under the control of a faction (3rd Way, CLC, "centrist&quot that has abandoned its role as a true liberal/progressive counterpoint to the GOP when it comes to issues related to Wealth and Power.

It comes from anger and frustration at a ruling faction of the Democratic Party that too often avoids actively dealing with so many core problems and issues that have knocked the slats out of the middle class, make life even more desperate and hopeless for the poor and siphon wealth upwards at their expense.

It comes from a political system in which the Wealthy Billionaire Class and Monopolistic Corporate States buy both parties and impose their will on the populace.

It comes from anger at having to yet again vote for defenders of a corrupot status quo, simply to hold the truly awful GOP at bay, instar of being able to enthusiastically support actual positive change and meaningful reform.

[Autumn]

13. There is no rage, maybe it's disgust over the fact that some voters

are forced to vote against a republican instead of voting for a Democrat.

[boston bean]

15. What Democrat are you referencing?

[Autumn]

24. Well vote for me I'm not as bad as a republican seems to be the slogan of the DNC

so make of that what you will. Now I'm done with you and your golden paddle OP .

[boston bean]

33. I would do it for Bernie. And I think he pretty much sucks on some issues.

[Autumn]

49. Now see we have reached common ground. I think she pretty much sucks on some issues.

[beam me up scottie]

18. +1

I will vote for Bernie or O'Malley if either of them win the nomination, I will vote against the Republican if Hillary wins.

[DianeK]

16. what is the point of this thread?

seriously..it reads like hillary is inevitable so 'neener neener neener'...is that how you meant it to sound? to me there is nothing else to respond to..i conclude you are just trying to bait those who support another candidate into another tired old du primary fight...bring something of substance or nothing at all, please

[leftofcool]

28. Please don't tell Hillary supporters what to post.

We pretty much decide that for ourselves. You can use ignore or just trash the thread.

[DianeK]

87. sorry if i touched a nerve..but your thread

does nothing but promote negativity...other than that...there is no constructive point

[Warren Stupidity]

99. "Please don't tell duers what to post. "

There is no way to pronounce an edict like that without violating your own rule. Well unless of course you meant that it is perfectly fine to tell everyone except Clinton supporters what to post.

[beam me up scottie]

27. I'm still outraged over the Iraq war, why aren't you?

We have a chance to support a candidate in the primary who didn't vote for war.

If we have to hold our noses and vote for Hillary so be it, but don't expect us to excuse her record and call it "rage" when we don't.

[leftofcool]

31. Don't you get it? We don't care who you vote for.

[beam me up scottie]

34. What I "get" is that the op is dismissing our concerns by calling them "rage".

Am I not allowed to object to that characterization?

[boston bean]

39. what word would you like me to use. I'll add it to the OP.

[beam me up scottie]

54. How about you just delete the bait and stop telling us what we feel?

[boston bean]

71. No, but I will add a word or two to make you happy. nt

[boston bean]

32. Wouldn't be the first time I've done it. I presume you also did as well,

being democrat and all.

[beam me up scottie]

36. So you are still outraged about the war? Good, everyone should be.

[boston bean]

37. Of course I am, it just doesn't define who I vote for.

It didn't in 2004 and it won't now.

I happen to understand that George Bush was the real enemy. Something many seem to forget.

[aidbo]

51. Your candidate forgot that too.

[virtualobserver]

60. Hillary continues to telegraph her hawkish tendencies

which concerns me.......

The Republicans worry me a hundred times more.

[Le Taz Hot]

42. Well, so much for the "civility"

for which Skinner advocated and for which others have asked.

[boston bean]

43. It was pretty civil.

I acknowledged some Bernie supporters feelings.

Off to the gallows I go! LOL

[PowerToThePeople]

48. Never. Voting. For. Clinton.

[Scootaloo]

55. Too bad they can't fathim the notion that there's a primary to deal with

[boston bean]

66. I presume you've missed all the I won't ever vote for her even in the GE posts?

Ok..

[Scootaloo]

76. Nope. I just don't worry because she won't be the nominee

I worry about hte reverse, though. Because Clinton supporters have an establish record of voting for Republicans when they don't get a WASP candidate.

[boston bean]

77. So, why are you in this thread making false arguments to something that wasn't being discussed?

If you don't worry, then don't worry.

[Scootaloo]

82. You assume she will be the nominee.

Now. What guarantees do WE have that you will not vote for Republicans over Sanders? Again, you're the ones with the quisling track record of jumping Republican when you don't get a white anglo-saxon protestant on the Democrat ticket.

[boston bean]

85. I don't assume anything. That is made up from thin air.

Point exactly to the wording where I assumed she will be the nominee.

[Scootaloo]

89. Oh, you don't?

So, what's your problem? If you don't assume she's the nominee, then you don't need to be shaking your finger in people's faces.

[boston bean]

91. I see you can't point to my assumptions of her being the nominee.

Am I to assume that all those who state they won't vote for her in the GE are making the same assumption. I believe I would have to if I were to use your way of thinking.

[Scootaloo]

97. I think they are assuming she won't be, and so they can brag off without ever having to actually DO

[NorthCarolina]

57. I have to ask, exactly what is your motive behind this post?

An honest request for meaningful discussion or just senseless flamebait?

[pinebox]

61. As an Indy I'll never vote for her

She simply doesn't fit me or my ethics. She's a DINO and is about as progressive as George W Bush.

Why support a candidate who has more baggage than Samosonite and wavers on every issue possible? She's changed her POV more than Han Solo has shot town TIE-fighters. I keep throwing up this meme but Hillary supporters won't accept reality.

[MannyGoldstein]

62. Well, I read at HillaryClintonSupporters.com

That Bernie Supporters are in a rage because there is a shortage of babies to eat, or some such thing. And that Hillary has come out firmly against eating babies.

But now those posts are hidden to the general public.

[TDale313]

68. Sadly, they seem pretty clueless as to why...

So many do not want her. Or that their dismissiveness and bullying is not helping their candidate or cause.

[ibegurpard]

69. thankfully you don't speak for all Hillary supporters

I know several IRL for whom I have tremendous respect who don't engage in this sort of petty nonsense.

[boston bean]

70. You're respect is shining through!

[ibegurpard]

80. IRL means in real life

For anonymous people like you on the Internet I have absolutely none.

[boston bean]

93. I know what IRL means. I didn't need the education on that front.

[ibegurpard]

96. Well you obviously needed

The education that I don't give respect to anonymous internet flame warriors. Why on earth would you think you are deserving of something you have a long history of refusing to give?

[DisgustipatedinCA]

75. I'm not faced with the possibility of voting for Clinton. Where did you get such an idea?

[hrmjustin]

78. I noticed that more Sanders supporters are being open and honest about they are not going

to vote for HRC if she is the nominee.

I appreciate their honesty but don't respect puma.

[sibelian]

86. You haven't the FAINTEST idea what you're talking about or who you're talking to

Why don't you just give up all this farcical posturing and start LISTENING?

[boston bean]

92. Who am I talking to? Should I be afraid?

Knock it off with the veiled threats.

[sibelian]

95. "veiled threats"...

That's a beauty. Well done.

[NonMetro]

98. I Support Sanders, But:

I will vote for HRC if she is the nominee. I'm pretty sure Bernie will, too. We're all in the same boat, here, and we all have a right to promote the candidate of our choice. But, let's stay real: when HRC gets the nod, who wants a Republican in the White House?

I'll even put in little plug for my fellow Democrat, Hillary Clinton: I felt her recent statement denouncing Republicans for their shameless attack of Planned Parenthood was right on the mark. I support her 100% on that, even though Bernie did the same thing a couple of months ago.

Now, those in the Clinton camp need to come in here and tell me how washed up I am about that, that Hillary's statement was far more forceful, better timed, far more influential, etc., and how she's always felt that way if any of us other dummies had been listening! Come on people: talk up your candidates!

[AgingAmerican]

102. This is her supporters pet 'issue'

Enticing, isn't it?

[LiberalArkie]

103. Such a long thread and only 1 Rec.

[CrispyQ]

104. 'Cuz they took Unrec away.

[Comrade Grumpy]

105. Classic shit stirring. Just what we've come to expect from you.

No substance, just snark, designed only to irritate supporters of other candidates. Stay classy!

[Logical]

107. If she is the nominee, I will get totally drunk election day and vote for her. No money or time.....

but she gets my vote.

[Avalux]

111. Your posts are just downright rude and obnoxious. n/t

[TBF]

112. Well, it IS October ...