Democratic Primaries
Related: About this forumInside the Russian effort to target Sanders supporters - and help elect Trump (WP)
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/inside-the-russian-effort-to-target-sanders-supporters--and-help-elect-trump/2019/04/11/741d7308-5576-11e9-8ef3-fbd41a2ce4d5_story.htmlInside the Russian effort to target Sanders supporters and help elect Trump
By Michael Kranish
April 12 at 6:00 AM
After Bernie Sanders lost his primary campaign for president against Hillary Clinton in 2016, a Twitter account called Red Louisiana News reached out to his supporters to help sway the general election. Conscious Bernie Sanders supporters already moving towards the best candidate Trump! #Feel the Bern #Vote Trump 2016, the account tweeted.
The tweet was not actually from Louisiana, according to an analysis by Clemson University researchers. Instead, it was one of thousands of accounts identified as based in Russia, part of a cloaked effort to persuade supporters of the Vermont senator to elect Trump. Bernie Sanders says his message resonates with Republicans, said another Russian tweet.
While much attention has focused on the question of whether the Trump campaign encouraged or conspired with Russia, the effort to target Sanders supporters has been a lesser-noted part of the story. Special counsel Robert S. Mueller III, in a case filed last year against 13 Russians accused of interfering in the U.S. presidential campaign, said workers at a St. Petersburg facility called the Internet Research Agency were instructed to write social media posts in opposition to Clinton but to support Bernie Sanders and then-candidate Donald Trump.
That strategy could receive new attention with the release of Muellers report, expected within days.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(143,998 posts)Link to tweet
?s=20
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BlueFlorida
(1,532 posts)and made no effort to stop it.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
comradebillyboy
(10,119 posts)The real question to be asked is what was the Clinton campaign [doing about Russian interference]? They had more information about this than we did, Sanders said in the interview with Vermont Public Radio.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
dalton99a
(81,065 posts)Hillary left her government job in 2013
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
zentrum
(9,865 posts)...to keep demonizing Bernie. Finding any excuse for her loss of the electoral college except the way the DNC and she ran the campaign in those three critical states.
While actually, Bernie's progressive influence is the only thing that has a prayer of successfully opposing Trump in 2020. To continue to demonize him is useless and actually harmful.
AOC for instance managed her tremendous upset, not because of Russians but because her Bernie-like progressivism.
I'm glad so many Democratic candidates for President in 2020 have endorsed his Mediare for All plan. They don't seem too concerned about how the Russians kept "pushing Bernie" or whatever the damn, sad, theory is.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
thesquanderer
(11,953 posts)...that someone won't then use to attack Bernie.
For all intents and purposes, Bernie is one of us. As Obama said, we are a circular firing squad.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
The Bernie Bros are not without blame in the circular firing squad. As stated before, the actions during 2016 left some deep wounds. To make matters worse, Trump won. Many Bernie Bros voted for Trump or Jill Stein or Johnson.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
thesquanderer
(11,953 posts)Last edited Fri Apr 12, 2019, 03:13 PM - Edit history (1)
... for the most part, these were people who were never going to vote for Hillary, period. They were not "traitors to the party," we never really had them to begin with. And I wouldn't count on them voting Dem in 2020 either, unless we have a candidate who appeals to them.
Remember, not every voter is a Republican or Democrat, there are tons of independent/unaffiliated voters, as well as voters who were registering for the first time and had no long term allegiance behind them. Sanders had more appeal with these groups than Hillary did. So particularly in states with open primaries (i.e. you didn't have to be a registered Dem to vote in the primary), you had people who voted for Sanders in the primary, but were never going to vote for Hillary in the general. And instead of being happy that we had a candidate who was able to bring some of them closer to our side, or register new young voters for the first time, folks are mad at them for not having made the full conversion.
The point is, it's a double-edged sword. You can say "Those outside-the-devoted-Dem-base Bernie supporters were terrible, they didn't support Hillary in the general" -- but the flip side of that is "Hillary had less appeal outside the devoted Dem base and couldn't appeal to the voters Bernie was bringing in." It is not a shock that she couldn't take those votes for granted, and how much of that you put on Hillary vs. how much of that you put on the voters who didn't like her is two sides of the same coin.
BTW, I'd say using the term "Bernie Bros" itself is a circular firing squad weapon, probably best avoided.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
progressoid
(49,824 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
justie18
(169 posts)I will continue to use Bernie Bros as it should not be forgotten how they booed every speaker at the convention in 2016, even Hillary while St. Bernie sat there and let it happen.
I suggest reading today's WP article about how the Russians helped St. Bernie:
After Bernie Sanders lost his primary campaign for president against Hillary Clinton in 2016, a Twitter account called Red Louisiana News reached out to his supporters to help sway the general election. Conscious Bernie Sanders supporters already moving towards the best candidate Trump! #Feel the Bern #Vote Trump 2016, the account tweeted.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
thesquanderer
(11,953 posts)It was from Russian trolls, not legit Sanders supporters.
As for what you say "should not be forgotten," that sounds like refighting the 2016 primaries, not permitted here. And the same goes for insulting the supporters of any candidate for the Democratic nomination. Check the Terms of Service link at the bottom of the page.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Cha
(295,899 posts)Link to tweet
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/jill-stein-democratic-spoiler-or-scapegoat/
The Liberal case against Bernie
by Erci Alterman.. former BS supporter..
snip//
Senator Bernie Sanderss presidential candidacy poses a conundrum for progressives. Not since 1936, when Franklin Roosevelt said that he welcomed the hatred of corporate interests, has a serious presidential candidate offered so aggressive a challenge to the conservative powers that be. At the same time, however, a dangerous lunatic is president of the United States, and Sanders, of all the major Democratic contenders, is the one who will make Donald Trumps reelection most likely. Eight years of a Trump presidency could mean the end of meaningful democracy in the United States, along with many of the rights that women, minorities, immigrants, LGBTQ people, and others now take for granted.
Let me clarify: Ive been a fan and supporter of Sanders ever since he was elected mayor of Burlington, Vermont, in 1981. I was honored to be asked to testify before him in Congress years ago, and I voted for him in the New York presidential primary in 2016. I did so, however, not because I imagined he might win the nomination, but because I hoped that a strong showing by Sanders would help wake up Hillary Clinton to the importance of addressing economic inequality, and also to honor his brave criticism of Israels occupation of the West Bank.
I was wrong. Sanders turned so negative toward Clinton that it hurt her in the general election. Even though he campaigned for her after he lost the nomination, roughly 12 percent of Sanderss supporters switched to Trump, and enough of the rest supported Jill Steins kamikaze candidacy that it helped tip key states to Trump.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=42334
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
thesquanderer
(11,953 posts)I don't think he was as hard on her as Trump's Republican opponents were on him. Or harder on her than any candidate should expect when entering the primaries. I can even think of a couple of times where he clearly let her off easy. And I could be wrong, but I don't remember him ever misrepresenting her. (As opposed to what's described at https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/03/10/5-times-hillary-clinton-has-played-fast-and-loose-with-the-facts-on-bernie-sanderss-record/ )
But as they say, politics ain't beanbag. Everyone gets a little bruised, it's par for the course, and no one should go in expecting otherwise. And despite voting for Sanders in the primary, I eagerly voted for Hillary in November. My feeling is that neither Bernie nor Hillary were perfect, but either would have made a fine president.
The fact that 12% of Sanders' primary voters switched to Trump does not mean they would have voted for Hillary if Sanders had not been in the race. That is really the point of the post of mine that you responded to.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Cha
(295,899 posts)with you.
You can deny it all you want. Doesn't change reality.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
thesquanderer
(11,953 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Cha
(295,899 posts)many others were there.. we know what happened.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
thesquanderer
(11,953 posts)Are you seriously going to disagree that Republicans went harder on Trump than Bernie did on Hillary? (Not that Trump didn't deserve and even provoke it.) Or that primaries are not intended to be love fests? Do you not recall that Clinton campaigned at least as hard against Obama in 2008 as Sanders did against Clinton in 2016?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Cha
(295,899 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
zentrum
(9,865 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Cha
(295,899 posts)any "responsibility"?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
betsuni
(25,122 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
LakeArenal
(28,713 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
DownriverDem
(6,205 posts)those Sanders folks wake up and vote for whoever the Dem nominee is this time. Unless they like what trump et al is doing.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
athena
(4,187 posts)A month or two ago, I was looking at a Kamala Harris campaign video on YouTube and saw comment after comment attacking her. Most comments were from accounts that had nothing publicly visible, but I saw one comment that had three liked or favorite (I dont remember which) videos with Russian titles. The Russians are already causing discord. After all, there was never any reason for them to stop.
If you see a post by someone disparaging any candidate, consider that it may be from a Russian troll. Even high post counts are no guarantee that someone is for real, since the Russians have been planning this interference for years. I am convinced that the reason DU was so inhospitable to Hillary supporters throughout the primaries in 2016 was due to Russian manipulation, which unfortunately resonated with some here. Based on what many DUers have been posting about some of our strongest candidates, I see no reason to think that anyone has learned anything from the 2016 experience. If people dont open their minds and hearts this time around, I fear we will get another four years of Trump. And that will mean the end of American democracy.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
UniteTheLeft
(49 posts)Russians for trump.... who'd have thunk it.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
WeekiWater
(3,259 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Tom Rinaldo
(22,911 posts)They would target voters who have been fed a steady diet of anti-Sanders propaganda for years and work to keep them away from the polls for the General Election in November, thus helping Trump win again. That was the exact playbook they used to elect Trump the first time, except they were working to keep people fed an anti Clinton diet for years away from the polls that time. There are always a small percentage of voters who are susceptible to this form of manipulation. With Hillary out of the race for 2020 the Russians will be looking for new easy marks. and some of those who have been nursing grudges against Sanders and or his supporters will definitely be targeted if Sanders is our nominee. And some will fall for it.
I am not suggesting that you personally would fall for that. Most on DU would not. Just like most Sanders supporters on DU in 2016 went to the polls and voted for Hillary.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
WeekiWater
(3,259 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
KPN
(15,585 posts)to interfere and influence our elections. But for that reason only.
Using articles/reminders like this as a tool for bashing candidates or Democratic party members is inappropriate and serves only to divide. In the end, it is exactly that kind of behavior, especially when unsubstantiated accusations or claims are made against others that drives would be Democrats to withhold their votes.
Let's unite folks, not divide!
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
oasis
(49,150 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
mopinko
(69,804 posts)we were tossing the bernie bros 24/7. someone thought it was a good idea to use 'bernie' in their handles, which probably was working in a lot of places. but here it was like swatting flies on fresh, warm shit.
and some old timers got the boot for being useful idiots.
i dont doubt that russia was behind the hack.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Nitram
(22,663 posts)were designed to look like a Clinton supporter rudely insulting Bernie supporters, and others designed to look like Sanders supporters that very nastily attacked Clinton. It worked. I don't know how many posts I saw where both sides were accusing the other of unfairly and rudely trashing their preferred candidate, even after the primaries. Both sides wondered why the other side was being so nasty.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
malchickiwick
(1,474 posts)I feel she shares his progressive principles but without all of Bernie's baggage like the above, and including Bernie Bros, tax returns, and his status as an independent.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(143,998 posts)Link to tweet
?s=20
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(143,998 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden