Democratic Primaries
Related: About this forumThe controversy over Joe Biden's treatment of women, explained
(snip)
That presence extended to a habit of quite publicly making remarks about womens appearances and frequent physical contacts that any modern HR department would probably warn against. For years, it was played off primarily as a joke Joe being Joe paired with some complaints from progressive writers and a larger volume of complaints from conservative writers that progressives were being hypocritical in not complaining about Biden.
In the wake of the heightened mobilization of women in the Democratic Party and the #MeToo movement, it was inevitable that this would become an issue if Biden ran for president. And even though hes not quite in the race yet, he and his camp keep very heavily hinting that he will be soon.
The allegation isnt that he has dark secrets, but that the stuff weve seen on camera and laughed off should be taken seriously as making public life hostile to women. Critics fear this will bring to life their long-held nightmare of #MeToo overreach, in which the idea of long-public behavior by a well-known and well-liked Democrat is suddenly unfairly castigated.
(snip)
These are all nice sentiments, and they underscore one of the reasons nobody in progressive politics has been particularly eager to bring this up. Biden is a personally very well-liked member of the Democratic Party establishment, nobody really thinks he meant any harm, and were he quietly fading into an elder statesman role, everyone might leave well enough alone. But Biden is putting himself forward as a political leader for the present-day, and his conduct does not really fit cutting-edge progressive values. You can clearly see that even in this statement, which centers his subjective intentions rather than womens experiences.
(snip)
https://www.vox.com/2019/4/2/18290345/joe-biden-lucy-flores-amy-lappos
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)And the attacks on Biden are bullshit.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
LongtimeAZDem
(4,494 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
LongtimeAZDem
(4,494 posts)But, more to the point, if you want to be taken seriously as a strong, independent adult, there's stuff you have to learn to deal with.
I've been subjected to many situations where others, both male and female, got too "up close and personal" and that made me uncomfortable. But, since I knew that wasn't their intent, as Flores admits, I let it go.
That's what grownups do; they don't (literally!) make a federal case out of it.
Nearly everyone agrees, even some of those who say Biden went to far, that he does it out of a genuine desire to be caring and compassionate. Both Flores and Lappos specifically state that they didn't believe it was sexual in any way.
So, we're seeing somebody get ratfucked for going over the line with being a nice guy. Enough.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
PatSeg
(47,239 posts)You didn't go around all the cable news shows and discuss your discomfort with the entire country?
But seriously, unless we've lived a hermit's existence for our entire life, we've all felt uncomfortable with some people either at work or socially. It could even be people that we genuinely liked, but as grownups, we know that everyone is different and what is okay with one person, might not be with another.
You know, it dawns on me that we have so many things to be upset about, especially in this Trump era, how anyone can dwell on crap like this is beyond my understanding. Well, not completely if you throw in political maneuvering and dirty tricks, that tends to make some sense.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)of a loss of identity power.
"But, more to the point, if you want to be taken seriously as a strong, independent adult, there's stuff you have to learn to deal with."
That's one way to do it, 'go along to get along' or you can work to change those power dynamics as the lady in the article below is doing.
Why Men Feel As If They Own Women's Space And How To Take It Back
(snip)
I was sitting in class and Cam was sitting on the complete opposite side. I heard rumors about him being very pushy and forward, but hadn't experienced it myself, so I kept a pretty neutral opinion of him, until my professors assigned us partners to work with. I got assigned to work with Cam for the rest of the class. So I looked to see if he was going to come to me (I had space next to me) but he didn't move, so I got up to got to him (nbd). I sit next to him and begin to start on our assignment, to which he barely participates in. And honestly, that worked for me because I am an independent worker anyways.
So, there I am sitting there doing the assignment when he moves his arm onto my desk. I was perplexed, but studies show men feel entitled to more space than women so I brushed it off. His arm wasn't really bothering me...except it was. Why are you on my desk, in my space? I thought it to be very rude and scooched my desk over, trying to be subtle. Nope, it did nothing. Then he begins to stare at me, odd behavior yes, but not a crime. I brush my hair (which luckily is super thick and long) over my shoulder to hide my face. He then has the audacity to move my hair out of my face. He touched my hair without permission. He was on my desk without permission. He begins hitting on me, even with all my fuck off signals. When he touched my hair I told him not to touch me. He was like, "but you're so pretty, I just wanted to see you."
(snip)
Men feel as though they have more rights over my space (a woman's space) than I do. It's crazy. You can't even always blame the man because it's been conditioned into them. I have to tell my boyfriend ALL the time that he's being domineering. He gets so upset and apologizes. He doesn't even realize it until I point it out though. Cam wouldn't care if I pointed it out. My boyfriend does because he says it helps him grow and learn as a person and as a man, but not all men care about learning and women's experience.
(snip)
And neither should you, because women are equal and deserve just as much as men, and that includes space.
https://www.theodysseyonline.com/personal-space-invaded
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
LongtimeAZDem
(4,494 posts)Flores is an ex-gangbanger that did time for auto theft, and her identity was lost because of that?
Even if I believed that, I couldn't respect it.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)Last edited Tue Apr 2, 2019, 09:33 PM - Edit history (1)
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
treestar
(82,383 posts)Funny. We made fun of Dubya. It was not discussed as sexual harassment. No way did Merkel think about it that way. I would bet on it.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)have claimed sexual harassment against Joe.
The issue is a respecting of personal space and how unwanted invasion of such creates feelings of identity diminish-ment and a loss of personal power.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
LongtimeAZDem
(4,494 posts)You're not selling me on this.
Do I believe the women were honestly uncomfortable? Yes.
Do I think they're making a mountain out of a molehill? Yes.
Do I think that they're proving the predictions of all of the male chauvinist pigs of 50 years ago? Absolutely.
Saying that they were diminished by an innocent violation of their personal space depicts them as fragile and weak.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)It may be a "mole hill" to you but you're not them.
I don't understand why respecting personal space should empower male chauvinist pigs?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
LongtimeAZDem
(4,494 posts)I believe it is important to them; I think they need to deal with it.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
LongtimeAZDem
(4,494 posts)To be fair, Lappos disqualified Biden not on his actions, but on his gender, which is IMO despicable:
If Biden truly supports women and gender equality he would step aside and support one of the many talented and qualified women running," she said. "The same goes for other men who have thrown their hat in the ring.
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/436823-biden-accuser-i-came-forward-because-im-disappointed-in-my-party
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)that I can find anyway, stating that Biden should be disqualified from running. She has just been pushing for an apology as to how he made her feel by invading her personal space.
In fact Lucy states she would vote for Biden over Trump.
JOE BIDEN ACCUSER LUCY FLORES SAYS 'IT'S NOT EVEN A QUESTION' SHE WOULD VOTE GOR FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OVER DONALD TRUMP
The first woman to step forward and recount an alleged experience of inappropriate touching from former Vice President Joe Biden said Monday that their interaction in 2014 would not keep her from voting for Biden in the 2020 presidential election.
Lucy Flores spoke to CBSN, the live-streaming news network operated by CBS News, where news anchor Tanya Rivero asked the former Nevada lawmaker if she would vote for Biden should he earn the Democratic nomination and run against President Donald Trump.
"Thats not even a question, of course I would support Biden," Flores replied.
But Flores said she would not vote for Biden in a Democratic primary, as there are things she does not "agree with in his history, positions he has taken," such as Biden's actions during the 1991 Senate Judiciary hearings to confirm Clarence Thomas as Supreme Court Justice.
(snip)
"There's absolutely a line of decency. There's a line of respect. Crossing that line is not grandfatherly. It's not cultural. It's not affection. It's sexism or misogyny," Lappos said.
https://www.newsweek.com/joe-biden-accuser-lucy-flores-says-its-not-even-question-she-would-vote-1382648
As for Lappos she says that Biden should step aside in allowing a woman to be President but there is no information in the article as to whether she would support Biden over Trump
"It wasnt sexual, but he did grab me by the head," Lappos told The Hartford Courant.
"He put his hand around my neck and pulled me in to rub noses with me. When he was pulling me in, I thought he was going to kiss me on the mouth," she added.
(snip)
In her statement Monday, Lappos said Biden, who is expected to enter the 2020 presidential race, should "step aside and support one of the many talented and qualified women running."
If Biden truly supports women and gender equality he would step aside and support one of the many talented and qualified women running," she said. "The same goes for other men who have thrown their hat in the ring. Women are 52 percent of the population. We are not a minority, we are the majority. It is time we are represented as such. After 45 male presidents it is time we elect a woman.
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/436823-biden-accuser-i-came-forward-because-im-disappointed-in-my-party
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
LongtimeAZDem
(4,494 posts)You could have found this easily, but you decided to spin. Sad.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)disqualified from running.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
LongtimeAZDem
(4,494 posts)I don't know how much clearer that can be.
You're not engaging honestly; I'm done.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)over Trump.
Believing that someone shouldn't run and that someone should be "disqualified" from running are two entirely different animals.
Peace to you LongtimeAZDem
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
BlueFlorida
(1,532 posts)She voted for Jill Stein the last time around.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
CentralMass
(15,265 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
treestar
(82,383 posts)Sexual harassment is one thing, but this is saying we are too fragile to deal with life, giving right wingers "proof" that we are not tough enough for the big jobs!
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
treestar
(82,383 posts)Putting this forward makes us women into weak sounding people and gives right wingers an opening to say we are not tough enough to deal with things. Anything can be taken too far. Here's an example.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
treestar
(82,383 posts)but the independent average voters we need I would bet are not so extreme on these issues.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BlueFlorida
(1,532 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Hekate
(90,534 posts)...was there to endorse her as a candidate and that she works for Sanders both then and now.
If what you say is entirely correct, LongtimeAZDem, I applaud her personal changes and growth.
However, all things considered, I will still have Biden's back.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
LongtimeAZDem
(4,494 posts)her turn her life around. She then went to college, and law school, which is impressive as hell.
So to say that she had a "loss of identity" because of an affectionate gesture beggars belief.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
trueblue2007
(17,189 posts)But it is wrong for Joe Biden to do it?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)Just guessing.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BlueFlorida
(1,532 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
treestar
(82,383 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Triloon
(506 posts)How do I lose my identity power? Isn't my identity my own? Aren't I responsible for it? And my personal space, isnt that also mine? Arent I responsible for maintaining it? Should I hold the rest of the world responsible for it? If someone intrudes on my space and I don't like it is up to me to push back, and no one else.
Perhaps I'm just old-fashioned and not in touch with "cutting edge progressive values", but this micro-agression junk is all bunk to me. A rubiks cube of pop-psychology semantics. I believe we all have bigger fish to fry.
(If anyone wants to jump on me for thinking this, please answer my questions first)
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)Last edited Tue Apr 2, 2019, 05:56 PM - Edit history (1)
Woman. She wants men to quit so we elect a woman...after all...poor weak women must
have men go to win (sarcasm). I despise them both and believe they are liars.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
CentralMass
(15,265 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)Sarah Slamen was the subject of significant harassment by high ups in the sanders campaign https://www.democraticunderground.com/1016224223
Here are some posts about Sarah on DU https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5207992
Here is a youtube video of Lawrence O'Donnell interviewing Sarah
Sarah was not invited and was excluded from the meeting of sanders campaign workers to discuss the sexual harassment issues. There are still issues with the sanders campaign according to Sarah.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)campaign has addressed it.
It's a long read but I believe well worth it.
Fantastic Lies: Special Ratf*cking Edition Part One
(snip)
The fact is that if you actually read the article (a task made more difficult by Politicos innocent decision to repeatedly alter it in the time since its publication) the story is a largely positive one. Sanders 2016 staffers who acknowledge the (previously reported) toxic atmosphere that most political campaigns give rise to, are requesting a meeting to preemptively attack sexual harassment during a potential 2020 run; a campaign they themselves are seemingly still interested in participating in.
The signers want the Sanders campaign to release a productive statement on harassment in the campaign environment and to establish a follow-up plan to implement concrete sexual harassment policies and procedures as well as a commitment to hiring diverse leadership by which I can only assume they mean more women. These seem like completely reasonable requests to me, and more importantly they actively demonstrate that people involved with a potential 2020 Sanders campaign structure are actively looking to address harassment and violence (sexual, or otherwise) proactively.
(snip)
The authors also mention 2016 high-level campaign volunteer and former Our Revolution organizer Sarah Slamen, noting that she quit the organization at the end of 2016 after she said she was berated by a male member of the Our Revolution steering committee for suggesting an organizing plan. In emails reviewed by The Times, she raised issues about sexist behavior with committee members who saw the incident and Our Revolutions national board of directors. She said she received no reassurance that anything would change.
Frankly, the inclusion of Slamens story in this piece is problematic because, even setting aside the fact that Our Revolution is merely a politically-affiliated progressive activist movement and thus explicitly doesnt work under Sanders, Weaver or the campaign committee, theres really no evidence presented that Slamens assessment was shared by the Our Revolution board; a body containing numerous progressive women who are openly sensitive to the issue of sexism. Indeed, because of the fact that there were admittedly multiple committee members present, no action was taken and nobody else is quoted in the article, it seems reasonable to question if Slamens real issue is that other people who witnessed the situation didnt think the problem was sexism. Or, I guess you could believe that a bunch of highly-experienced professionals, feminist activists and progressive members of Our Revolution who represent a myriad of races, genders and socioeconomic backgrounds are all in on some sort of nefarious plot to get Sarah Slamen. Once again, the watchwords are believe women not assume they are infallible and Slamens story is sort of a case of she said, but literally nobody else who saw it did.
(snip)
http://www.ninaillingworth.com/2019/01/12/fantastic-lies-special-ratfcking-edition-part-one/
To date along with the more stringent reforms in Bernie's 2020 campaign, to my knowledge no other campaign has unionized.
The problem that Joe faces is more direct and can't be helped by a union.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)I will pass this article on to Sarah. She will be amused
BTW, Sarah ran sanders' Louisiana operations http://www.p2016.org/sanders/sandersorg.html
Headquarters: IBEW Local 130 office, 3200 Ridglake Dr., Suite 400A, Metairie, LA 70002
State Coordinator Sarah Slamen
(from early Jan. 2016) Did GOTV on John Bel Edwards' gubernatorial campaign. Gained noteriety in July 2013 after state toopers escorted her out during her testimony against an anti-abortion bill in Texas (> . Campaign manager on Green Party candidate Amy Price for Houston City Council At-Large in 2011. From Texas.
Sarah was also active in Texas, New York and San Diego for the sanders campaign. I know that Sarah was in charge of trying to set up sanders' San Diego office until sanders shut down his ground operation in California and relied solely on events and TV ads (where Old Towne Media made a ton of money). Sarah was the point person for the Texas Democratic state Convention with the Limon person who there are some really fun stories about. I will ask Sarah if she knows that she never worked for the sanders campaign.
I doubt that sanders solved any of the underlying problems and I suspect that Sarah and others will be speaking up.
Again, thank you for amusing if poorly written article from someone no one has every heard of and who got all of his facts wrong.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
George II
(67,782 posts)...fully how he's going to address it, particularly the "more stringent reforms" this time around.
Perhaps that's the reason that his campaign workers felt the need to join a union, because they aren't satisfied with how he plans to addressing the "culture of sexual abuse, harassment, and inequality" in his last campaign?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)Evidently all problems were solved during this short meeting
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
George II
(67,782 posts)....that he spent so little time with them discussing the issues at that day and a half meeting. Of course the little time he DID spend with them coincided with an important vote on sanctions against a Russian oligarch, so he skipped the vote.
I'm not surprised that not too long after that meeting/non-meeting the Sanders campaign workers voted to unionize, taking that step to ensure the abuse and harassment of the last campaign aren't repeated.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)Link to tweet
The same pattern now repeats itself with Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.). He is indulged, allowed to skip by details, avoid probing and evade hard policy questions. Wed like to hear him pinned down, not permitted to move to the next topic without answering queries such as these:
.....What did you fail to do on the 2016 campaign that allowed female staffers to be harassed? How could you not have known what was going on? If you couldnt run an harassment-free campaign, why should voters think you can run an administration free from harassment?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)They talk about "he hasn't provided his taxes yet," this coming from the paper owned by the richest man in the world whose corporation payed no taxes.
(snip)
Bezos added to his business interests when he founded aerospace company Blue Origin in 2000. A Blue Origin test flight successfully first reached space in 2015, and Blue has plans to begin commercial suborbital human spaceflight in 2019. He purchased The Washington Post in 2013 for US$250 million in cash. Bezos manages other business investments through his venture capital fund, Bezos Expeditions.
On July 27, 2017, he became the world's wealthiest person when his estimated net worth increased to just over $90 billion. Bezos's wealth surpassed $100 billion for the first time on November 24, 2017, and he was formally designated the wealthiest person in the world by Forbes on March 6, 2018, with a net worth of $112 billion. The first centi-billionaire on the Forbes wealth index, he was named the "richest man in modern history" after his net worth increased to $150 billion in July 2018.[4]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Bezos
Amazon Will Pay a Whopping $0 in Federal Taxes on $11.2 Billion Profits
Those wondering how many zeros Amazon, which is valued at nearly $800 billion, has to pay in federal taxes might be surprised to learn that its check to the IRS will read exactly $0.00.
According to a report published by the Institute on Taxation and Economic (ITEP) policy Wednesday, the e-tail/retail/tech/entertainment/everything giant wont have to pay a cent in federal taxes for the second year in a row.
This tax-free break comes even though Amazon almost doubled its U.S. profits from $5.6 billion to $11.2 billion between 2017 and 2018.
To top it off, Amazon actually reported a $129 million 2018 federal income tax rebatemaking its tax rate -1%.
(snip)
http://fortune.com/2019/02/14/amazon-doesnt-pay-federal-taxes-2019/
There is nothing in Bernie's message that the top 1% should be paying their fare share that Bezos appreciates.
Bernie will release his taxes when he's ready, as one of the economically poorer members of the Senate, I believe there will be no there there.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)And perhaps attention seekers.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)If your space is invaded ,speak up. It is an insult to survivors to equate such stories with sexual asault.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)Nancy Pelosi and certainly not from me.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)moment and it is not.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)it was an invasion of privacy, certainly not as severe but demeaning to them nonetheless.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Amimnoch
(4,558 posts)I'd love to support a Democratic Party Candidate in the GE.
ANYONE but BS 2020.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
BlueFlorida
(1,532 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)Biden needs to have a rapid response team, like Bill Clinton did. All the candidates need that because whoever is doing well will be targeted.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)Have you considered his negatives? He is not unknown thus I don't expect them to decrease, His staying in once it is apparent he can't win will only hurt our 2020 efforts . The supers even on a second ballot will vote with the candidate with the most votes as they always do. Although, I hope he doesn't drag a losing campaign to the convention. We really need to beat Trump.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)If only to keep himself relevant. We'll just have to deal with it. I am not that worried if he stays in. IMO an exciting candidate will keep Sanders damage to a minimum. I am more worried about the right wing noise machine that will go after whoever our candidate is. If there is no real dirt, no real divisions, they will just make it up. Our candidate needs to have a media strategy to deal with that.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)Never with us to begin with.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)Link to tweet
Sanderss age, the socialist moniker he embraces and his 2016 campaign problem with women are not going to change during the race. Its unlikely his personality or his familiarity with foreign policy will improve, either. (The guy is 77, and if we have learned anything from Trump, it is that septuagenarians dont change their personalities nor attend to habitual deficits in knowledge.) Oh, and on Sunday he again promised to release his tax returns, which he promised over a month ago would be soon.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
WeekiWater
(3,259 posts)That about sums up the severity of the problem.
Kind of tells you all you need to know about those thinking he shouldn't run because of this.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
WhiskeyGrinder
(22,304 posts)He hasn't apologized and issued a statement that didn't seem really self-aware. I'm not interested in promoting someone like that.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
WeekiWater
(3,259 posts)A position that makes little sense.
"People are fired for not changing behavior similar to Biden's after they've been warned."
The sentence in the article, highlighted by the op, doesn't even claim the guarantee of a warning. But now we are up to "firing."
The hyperbole is what's become a joke. It flat out mocks the real issue and all women's issues.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
WhiskeyGrinder
(22,304 posts)Thinking there's a "real issue" is part of the problem. Women bring up issues that bother them; here's one of them.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
WeekiWater
(3,259 posts)"Thinking there's a "real issue" is part of the problem."
It has to be hard holding your position. First it's over the top. Then it's dismissive.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
floppyboo
(2,461 posts)I haven't heard or seen of repeats in the past little while. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt here.
You CAN learn new tricks. I've taught some of my old 70+ friends not to flick their butts on the ground or out the car window - not that I have taught them to quit smoking
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
PatSeg
(47,239 posts)However, I felt his statement did reveal self-awareness and a willingness to understand Flores' viewpoint. I suppose it depends on a person's viewpoint, but I found it honest and sincere.
I may not recall these moments the same way, and I may be surprised at what I hear. But we have arrived at an important time when women feel that they can and should relate their experiences, and men should pay attention, and I will."
On Saturday, Bidens spokesperson Bill Russo released a statement which seemed to cast doubt on Floress account. Russo said that neither then, nor in the years since, did [Biden] or the staff with him at the time have an inkling that Ms. Flores had been at any time uncomfortable, nor do they recall what she describes.
https://www.thecut.com/2019/03/joe-biden-issues-statement-in-response-to-lucy-flores.html
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
MineralMan
(146,248 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Nothing he says should ever be taken seriously again because he voted for a Republican 17 years ago?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
MineralMan
(146,248 posts)Make of it what you will.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BlueFlorida
(1,532 posts)He should accept it and live with it instead of trying to go scorched earth and denigrating any Democrat who is higher in the polls.
Sanders is well-known and his current support is his high water mark. It can only go rapidly downhill from here without brakes.
Judging from DU alone, over 50% of his 2016 supporters have left him. I don't see any "new" supporters.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
louis c
(8,652 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)I believe the strongest candidate would be Bernie Sanders, this is quite open for anyone to see.
But you don't address any of the substance in the actual OP, just putting forth a conspiracy theory.
Perhaps Flores went on to support Bernie Sanders in part because of the incident, that would be logical.
The incident with Biden took place in 2014, at least a year before Bernie even announced his candidacy.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
louis c
(8,652 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)Link to tweet
Sanderss age, the socialist moniker he embraces and his 2016 campaign problem with women are not going to change during the race. Its unlikely his personality or his familiarity with foreign policy will improve, either. (The guy is 77, and if we have learned anything from Trump, it is that septuagenarians dont change their personalities nor attend to habitual deficits in knowledge.) Oh, and on Sunday he again promised to release his tax returns, which he promised over a month ago would be soon.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
bernie59
(87 posts)pay a lot of attention to sources like Washington Post regarding who's electable. In my mind, they are still on probation due to their 2016 performance.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)The numbers cited in the article and not going to change just because you do not like the source.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
bernie59
(87 posts)It's just that they have not been very accurate with predicting Presidential primaries and elections as of late.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)I really believe that sanders is simply not electable
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)Just because what they find might be disturbing doesn't mean that it isn't factual. Reporting a candidates own words isn't "predicting" it's relaying facts.
You keep murmuring about their "2016 predictions" - what specifically are you talking about?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)Specifically?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)the socialist meme. They think they can beat him. Yet, they fear Biiden- and will run ads against him even before he announces...this was on Morning Joe.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)Last edited Tue Apr 2, 2019, 08:16 PM - Edit history (1)
that Bernie is Joe's strongest competitor, should Joe run.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)Sirota lied about working for the campaign and trashed Beto.There is precedent.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Autumn
(44,972 posts)you yourself posted several times in the thread where it was posted that she was no longer on the board, yet you persist on continuing to post that lie. Shame on you. Look to yourself before you complain about someone else's lies.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/128745690#post35
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/05/24/our-revolution-bernie-sanders-staff-changes-607330
A co-vice chair of Our Revolution who accused the group of insensitivity toward Latinos parts ways in the wake of a POLITICO report.
Velasquezs departure follows the resignation of Lucy Flores, a former Nevada assemblywoman and fellow founding board member, who quit in April over her own anger at Our Revolution for, in her view, ignoring issues important to Latinos. The groups former political director has also claimed she was fired by Turner for helping with organizing in favor of the DREAM Act, which Turner has not disputed.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)Biden. Is Sirota involved? She is a disgraceful. And if she succeeds we will lose. She and others who are politically motivated to attack candidates will destroy Me Too also,..,Hmm a known surrogate attacks a Sanders opponent who is beating Sanders by 10 or more points,..and I am supposed to believe her completely stupid story,.,that would be a no.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Autumn
(44,972 posts)posting over and over again what you know to be a lie. When you have to blame Bernie for actions of what another candidate actually did you have already lost.
Autumn (33,915 posts)
49. No she is not on the board of Our Revolution. You have been told that many times and
you yourself posted several times in the thread where it was posted that she was no longer on the board, yet you persist on continuing to post that lie. Shame on you. Look to yourself before you complain about someone else's lies.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/128745690#post35
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/05/24/our-revolution-bernie-sanders-staff-changes-607330
A co-vice chair of Our Revolution who accused the group of insensitivity toward Latinos parts ways in the wake of a POLITICO report.
Velasquezs departure follows the resignation of Lucy Flores, a former Nevada assemblywoman and fellow founding board member, who quit in April over her own anger at Our Revolution for, in her view, ignoring issues important to Latinos. The groups former political director has also claimed she was fired by Turner for helping with organizing in favor of the DREAM Act, which Turner has not disputed.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)the sexual harrassment allegations and did nothing. I find it telling that you feel the need to attack me . Don't call me a liar again. You may not believe what I post is true but I am not lying...perhaps a difference of opinion. In any case, your attacks on my credibility are surprisingly and rather sad.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Autumn
(44,972 posts)posting and over that she IS on the board even after you knew she left Our Revolution in May 2018. I posted a direct link to you knowing she wasn't on the board and you were still continuing to say she was. That speaks a lot to me of your credibility.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)People. She is still a Sanders supporter in my opinion. Who knows what her status is...consider Sirota. Sanders gets my vote only in a general as I think he will lose a general. I will vote for whoever the nominee is....including Sanders. But I pray somone else who has a chance will win the primary.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)associated with the campaign after the attacks on Beto but later acknowledged he was.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Autumn
(44,972 posts)Last edited Wed Apr 3, 2019, 12:05 PM - Edit history (1)
46. She is on the board of Our revolution. And we know
Sirota lied about working for the campaign and trashed Beto.There is precedent.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)her. She also ignored sexual harassment which included violence during 16. Think what you like. I believe she is a political operatives who will harm me too. I will finish with this...she was on the board of OR. That fact is not in dispute. Time will tell if she is associated with the campaign.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
George II
(67,782 posts)...on the board of Our Revolution?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Autumn
(44,972 posts)are discussing. Then read this OP pointing out that Flores was not on the board of our revolution she had left in May 2018 and the responses in the thread.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/128745690
then read # 46 post #49 and get back to me with her being correct in her posts that Flores was on the board of Our Revolution when she knew she wasn't. Post #73 means nothing, that is nothing to do with the conversation. . The fact that Flores was on the board at one time, the fact that there was a connection to them and Sanders was never in question. I'm not going on a deflection merry go round. Have a nice day.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
George II
(67,782 posts)Have a nice day.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Autumn
(44,972 posts)posting what they know is not true.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)I think that Joe is far more worried about Senator Harris than he is about sanders. Without support from African American voters, sanders will not be the nominee.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)The response to this is like white fragility- when white people have their feelings hurt if their racially insensitive or hostile behavior is noted.
What I thought was missing from Joe's statement is this. With what I now know because of me too, it is clear that there are likely to be women who felt threatened by me despite my good intentions. Their experience matters, I can't fix it, I can only commit to do better.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
PDittie
(8,322 posts)But he nailed it completely in this piece.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
George II
(67,782 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BlueFlorida
(1,532 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)In the primary.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Skidmore
(37,364 posts)Think there was a wagging finger with all that 'splainin' that this woman is resenting right now. On the cutting edge of progressive thinking enough to know that I can think for myself.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
underpants
(182,585 posts)Marking for later read
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
sfwriter
(3,032 posts)Been saying it for months. Later expect Anita Hill to come up.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Drunken Irishman
(34,857 posts)Because I promise you most HR departments would have a conniption fit if they found out management had ignored, either willfully or ignorantly, sexual harassment allegations like we saw from some on his staff during the 2016 campaign.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)Link to tweet
/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1083425779407572992&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnbc.com%2F2019%2F01%2F10%2Fbernie-sanders-apologizes-for-sexual-harassment-in-2016-campaign.html
Bernie's campaign is also the only one to date to welcome unionization, a further safeguard against such incidences happening again.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Drunken Irishman
(34,857 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,270 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(144,884 posts)Link to tweet
Its not clear this was even necessary. Other than journalists, it was hard to find anyone who honestly thought Biden is a hugger was news; it surely wasnt new. Even Republicans had come to his rescue. Sen. Lindsey O. Graham (R-S.C.), in a reminder of the old Lindsey Graham, remarked, I just want to say Joe Biden is my friend, and I know him very well, and whatever he did it may have been inappropriate but it was not driven by malice or misconduct. Sens. Susan Collins (R-Maine) and Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.) also vouched for him, as has Meghan McCain.
Biden conveyed in his message why he touches people to soothe, empathize and encourage. In saying that he would resist the notion that politics has to be antiseptic, he showed that hes in public service not for glory but to help others. In short, he helped voters remember the positive qualities hes well known for, which even political opponents attest to.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden