2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumNo, Bernie's election won't make all "the venal and craven aspects" go away...
...but at least we'll know that the president we've elected is actually against those aspects and will TRY to fight them.
That matters.
CaliforniaPeggy
(149,514 posts)daleanime
(17,796 posts)tecelote
(5,122 posts)Hillary is going to veer right.
Bernie may not pull off a full 180 but he'll get us on track for a better America.
It's time for real change.
uponit7771
(90,301 posts)Obama completed ~ 80% of his promises, Clinton was damn good too... neither perfect but neither was any other dem progressive prez in America's past.
None of the past dem progressive presidents could throw stones either...
... and neither can any of the current dem candidates, no matter how rosy some glasses get.
TM99
(8,352 posts)and Obama.
He identified himself as a moderate 1980's Republican. We didn't want 80% of those promises fulfilled. We sure as shit don't want Clinton's who is further right than Obama is.
uponit7771
(90,301 posts)... was a moderate republican, that's a winger lie.
He said OTHERs would ID him as that regardless of his stances...
Obama's list was posted before he was elected, to say people didn't want that list is not reality...
People who voted for Obama wanted a progressive agenda and got it, facts matter.
TM99
(8,352 posts)In an interview where he was asked if his economic policies were socialist, he replied thusly --
Yes, facts matter. To bad, you don't seem to know them.
Obama sold a nice PR ploy of Hope & Change. He was NOT a progressive. He is a New Dem. Sorry the truth hurts, I know, but most Democrats have now gotten it after seeing the ACA, TPP, etc. come to pass under his watch.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)uponit7771
(90,301 posts).. I've seen this vid too many times and you can't dispute either of the points without must obfuscation.
I'm not a LIV... been around for second
He was asked if his policies were 'socialistic'. He replied as the video demonstrates.
Those were his words. I realize that you must have a psychological block to hearing it but he said.
uponit7771
(90,301 posts)TM99
(8,352 posts)to avoid the truth. New Dems consider themselves to be 'liberals', 'progressives', etc. It doesn't mean they are.
So fine, you have a great day!
Number23
(24,544 posts)Anyone that chooses to characterize:
as "Oh yeah baby, I'm a moderate Republican!!" is not worth a second of your time.
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)Don't bother replying.
Number23
(24,544 posts)When such a thing existed. Saying that his policies would have been CONSIDERED moderate Republican 30 years ago is a strange comment, but it is not in any way the same thing as saying "I am a Moderate Republican" and every half way honest person recognizes that.
Don't bother replying.
I won't again and wish you hadn't to begin with.
kjones
(1,053 posts)When did Left Wingers start sounding like Right Wingers?
It's been too wacky for too long around here.
uponit7771
(90,301 posts)tazkcmo
(7,300 posts)I don't know how this is any better than what you are refuting.
kjones
(1,053 posts)...But it's nice to see how dedicated some people still are to trashing
Obama, and he's not even running for anything anymore.
Number23
(24,544 posts)lionized here.
But it's nice to see how dedicated some people still are to trashing
Obama, and he's not even running for anything anymore.
Absolutely. And it's hilarious to see so many of this same crew now running around acting as though they've always supported this man when they've done nothing of the damn sort and everyone knows it.
Actually trying to pretend that someone saying "my POLICIES are so mainstream that IN THE 1908s they would have been CONSIDERED (by others to be) moderate Republican" is the same thing as someone saying "now, in the 21st century, I am a Moderate Republican."
And keep your eyes open. A week from now if not sooner, somebody else will post this exact same video and claim that it's Obama saying he's a moderate Republican. No matter how many times this lie has been debunked, rebunked and debunked again, a determined few just keep pulling it out of the trash apparently oblivious that trying to keep it going says far more about them than their target.
uponit7771
(90,301 posts)... the vid is a winger mainstay and we all know it
kjones
(1,053 posts)His comment was, for the most part, to point out how far right the Republicans
have shifted in the past thirty years. It was a dig against Republicans...
but by all means, use it to bash the Democratic POTUS.
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)kjones
(1,053 posts)Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)kjones
(1,053 posts)But if we're talking about "sames"...I've generally found that doing away with the middle,
or in this case moderates, tends to be about the same as "you're either with us, or
against us."
The funny thing is, I think I've heard quite a bit about Bernie's strategy to "peel" off
or pull over some moderate conservatives as his ticket through the primaries...or
at least that was the buzz around here with some of the Bernie people not too long
ago.
tazkcmo
(7,300 posts)Deal with it.
uponit7771
(90,301 posts)Phlem
(6,323 posts)It's awesome that all the bankers who ruined the US economy are in jail, and that prescription drug prices are not going through the roof. Whew! Glad none of the Clintons and Obama had any Wall Street or Pharmaceutical ties.
Thank god we've got all this money flooding in for elections because that's how we're going to find a leader that cares about governing. Go Hillary!!
Also no more wars and a huge influx of living wage jobs are drowning us.
And I swear, if one more mega corporate entity pays their fare share of taxes, I'm just going to explode!!!
I'm sorry but the Clintons and Obama just make FDR look pitiful.
Sing it out loud for everyone to hear!!!!
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Phlem
(6,323 posts)Thank You.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)TDale313
(7,820 posts)Having a President who sees the problems, is and is willing to talk about them and fight to fix them makes a huge difference. I'm not naive enough to think his election will stop all the Republican obstruction. I do think he'd do a much better job making the case to the American people.
saltpoint
(50,986 posts)in a point that 'venal' has been achieved by a famous Republican of these recent generations, one Richard Milhouse Nixon:
- - - - -
It is Nixon himself who represents that dark, venal and incurably violent side of the American character that almost every country in the world has learned to fear and despise."
-- Hunter S. Thompson
- - - - -
LWolf
(46,179 posts)Babel_17
(5,400 posts)It's just not sustainable, and the wheels come off this shared society of ours.
Uncle Joe
(58,268 posts)Thanks for the thread, Ken Burch.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)Amimnoch
(4,558 posts)I promise world peace,
$1 million to every citizen.
Tesla cars for every driveway
An end to cancer, heart disease, lung disease.. Hell, I promise immortality for everyone!
My name is Amimnoch and I approve this message.
Personally, I'll stick with actual progress, proven history, and the capability to actually get the 115th congress to pass bills that will continue the progress that President Obama started.
Much better than someone who will "try", even though there is obviously no version of congress that will make success possible.
neverforget
(9,436 posts)tazkcmo
(7,300 posts)Track record, integrity. Two things you nor your candidate have.
bigwillq
(72,790 posts)K and R
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)As President Bernie will tell the people why Medicare for All is better than the status quo.
He will tell the people why we must reenact Glass Steagal and why it was a mistake to end it.
He will explain the destructive nature of the trade deals and why it is necessary to preserve American manufacturing jobs.
We will have someone on our side, for a change.
stupidicus
(2,570 posts)to take the bull by the horns.
The election of Bernie is by no means a cure to all that ails us in the short term, but it will show the many that need it, what is possible going forward.
Hopefully it will snowball from there.
sadoldgirl
(3,431 posts)Obama will be unable to pass the TPP, and Bernie as
President would shred it.
Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)then burn them and bury the ashes in the Ronald Reagan Memorial Toxic Waste Dump.
Douglas Carpenter
(20,226 posts)Just to have a President who gets the country crawling and then taking baby steps toward a more just society that is at peace with the world would be a huge step forward in itself
2pooped2pop
(5,420 posts)of us.
99Forever
(14,524 posts)No more lies.
Sanders '16
Feel the Bern.
liberal_at_heart
(12,081 posts)hopemountain
(3,919 posts)he is the only candidate for the people and not the almighty greed of the corporations.