HRC = Holy Republican Congress

[mhatrw]

Hillary Clinton is the biggest motivator of Republican voters and weakest motivator of Democratic voters in the entire history of the two party system of electoral politics in the United States.

[Punkingal]

1. Big K&R. Plus an Amen.

[Art_from_Ark]

2. Well, I wouldn't go that far-- at least, not yet.

Mondale couldn't motivate a lot of Democrats, nor could Dukakis, although admittedly they were both running against incumbents. But with Bill Clinton, even though he won in 1992, we still lost 9 House seats, and only managed to maintain our number in the Senate. And in 1996, Clinton won again, but he still had no coattails, as we lost 2 Senate seats and picked up only 2 House seats. And that was coming after the super disastrous election of 1994, when we lost the House for the first time in 40 years, and lost the Senate as well.

[napi21]

3. That's only because she and Bill have been hated by the pubs for decades.

Most of the pubs don't know anything about Bernie and really don't care to find out either. I question the "weakest motivator of Dems" statement. What's making her a weak motivator right now is the media's promotion of Hillary as the inevitable winner. If a lot of people believe she will be the Dem. nominee what would motivate them to get excited about her? I suspect if she is the Dem. nominee, she will generate plenty of enthusiasm to elect her.

[Blue_In_AK]

7. If I have to,

I'll most likely vote for Hillary, although she doesn't stand a snowball's chance in hell of winning here, and my vote, however I choose to cast it, will be meaningless, as it is in most presidential elections. So I can't see myself being enthusiastic other than in response to the fact that she's much better than any of the alternatives on the Republican side. If Bernie were the nominee, he would generate enthusiasm here, I know it, but Hillary not so much.

I'm getting old, and for the sake of my kids and grandkids, I'd like to see some more forward progress before I pass on to whatever is next. I'd like the peace of mind to know that there's hope for a more peaceful and tolerant future where people finally start caring for each other.

I'm an idealist, I know - it's a curse.

[tecelote]

9. +1 for the kids.

Like you said "I'd like the peace of mind to know that there's hope for a more peaceful and tolerant future where people finally start caring for each other."

[underthematrix]

4. Yep. This one gets a LAWD!

[Hortensis]

5. Is this wishful thinking, mhatrw?

Actually, both Hillary and Bernie are drawing independents left, also of course the need for change we all recognize; and with those scary-clown candidates applying the stick from the right, the GOP has good reason to fear large losses in 2016.

[mhatrw]

6. My wishful thinking is not more of the same neolib/neocon crap.

YMMV

[Hortensis]

8. When grabbing for labels to fling like mudballs it might help

to remember that it's truth that hurts. Nonsense does not.

This month's The Atlantic, a politically fairly middle of the road journal, has a big article on "America's Lurch to the Left." It provides a historical overview of what is happening, context in which to view what we are all a part of. Hopefully it'll be reassuring to those who fear change is not happening.

Why America Is Moving Left: Republicans may have a lock on Congress and the nation’s statehouses—and could well win the presidency—but the liberal era ushered in by Barack Obama is only just beginning.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2016/01/why-america-is-moving-left/419112/

[tecelote]

11. America is moving to the left.

But... "Moreover, the Occupy-Warren-Sanders axis has influenced Clinton’s own economic agenda, which is significantly further left than the one she ran on in 2008. She has called for tougher regulation of the financial industry, mused about raising Social Security taxes on the wealthy (something she opposed in 2008), and criticized the Trans-Pacific Partnership (a trade agreement she once gushed about). Overall, Vox’s Matthew Yglesias has written, Clinton appears “less inclined to favor a market-oriented approach than a left-wing approach, a real change from the past quarter century of Democratic Party economic policymaking.” Her “move to the left,” notes Kira Lerner of ThinkProgress, “distances her policies from those of her husband and Obama.”

We have no proof that Hillary is sincere and many believe that she is only moving left to get elected.

Plus, Hillary will continue with the failed ME policies and keep us in continual war.

Better than Republicans? Yes. by a long shot. But...

Bernie has always been there.

[pnwmom]

13. Dream on. Have you heard the word "Trump" lately?

[tecelote]

15. You've seen the line-ups.

Bernie beats Trump but Hillary is a contest.

[pnwmom]

18. Bernie has not gotten the mud-throwing treatment from the Rethugs yet.

He will, and then his positives will fall.

And it won't matter how pure he may be. If they have to, they'll make stuff up -- like they did with Obama. Next thing you know he'll be a Russian spy with an implant in his brain, ready to betray the US for Russia.

[tecelote]

19. If you say so.

The reality is that it will give him more exposure and that's all he needs to win.

Bernie is good at winning elections. He's won more than any other candidate.

[Hortensis]

20. PWN is right, fwiw. But Tecelote, I posted the article

in the hope that some would think about it, not dismiss it out of hand. Try this:

"Arguably more significant than the Sanders campaign itself is the way Democratic elites have responded to it. ... Today, in a Democratic Party whose guiding ethos is “no enemies to the left,” Sanders has met with little ideological resistance. That’s true not only among intellectuals and activists but among many donors.

Journalists often assume that Democrats who write big checks oppose a progressive agenda, at least when it comes to economics. And some do. But as John Judis has reported in National Journal, the Democracy Alliance, the party’s most influential donor club, which includes mega-funders such as George Soros and Tom Steyer, has itself shifted leftward during the Obama years. In 2014, it gave Warren a rapturous welcome when she spoke at the group’s annual winter meeting. Last spring it announced that it was making economic inequality its top priority."

Now, can't one find at least a glimmer of hope in that? Change is always the cumulative product of many and occurs over time. It's already started and is continuing.

[tecelote]

21. I see a glimmer and I see a fire.

You said: "Now, can't one find at least a glimmer of hope in that? Change is always the cumulative product of many and occurs over time. It's already started and is continuing."

Totally agree. It is starting but, and as a Democrat I can't believe I have to say this... what about Peace? Why is Hillary supporting regime change?

I voted for Barack for many reason but I expected an end to our continuous wars. That didn't happen.

Bernie is my choice for many reasons as well. However, he is the left. He is the candidate that will take our country where it needs to go for the sake of our children.

War, Global Warming and Social Justice. Bernie is the one.

A slow turn is happening but the world is not waiting for us. America needs a hard left turn now.

[Hortensis]

23. America can't have a HARD left turn now,

"hard" meaning by definition far more than what all those work has created this leftward movement feel can be done now. Conservatives are half this nation. Even if they don't take the White House, they will still be there working very hard for what they want.

Much of what you say sounds reasonable, but this impossible and out-of-touch goal just underlines my constant impression of too many Bernie followers. People demanding, whining, and kicking because they want everything right now -- their way and only their way-- and refuse to admit that's not possible. Even though the constant roiling resentment on this forum reveals most are not entirely deluded.

BTW, global warming has been a planet-sized oncoming express train heading right at us for over 50 years. President Johnson officially informed Congress a half century ago. Ten years later my college geography teacher explained everything that was going to happen with what, in hindsight, turns out to be great accuracy. The only thing new here is that the planet is finally admitting it and STARTING to do what we always needed to do. More than 50 years after we needed to, after 50 years of enthusiastically stoking the train's engines, we've...STARTED. Too late to avoid the dreadful consequences, but that's what reality is like.

[tecelote]

24. You make my point.

You point out... "People demanding, whining, and kicking because they want everything right now -- their way and only their way-- and refuse to admit that's not possible. Even though the constant roiling resentment on this forum reveals most are not entirely deluded."

Call it what you will but this is how change is brought about.

Your Global Warming argument supports the need for a hard left turn as well.

We can't fight Global Warming while looking out for big energy profits. Hillary is not going to upset the apple cart. Bernie will.

Don't be afraid of hope and please, do what you know you should. Vote for Bernie.

[Hortensis]

31. Political, economic and social change are already happening.

Some here have evidently been so disaffected that they literally do not know it's happening. They know their own discontent. And they fool themselves if they think hanging around here incessantly and tediously complaining and badmouthing "DWS," the DNC, Democrats and Hillary is a meaningful contribution.

They really need to understand that many others are and have been busy WORKING for change, formulating change and making it happen. The profound contempt here for all those who have been doing incredibly more for far longer on many fronts, in many nations and in many ways is a very unjustified conceit.

[tecelote]

34. So, you have a serious disdain for many of the people here.

'Not sure that's going to help.

I work for change in sustainable agriculture but I also believe that we need the hard left turn I discussed earlier.

My fear is that intelligent people like yourself are short changing our future by voting for the status quo. Bernie will not hinder the efforts of people already working for change, He'll support and increase the efforts.

[Hortensis]

35. In 40 years I have never voted for the status quo.

The purpose of that article was to provide a larger picture for consideration. The stakes are not all or nothing, Tecelote.

How do you work for change in sustainable agriculture? That sounds interesting.

[tecelote]

36. It's not all or nothing but I think it can be more.

We obviously disagree there.

I can't discuss the specifics until we publish but basically we are looking at using one acre to supply four to six times what an acre can now support without herbicides or pesticides. The impact will be minimal in most of the US due to the grip international monopolies have on our agriculture but it can be huge for impoverished and nutrient depleted areas.

[msongs]

10. OMG probably all the way back to the big bang and whatever came before that TOO nt

[pnwmom]

12. Bernie the socialist-who-visited-Russia would be just as big a motivator

of Republican voters.

And she will bring out a huge number of women, and African Americans and Latinos, who will proud to cast their votes for the first woman President, the former Secretary of State and New York Senator.

[tecelote]

14. This..

http://elections.huffingtonpost.com/pollster/hillary-clinton-favorable-rating#!selected=Favorable,Undecided,Unfavorable

Pollster Trend

Unfavorable 51.5%
Favorable 42.5%
Undecided 5.1%

---

And this...



http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251984209

[tecelote]

16. And this...

Another Reason To VOTE For Bernie Sanders & Not Hillary Clinton Is ELECTABILITY

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251986696

[AZ Progressive]

17. And you thought Al Gore was bad at motivating voters...

[ismnotwasm]

22. Ok.

[NurseJackie]

25. Ooo... very creative... and how droll. :-/

I suppose someone could also come up with witty, dry and insulting acronyms (or anagrams) for other candidates, but something tells me that such a waggish effort (no matter how clever) would likely not survive an alert.

*Sigh* ... oh well! Such is life.

[still_one]

26. If I was to judge Bernie Sanders on the basis of some comments made on DU by some who say they are

his supporters, I would have some problems if he was the nominee.

Fortunately, Bernie is not like some of the comments supposedly made on his behalf, therefore it isn't a problem for me.

[Katashi_itto]

27. K&R down with 3rd way

[FarPoint]

28. I totally disagree...

Just the opposite... Repugs are frighten of Hillary. Repugs want Democrats to become discouraged in effort to eliminate Hillary from the game.

[Uben]

29. And BS=?

....yeah, that's what I thought!

[Vinca]

30. I have to agree. She's the one person they despise as much as President Obama. Maybe more.

So the right is energized (they get that way when they're in "hate" mode) and the left is not if Hillary is the nominee. It's a dangerous game.

[redstateblues]

32. A Socialist on the ballot would generate a massive

Turnout of Republicans. They would have a field day with Bernie.

[99Forever]

33. Agreed.