It's sort of funny that an entire debate has been reduced down

[MineralMan]

to a couple of interchanges between candidates. It's almost as though none of the rest of it even happened.

We sure have short attention spans. We can only think about one thing at a time, so whatever was the most dramatic two minutes in a 2-hour period is what we take from the event.

But, that's how this election business goes, it seems. As the campaigning proceeds, we react to the latest gaffe or fiery challenge, as if nothing else has occurred during the campaign. We swing wildly back and forth, based on high or low points, instead of looking at the overall picture.

That's human nature. That's just how we are, I guess.

"Short Attention-Span Theater" is our primary form of entertainment.

We could do better, I think, but we probably won't.

[Lulu KC]

1. Yes--

and I think our party is the only one who even thinks the debates matter. I am enjoying it this year, for some reason, knowing that this is not where the decision is actually made about who will be in the White House. It feels like being back in junior high public speaking class (not really a debate, even).

[MineralMan]

4. Yes. I work closely with a man who recently give a TED talk.

I helped him write and polish the talk, because that's the kind of thing I do. So, when the schedule for the talks was announced, he was the last speaker at the event. He expressed his disappointment to me about that.

I explained to him that speaking last was not a bad thing at all. With eight speakers lined up, his would be the last talk. I told him that people would remember his talk better than all the ones that went before, simply because it would be the last thing they heard. We have short memories for things like that.

He got it. Of course, going last meant more time in the Green Room before he could deliver his talk. That's a tense place to be for all that time, really, and he was sort of nervous just before going on stage. I told him, "Just go out there and do it like you did in the rehearsals. You'll be fine." He was fine, and his talk is the one people were conversing about after the event, just as I predicted. He got mobbed by people in the audience who wanted to talk with him further about the ideas he brought up.

The other talks? I don't remember them, really.

[trev]

52. What was his subject?

Do you have a link to his talk?

[True Dough]

2. When one particular candidate, a very seasoned one,

is repeatedly the source of gaffes, it's no longer an anomaly or a slip-up to be swept under the rug. Whether you like it or not, the headlines everywhere today proclaiming "Biden stumbles" will reinforce that image and continue to change some voters' minds. There's a long road ahead and Biden is far from done, but his margin for error is getting narrower and narrower.

[Cha]

5. Yes.. Biden "stumbles".. heard it all..

And Yet.. The Mayor of Atlanta Endorsed Joe Biden for President 2020 this morning.. after the debate.

Biden Lands Endorsement From Atlanta Mayor Bottoms

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287174729

[Tipperary]

9. I think Biden is gonna be just fine.

This is not his first rodeo.

[Lulu KC]

22. That's not what CNN thinks on their website front page

So now I'm turning away. "Turmoil." Save a word like that for when we really need it. So many examples surround us, and now the buzzards are all over Joe.

[Tipperary]

37. Pay them no mind.

Striving for relevance.

[gldstwmn]

51. We need to pay attention. He is not a good candidate.

His campaign is a mess.

[Butterflylady]

56. Who says that!

Not what I heard. As read earlier here he gave a hell of good speech today. Negativity gets you no where. At least Joe isn't tearing into other candidates. He's not giving orange anal any ammunition to use against the others. We have enough of disrespect coming out of the oval office we don't need it here.

[gldstwmn]

57. Lots of people are saying it.

Its not dispespect. I don't dislike him personally. He is not right for this election cycle IMO. There are better choices IMO who are better suited to take on Trump and fix the mess he has made.

[Tarheel_Dem]

49. +1

[delisen]

24. Possibly Biden already had that endorsement & this debate triggered a decision

to announce or possibly the announcement after the debate had already been plannEd.

[Cha]

26. Yeah.. keep parsing that ol endorsement

from Mayor Bottoms!

[delisen]

33. Have no idea why my comment should evoke your response

The choreography of political campaigns is important to me, and this includes deals and agreement made that are not done in the public eye.

Your "parsing" comment is puzzling.

My interest in what is done behind the scenes may be of no interest to you but is certainly no reason to disparage my interest in the process of decision-making.

[Cha]

35. More from Mayor Keisha Bottoms..

"The larger context was that you have to work across the aisle with people you don't like, people you don't agree with," Bottoms said. "I do it each and every day as mayor of Atlanta in a red state."

