Democratic Primaries
Related: About this forumJimmy Carter and Bernie Sanders show age is no obstacle when it comes to serving
I could not help but be moved by recent photos circulating out of Nashville, Tennessee, showing Jimmy Carter, looking as though he had been punched in the eye, patiently fashioning a piece of wood and preparing to use a power drill lending his energies to a building project for one more person in need.
(snip)
Yet we are right to celebrate Carters endurance even as it comes around in these same days that some are questioning the health of Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders, who suffered a heart attack on Oct. 1, and encouraging him to drop out of the presidential race.
(snip)
I dont know whether Sanders should drop out of the race. It strikes me as the most personal of decisions. He alone knows how he feels. What I would say about Sanders, though, is that he seems genuine, a politician to be sure, but one who, like Carter, is driven to do good.
In the end, I think that as you get older you gain appreciation for your elders, those who came before, who have been where you are now walking, and somehow survived into greater maturity. Both Carter and Sanders are teaching us lessons about the journey, and maybe we can take some of them along as we make our own way.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2019/10/21/bernie-sanders-jimmy-carter-lessons-on-service-into-maturity-column/4046506002/
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
BeyondGeography
(39,284 posts)Carter has already said he couldnt have handled the job of President at 80.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
George II
(67,782 posts)...comparison between Jimmy Carter and Bernie Sanders.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)I dont know whether Sanders should drop out of the race. It strikes me as the most personal of decisions. He alone knows how he feels. What I would say about Sanders, though, is that he seems genuine, a politician to be sure, but one who, like Carter, is driven to do good.
blob:https://uw-media.usatoday.com/c9356f2f-ba38-4eaa-9d9c-593e346e2bf1
I suppose it could be argued that some people couldn't handle the job of working on homes for the less fortunate at the age of 95 or perhaps even 85 but that hasn't stopped Jimmy.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)every individual ages differently.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)Jimmy was 17; almost old enough to go to war when Bernie was a baby.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)Carter has always been very active and fit.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)"Carter has always been very active and fit."
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)than Trump while maintaining a grueling campaign schedule and doing all that with one clogged artery for at least months no doubt
Now Bernie is operating on full blood flow.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
George II
(67,782 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)Bernie Sanders' campaign announced Thursday it has now received contributions from over 1 million individual donors.
"With 1 million contributors, this is the only Democratic campaign that has more supporters than Donald Trump," said campaign manager Faiz Shakir. "Our strength is in numbers, and that is why Bernie Sanders is the only candidate who is able to say his campaign will rely only on grassroots funding in both the primary and against Donald Trump."
Sanders reached the milestone seven months after he announced his candidacy in February, faster than any candidate ever.
(snip)
The campaign also presented this statistic in its release "in counties nationwide that flipped from Obama in 2012 to Trump in 2016, Sanders has received more than 81,000 donations, which is three times the next Democratic candidate and more than the next three Democratic candidates combined."
(snip)
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/bernie-sanders-has-one-million-donors/
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
George II
(67,782 posts)...included only 28,000 donors, 28,063 to be exact.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
George II
(67,782 posts)....to the FEC by the Sanders Campaign.
You can find them here and tell me how I'm misrepresenting them:
https://www.fec.gov/data/receipts/?committee_id=C00696948&two_year_transaction_period=2020&data_type=processed
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,273 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TidalWave46
(2,061 posts)You keep making bad points for someone you claim to support.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,273 posts)https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/democrats-vs-trump/jimmy-carter-reveals-he-voted-bernie-sanders-over-hillary-clinton-n756846
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)He was an anyone but Hillary guy in the primaries.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)that was the case?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)Bad blood between Carter and Clintons is no secret.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)but asking why?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Otto Lidenbrock
(581 posts)1) President Carter's decision to allow the Cuban refugees on the Mariel Boat and house some of them in Arkansas hurt Governor Clinton's re-election. First because people were not happy in the state they were being sent there, but more importantly some broke out of the housing complex and caused disruption. Clinton's opponent campaigned on that lack of order to win in 1980 and Clinton who was polling well for most of his term blamed the Carter Administration for putting him in a limbo.
2) When Clinton was elected President in 1992 several of his advisors, especially on foreign policy, were Carter alumni. Yet the Clinton Administration distanced itself from Carter. Clinton communicated with Richard Nixon until Nixon's death but not really with Carter. Until it came to North Korea in 1994 when Carter was acting on the administration's behalf to negotiate an agreement to stop the building of nuclear reactors, allow UN inspectors to visit and halt tension (violated under GW Bush). Carter accomplised that but went on CNN to announce it ahead of time and the Clinton cabinet were not best pleased at that.
3) Their character and post-presidencies are unlike. Clinton was and still is a stellar political surrogate. His speech at the 2012 DNC rocked the place. He's a great guy to have on the stump down ballot. He has the celebrity pull for fundraising. He's not lost that charisma even if he is a bit out of the picture these days. Carter on the other hand comments on active US politics but he's never really been involved deeply since leaving the White House. Both have done great things with their foundations but I guess Clinton's speech money makes him open to criticism - especially when compared to Carter. This is a media perception though. I think they get along ever since Bill left office and any tension was left in a bygone era.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TidalWave46
(2,061 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
comradebillyboy
(10,119 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ismnotwasm
(41,921 posts)Has nothing to do with him not being my choice.
I will say, however, a heart attack means a part of your heart has died. The area of infarct shows up on EKGs for instance The rest of it picks up and functions, but its never the same. While I am sure Bernie has excellent medical care, and takes as best care of himself as possible, To continue as is is, in the face of the odds he faces as far as HEALTH and age, probably isnt wise, but its certainly not my decision to make.
Im also a bit appalled at the article using Jimmy Carter to boost Bernie Sanders. Jimmy Carter hasnt been president in decades. Jimmy Carter doesnt grandstand, just quietly goes about the world doing good as often as he can. Bernie is constantly in the spotlight~he HAS to be to run for president. It is grueling and exhausting. I doubt Bernie will stop either. In my opinion, hes unlikely to win the nomination. I dont think hes going to stop being in the public eye. Once this is over, though, maybe he can slow a bit, enjoy his grandchildren, enjoy his homes. Enjoy the little luxuries he has acquired after 40 years.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)mortal, major damage or very minor damage.
Bernie believes in the message or movement first and foremost, that's what he is about, "not me, us."
I'm totally in agreement with the article in regards to "both being driven to do good."
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
ismnotwasm
(41,921 posts)Heres where age does matter though. As you age so dies your entire vascular system. Your venous system has valves that fail, you arteries stiffen, the heart valves weaken.
His heart is in good enough shape for sure, otherwise he wouldnt be able to do what he does at ALL
Jimmy Carter is concerned with poverty and homelessness. Bernie Sanders wants to change an entire political system.
At my kindest, what I think hes doing, is driving the conversation, rather than thinking he will live to SEE actual changes. He uses every drop of political capital he has to push the idea of Democratic Socialism. I know you love him, and think his proposals have merit, but to me they are outlines, with so many of the details that make policy work, left out.
Its like he paints, on a political canvas, what he sees as beneficial, but in the impressionist style.
He is facing enormous pushback however. The next President after Trump is going to have to fix a broken country.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)What do you believe has lead to record poverty and homelessness?
The greatest wealth inequality in 50 years, this didn't happen overnight.
Trump is a manifest symptom of the system, you can treat the symptoms but if you don't treat the disease it will come back and in a much more virulent form.
I remember when George W. Bush and Cheney; promoters of torture and wars based on lies were the worst threat to the republic, now Trump almost makes them seem like statesmen, that's how far down the rabbit hole we have fallen.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
ismnotwasm
(41,921 posts)Like I said, at my most kind, in my most charitable thoughts, this is what I think Bernie Sanders is trying to do. Also, still feeling kind and charitable, I dont think, is that HE thinks, that 1) He will be president 2) He will see the changes he desires in his lifetime. Change doesnt work that way unless there is bloody revolution.
He is driving a conversation, a prelude to change,
(You are talking about the greatest wealth inequality in a Democratic system, specifically the a United States of course)
Trump is peak Whiteness to me. Trump is what happens in a system, social and economic that oppresses base of race, culture and gender.
