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magical thyme

(14,881 posts)
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 01:08 PM Oct 2015

Bernie Sanders is Ayn Rand’s worst nightmare: He’s changing how we view socialism — and exposing

free market parasites
http://www.salon.com/2015/10/08/bernie_sanders_is_ayn_rands_worst_nightmare_hes_changing_how_we_view_socialism_and_exposing_free_market_parasites/

Excellent article on what socialism is, what socialism isn't, who the real "welfare queens" are, and what they cost our society.

As one would expect, as Sanders has surged, the American right (and center) have gone from ignoring him to attacking him, and the barbs have been predictable indeed. The most common sound something like this: “Socialism has already been tried and it failed,” “There is no free stuff,” “He wants to steal from the job-creators.” Of course, these are familiar attacks that have long wielded against the Democrats, but with a man who does not shun the “socialist” label, they have become even sharper.

First things first: The word “socialism” has become so freely used by the right that it has all but lost the meaning that it once possessed. Since even before the Cold War, the word socialism has been a pejorative in America. When people on the right say, “Socialism has already been tried,” they are by and large thinking of 20th-century communism in the East, i.e., a totalitarian state with a centrally planned economy. If this were the sole definition of socialism, then these anti-socialists would be entirely correct. When considering 20th century communism, it is clear that centrally planned economies without markets do not work in the long run (and black markets become an inevitable feature). At this point in history, markets are necessary for human innovation and wealth creation. But as the economist (and communist, according to Bill O’Reilly) Robert Reich points out his his new book “Saving Capitalism,” the free market vs. government debate is mostly pointless. In order to have a functioning market, there need to be rules, and for rules of the market there needs to be government; the real debate should be whether those rules are working for everyone or just the wealthiest individuals and corporations.

The point is, “socialism” does not necessarily mean centrally planned economies, as most on the right believe. The original definition of socialism was something like this: the collective ownership of the means of production and distribution. In this sense, worker-owned businesses (i.e. worker co-ops) are very “socialistic,” and Sanders has appropriately put forth a plan to increase worker ownership. The word socialism can also mean “Social Democracy” — this is what best describes Bernie Sanders’s philosophy — which involves a market economy with socialistic programs. The most common example of this sort of economic system can be found in the Scandinavian countries, which have hardly “failed.” Indeed, Scandinavian countries have all been previously ranked among the highest in the world when it comes to “ease of doing business,” “global innovation,” and “prosperity.”

The study found that 56% of federal and state dollars spent between 2009 and 2011 on welfare programs — including Medicaid, food stamps and the Earned Income Tax Credit — flowed to working families and individuals with jobs. In some industries, about half the workforce relies on welfare.”

One of the most notorious of these corporations that doesn’t have to pay its workers living wages and is more or less receiving corporate welfare is McDonald’s. Indeed, if we are keeping with these right wing terms, McDonald’s is one enormous welfare queen. It has previously been estimated that fast-food workers, who are on average 29 years old, receive around $7 billion in public assistance, and McDonald’s even has a resource line (McResource) that assists workers in signing up for assistance programs (so it doesn’t have to pay livable wages). This is also true for other massive corporations like Walmart, which is notoriously low-paying and last year made nearly $16 billion in profit. It is always easier to go after the working class poor than massive corporations who make billions in profit and spend millions on lobbying.
33 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Bernie Sanders is Ayn Rand’s worst nightmare: He’s changing how we view socialism — and exposing (Original Post) magical thyme Oct 2015 OP
Kick!!! Faux pas Oct 2015 #1
Rec!! Martin Eden Oct 2015 #2
This is an excellent read, I was just about to post it when I saw your OP. Uncle Joe Oct 2015 #3
K&R deutsey Oct 2015 #4
Who's Ayn Rand? ;) Time to bury her and her followers as just another weird 20th century cult. reformist2 Oct 2015 #5
+1 Matariki Oct 2015 #6
A "philosopher" whose ideas have been tried and failed nxylas Oct 2015 #20
Ayn Rand is the true Author of the Satanic Bible Utopian Leftist Oct 2015 #29
Recently might be a stretch. DemocraticWing Oct 2015 #32
It says something, not very good, about a country and its leaders, see Greenspan eg, that ever sabrina 1 Oct 2015 #7
a little like Lysenko, eh? of course it's because there was profit in it MisterP Oct 2015 #8
HUGE K & R !!! - THANK YOU !!! WillyT Oct 2015 #9
Sanders vs. Ron Paul would have been an interesting election Reter Oct 2015 #10
You might be a socialist if you- ErikJ Oct 2015 #11
Great list and counter! Duppers Oct 2015 #21
Kicked and recommended a whole bunch! Enthusiast Oct 2015 #12
Ayn Rand is dead. zappaman Oct 2015 #13
Maybe her time in Hell is a bit worse now. Motown_Johnny Oct 2015 #26
Too bad her ideas aren't. eom Fawke Em Oct 2015 #27
May I second that? Thank you. dae Oct 2015 #31
k&r polichick Oct 2015 #14
Thanks for posting this. complain jane Oct 2015 #15
This was posted earlier today by cal04 gregcrawford Oct 2015 #16
sorry, missed them. it happens a lot on GD and GDP magical thyme Oct 2015 #17
No biggie... gregcrawford Oct 2015 #23
Kick and Rec! hifiguy Oct 2015 #18
ayn rand was flexible captainarizona Oct 2015 #19
K & R! SoapBox Oct 2015 #22
Definitely a good thing kenfrequed Oct 2015 #24
For those who claim Socialism is the same as Communism... Spitfire of ATJ Oct 2015 #25
People are catching onto one thing HassleCat Oct 2015 #28
K & R LWolf Oct 2015 #30
It's her own fault lostnfound Oct 2015 #33

Uncle Joe

(58,338 posts)
3. This is an excellent read, I was just about to post it when I saw your OP.
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 01:45 PM
Oct 2015

Thanks for the thread, magical thyme.

nxylas

(6,440 posts)
20. A "philosopher" whose ideas have been tried and failed
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 03:40 PM
Oct 2015

Right back atcha, free market fundamentalists.

Utopian Leftist

(534 posts)
29. Ayn Rand is the true Author of the Satanic Bible
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 07:12 PM
Oct 2015

No, I kid you not!

Anton LeVey, the founder of the Church of Satan has recently, publicly admitted to plagiarizing Ayn Rand books, in order to write the Satanic Bible, AKA the Necronomicron.

So Ayn Rand is indirectly the Anti-Christ; Rand Paul her minion. Quelle surprise?

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
7. It says something, not very good, about a country and its leaders, see Greenspan eg, that ever
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 02:05 PM
Oct 2015

embraced the selfish, distorted beliefs of this unfortunate woman who lacked even basic human instincts.

How she EVER got to where she did, where her garbage was required reading in US colleges, is beyond me.

And that there are still those who can't see what a warped psyche they are supporting, should be a matter of concern for this society in general.

Maybe Bernie is the one who can finally put an end to any notion that this woman was anything other than a bitter, selfish, warped individual whose hero was a child murderer.

How refreshing to have someone who is actually intelligent and decent running for office

MisterP

(23,730 posts)
8. a little like Lysenko, eh? of course it's because there was profit in it
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 02:43 PM
Oct 2015

we wouldn't be listening to the people who think Satan's allowed into your house through Celestial Seasonings tea boxes if it didn't serve some interest, either

 

Reter

(2,188 posts)
10. Sanders vs. Ron Paul would have been an interesting election
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 02:47 PM
Oct 2015

Voters would have really had a clear choice. Both establishment side would have gone nuts.

 

ErikJ

(6,335 posts)
11. You might be a socialist if you-
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 02:51 PM
Oct 2015

I've used this to counter when RWers use the socialist label

http://blog.oregonlive.com/myoregon/2009/09/you_might_be_a_socialist.html

You might be a socialist if you ever had to call the police.

You might be a socialist if you ever summoned the fire department.

You might be a socialist if you ever drove your car on a public street or walked on a public sidewalk.

You might be a socialist if you use a municipal sewer service.

You might be a socialist if you get your water from a public water system.

You might be a socialist if you get your electric power from a public utility district.

You might be a socialist if you ever use a public library.

You might be a socialist if you have ever or plan to ever accept a social security check.

You might be a socialist if you use or plan to use Medicare or Medicaid.

You might be a socialist if you or your children attended public school.

You might be a socialist if you ever ride public transit.

You might be a socialist if your bank account is insured by the FDIC.

You might be a socialist if your or a member of your family went to college on a government subsidized student loan.

You might be a socialist if you ever took a trip on AMTRAK.

You might be a socialist if you ever needed the services of a fire department ambulance and EMT.

You might be a socialist if you have sent or received mail via the US Post Office.

You might be a socialist if you were ever represented in a legal matter by a public defender.

You might be a socialist if you ever referred a child to a child welfare office for protection.

You might be a socialist if you ever used electric power produced by Federally built dams.

You might be a socialist if you ever filed suit in a Federal, County, or City court.

You might be a socialist if you ever used a Federal, state, or city park.

You might be a socialist if you have ever used a public swimming pool.

You might be a socialist if you ever sought the help of a government official in solving a problem.

You might be a socialist if you ever benefited from the government regulation of private business.

You might be a socialist if you have benefited from the services of the CDC, FAA, FTSB, or other government agency.

You might be a socialist if your rights and safety have ever been defended by the armed forces.

You might be a socialist if you or a family member has ever been rescued by the Coast Guard or National Guard.

You might be a socialist if an airplane you flew on was guided to a safe landing by an air traffic controller.

You might be a socialist if felons in your area are placed in prison and the criminally insane in asylums.

You might be a socialist if you use the internet, a system developed originally by the U.S. military and scientific groups.

You might be a socialist if you have benefited in any way from research conducted by public universities.

You might be a socialist if you or any of your family have attended a public university or community college.

You might be a socialist if local public employees have cleared your streets of snow, picked up your litter, repaired potholes, or any of hundreds of other necessary tasks.

You might be a socialist if a local municipal garbage service has carried off your trash and your recyclables

You might be a socialist if state or local forestry workers have fought forest fires and maintained healthy forests in your area.

You might be a socialist if state and federal fishery workers have tried to save endangered salmon so you can continue to eat them.

You might be a socialist if you have been involved in a natural disaster and received help from a federal or state disaster relief programs.

You might be a socialist if you have ever supported the passage of a law that requires or bans activities by your fellow citizens which respectively benefit or harm you.

You might be a socialist if you own or work for any business that receives government subsidies or receives tax breaks for locating in particular areas.

You might be a socialist if you attend your favorite pro team’s games in their partially tax funded parks, stadium, or arena.

You might be a socialist if you attend the games of a state college athletic team.



You might be a socialist if you invest in government securities like savings bonds or T bills.

You might be a socialist if you are a public employee.

You might be a socialist if you accepted the tax write off for buying a new home recently offered by the government.

You might be a socialist if you acquired a new car under the Cash for Clunkers program.

You might be a socialist if you have ever supported the document which begins: “We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.”

In short, you might be a socialist if you accept any service, program, or benefit that is supported in whole or in part by tax money.

I’m sure all those good folks protesting government programs like health care because they are socialistic will lead by example and forswear using all of the above socialistic agenda items and any others that may have been omitted.

http://blog.oregonlive.com/myoregon/2009/09/you_might_be_a_socialist.html

 

magical thyme

(14,881 posts)
17. sorry, missed them. it happens a lot on GD and GDP
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 03:27 PM
Oct 2015

prolly because things move so fast.

The only place it's a "crime" is on late breaking news!

SoapBox

(18,791 posts)
22. K & R!
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 04:12 PM
Oct 2015

She was another nut job, that was able to spew out psycho babble, that weak minded types jumped on as gospel.

kenfrequed

(7,865 posts)
24. Definitely a good thing
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 04:17 PM
Oct 2015

Taking back the word 'socialist' has been a long time coming!

Candidates should be lining up and bumping elbows with each other to fight over who will help the people the most and the corporations the least!

 

HassleCat

(6,409 posts)
28. People are catching onto one thing
Thu Oct 8, 2015, 05:29 PM
Oct 2015

Socialism is alive and well in the United States, and corporations are the beneficiaries. Corporations are legally allowed to seize their employees' pension money, for example, and dump pension liabilities on the government. Businesses are not required to have a certain percentage of employees at 40 hours a week, and are free to keep as many employees as they want below the cutoff for benefits, outside the reach of labor laws, etc. so they become essentially wards of the state. And don't even get me started on subsidies, tax credits, etc. given to corporations to entice them to obey the law.

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