Bottoms added that Biden's work on civil rights issues and his progressive resume demonstrate his commitment and that the remarks were blown out of proportion.

"My position is, if his explanation was good enough for John Lewis, then it's good enough for me," Bottoms added, referring to the Georgia congressman and civil rights icon who was among Biden's defenders after the controversy.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/biden-nabs-2020-endorsement-atlanta-mayor-bottoms-64012750

[Tipperary]

38. Thank you.

This.

[Cha]

47. Thank You, Tipperary!

[delisen]

46. Still don't see how this relates to my comment. Possibly

you are responding to someone else.

[MarcA]

48. +1,000 n/t

[Backseat Driver]

3. With so much talent, it's a tough choice

I don't know about you, but decisions are made by pro and cons, best qualities; worse qualities; otherwise, we'd have a presidency that would look like a Committee somewhere in the gray area between. So, being informed on proposed improvements in a platform and intense listening skills of those that will implement are so necessary when this field is so large, so talented, and the choice ever so important.

[MineralMan]

13. Yes, it is a tough choice.

That's why I'm not looking at individual moments or statements. Instead, I'm looking at a much bigger picture, and the goal of beating Donald Trump. My final decision in the primaries will be: Who has the best chance to win in November? That's always the final question I ask myself.

[crazytown]

16. I imagine the tough prosecutor who plays to win

moved up your list of possibles. The strategy was well planned, well executed, and paid off more or less as anticipated. On a larger scale, that is how you win campaigns.

[MineralMan]

19. Back when Kamala Harris launched her campaign, as the very first

candidate to do so, I remarked that she did a wonderful job and would be a force to reckon with.

I still think so. My dream ticket is Biden/Harris, and that's still my dream ticket for the general election. Their minor dispute doesn't change that for me, nor does it take that ticket out of likely outcomes.

Harris's only mistake was to already have the t-shirts with her childhood picture up for sale before the debate. That was not great planning, since it now looks like she was all set to "ambush" Biden during the debate. It was a good choice to do that, but not a good choice to provide evidence that it was all planned in advance. The media has noticed that, as well, and it takes away some from her victory on that one point.

[crazytown]

29. I've looked at that t-shirt. It doesn't appear pre-planned to me.

A quick cut and paste of a photo, and generic karmalaharris.org on the back. No mention of that little girl was me.

[emmaverybo]

32. Campaign team tweeted this picture out her out during debate. Whole thing set to go. NT

[Buzz cook]

60. As was the endorsement today by Atlanta Mayor Krisha Bottoms.

It was set up for the day after the debate to either shore up apoor debste or bolster a good debate by Biden.

Its what campaigns do, they set things up for their candidate.

[emmaverybo]

62. An endorsement is not a graphic to accompany a scripted, rehearsed, and brilliantly acted out

vignette sprung as performance politics to dazzle the audience and discombobulate the target.
Innovative as heck. But not anything we have seen before in a debate, so can not be prepared for.

[BlueWI]

65. Biden doesn't need these excuses.

He should be better prepared next time to address the substance of the real issue - school segregation and enduring racism, and to do it with a bit more grace. These issues are just as relevant today as they were in the 1970s. It's perfectly reasonable to expect a presidential candidate to defend their record more effectively. Leaning on surrogates and endorsements too much is a mistake made by the Clinton campaign on racial issues, followed by depressed turnout on election day. Don't repeat this mistake - prepare!

I think that on balance, his record on these issues has some strong points, but there's too much dependence on his association with Obama to insulate him from scrutiny of his record. He's got to stand on his own and articulate positions that speak to the future of race relations.

Temperamentally, Biden seems to struggle when his views are questioned vigorously. He should study Mayor Pete's answers to similar questions.

[emmaverybo]

66. He's back in the game now. Every one can learn Harris too.

[BlueWI]

67. Agreed that Harris can learn too.

The campaign that learns fastest is a likely winner.

[Kind of Blue]

68. Yeah, I agree. Strategic merchandise planning is not

really necessary these days. Just log on to Zazzle or any of a number of printing on demand, upload your jpg and see how it looks on just about anything for display, done within seconds.

And it seems the image and or words already selling at online stores - Esty, Red Bubble, Crew T-shirts, not just her campaign. I don't know how that works with trademark infringement and stuff like that but it's already a hot item for many sellers.

[Tiggeroshii]

6. Biden lost most

Last edited Fri Jun 28, 2019, 11:09 PM - Edit history (1)

And will continue to do so in the upcoming debates

[Thekaspervote]

11. Meh

[MineralMan]

14. Not really. You're looking at it from a strongly biased position.

I've seen your posts here, ever since this forum opened. I think your bias is showing clearly through the entire thing.

So, I'm going to weigh that as I read what you post.

[Tiggeroshii]

64. Bias doesnt necessarily mean "wrong."

And I concretely agree that I am biased (as are most people with any kind of an opinion).

Nonetheless, he spent most of the time on the defense and most attention was focused on the lesser known candidates like Yang, Harris and Swalwell. Bernie and Biden got few chances to shine, and Biden was attacked the most because he is the frontrunner and did not seem to fair through the criticisms so well...

[MineralMan]

69. I didn't say it did mean wrong.

Bias is just a tendency. It can be positive, negative, or completely neutral. I used it in that sense.

[gldstwmn]

54. Agreed. A lot of folks

don't even see it happening.

[democratisphere]

58. In your dreams.

Biden had one of his largest donation days yesterday during the debates. The debates sure helped me drastically clear the field of candidates and now I am down to only 2. Biden and Warren are the most qualified candidates we have to become President. The rest just don't cut it.

[Tipperary]

7. No shit.

Spot on.

[nolabear]

8. It's better this morning. I'm hearing about many more responses.

It takes time. There’s a breakdown of Kamala’s Hand up on “Would you give up your private insurance?” (she says she heard it differently and wasn’t advocating MFA). There’s curiosity about how calculated her launch into Biden was, given they’re already flogging shirts with “That little girl was me” and the photo she immediately tweeted. There’s Rachel quoting Bernie and him saying it wasn’t true (and I’m not stating the nuance, but she reiterated it was a quote).

The Root correspondent on MSNBC this morning was pretty sanguine, giving her her due but doubting that had changed black votes. There was commentary on Bernie’s response to the “torch passing” afterward, where he sort of blew it off, but the surprising, to me, addition that Democrats had never elected anyone over 54.

As the adrenaline wears off the analyses and responses are going to evolve. It’ll be a long few months.

[Cha]

12. Thanks for that report, nolabear.. there's this, too..

Biden Lands Endorsement From Atlanta Mayor Bottoms

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287174729

[nolabear]

17. That's important. I do want Joe to get out there and talk policy.

The press and opponents will stick with the past as much as possible to keep emotions high and give him no way out. I’d go straight to “I will talk about what I will do for this country now. Support those policies or don’t.”

[peggysue2]

39. Yes, very long!

I do think the tee-shirt business undercuts the attack. Harris' campaign should have been smarter about that because it appears absolutely calculated and pre-planned.

That being said, I fully understand the reason for punching up and out. Harris' poll numbers have been flagging and she needed to reverse that. I fully expect her numbers will improve. It's politics, after all. A blood sport. We're likely to see and hear much more of this.

Interesting comments by The Root correspondent about the exchange not changing the black vote by any real measure. It pretty much sums up my personal assessment: Joe Biden is a known quantity. Voters know who he is, what he cares about and where his heart is. They've seen him over many years; they trust and like (even love) him. That's a huge advantage.

[mcar]

10. Controversy aside

We had actual answers given using real words. The fact checkers had a very easy job of it, since most everything said was...what's the word? Oh yeah, true.

A breath of fresh air.

[MineralMan]

15. Yes. As I said, we have a lot of talent up there running in

this primary campaign. All are good people. A couple I don't care for, but they're not doing well, so I'm not concerned about them. The rest, though, are all people I could vote for next November. That's a very good sign.

[mcar]

43. I'd be happy to vote, and campaign for,

most of them.

[MineralMan]

44. Yes. My primary goal is defeating Trump,

so that's the ability I'm looking for in the primary candidate I vote for. Almost all of our candidates are in favor of things I also favor, so there's no problem there. However, not all of our candidates can win against Trump, I'm certain and that's the one thing our nominee must be able to do.

[Lulu KC]

23. +1

[True Dough]

40. True.

They're all decent, if not exemplary, candidates. Personally, I find Williamson kind of "off the wall" but there was real substance and authenticity to the debate. I'm looking forward to more of these events in the months to come.

[Act_of_Reparation]

18. It's not our attention span that's the problem here.

There are too many candidates, full stop. Hopefully that will change before the primaries start. A smaller debate between front runners of more varying positions would be more useful.

[MineralMan]

20. I agree that there are too many candidates.

I've tuned out most of them, but that doesn't change the limited time each had in the debate schedule. Like you, I hope some will realize the futility of continuing and shift their direction to some other office they could maybe win.

There will be new polling out on Monday and Tuesday. I hope some take a clue from it and make new plans.

[Kaleva]

21. History shows that short exchanges or one liners can have major effects.

Ronald Reagan

"I will not make age an issue of this campaign. I am not going to exploit, for political purposes, my opponent's youth and inexperience."

Lloyd Bentsen

"I served with Jack Kennedy. I knew Jack Kennedy. Jack Kennedy was a friend of mine. Senator, you're no Jack Kennedy."

Gerald Ford

"There is no Soviet domination of Eastern Europe."

[MineralMan]

27. Yes, they can. I have not seen anything like that, though.

I remember the busing controversy in the early 1970s. Busing was a very unpopular solution in the minds of almost everyone. It turned out better than expected, but it's not really being used any longer as a way to balance racial distribution in the schools in most places. Other solutions have been developed.

That was almost 50 years ago now. Memories are vague after 50 years, for most people, and non-existent for a helluva lot of folks, who weren't even born yet.

It's not going to be an issue that persists, I think.

[42bambi]

25. I'll add that the media loves them some instant

DRAMA! Let's try not to focus on the hype and focus on what is important for the long term.
imho

[MineralMan]

28. That's true, of course.

[emmaverybo]

30. When one person makes herself the center of attention, she "upstages" the whole cast. Kamala

Harris planned a bit of theater last night to make the debates about her.
And yes, she was a great success, lauded now as a rising star, ready for the presidency. We are being told how to think about her performance on CNN, on.MNSBC.

Andrea Mitchell said something to the effect that Harris was so dazzling that the debate came down to her moment.

[MineralMan]

34. Well, you won't find me dissing Kamala Harris.

I think she'll be Biden's running mate, if he's smart. She would be an enormous asset to the ticket. As the top of the ticket, though, I think Harris would lose to Trump. As a VP candidate, I think she would make a Democratic victory a sure thing.

Think strategically. That's my recommendation.

[emmaverybo]

41. I'm not asking you to. I can do fine all by myself. I admired her greatly. I think a VP does have

to play second field and this humility is not really for her—not a criticism.
Biden has choices. He doesn’t have to choose from among his rivals.

[Cha]

36. OH gawd.. Andrea, But Her Emails, Mitchell

[emmaverybo]

42. Made me chuckle. NT

[wyldwolf]

31. ...over an issue very few care about

It's a given supporters of lower polling candidates will come after the frontrunner. But the left have a special kind of faux outrage.

[MineralMan]

45. Well, when someone never has anything good to say about the leading

candidate, but often has something bad to say, then I know something's going on. When someone doesn't even bother to post, except to push for a single candidate, then I know something's going on. When someone can't even entertain the idea that someone other than one candidate might end up being the nominee, then I know something's going on.

I didn't go through the 2016 primary without learning those things, and I'm not about to forget them.

There is a lack of subtlety in some people who choose to post here that gives them away. I try not to engage with such folks.

[R B Garr]

61. Yup, so much for this being an election about the future.

Arguing over busing from 40 years ago is what’s being served up.

[gldstwmn]

50. Your guy lost. He stumbled badly.

He is not the right candidate for this election. IMO. I'll vote for him if I have to but there are better choices.

[JoeOtterbein]

53. It's odd to me that such an experienced candidate would expect...

..anything else.

[happyaccident]

59. I care about policies and ideas not personal charisma

I don't love the politician I support (Warren). I respect her. I don't put much importance on primary debates, every candidate can be researched on issues. I will watch the national debates (if they happen) to watch trump squirm and look the fool. last time was politics as usual, expecting a real fight this time. This is the best Democratic Party lineup this liberal has ever seen (except for Trojan Horse Tulsi).

[cbelle1039]

63. Not sorta funny. Sorta sad.

[StarfishSaver]

70. A black woman talked about race

So it's a thing.