Economically, is there another country as large and diverse as the US that has embraced Democratic socialism?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)relying solely on grass roots funding while taking on the most powerful entities; whether they be oligarchs, or mega-conglomerates in our current dysfunctional and cruel system, what do you believe would be the political social impact or reverberations if Bernie were to win the Presidency?
Would such a win against the odds have long "coattails" for Democratic candidates running for the Congress?
To me Trump is most transparent whiteness, he lacks the political skills and guile to camouflage his rhetoric in more politically correct terms.
I believe one has to view the power brokers or structures in any society as a requisite in regards to social, economic oppression based on race, gender and culture.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
ismnotwasm
(41,921 posts)I am done arguing about institutional racism here. Suffice to say, yes its real.
Anyway.
Unfortunately I see no scenario where Bernie would win, but lets play. (off the cuff here)
He supports changes that in cases will need court challenges, such as corporate personhood. Im all for it. He supports M4A, which will FACE enormous court challenges, but I can get behind it if the promised universal healthcare ALSO delivers healthcare workers and facilities and equipment especially in underserved and rural areas. If ANY legislation does not take healthcare workers, providers and facilities into consideration It. Will. Not. Work. The system is already overloaded. People talk about drug prices, but did you know most drug are manufactured outside the US? We are constantly facing shortages. Right now its heparin.
Wall Street. As I recall, Bernie Sanders likes to play with math and Wall street, cutting into corporate profits to pay for social programs. One of the many reasons I am not supporting Bernie right now is his math never seemed to work out and quite frankly reining in the excesses of Wallstreet will take precision. A series of regulations and oversight that balances the economy. Traders work a certain way, for instance sometimes very reckless indeed, is my understanding.
And We are a global economy no matter what populist candidates think. Other countries matter.
So grassroots lets see, what would you like, limit campaign contributions to say, 500 dollars from individuals and $2000 from pacs? Or better yet, simply limit the amount of spending any candidate can use. Say Each major race had a cap of 10 million, local races 2 million something like that? I could go for that. (Im making numbers up for convenience)
I get the premise of Democratic Socialism. It called sharing. The US may get there, in part, someday. It wont get there quickly or without pain. I do not want want vulnerable communities to pay the price. So no. Im not a revolutionary.
Being a fan of cyberpunk, Ive seen through imaginative writings, the ultimate outcomes of unregulated government (bad)or the breakdown of government into city states. (bad, but interesting, in a train wreck kind of way) and other scenarios.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
GeorgeGist
(25,294 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Skidmore
(37,364 posts)He's older than us boomers by a few years.
BTW Jimmy Carter has more guts and savvy than Sanders ever had. My opinion. That man has done so much for others, dealt with incredibly serious health concerns, and can still build houses in his 90s. Not to forget that he actually was president, brokered a peace deal that lasted until Trump shredded it, and is a nuclear engineer. No comparison.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(144,005 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
appalachiablue
(41,056 posts)and pride; President Carter still going strong and Bernie on the mend. I've had the luck to meet both of them.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Response to Uncle Joe (Original post)
elocs This message was self-deleted by its author.
George II
(67,782 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
George II
(67,782 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)"That's America, and why Jimmy Carter signed up to serve in the US Navy and protect our freedoms."
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)It's amusing when any candidate needs to be compared to a 95 year old in order to make them appear to be younger and healthier than they actually are. That's the sign of a campaign that's feeling desperate, and that has run out of good ideas.
Fact of the matter is, BS is not a healthy man... and the office of POTUS is one that's very stressful and it is well known to age many fine and FIT men by 25 years before their term is complete. Do the math! His afib fainting spell (or slip-and-fall) and his heart attack and the stents to open up his clogged arteries... well things just aren't looking good for him, health-wise.
All I'm saying is that when you consider the stress, the long hours, the travel, the jet-lag and lack of sleep... well that's something that takes a lot out of you, so the candidate I support will be one who can handle the rigors of the office. It's my belief that if someone can't easily handle the rigors of campaigning, then that person is definitely not the one for the rigors of the office of POTUS.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)Jimmy Carter is a loyal Democrat who loves his party. He's not the kind of many who'd go around calling Democrats "feeble" and "ideologically bankrupt". Carter would never accuse the party of being "corrupt" or "no different than the GOP". President Carter would also never stoop so low as to denigrate the party with a baldfaced lie by saying the Democrats "are the party of the elite" or "the party of the one-percent".
All I'm saying is that Jimmy Carter is an honorable man. I like him a lot. I always have, I always will.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
ismnotwasm
(41,921 posts)Seriously doubt Carter would have voted for him were he not. He is now too, right? He just switched for his local races? I dont keep track.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)and he knew it then.
Bernie is running as a Democratic candidate for President now and if he should win the nomination and election, he will govern as a Democratic President.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)both as a general election voter and Superdelegate.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
George II
(67,782 posts)...the upper west side of Manhattan in 1976. I was only 28 years old, and I was devastated when he lost four years later.
I'd campaign for him today if he could run. A great man and a great, loyal Democrat.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)graciousness. He has superb intellectual agility, and has the self awareness and strength of character to admit when he has made a mistake.
That's why he's so honored and respected among his progressive peers, much like HRC.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
stonecutter357
(12,682 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)was no Abraham Lincoln but they're all on Mount Rushmore.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)was no Abraham Lincoln but they're all on Mount Rushmore.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
myohmy2
(3,118 posts)...that much about chronological age...it's how you feel and what shape you're in at any age...young people die everyday...
"...but one who, like Carter, is driven to do good."
...this is what's important to me...
...I'm sure Bernie will pick a like-minded VP...I'm convinced if you can survive the rigors of running and getting elected President, you can do the job...
...only Bernie knows how Bernie feels and what his limits may be...but I don't see Bernie being any different than any other candidate...
...as long as Bernie's being medically transparent, screw his age...then think if we had medically dismissed FDR...
...what would the world look like today?...
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
PhoenixDem
(581 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Jimmy Carter has been a lifelong rolemodel and delivers results rather consistently. Jimmy Carter just doesn't talk about a perfect world, he seems to be working his ass off producing concrete results to bring that world into reality.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)In the long arc of reality, that meant nothing but that I preferred her in the primary. President Obama was perfectly acceptable to me, I just preferred Hillary. Jimmy Carter is pretty much a pacifist now, maybe Hillary's Iraq War vote is why he preferred Bernie, people have their reasons.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)I believe that also played a major role in his decision making.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,112 posts)(snip)
Many governments, media, and human-rights organisations outside Honduras have termed the ouster a coup.[38] The United Nations, the Organization of American States (OAS),[39] and the European Union condemned the removal of Zelaya as a military coup. On 5 July 2009, the Organization of American States OAS, invoking for the first time Article 21 of the Inter-American Democratic Charter, voted by acclamation of all member states to suspend Honduras from the organisation.[40]
Soon after the coup, U.S. President Barack Obama stated: "We believe that the coup was not legal and that President Zelaya remains the president of Honduras, the democratically elected president there."[41] He stated: "It would be a terrible precedent if we start moving backwards into the era in which we are seeing military coups as a means of political transition, rather than democratic elections."[41] Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, however, equivocated, saying that "We do think that this has evolved into a coup" and noting that under U.S. law, officially declaring a coup would oblige the U.S. to cut off most foreign aid to Honduras."[41][42] Cutting off aid was seen as a possibility in the days after the coup,[42] and State Department Director of Policy Planning Anne-Marie Slaughter urged Clinton to "take bold action" and to "find that [the] coup was a 'military coup' under U.S. law."[43] Nevertheless, Clinton did not do so, and the U.S. never formally declared that a coup had occurred.[41] By November 2009, the U.S. "focused on pushing for elections" in the country.[44] In September 2009, the Board of the U.S. Millennium Challenge Corporation, headed by Clinton, cut off $11 million in aid to the Honduran government in the wake of the coup, and suspended another $4 million in planned contributions to a road project.[45] From 2009 to mid-2016, however, the U.S. provided about $200 million in military and police aid to Honduras, a controversial decision given the violence in Honduras and the government's human rights violations.[46]
(snip)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Honduran_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Response to Uncle Joe (Original post)
BlueMississippi This message was self-deleted by its author.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)Heal quickly President Carter! We love you!
https://www.live5news.com/2019/10/22/former-president-jimmy-carter-suffers-another-fall-his-ga-home/
Link to tweet
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden